The Roster Thread, Summer 2024

[Jim Bob]

Nelson is signed though and has a 16-team NTC because Lou gives those out like he's competing with Ken Holland. 12 of 'em on the Isles from what I see.

It's still not a situation that I would like for this team. A veteran on a one year deal. Age 32. I just don't like how that could work out as it could be another Staal, Hall, and EJ situation that doesn't really move the needle.

Interesting, since he's been used there multiple times, including in the playoffs.

View attachment 874429

View attachment 874426

View attachment 874427

Are you saying a top 6 C on multiple Cup winners could play in the Sabres top 6?

Surely you jest!

 

[Doug Prishpreed]

I'd take one year of 32-yr old Nelson in a heartbeat. It would give me so much hope for next season...he's no Eric Johnson, not by a longshot.

 

[BFLO]

It's still not a situation that I would like for this team. A veteran on a one year deal. Age 32. I just don't like how that could work out as it could be another Staal, Hall, and EJ situation that doesn't really move the needle.


Are you saying a top 6 C on multiple Cup winners could play in the Sabres top 6?

Surely you jest!

Plenty of other teams get their money's worth out of 1 year or short term deals for vets in their 30's.

Maybe we should replace the common denominator in all 3 of those signings/trades, instead of giving up on acquiring good veterans? The common denominator being Kevyn Adams. Seems like he's incapable of identifying and acquiring NHL players that improve the roster. Not that NHL players in their 30's are incapable of improving our roster.

 

[Zman5778]

I think this pick should be be in play. I really hope it's in play.

I'm pretty sure that Adams has come out and said that he's open to the idea of moving 11 OA for the right guy.

I don't think it happens (insert @Jim Bob 's yearly breakdown)........but I do think it's in play.

 

[Doug Prishpreed]

Plenty of other teams get their money's worth out of 1 year or short term deals for vets in their 30's.

Maybe we should replace the common denominator in all 3 of those signings/trades, instead of giving up on acquiring good veterans? The common denominator being Kevyn Adams. Seems like he's incapable of identifying and acquiring NHL players that improve the roster. Not that NHL players in their 30's are incapable of improving our roster.

I used to say "he sucks at everything but drafting" but now I'm not even loving his draft picks. Especially watching Johnston get a Conn Smythe and we're sitting here trying to convince other teams that they should trade us their good players for Rosen because he's utterly redundant.

 

[Jim Bob]

I'm pretty sure that Adams has come out and said that he's open to the idea of moving 11 OA for the right guy.

I don't think it happens (insert @Jim Bob 's yearly breakdown)........but I do think it's in play.

Trading a top 10-15 pick in a deal for an NHL roster player happens way more frequently than the NFL-style trade back for picks.

That trade back for picks is my yearly post when people say "The Sabres should trade back 3-5 spots and add a later pick..."

If you look at the last 5-10 drafts, you see a lot more top 20 picks moving in deals for NHLers.

 

[TheMistyStranger]

I'm pretty sure that Adams has come out and said that he's open to the idea of moving 11 OA for the right guy.

I don't think it happens (insert @Jim Bob 's yearly breakdown)........but I do think it's in play.

It just doesn't happen that often anymore. Feels like it was way more common pre-Cap

 

[Jim Bob]

Plenty of other teams get their money's worth out of 1 year or short term deals for vets in their 30's.

Maybe we should replace the common denominator in all 3 of those signings/trades, instead of giving up on acquiring good veterans? The common denominator being Kevyn Adams. Seems like he's incapable of identifying and acquiring NHL players that improve the roster. Not that NHL players in their 30's are incapable of improving our roster.

Those teams tend to be solid playoff teams before adding such players. Those short term deals tend not to work out great for teams in Buffalo's spot.

Tarasenko to Ottawa, PKane to Detroit, and Domi & Bertuzzi to Toronto are in the similar boat for me in that they could not take teams to that next level.

 

[Archie Lee]

I'm pretty sure that Adams has come out and said that he's open to the idea of moving 11 OA for the right guy.

I don't think it happens (insert @Jim Bob 's yearly breakdown)........but I do think it's in play.

He has said such things. Outside of very high picks (top 3) and truly elite players, pretty much every GM would say that they would move "such and such an asset" for "the right player". It's not very meaningful if the right player is never available.

 

[Dingo44]

I used to say "he sucks at everything but drafting" but now I'm not even loving his draft picks. Especially watching Johnston get a Conn Smythe and we're sitting here trying to convince other teams that they should trade us their good players for Rosen because he's utterly redundant.

A lot of teams passed on Wyatt Johnson and he was drafted after a Covid year where the OHL was shut down. Can't blame Adams for missing that one.

 

[Der Jaeger]

If Adams can somehow move Skinner, even with 50% retained, it opens up roster possibilities.

I assumed the Toronto scenario played out (Marner for Saros, Toronto looking for a 3rd line presence similar to what Edmonton did adding Kane). I traded the 2024 2nd to Toronto for Skinner (50% retained) and Nashville's 5th.

Boy, does that change what Adams could do.

 

[Gabrielor]

A lot of teams passed on Wyatt Johnson and he was drafted after a Covid year where the OHL was shut down. Can't blame Adams for missing that one.

Moving along towards the mid-term of development, and the 2021 class doesn't look particularly great.

Power is a fantastic pick, big win. Franchise D.

Rosen trending to a role player for a 14th pick (13th really, arizona pick was voided) is disappointing.

Poltapov is an unknown and also not exactly dominating the KHL

Kisakov was a pure boom/bust swing trending to bust

Sardarian was a weird pick at the time and, so far, hasn't found his footing in the NCAA

Bloom was traded and actually went back from the AHL to the ECHL to the CHL again last season. Rough.

