This Pittsburgh Penguins Act is Getting Old

[StreetHawk]

No GM has authority to come in there and just tell Sidney Crosby they're rebuilding while he can still play at a high level.

That's not how having a player of his stature works.

You do your best to give them one more last run until they are gone, and then and only then do you rebuild.

And that's not even a GM thing, a rebuild in this kind of case has to be signed off by the owner because really by rebuild you're essentially telling Crosby to go elsewhere and that's an ownership decision, that's not a "your GM woke up on a Tuesday and decided this is the direction of the team" decision.

See how that conversation goes this July when Sid is eligible for a new contract. What does he want to do? And what does the team want to do? Does Sid want to remain if the team wants to begin a rebuild? Does Sid want to try to win 1 more cup elsewhere? Do the Pens continue to try to make win now moves if Sid extends, even though they've been a borderline PO team for 3 seasons in a row now?

 

[b in vancouver]

i cant see crosby ever leaving but seeing him in colorado would be insane.

Boston would be a fun one also. Especially if it could coax Bergeron out of retirement.

 

[WarriorofTime]

 

[HanSolo]

I responded to Suzuki in different reply stating that the post should probably be modified to Veteran type players. Suzuki never played a game for Vegas.

Alex Tuch is a pretty good exception. Young player that started promising then had a couple of seasons showing no real growth. Vegas cut ties and he became one of if not the central piece to the Jack Eichel trade. A trade that's looking like a fleecing for Vegas all things considered. Krebs isn't pissing a drop and Noah Ostlund I have to admit I don't know alot about. He may be very promising.

So perhaps it's better to say Stay away from Vegas veterans they're willing to unload for cheap. Unless you have cap space to burn. I just think they're really good at identifying players on the down turn and unloading them. And I also think players are naturally motivated to play in the City so you may be due for some motivational regression.

Players line up to play there no matter how they're treated. And I'm not saying they treat they're players poorly. I just think they're not afraid of the consequences of reputation like a lot of other franchises have to consider. It's put up or get out there. Like I mentioned in my earlier post. Reilly wasn't good against the Oilers in the playoffs. They knew and unloaded him. Pittsburgh in desperation took him. It's not the worst fleecing ever. His stats aren't brutal. But it sounds like he's not really moving the dial helping the team win either.

I mean sure. They knew guys like Schmidt, Pacioretty, etc. were either cooked or playing above their heads and figured Fleury was going to start declining but using the Oilers series as a measuring stick is weird when considering Smith had 14 points in 22 playoff games. That's not a point per game pace but it's still very solid for a second liner.

I mean, don't get me wrong. Edmonton was probably our toughest opponent but his being colder against the Oilers is not proof that at 32 he can't still be productive in the NHL. It just feels like such a bizarre premise.

 

[eramosat]

Dubas does not need to be good at drafting. Knowing Pittsburgh luck.They will end up drafting first overall in 2026.

From Mario L/Jagr> Crosby/Malkin> Gavin McKenna(2026)....

Pitts is one of the luckiest team in the league. Two generational talent drafted by the same team....

Sorry, but you're waaaayy off.

They are THE luckiest team. Period. No one has accumulated at the draft with luck-based picks anything remotely like they have, ever since the draft was instituted. Their first 15 years were lean, but it's been a party in Pittsburgh ever since!

When Lemieux and/or Crosby and the likes of Jagr and Malkin et al are drafted and play for your team for just about 40 years in a row? And actually deliver on their draft day hype to the tune of 5 Stanley Cups?! That is quite simply nuts to contemplate, and even as a thorough non-Pittsburgh fan, I gotta salute that run. It rivals anything accomplished pre-expansion, as well as the nutty runs of the 60s/70's Habs, the 80's Isles and the 80s/90 Oilers.

For fans...probably better than all of those, as blocs of grandparents, parents and children fans would all get a taste to savor together. 40 years, wow.

 

[BallardEra]

 

[BoHorvat 53]

If Josh Yohe (The Athletic's Penguins reporter) is to be believed, he thinks firing Mike Sullivan isn't even on the table for this season. Find that very interesting, but I just do not understand how this Pens team is this bad. They're metrics at 5-on-5 would suggest they're somewhere around the 6th-9th best team in the league - definitely top 10. Taking a look at MoneyPuck's 5-on-4 stats, the Pens should have a Power Play that ranks in the top half of the league for sure, as their xGoals % is between the Canucks and Stars - two teams that are in the top half of the league in PP % as the Canucks sit at 10th and the Stars sit at 13th. How is a PP unit with Crosby/Malkin/Karlsson/Letand/Guentzel this bad? They haven't scored more than 3 goals since they beat the Flyers 4-1 on January 8th, which is also shocking. But they should definitely not be this bad.

