OT: Thread About Nothing (TaN #...lost count)

[JimEIV]

I actually think the biggest political group is hunters. I don't think most people understand the sheer size of the hunting/outdoor industry and the political power and money they have.

They are disjointed in many instances and do have competing interests frequently. But in most of these states a politician would much rather piss off a rancher than the hunting community.

That's why we see so many politicians on fake duck and pheasant hunting photo ops.

 

[Guadana]

It seems much more than that. Of course only I have have anecdotal evidence, mixed with some scientific data from Fish and Wildlife departments but it is a fact that the number of grizzly bears has exploded over the last 20-ish years throughout much of the US West and Canada...but there is a second issue that I hear almost no one talk about (mainly because it's much more politically charged), on top of the grizzly bear population there has been a wolf population explosion all along the exact same range of the grizzly. The American West, British Columbia, and the Canadian Rockies are vast but no matter big an area is there is only so much food to go around.

Two apex predators in the midst of a population explosions that share many of the same food sources forces those populations to expand to nontraditional areas to find new food sources.

Late August through September seems prime time for most of these grizzly attacks in Wyoming, Montana and in the National Parks, British Columbia and the Canadian Rockies. And it makes sense. This is the time that calories are at a premium before winter.

I don't think these animals are actively seeking people, not at all....but their expanded range is putting them more in contact with people and I believe the competition for food is absolutely making them more aggressive.

We are now starting to see aggressive behavior from wolves in various places. Banff has a pack that has shown aggressive behavior towards people in camp sites on numerous occasions over several years. I personally believe this is a result of competition for food that stems from their population reaching carry capacity.

Why your "forest department" part of government doesn't open the hunt? If they are so worry about green planet, CO2 and other stuff, they should control population of predators. Its nothing new. Even if it doesn't look green activists friendly.

 

[JimEIV]

Why your "forest department" part of government doesn't open the hunt? If they are so worry about green planet, CO2 and other stuff, they should control population of predators. Its nothing new.

You would think it's pretty simple but there are so many competing interests all with a million different agendas.

Some times the person who yells loudest wins.

 

[Guadana]

You would think it's pretty simple but there are so many competing interests all with a million different agendas.

Some times the person who yells loudest wins.

I understand what are you talking about. It is important not just to shout loudly, it is important who has a mouthpiece in their hands. And a camera. I have a strong feeling that these people either have something bad in mind, or simply do not understand what they are doing and what it will lead to.

It's hard to judge from my side, I'm far away and only scraps of information reach me, so I want to know how it is perceived from your side. How much is the initiative to replace animal meat with insect meat progressing and developing? How it effects on life of the regular citizen? If effects at all.

 

[My3Sons]

I actually think the biggest political group is hunters. I don't think most people understand the sheer size of the hunting/outdoor industry and the political power and money they have.

They are disjointed in many instances and do have competing interests frequently. But in most of these states a politician would much rather piss off a rancher than the hunting community.

That's why we see so many politicians on fake duck and pheasant hunting photo ops.

Are hunters and the NRA the same thing? By me they overlap but really they shouldn’t. NRA are a bunch of scared money raisers while hunters don’t have to be scared.

We recently moved and one of the houses we looked at had some hunting equipment. Some compound bows a fake deer target and a couple of rifles and rods and four wheelers. Another had similar stuff but had about 20 guns laying around in a closet including a couple of AR-15s that I could have just walked out with if I was so inclined.

I’m in favor of gun ownership so long as it is handled like cars. Show proficiency pass a safety test and don’t shoot while intoxicated. And you have to carry insurance. The NRA would have you believe I’m trying to set up their children to carried off by nefarious government agents in the middle of the night for suggesting some basic common sense. Really embarrassing.

 

[JimEIV]

Are hunters and the NRA the same thing? By me they overlap but really they shouldn’t. NRA are a bunch of scared money raisers while hunters don’t have to be scared.

We recently moved and one of the houses we looked at had some hunting equipment. Some compound bows a fake deer target and a couple of rifles and rods and four wheelers. Another had similar stuff but had about 20 guns laying around in a closet including a couple of AR-15s that I could have just walked out with if I was so inclined.

