Prospect Info: The Second Overall Pick Thread: Part III (Kakko/Hughes Talk)

[apoptygma]

I don't understand how some so sure that we can pencil say Newhook drafted as 12. overall as our 2. line center in a few years and think of it as a rooster spot filled for another decade. He can become that 2. line center, he can also become a real 1. line center, or even a 3. liner or bust. Same for Seider and that 2-way d-man on the right side.

There might be some truth for it from a statically point of view, but our 2. line center 5 years in the future might come from a 7. round draft pick, from a trade, or even as a UFA.
Trading up makes me queasy, the odds of getting a better value on a trade up unless is into the top 10 feels very low.

 

[offdacrossbar]

There are going to confine to be a lot of moving parts throughout this rebuild. I’ve said for awhile that not every player drafted is going to be on this roster when the rebuild is completed.

also, every prospect and every roster player is an opportunity to improve your team in a hockey trade.

the deals we made for mika Z and mcd27, and even the strome deal, prove that.

im ok moving andersson or any other young guy tbh, as long as its not a lateral move.

you gotta give to get, but the key is getting back more than you give....

 

[Inferno]

Lefty

Hmm that's interesting...I would thought right based on those splits...unless his opposite wing is a great passer too.

Pro players it doesn't matter as much... But ideally you want right center with a high end left wing.. and vice versa... Of course style of players factors in as well...

 

[Inferno]

Lias' plus pionk to Edmonton 8oa.... And then you remember that chiarelli is gone...

 

[Machinehead]

Love the new avi by the way. I am mentally high-fiving VVD every time I see it

Absolutely immense.

He has changed a Liverpool culture that existed for years.

 

[Ola]

- Pido asks Gorton about the excitement of winning the 2OA. Dumb question, but Gorton basically re-lives his experience at the lottery.
- JG is asked about this being a 2 player draft (at the top.) JG says he's happy that they're in the top 2 and then the usual "try not to tip my hand" jargon of "there still is scouting to be done."
- Pido asks if Gorton can say "Kaapo Kakko." JG laughs nervously and says Kaapo Kakko. Says he can also say "Jack Hughes"
-JG gets into what separates the 2 of them from the others in the draft. JG responds with how those guys make the players around them better, how other teams focus on trying to shut them down and can't do anything to stop them. Says "I think it's great for the Rangers and the future is bright." - This is what I was referring to when he basically said he was going to take one or the other.
-Asked about not having a president. Says it hasn't changed his process at all. His exact words "We're making deals, we're trying to trade people."
- Gets into detail about Fox, Shestyorkin and Kravstov.

Good that you replied, ment to do it earlier but was disrupted.

It was really zero info in that interview besides ‘we are trying to trade people/players’. And to be honest, Gorton just referred to having made a trade, and said that in connection to them trying to keep doing that, it was certainly a bit of a slip. Freudian? I don’t think that is far fetched — but it was a real nothing interview. Fluff piece.

 

[romba]

I don't understand how some so sure that we can pencil say Newhook drafted as 12. overall as our 2. line center in a few years and think of it as a rooster spot filled for another decade. He can become that 2. line center, he can also become a real 1. line center, or even a 3. liner or bust. Same for Seider and that 2-way d-man on the right side.

There might be some truth for it from a statically point of view, but our 2. line center 5 years in the future might come from a 7. round draft pick, from a trade, or even as a UFA.
Trading up makes me queasy, the odds of getting a better value on a trade up unless is into the top 10 feels very low.

It’s the same thought process as the guys predicting our record to be significantly better next year based purely on our rookies coming over replacing the vets we have and will continue to trade away. Yes, they’re highly touted and very skilled but rookies have lots of growing pains even when they’re scoring consistently which can’t be expected. And our second year guys will have plenty of growing and learning to do themselves.

Pretty much agreed about trading up. The name sounds sexy as hell but is it worth the sacrifice to move?

 

[Ola]

- Pido asks Gorton about the excitement of winning the 2OA. Dumb question, but Gorton basically re-lives his experience at the lottery.
- JG is asked about this being a 2 player draft (at the top.) JG says he's happy that they're in the top 2 and then the usual "try not to tip my hand" jargon of "there still is scouting to be done."
- Pido asks if Gorton can say "Kaapo Kakko." JG laughs nervously and says Kaapo Kakko. Says he can also say "Jack Hughes"
-JG gets into what separates the 2 of them from the others in the draft. JG responds with how those guys make the players around them better, how other teams focus on trying to shut them down and can't do anything to stop them. Says "I think it's great for the Rangers and the future is bright." - This is what I was referring to when he basically said he was going to take one or the other.
-Asked about not having a president. Says it hasn't changed his process at all. His exact words "We're making deals, we're trying to trade people."
- Gets into detail about Fox, Shestyorkin and Kravstov.