 

[Midnight Judges]

If Josh Yohe (The Athletic's Penguins reporter) is to be believed, he thinks firing Mike Sullivan isn't even on the table for this season. Find that very interesting, but I just do not understand how this Pens team is this bad. They're metrics at 5-on-5 would suggest they're somewhere around the 6th-9th best team in the league - definitely top 10. Taking a look at MoneyPuck's 5-on-4 stats, the Pens should have a Power Play that ranks in the top half of the league for sure, as their xGoals % is between the Canucks and Stars - two teams that are in the top half of the league in PP % as the Canucks sit at 10th and the Stars sit at 13th. How is a PP unit with Crosby/Malkin/Karlsson/Letand/Guentzel this bad? They haven't scored more than 3 goals since they beat the Flyers 4-1 on January 8th, which is also shocking. But they should definitely not be this bad.

This idea of isolating 5v5 and tossing out the other ~ 35% of scoring has always been fundamentally stupid. Your post highlights this nicely.

 

[sxvnert]

The Pens are Sid Crosby. Period. The captain trying to drag dead weight through another season while Sullivan pretends to be frustrated and shocked is an old act. I like Jeff Carter but when the old man is on both special teams units someone's clueless.
Karlsson replaced Petry and the team is worse after the switch?
Rielly Smith was a beaut on the Cup Champs and looks lost on Sullivan's squad. Jarry leads the league in shut outs and Sid is having a great year (even by his standards) yet the team has not held a play off spot for one day all season?
This team earned the age old option of a "new voice" like no team I've ever seen. Sullivan should take a page from Paul Maurice and get out of the way. As the owners won't make the change and apparently wont let Dubas do it.

This is classic Dubas. Pretend to do everything possible to "improve" the team while allowing the team to implode. Once the media and fans anger reaches its peak, they'll beg him to fire Sully. See the entire Dubas hiring in TO followed by the Babcock firing.

Don't be surprised if Guentzel is still a Pen after TDL. Letting the core fail is far more important to Kyles future plans than a late first round pick.

 

[Golden_Jet]

Sully should let EK65 do what he does best, and jump in play, and rover, except when he’s last D man. Back.

 

[Divine]

No GM has authority to come in there and just tell Sidney Crosby they're rebuilding while he can still play at a high level.

That's not how having a player of his stature works.

You do your best to give them one more last run until they are gone, and then and only then do you rebuild.

And that's not even a GM thing, a rebuild in this kind of case has to be signed off by the owner because really by rebuild you're essentially telling Crosby to go elsewhere and that's an ownership decision, that's not a "your GM woke up on a Tuesday and decided this is the direction of the team" decision.

So why would they even consider trading Guentzel now if that's the case?

 

[BoHorvat 53]

This idea of isolating 5v5 and tossing out the other ~ 35% of scoring has always been fundamentally stupid. Your post highlights this nicely.

I'm gonna take a hint from this reply and just assume reading comprehension isn't your strong suit, because I do go on to mention that their power play is performing well below expectation and don't understand how that is the case. Penalty Kill is also performing in line with where you'd expect it to be based on the underlying numbers. Everything except the power play lines up with the underlying numbers.

 

[sxvnert]

View attachment 819953

Phase two: Hire Keefe

The problem is Dubas, like FSG, legitimately thinks Mike Sullivan is God’s gift to coaching. I’m sure they have cooked up a nice bar graph showing how the Pens season is actually going well.

Dubas will remove anyone who can question his authority.

 

[Midnight Judges]

I'm gonna take a hint from this reply and just assume reading comprehension isn't your strong suit, because I do go on to mention that their power play is performing well below expectation and don't understand how that is the case. Penalty Kill is also performing in line with where you'd expect it to be based on the underlying numbers. Everything except the power play lines up with the underlying numbers.

I'm well aware of what you wrote and that you were not ignoring a huge portion of scoring - as is the current trend in so-called "advanced" stats. Your assumption that I was somehow refuting something in your post is the reading comprehension issue here.

The point is, a well-rounded team generally needs to be good across the board, and so this current trendy emphasis on 5v5 (I did not say you were doing this) is fundamentally dumber than taking a comprehensive look.