I’m in favor of gun ownership so long as it is handled like cars. Show proficiency pass a safety test and don’t shoot while intoxicated. And you have to carry insurance. The NRA would have you believe I’m trying to set up their children to carried off by nefarious government agents in the middle of the night for suggesting some basic common sense. Really embarrassing.

There is definitely a lot of crossover from the hunting community and the NRA. I think the NRA has fallen out of favor with most hunters after the financial issues and pure corruption that was exposed a while ago. More hunting based organization are more prominent like Safari Club International, Ducks Unlimited, Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation

From my perspective guns aren't a part of hunting and archers have their own organizations and are very well represented. Archery Trade Association, Archery Manufacturers Organization, Pope and Young, National Field Archers Association, Professional Bowhunters Society, Compton Traditional Archers...and every state has there own Bowhunters organizations.

Most hunters aren't single focused like I am. I only bowhunt, most others participate in every season available. So they are likely to support all these organizations.

For them the gun issues is very much directly related to hunting, not me...I don't believe the second amendment has anything to do with hunting.... I'm one of those.

 

[My3Sons]

There is definitely a lot of crossover from the hunting community and the NRA. I think the NRA has fallen out of favor with most hunters after the financial issues and pure corruption that was exposed a while ago. More hunting based organization are more prominent like Safari Club International, Ducks Unlimited, Rocky Mountain Elk Foundation

From my perspective guns aren't a part of hunting and archers have their own organizations and are very well represented. Archery Trade Association, Archery Manufacturers Organization, Pope and Young, National Field Archers Association, Professional Bowhunters Society, Compton Traditional Archers...and every state has there own Bowhunters organizations.

Most hunters aren't single focused like I am. I only bowhunt, most others participate in every season available. So they are likely to support all these organizations.

For them the gun issues is very much directly related to hunting, not me...I don't believe the second amendment has anything to do with hunting.... I'm one of those.

Probably because you don’t own a gun. While understand many uses for firearms - hunting, target shooting, military collectibles (I bought my dads a WW1 Lee Enfield rifle some years ago because he has always collected old antique firearms) and self defense where appropriate - I laugh at the loonies who think their AR-15 would ever actually stop anything if the government really came to take their firearms away. Ask the Branch Davidians how that worked out. There are a number of those folks by me and I’m guessing that hunting is only done because it’s the only way they can use long arms. Real hunting is rare by me. Most just get lit up and sit in a deer stand. What you do is much different.

 

[JimEIV]

Probably because you don’t own a gun. While understand many uses for firearms - hunting, target shooting, military collectibles (I bought my dads a WW1 Lee Enfield rifle some years ago because he has always collected old antique firearms) and self defense where appropriate - I laugh at the loonies who think their AR-15 would ever actually stop anything if the government really came to take their firearms away. Ask the Branch Davidians how that worked out. There are a number of those folks by me and I’m guessing that hunting is only done because it’s the only way they can use long arms. Real hunting is rare by me. Most just get lit up and sit in a deer stand. What you do is much different.

Well this conversation could get real weird real fast. But I will say I definitely do believe the people can defend themselves against their own government. It can only work based on broad support though.

The Wacko people had no broad based support. They had no righteous cause to garner that support....the Viet Cong did. The Taliban did. But I'll stop. Because this conversation is weird. But 1000 Americans with sympathy of their community I'd put my money there.

 

[My3Sons]

Well this conversation could get real weird real fast. But I will say I definitely do believe the people can defend themselves against their own government. It can only work based on broad support though.

The Wacko people had no broad based support. They had no righteous cause to garner that support....the Viet Cong did. The Taliban did. But I'll stop. Because this conversation is weird. But 1000 Americans with sympathy of their community I'd put my money there.

It’s not that weird to me. What you are pointing out is the difference between genuine self defense and loonies. As you’ve noted the average person isn’t foaming at the mouth about anything. Sure if enough loonies got together they’d be dangerous but as someone living among them I’ll just say they aren’t like you. I could probably kill most of them in single combat and I am an old broken down average sized guy. All I’d have to do is bait a trap with poisoned cupcakes and fried anything and they’d all come running.

