Rumor: Things Not Left Unsaid: Flyers Rumors & Media Mentions

[GKJ]

It's the cleanest way possible, short of someone trading for him at full salary or with better retention.

Oh you mean clear his whole salary.

We would have to give up assets to do that given what we’re getting just to retain half.

 

[Cody Webster]

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

I'm sorry but the fact that some of you guys are arguing over using a salary retention slot for TDA vs. using a buyout for TDA is kinda embarrassing. He is not worth this amount of discourse. The trade Fletch made for him was the worst of his entire tenure as GM, which says a lot, and the sooner they wash their hands of him, the better. The return ultimately doesn't matter; you're not recouping anywhere close to the sort of value that you gave up for him anyway.

And no, i have no reason to believe he would fetch more at the deadline. Not when he'd likely be healthy scratch for whatever amount of time he'd still be on the Flyers.

What’s embarrassing about it? Every single thing this organization does matters. Process matters.

Glossing over miscalculations by the organization is how we get in this mess.

We’ve had these exact discussions for years now and contrary to “popular” belief they do matter.

If you don’t actively want the prospect that you’re getting then a buyout is the better move where the organization is. Flexibility matters.

 

[BrindamoursNose]

They f***ing better not be if that's the return we'd get

 

[Striiker]

f***ing delusional

 

[BrindamoursNose]

It would be fun and a good twist if there really is a leak in the Flyers not-named Briere or Jones and this weekend was just an exercise to find out who is filtering the wrong information a la Tyrion in Game of Thrones.

Tell some people one thing, tell another to others, and something totally separate to a different party...see what comes from where.



I have zero belief this *is* what happened, but that would be a fun twist if SanFilipo's stupid "know it all inside" face was bamboozled

 

[FatTugboatFlahr]

Why do people give a shit if we’re retaining salary on people.

It’s one of the most useful tools a dogshit team has.

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

f***ing delusional

Ah, they’re already laying the groundwork for “Mission Accomplished.”

 

[Redpath]

Oh you mean clear his whole salary.

We would have to give up assets to do that given what we’re getting just to retain half.

I don't mean his whole salary. I thought that's what you were getting at it with "that's not possible."

Briere liking the D-tier prospect that we'd be getting back for trading/retaining DeAngelo is not "the only reason" to not buy him out. (That's just preemptive false framing to claim and complain that the Flyers actually value whatever D-tier prospect we get back.) Another, more practical reasoning for trading/retaining DeAngelo is that it saves money in 2024-25, which a buyout would not.

 

[VladDrag]

For those who responded to me re Sanheim and the scratching in Calgary, thank you.

I haven't been following NHL news as much this summer, so I was just curious if further information came out regarding the relationship between Torts and Sanheim.

 

[Columbus Hockey Dad]

Why do people give a shit if we’re retaining salary on people.

It’s one of the most useful tools a dogshit team has.

Because you can only have three active salary retentions at one time. TDA is dogshit that no one wants (thanks Chuck). I would rather buy him out than use up one of the retention spots. Retention spots should be used for players who would otherwise have value if some salary was retained. TDA has no value either way.

 

[GKJ]

I don't mean his whole salary. I thought that's what you were getting at it with "that's not possible."

Briere liking the D-tier prospect that we'd be getting back for trading/retaining DeAngelo is not "the only reason" to not buy him out. (That's just preemptive false framing to claim and complain that the Flyers actually value whatever D-tier prospect we get back.) Another, more practical reasoning for trading/retaining DeAngelo is that it saves money in 2024-25, which a buyout would not.

who cares about saving money in 2025? We don’t need it then either.

 

[TheKingPin]

Getting salary cap space to trade for picks seems important this year more than ever. Using a retention spot on TDA is dumb. Let him play out the deal. Move him at the deadline. But who cares about getting a low return on him? Get a big retention or take back a loafer contract for a 1st like has been done in the past.

 

[BrindamoursNose]

Why do people give a shit if we’re retaining salary on people.

It’s one of the most useful tools a dogshit team has.

If we had unlimited slots, no one would care. But since we only have 3 slots and a massive pile of crap - it's important to be strategic with them.

We should be weaponizing it to get picks/prospects in return for what we ship off, not to sell players without getting any return. I'd rather eat a contract via buyout rather than trade them 50% if we're not getting anything back in value.

 

[Redpath]

who cares about saving money in 2025? We don’t need it then either.

More cap space is better than less cap space. There is no sense in wasting cap space on a buyout, even if it's a relatively small amount, when it can be used to facilitate future trades instead (Like taking on more Cal Petersens)

 

[DrinkFightFlyers]

Getting salary cap space to trade for picks seems important this year more than ever. Using a retention spot on TDA is dumb. Let him play out the deal. Move him at the deadline. But who cares about getting a low return on him? Get a big retention or take back a loafer contract for a 1st like has been done in the past.

Why does it matter? It is one year of retention in a year that we don't need cap space. I think we are able to retain on three at a time. Hayes is a no-brainer, then TDA, then we still have another spot if we need to retain on someone else (like perhaps Krug if that deal goes through).