As for the Pens powerplay, yeah in theory the skill ought to be sufficient but that's the beauty of hockey: It's a team sport and the parts have to work together. Talent alone doesn't cut it. Chemistry is a thing.

 

[rahad]

Crosby playing for one season with his childhood team (Habs) would be insane!

 

[jcs0218]

Dubas isn't in any rush to fire Sullivan.

Because firing Sullivan and bringing in his own coach starts the timer on Dubas existence in Pittsburgh.

Dubas has one bullet in his gun, which is firing Sullivan.

Once that bullet is used and Dubas brings in his own coach, then he will no longer be able to blame poor coaching for the Penguins poor performance.

Dubas will then start to face scrutiny regarding his own job performance after he brings in his own coach and that coach fails.

Keeping Sullivan as coach lengthens Dubas honeymoon grace period as GM of the Penguins.

 

[BallardEra]

Pittsburgh Penguins' Jake Guentzel to miss up to four weeks with an upper-body injury | TSN

The struggling Pittsburgh Penguins will have to claw their way back into the playoff race without star forward Jake Guentzel.

www.tsn.ca

 

[Offtheboard412]

If Josh Yohe (The Athletic's Penguins reporter) is to be believed, he thinks firing Mike Sullivan isn't even on the table for this season. Find that very interesting, but I just do not understand how this Pens team is this bad. They're metrics at 5-on-5 would suggest they're somewhere around the 6th-9th best team in the league - definitely top 10. Taking a look at MoneyPuck's 5-on-4 stats, the Pens should have a Power Play that ranks in the top half of the league for sure, as their xGoals % is between the Canucks and Stars - two teams that are in the top half of the league in PP % as the Canucks sit at 10th and the Stars sit at 13th. How is a PP unit with Crosby/Malkin/Karlsson/Letand/Guentzel this bad? They haven't scored more than 3 goals since they beat the Flyers 4-1 on January 8th, which is also shocking. But they should definitely not be this bad.

Everyone on the team thinks they can tip pucks like Crosby the last couple years. Everything is shot pass and redirects. That has to be a part of it. Also all their wingers are kinda all around guys. There's nobody with an above average shot in their line up. I guess Smith's got a pretty good shot but he isn't the player he was 4-5 years ago.

 

[dalewood12]

Sid might just pull of a miracle and drag this team into the playoffs.

 

[BallardEra]

Sid might just pull of a miracle and drag this team into the playoffs.

Team is cooked and Sullivan still feeling no heat.

 

[ffh]

Crosby playing for one season with his childhood team (Habs) would be insane!

To bad the habs are on a decade + rebuild and it won't happen.

 

[GhostfaceWu]

This team could rebuild in three years if they traded away Crosby rust Letang Karlsson and Malkin but they'd rather miss the playoffs with this group and have nothing to show for it in three years

 

[wetcoast]

Dubas isn't in any rush to fire Sullivan.

Because firing Sullivan and bringing in his own coach starts the timer on Dubas existence in Pittsburgh.

Dubas has one bullet in his gun, which is firing Sullivan.

Once that bullet is used and Dubas brings in his own coach, then he will no longer be able to blame poor coaching for the Penguins poor performance.

Dubas will then start to face scrutiny regarding his own job performance after he brings in his own coach and that coach fails.

Keeping Sullivan as coach lengthens Dubas honeymoon grace period as GM of the Penguins.

Pretty much this but came here to say that the Pens playoff chances are toast, they simply have squandered too many opportunities and really are wasting a really good year from Crosby.

I thought trading for EK was a really dumb idea and losing that 1st rounder is really coming back to haunt them.

Dubas was that GM and they might be able to retain their #1 this year because it's top 10 protected but the team will probably be worse next year.

just a complete mess.

This team could rebuild in three years if they traded away Crosby rust Letang Karlsson and Malkin but they'd rather miss the playoffs with this group and have nothing to show for it in three years

The problem is that all of them have a no movement clause except for Letang who has a 10 team list AFTER the 25-26 season.

Realistically the only player getting back any decent return would be Crosby given the ages and performance of players involved.

 

[CaptainShark]

Thread title should be changed to „The Pittsburgh Penguins are getting old“.

I get major San Jose Sharks vibes from a few years back, desperately trying to give the old core more chances at glory and not seeing there is no way they win anything with that core anymore and not seeing that being in the mushy middle doesn’t help your rebuilt.

 

[jcs0218]

The Penguins only solution is to sign and play the ageless wonder Jaromir Jagr.