Salary Cap: The Salary Cap Thread | Trust me... nothing has changed.

[Gurglesons]

Not sure I agree with that... however I think that Sheary - Crosby - Hornqvist is effective enough that we could put Guentzel with Malkin and move Kessel to the 3rd line (or Guentzel on the 3rd line) which would effectively give us 3 legitimate scoring lines. I do not see that happening if both Sheary and Guentzel play on the same line with Crosby. I also think that Sheary is better on LW then RW.

I dunno if I'm misreading him but I think he is saying Guentzel - Crosby - Horny is better.

 

[Peat]

Not sure I agree with that... however I think that Sheary - Crosby - Hornqvist is effective enough that we could put Guentzel with Malkin and move Kessel to the 3rd line (or Guentzel on the 3rd line) which would effectively give us 3 legitimate scoring lines. I do not see that happening if both Sheary and Guentzel play on the same line with Crosby. I also think that Sheary is better on LW then RW.

I think - if memory serves - all Guentzel-Crosby variants (regular season) scored plenty but weren't all that watertight the other way. Where as Sheary-Crosby-Horny scored a bit less but conceded a hell of a lot less. That's my argument.

In any case, the fact that SCH is effective is the main point though.

Although, 3C considerations aside, I'd be interested in Guentzel staying with Crosby and Sheary being tried as the main attacking threat on the 3rd line.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Logically speaking, making the top line Sheary-Crosby-Hornqvist probably makes more sense than anything else, considering how poorly Sheary/Hornqvist fit with other centers on the roster and how flexible guys like Guentzel and Rust are with what line they're on. Ideally, I'd want to see:

Sheary-Crosby-Hornqvist
Guentzel-Malkin-Rust
Hagelin-3C-Kessel
Wilson-Rowney-Reaves

To open the season and:

Sheary-Crosby-Hornqvist
Guentzel-Malkin-Sprong
Rust-3C-Kessel
Hagelin-Rowney-Wilson

To start the playoffs. The only other lineups I'd like include Sprong on LW, which we don't know if he can do yet in the NHL.

 

[mpp9]

If we're playing Rowney or McClement at 3C, I'm not putting Phil with him. You roll a top 6/bottom six.

 

[Empoleon8771]

If we're playing Rowney or McClement at 3C, I'm not putting Phil with him. You roll a top 6/bottom six.

Rowney or McClement aren't going to be our 3C by the time the season is over.

 

[Andy99]

Logically speaking, making the top line Sheary-Crosby-Hornqvist probably makes more sense than anything else, considering how poorly Sheary/Hornqvist fit with other centers on the roster and how flexible guys like Guentzel and Rust are with what line they're on. Ideally, I'd want to see:

Sheary-Crosby-Hornqvist
Guentzel-Malkin-Rust
Hagelin-3C-Kessel
Wilson-Rowney-Reaves

To open the season and:

Sheary-Crosby-Hornqvist
Guentzel-Malkin-Sprong
Rust-3C-Kessel
Hagelin-Rowney-Wilson

To start the playoffs. The only other lineups I'd like include Sprong on LW, which we don't know if he can do yet in the NHL.

I agree that Hornqvist on the first line is the best option to start the season if we don't land a good 3C who he can play with. However, Sid has all but said that he doesn't like Hornqvist on his line. Horny can't make a zone entry and just dumps the puck, which Sid hates. You can see his frustration with the way Horny plays. I just don't see it happening. If Sprong plays well, in the absence of a new 3C, he may be more likely to get a shot on the first line. At least I hope so over Rust. Rust just loses his game on that line and is ineffective

 

[Gurglesons]

I agree that Hornqvist on the first line is the best option to start the season if we don't land a good 3C who he can play with. However, Sid has all but said that he doesn't like Hornqvist on his line. Horny can't make a zone entry and just dumps the puck, which Sid hates. You can see his frustration with the way Horny plays. I just don't see it happening. If Sprong plays well, in the absence of a new 3C, he may be more likely to get a shot on the first line. At least I hope so over Rust. Rust just loses his game on that line and is ineffective

I don't really agree with the Rust can't play with Sid thing. Go look at Rust's points with Sheary and Crosby.