 

[LegionOfGloom]

More cap space is better than less cap space. There is no sense in wasting cap space on a buyout, even if it's a relatively small amount, when it can be used to facilitate future trades instead (Like taking on more Cal Petersens)

Retention slots can also be used to facilitate future trades (same trade you listed as an example but with Provorov).

The question is whether $2.5 million in cap space and this D-level prospect is more valuable than what another retention slot could ultimately bring. I don't know the answer to that and doubt Briere knows it either since who knows what offers may come in the next 9 months. But given the lackluster return, I'd rather take the chance and find out.

Why does it matter? It is one year of retention in a year that we don't need cap space. I think we are able to retain on three at a time. Hayes is a no-brainer, then TDA, then we still have another spot if we need to retain on someone else (like perhaps Krug if that deal goes through).

It's not just our own players. The retention slot can also be used to be a third-party broker for other trades.

 

[GKJ]

More cap space is better than less cap space. There is no sense in wasting cap space on a buyout, even if it's a relatively small amount, when it can be used to facilitate future trades instead (Like taking on more Cal Petersens)

How many Cal Petersen’s are you expecting to take on with the cap finally going up next year? Are we taking $30m in cap dumps?

 

[Redpath]

Why does it matter? It is one year of retention in a year that we don't need cap space. I think we are able to retain on three at a time. Hayes is a no-brainer, then TDA, then we still have another spot if we need to retain on someone else (like perhaps Krug if that deal goes through).

To add to this point, if we retain on Krug and Hayes, that is 2 of our 3 retention slots gone through 2026.

The advantage on retaining on DeAngelo is that a) we can get an asset by using his freed up cap space to take on someone else's expiring deal at the deadline, while b) soon earning that retention slot back because DeAngelo is an expiring contract.

 

[DrinkFightFlyers]

It's not just our own players. The retention slot can also be used to be a third-party broker for other trades.

Sure, but we have 3 spots. We can facilitate another deal at the deadline or use it for another player like a Krug. What's the difference if we trade TDA now retained and get a pick or retain a different contract that may or may not ever come to fruition? It's a small amount for one year and gives us another slot to use at some point later.

 

[LegionOfGloom]

To add to this point, if we retain on Krug and Hayes, that is 2 of our 3 retention slots gone through 2026.

The advantage on retaining on DeAngelo is that a) we can get an asset by using his freed up cap space to take on someone else's expiring deal at the deadline, while b) soon earning that retention slot back because DeAngelo is an expiring contract.

Again, that limits you to a situation where a team just wants to dump a player. If you have an open retention slot, you can get involved in a situation where you're critical to a team acquiring a player it actually wants by being able to retain half of it.

Sure, but we have 3 spots. We can facilitate another deal at the deadline or use it for another player like a Krug. What's the difference if we trade TDA now retained and get a pick or retain a different contract that may or may not ever come to fruition? It's a small amount for one year and gives us another slot to use at some point later.

It's just maintaining optionality. I understand your point that we may end up not needing that extra retention slot. By the same token, we may also not need that extra $2.5 million in space. It's impossible to know right now whether or not we'd be better off hanging onto the retention slot. I'm ok with the possibility of potentially losing this D-level prospect to find out.

 

[Curufinwe]

Getting salary cap space to trade for picks seems important this year more than ever. Using a retention spot on TDA is dumb. Let him play out the deal. Move him at the deadline. But who cares about getting a low return on him? Get a big retention or take back a loafer contract for a 1st like has been done in the past.

Angelo is persona non grata around these parts. Just like Hayes.

 

[deadhead]

We're not retaining on Krug.

 

[BrindamoursNose]

We're not retaining on Krug.

Especially because he refuses to come here

 

[Redpath]

Retention slots can also be used to facilitate future trades (same trade you listed as an example but with Provorov).

The question is whether $2.5 million in cap space and this D-level prospect is more valuable than what another retention slot could ultimately bring. I don't know the answer to that and doubt Briere knows it either since who knows what offers may come in the next 9 months. But given the lackluster return, I'd rather take the chance and find out.


It's not just our own players. The retention slot can also be used to be a third-party broker for other trades.

But the downside of doing a Provorov-type retention deal is that it ties up the retention slot for years. We are already losing a retention slot on Hayes for years, too. Obviously these types of trades should be considered, but there is also value in quick turnaround on retaining (for lack of a better word) our retention slots in order to maximize how many can be performed.

Again, that limits you to a situation where a team just wants to dump a player. If you have an open retention slot, you can get involved in a situation where you're critical to a team acquiring a player it actually wants by being able to retain half of it.

Yes, it does have a limiting factor in that we can only take on a cap dump versus brokering a retention. (Assuming we actually hit the 3-limit threshold). But an asset from a cap dump + quick turnaround in regaining DeAngelo's retention slot has value too that needs to be factored in. (Versus having the retention slot lost for seasons)

How many Cal Petersen’s are you expecting to take on with the cap finally going up next year? Are we taking $30m in cap dumps?

Are we going to have that much cap space? Gagner, Lehtera, and Filppula, were an easy ~$15 million when we weren't even trying to rebuild and truly weaponize cap space.