 

[JimEIV]

It’s not that weird to me. What you are pointing out is the difference between genuine self defense and loonies. As you’ve noted the average person isn’t foaming at the mouth about anything. Sure if enough loonies got together they’d be dangerous but as someone living among them I’ll just say they aren’t like you. I could probably kill most of them in single combat and I am an old broken down average sized guy. All I’d have to do is bait a trap with poisoned cupcakes and fried anything and they’d all come running.

A poisoned cupcake to catch rednecks. It sounds like an SNL skit about the Civil War

 

[JimEIV]

This is an excellent article outlining from when the grizzly bear was put on the endangered species list in 1975 and the subsequent cort cases and rulings that have taken place. The Greater Yellowstone grizzly has been considered "recovered" since 2007. They're currently still fighting issue 16 years later and the population grows just about every year.

The numbers are also very under represented. This article list the Greater Yellowstone population as 700, I've seen estimates closer to 1200. Apparently it's a discrepancy in the area not the number of bears. The smaller number is from Park biologist that focus solely on the animals in the Park.

Pretty wild how much time and money has gone into this.

Timeline: A History Of Grizzly Bear Recovery In The Lower 48 States

At their peak, grizzly bears numbered more than 50,000 in the Lower 48. They roamed from the West Coast to the Great Plains, from northern Alaska to…

www.mtpr.org

 

[njdevils1982]

This is an excellent article outlining from when the grizzly bear was put on the endangered species list in 1975 and the subsequent cort cases and rulings that have taken place. The Greater Yellowstone grizzly has been considered "recovered" since 2007. They're currently still fighting issue 16 years later and the population grows just about every year.

The numbers are also very under represented. This article list the Greater Yellowstone population as 700, I've seen estimates closer to 1200. Apparently it's a discrepancy in the area not the number of bears. The smaller number is from Park biologist that focus solely on the animals in the Park.

Pretty wild how much time and money has gone into this.

Timeline: A History Of Grizzly Bear Recovery In The Lower 48 States

At their peak, grizzly bears numbered more than 50,000 in the Lower 48. They roamed from the West Coast to the Great Plains, from northern Alaska to…

www.mtpr.org

great read.

 

[njdevils1982]

did one final round of golf this afternoon before the course closes on monday.... a solid round but my P club is now in two pieces due to a violent throw at my golf bag.....

thanks to my playing partner deciding to talk during one of my swings on an easy 30' chip on to the green .....i flubbed it and just turned and whipped the thing......

its ok ....i have and extra P club thats exactly the same as the broken one.....just needs a better grip put on....


who the f*** talks during someones swing?! i beat my friend by 19 strokes


we're usually about 3 or 4 apart in score.......so ya....theres that i guess

 

[JimEIV]

This is fascinating. I know most people don't care about stuff like this but I absolutely love it....not only the history, but forgotten history that is right under our noses.

4 shipwrecks found in N.J. river tell tale of epic Revolutionary War battle

Friday is the 245th anniversary of an attack on a "hole-in-the-wall" New Jersey port filled with privateers who tormented British supply chains.

www.nj.com

 

[JimEIV]

One more bit of useless information

Akshara Vijay pulled off a major upset in the women's senior recurve division at the Nationals. She is now in a prime spot to make the US Olympic Team. Akshsra is a member of my rrchery club Waxibo Archers. So I'll be rooting hard for her.

Vijay launches comeback to claim U.S. Open on a day of silverware and surprises

Akshara Vijay upset top seed Casey Kaufhold on Saturday to claim the U.S. Open title in the recurve senior women division at the age of just 15.

www.usarchery.org

 

[Guadana]

This is fascinating. I know most people don't care about stuff like this but I absolutely love it....not only the history, but forgotten history that is right under our noses.

4 shipwrecks found in N.J. river tell tale of epic Revolutionary War battle

Friday is the 245th anniversary of an attack on a "hole-in-the-wall" New Jersey port filled with privateers who tormented British supply chains.

www.nj.com

Its a great read. I'm a big fan of fights history, at least as a listener or reader. Memory isn't working well to be good in it.