 

[Shaffer]

If we do acquire a third line center for say Wilson/Kuhnackl+2nd, I got:
Guentzel-Crosby-Hornqvist
Hagelin-Malkin-Rust
Sheary-3C-Kessel
Wilson/Kuhnackl-Rowney-Reaves
If we DON'T acquire a third line center, I got:
Guentzel-Crosby-Sheary
Rust-Malkin-Kessel
Hagelin-Rowney-Hornqvist
Wilson/Kuhnackl-McClement-Reaves
OR:
Sheary-Crosby-Hornqvist
Rust-Malkin-Sprong
Hagelin-Guentzel-Kessel
Wilson/Kuhnackl-Rowney-Reaves

I would have really like to run a lineup with an offensive 3rd line center, got a 4th line center, played Rowney as 4th line RW so we could have our 4th line center and Rowney be the PK centers. Kinda like the Cullen/Fehr thing.

 

[Riptide]

I think - if memory serves - all Guentzel-Crosby variants (regular season) scored plenty but weren't all that watertight the other way. Where as Sheary-Crosby-Horny scored a bit less but conceded a hell of a lot less. That's my argument.

In any case, the fact that SCH is effective is the main point though.

Although, 3C considerations aside, I'd be interested in Guentzel staying with Crosby and Sheary being tried as the main attacking threat on the 3rd line.

My only concern with that is I'm not sure that Sheary is creative enough to make enough of a difference there. I think between CS, JG and PK, Sheary needs the most help to produce.

 

[SEALBound]

Logically speaking, making the top line Sheary-Crosby-Hornqvist probably makes more sense than anything else, considering how poorly Sheary/Hornqvist fit with other centers on the roster and how flexible guys like Guentzel and Rust are with what line they're on. Ideally, I'd want to see:

Sheary-Crosby-Hornqvist
Guentzel-Malkin-Rust
Hagelin-3C-Kessel
Wilson-Rowney-Reaves

To open the season and:

Sheary-Crosby-Hornqvist
Guentzel-Malkin-Sprong
Rust-3C-Kessel
Hagelin-Rowney-Wilson

To start the playoffs. The only other lineups I'd like include Sprong on LW, which we don't know if he can do yet in the NHL.

In theory, I think this is rather spot on. In practice though, I doubt we see that. I think Sid doesn't like playing with Horny enough to where we do not see it much outside of a shift here and there.

One option would be to switch Horny and Rust. They seem to like Rust with Sid and as long as Malkin has Jake on his line, I think Horny can work there. Less than ideal though.

 

[Honour Over Glory]

You think that is spot on?

 

[Peat]

My only concern with that is I'm not sure that Sheary is creative enough to make enough of a difference there. I think between CS, JG and PK, Sheary needs the most help to produce.

You may be right. Personally I think Sheary can operate fairly solo against lesser opposition and should have a good wing to back him up anyway, but may be wrong. I like the idea because it limits his minutes a bit and keeps line 3 strong without sacrificing Guentzel-Sid and Geno-Phil. But, yeah, no guarantee it will work.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Sid finally has a winger that he clicks with and provides him with a legitimate chance at winning the scoring title again, and people are quick to remove him.

Why do you people hate Sid so much and want him to fail?

 

[Andy99]

I don't really agree with the Rust can't play with Sid thing. Go look at Rust's points with Sheary and Crosby.

I don't know what sites you're looking at. Most of his points last year occurred through January. He was injured and then wasn't put with Sid until the end of the RS when he returned. He hasn't spent a lot of his playing time with Sid, but when he's played there, he's spent more time trying to get open for Sid to find him based on my eye test. He doesn't play as much the forechecker role. I'm not saying he hasn't put up any good points with Guentzel or Sheary on the first line at times, particularly in the playoffs. But his game is not finding creative ways to get open, but works most effectively off the forecheck. I think he plays really well with Malkin because he can do the dirty work, get Geno the puck to carry in and then get to the net for Geno to find him. I just think he plays a more simple effective game with Geno that compliments his attributes better

 

[Freeptop]

That can't be a real thing.