Good that you replied, ment to do it earlier but was disrupted.

It was really zero info in that interview besides ‘we are trying to trade people/players’. And to be honest, Gorton just referred to having made a trade, and said that in connection to them trying to keep doing that, it was certainly a bit of a slip. Freudian? I don’t think that is far fetched — but it was a real nothing interview. Fluff piece.

 

[Ghost of jas]

It’s the same thought process as the guys predicting our record to be significantly better next year based purely on our rookies coming over replacing the vets we have and will continue to trade away. Yes, they’re highly touted and very skilled but rookies have lots of growing pains even when they’re scoring consistently which can’t be expected. And our second year guys will have plenty of growing and learning to do themselves.

Pretty much agreed about trading up. The name sounds sexy as hell but is it worth the sacrifice to move?

The reason it is being discussed is that it has mentioned both by Brooks and by some of our insiders here that, yes, the plan to attempt to secure another top 10 pick, and the philosophy this time around is quality over quantity this time around. You can debate the merits of that approach, but that doesn't change it.

 

[haveandare]

I’d be surprised if we move lias soon and very surprised if strome spends a significant amount of time at 2C

 

[Rangerfans]

It’s the same thought process as the guys predicting our record to be significantly better next year based purely on our rookies coming over replacing the vets we have and will continue to trade away. Yes, they’re highly touted and very skilled but rookies have lots of growing pains even when they’re scoring consistently which can’t be expected. And our second year guys will have plenty of growing and learning to do themselves.

Pretty much agreed about trading up. The name sounds sexy as hell but is it worth the sacrifice to move?

Well prospects and rookies are extremely coveted on these boards. In fact, (without discussing other fan bases) I feel we overhype our prospects personally (minus our Kakko/Hughes pick). Veteran leadership be damned.

 

[Trxjw]

One thing that's often overlooked is the timeline of theses kids coming into the organization and people tend to forget that Howden was acquired 9 months after Andersson was drafted. Similar players and Howden is only 7 months older. If the Rangers view both players as having similar upside and playing similar roles in the organization, then it wouldn't be a huge stretch to think that the guy who has struggled to solidify a spot in the lineup would get moved in favor of the guy who won a spot out of camp.

I certainly don't think it's a guarantee that they deal Andersson, but would I be completely surprised if they did? No I would not. Perhaps there's a team that really likes him and it allows the Rangers to get back into the top-10 or acquire a good young player in exchange. That could make more sense for them in the long run.

 

[Polar Bear]

Good that you replied, ment to do it earlier but was disrupted.

It was really zero info in that interview besides ‘we are trying to trade people/players’. And to be honest, Gorton just referred to having made a trade, and said that in connection to them trying to keep doing that, it was certainly a bit of a slip. Freudian? I don’t think that is far fetched — but it was a real nothing interview. Fluff piece.

Pretty much, but if you read between the lines properly, it was obvious that he was hinting that we're taking Kakko/Hughes, 100%.

 

[ddlennon]

Thought this was interesting was posted on reddit, albeit missing barkovs minute based stats and 5v5 / pp point shares

 

[Brooklyn Rangers Fan]

Thought this was interesting was posted on reddit, albeit missing barkovs minute based stats and 5v5 / pp point shares

I love my large adult son.

 

[Zibanejbread]

Thought this was interesting was posted on reddit, albeit missing barkovs minute based stats and 5v5 / pp point shares

Boing

 

[Synergy27]

It’s the same thought process as the guys predicting our record to be significantly better next year based purely on our rookies coming over replacing the vets we have and will continue to trade away. Yes, they’re highly touted and very skilled but rookies have lots of growing pains even when they’re scoring consistently which can’t be expected. And our second year guys will have plenty of growing and learning to do themselves.

Pretty much agreed about trading up. The name sounds sexy as hell but is it worth the sacrifice to move?

How bad were the Penguins right after drafting Crosby?