 

[JimEIV]

Its a great read. I'm a big fan of fights history, at least as a listener or reader. Memory isn't working well to be good in it.

New Jersey is such an interesting place and no one seems to know about it. Over 90 Battles over 200 skirmishes in our battle for independence.

Massachusetts and Virginia seem to get all the press, but New Jersey was where the great many battles were fought. It was the crossroads of the Revolution.

We've been defiant bastards from the beginning. Massachusetts, New York and most other cities folded pretty quickly when faced with the full force of the British. Not New Jersey, we laugh and we fight.

 

[njdevils1982]

New Jersey is such an interesting place and no one seems to know about it. Over 90 Battles over 200 skirmishes in our battle for independence.

Massachusetts and Virginia seem to get all the press, but New Jersey was where the great many battles were fought. It was the crossroads of the Revolution.

We've been defiant bastards from the beginning. Massachusetts, New York and most other cities folded pretty quickly when faced with the full force of the British. Not New Jersey, we laugh and we fight.

my spirit lives in jersey

 

[njdevils1982]

‘Jersey’ as a Nickname for New Jersey (Published 2010)

Those who dislike the label may be surprised to discover that it has a distinguished historical pedigree.

www.nytimes.com

 

[JimEIV]

my spirit lives in jersey

That's called the "spirit of the jerseys" by Thomas Paine in the "Crisis" or the American crisis

Basically Pain said we let General Howe sit by and ravage the country but if we unleashed New Jersey we could have propelled the British much sooner

" we have none to blame but ourselves. But no great deal is lost yet. All that Howe has been doing for this month past, is rather a ravage than a conquest, which the spirit of the Jerseys, a year ago, would have quickly repulsed, and which time and a little resolution will soon recover."


The Spirit of the Jerseys is yearly festival we still have here.

 

[Guadana]

New Jersey is such an interesting place and no one seems to know about it. Over 90 Battles over 200 skirmishes in our battle for independence.

Massachusetts and Virginia seem to get all the press, but New Jersey was where the great many battles were fought. It was the crossroads of the Revolution.

We've been defiant bastards from the beginning. Massachusetts, New York and most other cities folded pretty quickly when faced with the full force of the British. Not New Jersey, we laugh and we fight.

I understand that the presence of infrastructure at that moment, but its insufficient development allowed grouping, hiding, organizing guerrilla attacks and actively resisting.

 

[JimEIV]

I understand that the presence of infrastructure at that moment, but its insufficient development allowed grouping, hiding, organizing guerrilla attacks and actively resisting.

It was different in New Jersey. They definitely used unconventional tactics but a lot of the fighting was New Jersey vs others from New Jersey. Loyalist vs Patriots and just good old fashioned grudges.

The people of New Jersey were constantly fighting even before the revolution. Mostly land disputes.

Historians say it was like a mini civil war in New Jersey. With 1/3 supporting Independence, 1/3 Loyalist and 1/3 neutral or drifting back and forth.

"For the residents of New Jersey, the fight for American Independence meant eight years of civil war. Both armies vied for the food, forage, wood, and other resources that the countryside could provide and launched disruptive forays against each other.

New Jersey’s population was culturally diverse, dispersed and primarily agrarian. The ravages of occupation forced a reluctant population to take sides. Bitter divisions developed within communities. Ad hoc militias waged unconventional warfare. Neighbor turned upon neighbor and allegiances shifted with the fortunes of war. "

New Jersey and the Revolution - Crossroads of the American Revolution

New Jersey played a crucial role in the American Revolution. Positioned between the new nation’s capital in Philadelphia and the British stronghold in New York, no place in New Jersey […]

revolutionarynj.org

 

[JK3]

It was different in New Jersey. They definitely used unconventional tactics but a lot of the fighting was New Jersey vs others from New Jersey. Loyalist vs Patriots and just good old fashioned grudges.

The people of New Jersey were constantly fighting even before the revolution. Mostly land disputes.

Historians say it was like a mini civil war in New Jersey. With 1/3 supporting Independence, 1/3 Loyalist and 1/3 neutral or drifting back and forth.

"For the residents of New Jersey, the fight for American Independence meant eight years of civil war. Both armies vied for the food, forage, wood, and other resources that the countryside could provide and launched disruptive forays against each other.