I hate to break it to you but...

yes, Coldplay really does exist.

 

[Peat]

Sid finally has a winger that he clicks with and provides him with a legitimate chance at winning the scoring title again, and people are quick to remove him.

Why do you people hate Sid so much and want him to fail?

He has multiple such wingers - 3 by my counts if he stops hating Horny's game.

 

[Riptide]

Sid finally has a winger that he clicks with and provides him with a legitimate chance at winning the scoring title again, and people are quick to remove him.

Why do you people hate Sid so much and want him to fail?

Because I could care less if Sid wins another scoring title as long as we're winning Stanley Cups?

 

[Gurglesons]

I don't know what sites you're looking at. Most of his points last year occurred through January. He was injured and then wasn't put with Sid until the end of the RS when he returned. He hasn't spent a lot of his playing time with Sid, but when he's played there, he's spent more time trying to get open for Sid to find him based on my eye test. He doesn't play as much the forechecker role. I'm not saying he hasn't put up any good points with Guentzel or Sheary on the first line at times, particularly in the playoffs. But his game is not finding creative ways to get open, but works most effectively off the forecheck. I think he plays really well with Malkin because he can do the dirty work, get Geno the puck to carry in and then get to the net for Geno to find him. I just think he plays a more simple effective game with Geno that compliments his attributes better

He was playing with Sheary and Crosby in January. 12 of his 28 points were with Sid.

 

[T1K]

I wouldn't be shocked if Blueger got first crack at 3C. I imagine Guentzel and Rust will stay wingers unless Sprong is simply too good to send down.

 

[billybudd]

gefilte fish milkshakes.

Yak. I'll guzzle a warm glass of arsenic before I get within ten feet of that.

 

[billybudd]

After two Cups in two years, my personal benchmark for this coming season to be a success is for the Pens to make the playoffs. Nothing more than that. Anything beyond that will be gravy

Seriously. If we didn't think some measure of attrition was not only possible, but likely, after going back to back in a cap system, we weren't being realistic. Roster holes were gonna pop up and some guys are probably even going to look tired during the year.

If JR figures this out, I'll be ecstatic, but if we limp to the trade deadline with a top-heavy center group, the magnitude of that problem really needs to go into perspective against what he's done since January of 2016. I'm sure as Hell not going to be "depressed" about the recent Penguins, short of, idk, Letang's head falling off during the national anthem one night.

 

[mpp9]

Rowney or McClement aren't going to be our 3C by the time the season is over.

In your scenario they will be with Kessel possibly until the deadline. **** that.

I'm all for spreading the wealth and really don't think you maximize 71 and 81 by putting them together, but Rowney with Kessel is puke worthy. Can't get him the puck. Can't score.

 

[mpp9]

Seriously. If we didn't think some measure of attrition was not only possible, but likely, after going back to back in a cap system, we weren't being realistic. Roster holes were gonna pop up and some guys are probably even going to look tired during the year.

If JR figures this out, I'll be ecstatic, but if we limp to the trade deadline with a top-heavy center group, the magnitude of that problem really needs to go into perspective against what he's done since January of 2016. I'm sure as Hell not going to be "depressed" about the recent Penguins, short of, idk, Letang's head falling off during the national anthem one night.

I agree we're better off waiting than wasting the cap space we have on a run of the mill guy. But if they are serious about going for a dynasty, you simply can't be relying on 87/71 all year for offense. Not a good idea after two long playoff runs when they're both 30+ years old.

 

[Pens x]

I don't know how you can justify taking Jake off Sid's line. They play great together. So now we are going to have a useless fourth line and hinder the top line all because jimbo can't find respectable centers?

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

He has multiple such wingers - 3 by my counts if he stops hating Horny's game.

True. But there's clicking, and then there's "lead the playoffs in goal scoring as a rookie" clicking.

I think it's fair to say that Sid has better chemistry with Guentzel than he's had with any other winger. They tore the league a new one in their very first crack at it, at the most important time of year against the best competition in the world.