 

[Leetch3]

How bad were the Penguins right after drafting Crosby?

crosby's first season the pens finish last in the division...2nd worst record in the league...year 2 they had 105 points and finished 2nd but lost in the first round. year 3 they lost in the finals...

but heading into their return to the playoffs in 06-07, the pens drafted 5th overall, 1st overall, 2nd overall, 1st overall and 2nd overall...so 5 straight years in the top 5, 4 straight years in the top 2 where they came away with 2 generational players. even the oilers are jealous of that run

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

 

[LORDE]

crosby's first season the pens finish last in the division...2nd worst record in the league...year 2 they had 105 points and finished 2nd but lost in the first round. year 3 they lost in the finals...

but heading into their return to the playoffs in 06-07, the pens drafted 5th overall, 1st overall, 2nd overall, 1st overall and 2nd overall...so 5 straight years in the top 5, 4 straight years in the top 2 where they came away with 2 generational players. even the oilers are jealous of that run

The ‘accelerate the rebuild’ crew don’t wanna hear this

 

[Hi ImHFNYR]

If the Rangers view both players as having similar upside and playing similar roles in the organization, then it wouldn't be a huge stretch to think that the guy who has struggled to solidify a spot in the lineup would get moved in favor of the guy who won a spot out of camp.

At their ages, with how cheap they are, with the holes on this team, with how many C's can switch to W and with how many holes both guys still had in their games last year, yes, it's a huge stretch.

If these are redundant vets on a fully constructed team then it's perfectly reasonable to possibly even assume one gets traded in favor of keeping the other.

 

[Hi ImHFNYR]

crosby's first season the pens finish last in the division...2nd worst record in the league...year 2 they had 105 points and finished 2nd but lost in the first round. year 3 they lost in the finals...
but heading into their return to the playoffs in 06-07, the pens drafted 5th overall, 1st overall, 2nd overall, 1st overall and 2nd overall...so 5 straight years in the top 5, 4 straight years in the top 2 where they came away with 2 generational players. even the oilers are jealous of that run

You have to also consider what else was in their prospect pool and what each of those picks went on to be. Then look to see if we have comparables already in our system.

We don't have anything to compare with Crosby and Malkin (but neither does the rest of the league....or you have McDavid but he's on a squad so bad that obviously it's a wash)
We do have kakko and Kravtsov who seem to be positively infested with talent though so we aren't exactly bereft. We also have Chytil, Buch and Zib who can all reasonably be expected to develop into legit top 6 talents (and Zib already is a 1st line talent)

Shesty can be as good as Fleury (who was average at best for ages with many years of meme worthy atrocious playoff performances
Staal wasn't that good.

We have kakko or Hughes incoming. We have kravtsov, Chytil, Andersson, Howden, ADA, Fox, all under control for years.

We still have some solid vets like hank, Zib, Buch and kreider. We could potentially add a major FA addition or two in the next 3 years.

You hope K’Andre and another prospect with a long road ahead can be worthy of a top 4 D/top 6 F spot.

Between Rykov, hajek and Lindgren you hope you can get one of them to be a reliable top 4 guy for years to come

So when I compare our current roster and near future to what the Pens had…
I see us as lacking the obvious best player in the world but we have them far outstripped in terms of all of the other talent we already have in both the pipeline and the roster already. I’d be shocked if we’re still losing after this coming season and would not be surprised at all if we’re in the playoffs next season.

What's nice is there is no team constructed the way the pens team was so we don't have to contend with that. The playing field is more level. Instead of competing aginst like 3 1 OA players ( with two of them being all universe gods), the biggest and best teams had to be built with a diverse array of talents from varying parts of the draft. Look at the teams left this year. No one is even remotely in the same stratosphere that Crosby and malkin were in. I've been saying it for the last two years, we are entering a new period of hockey. The era of domination from the same two or three "top pick" teams is over.

Even the superstar laden TB and Tor teams have stars with big holes in their games that guys like Malkin and Crosby never had

 

[Tawnos]

I was cleaning up the labeling on a map and came across a town in Oklahoma called Krebs and got a horrible flashback to seeing that name over and over again going to the Rangers on the Tankathon Generator.

Is is June 21st yet?

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

I was cleaning up the labeling on a map and came across a town in Oklahoma called Krebs and got a horrible flashback to seeing that name over and over again going to the Rangers on the Tankathon Generator.

Is is June 21st yet?

Krebs means cancer in German. Not sure what to think

 

[Tawnos]

Krebs means cancer in German. Not sure what to think

It's pretty close to a disease in English too.