New Jersey’s population was culturally diverse, dispersed and primarily agrarian. The ravages of occupation forced a reluctant population to take sides. Bitter divisions developed within communities. Ad hoc militias waged unconventional warfare. Neighbor turned upon neighbor and allegiances shifted with the fortunes of war. "

New Jersey and the Revolution - Crossroads of the American Revolution

New Jersey played a crucial role in the American Revolution. Positioned between the new nation’s capital in Philadelphia and the British stronghold in New York, no place in New Jersey […]

revolutionarynj.org

I’ve fished that spot on the Mullica from that previous article you posted, didn’t know about those boats there, pretty wild.

I didn’t realize how much revolutionary war stuff is down here along the coast. There are historical plaques everywhere but easy to miss if you aren’t looking for them.

The LBI massacre and ensuing pursuit of John Bacon always fascinated me, I go up to Barnegat Lighthouse a lot. It’s a good example of these crazy tit for tat grudges during that time. After the large scale battles were finished and negotiations and a treaty was being drawn up some of the very last skirmishes of the war were still going on in NJ.

This is a pretty good site:

Long Beach Island, New Jersey Revolutionary War Sites | Long Beach Island Historic Sites

A list of Revolutionary War sites in Long Beach Island, New Jersey. The historic sites in Long Beach Island NJ include the Massacre at Long Beach monument.

www.revolutionarywarnewjersey.com

Barnegat, New Jersey Revolutionary War Sites | Barnegat Historic Sites

A list of Revolutionary War sites in Barnegat, New Jersey. The historic sites in Barnegat NJ include the Affair at Cedar Bridge.

www.revolutionarywarnewjersey.com

 

[Guadana]

It was different in New Jersey. They definitely used unconventional tactics but a lot of the fighting was New Jersey vs others from New Jersey. Loyalist vs Patriots and just good old fashioned grudges.

The people of New Jersey were constantly fighting even before the revolution. Mostly land disputes.

Historians say it was like a mini civil war in New Jersey. With 1/3 supporting Independence, 1/3 Loyalist and 1/3 neutral or drifting back and forth.

"For the residents of New Jersey, the fight for American Independence meant eight years of civil war. Both armies vied for the food, forage, wood, and other resources that the countryside could provide and launched disruptive forays against each other.

New Jersey’s population was culturally diverse, dispersed and primarily agrarian. The ravages of occupation forced a reluctant population to take sides. Bitter divisions developed within communities. Ad hoc militias waged unconventional warfare. Neighbor turned upon neighbor and allegiances shifted with the fortunes of war. "

New Jersey and the Revolution - Crossroads of the American Revolution

New Jersey played a crucial role in the American Revolution. Positioned between the new nation’s capital in Philadelphia and the British stronghold in New York, no place in New Jersey […]

revolutionarynj.org

Good old neighborly relations between close and exactly the same people. Ageless classics)

 

[JimEIV]

I’ve fished that spot on the Mullica from that previous article you posted, didn’t know about those boats there, pretty wild.

I didn’t realize how much revolutionary war stuff is down here along the coast. There are historical plaques everywhere but easy to miss if you aren’t looking for them.

The LBI massacre and ensuing pursuit of John Bacon always fascinated me, I go up to Barnegat Lighthouse a lot. It’s a good example of these crazy tit for tat grudges during that time. After the large scale battles were finished and negotiations and a treaty was being drawn up some of the very last skirmishes of the war were still going on in NJ.

This is a pretty good site:

Long Beach Island, New Jersey Revolutionary War Sites | Long Beach Island Historic Sites

A list of Revolutionary War sites in Long Beach Island, New Jersey. The historic sites in Long Beach Island NJ include the Massacre at Long Beach monument.

www.revolutionarywarnewjersey.com

Barnegat, New Jersey Revolutionary War Sites | Barnegat Historic Sites

A list of Revolutionary War sites in Barnegat, New Jersey. The historic sites in Barnegat NJ include the Affair at Cedar Bridge.

www.revolutionarywarnewjersey.com

This is awesome. Thanks.