Nadeau played in the ECHL the majority of the season and skating likely holds him back from more

Marjala is interesting; had a solid D+3 season in the Liiga. He's more of the same soft skill though, so not a great fit for Rochester right now

Von Barnekow is lanky, still growing into his body a bit, and has dealt with multiple injuries in D+2 and D+3 while not doing much.

Novikov looks like a late hit, finally! Skating still needs work, but he could make the NHL on the bottom pair in a few years if it works at it.

Kozak just can't stay healthy. His solid playoff run in 22-23 wasn't expanded upon at all this season. He was either hurt or not producing much. Love the player, but needs to stay healthy.


11 picks, and trending to 1 franchise D, 1 possible role player, 1-2 possible NHL tweeners,. That's it.


It wasn't a great draft, but they could've done much better. 2022, and 2023 hold more promise right now.

 

[paulmm3]

Feels like 15 years, through multiple rounds of firing all the scouts, we've consistently had well below average pro scouting.

 

[Doug Prishpreed]

A lot of teams passed on Wyatt Johnson and he was drafted after a Covid year where the OHL was shut down. Can't blame Adams for missing that one.

I’ve said it before but I think all 10 picks after Rosen were better choices than him too. There’s still time for that to change but at the moment I’d prefer every one of those 10 to be in our system right now, so it’s not just Johnston.

 

[Gabrielor]

Feels like 15 years, through multiple rounds of firing all the scouts, we've consistently had well below average pro scouting.

It has improved under Adams.

2020 was a massive success, there's no other way to put it. They went into the 1st covid draft with 6 picks, only made 5, and came out with 2 top 6 forwards who are still both 22 years old. That beats basically any Murray draft alone. The 3 other picks are nothing, but they were a 5th and 2 7ths.


2021 I broke down above.

2022 has the noted strength of picking 1st 3 times in a deepish draft, but they also seem to have hit late twice. Leinonen at 41 isn't going well, but Neuchev at 74 and especially Komarov at 134 is. If they get 2-3 roster players out of this draft, it'll be a success, and they could get more.

2023 Benson was a top 5 talent that fell for idiotic reasons. We may well have gotten a franchise-type winger at 13, and kudos to Adams for actually making that pick, because he could've been scared about size like 6-7 other GMs were. It's early, but Wahlberg also looks like an ahead-of-the-curve pick. We'll see on the rest, too soon.

2024 8 picks, we'll see how many we make.

 

[KrakenSabresMike]

I’ve said it before but I think all 10 picks after Rosen were better choices than him too. There’s still time for that to change but at the moment I’d prefer every one of those 10 to be in our system right now, so it’s not just Johnston.

Outside of the goalies and Johnston which of those time would you exactly want over Rosen? I’m not exactly seeing the big difference that you apparently are. Also Rosen is producing in the AHL at a decent rate, and can play defense, he’s not a bust so for a mid first round draft pick if you get a middle forward out of it, that sort of. Meeting expectations. Anything more is a rarity

 

[Doug Prishpreed]

Outside of the goalies and Johnston which of those time would you exactly want over Rosen? I’m not exactly seeing the big difference that you apparently are. Also Rosen is producing in the AHL at a decent rate, and can play defense, he’s not a bust so for a mid first round draft pick if you get a middle forward out of it, that sort of. Meeting expectations. Anything more is a rarity

I see players that are doing well in their development and provide things that Buffalo's pipeline doesn't already have, like Rosen does. How many wingers of that type can we fit on this team?

I understand each prospect has a wide variety of opinions, and will continue to have a wide variety of opinions as they enter and play in the NHL. It's not black and white. But Adams whole claim to fame is his drafting, and I'm not seeing him draft better than other teams who are drafting around us, year over year.

 

[Reddawg]

2022 has the noted strength of picking 1st 3 times in a deepish draft, but they also seem to have hit late twice. Leinonen at 41 isn't going well, but Neuchev at 74 and especially Komarov at 134 is. If they get 2-3 roster players out of this draft, it'll be a success, and they could get more.

Just imagine if that 41st overall had been used on Lane Hutson like everyone on this board was clamoring for at the time. It would already be our greatest draft ever.

 

[joshjull]

 

[Doug Prishpreed]

It has improved under Adams.

2020 was a massive success, there's no other way to put it. They went into the 1st covid draft with 6 picks, only made 5, and came out with 2 top 6 forwards who are still both 22 years old. That beats basically any Murray draft alone. The 3 other picks are nothing, but they were a 5th and 2 7ths.


2021 I broke down above.

2022 has the noted strength of picking 1st 3 times in a deepish draft, but they also seem to have hit late twice. Leinonen at 41 isn't going well, but Neuchev at 74 and especially Komarov at 134 is. If they get 2-3 roster players out of this draft, it'll be a success, and they could get more.

2023 Benson was a top 5 talent that fell for idiotic reasons. We may well have gotten a franchise-type winger at 13, and kudos to Adams for actually making that pick, because he could've been scared about size like 6-7 other GMs did. It's early, but Wahlberg also looks like an ahead-of-the-curve pick. We'll see on the rest, too soon.

2024 8 picks, we'll see how many we make.

Fair assessment...but why are we comparing Adams to the shittiest GM ever in Murray and not good GMs like Nill? I want to win a cup, not just be a perennial first-round exit. The drafts in the rebuilding phase need to be better for that to happen. Especially when it's the sole focus of the franchise.

 

[Gabrielor]

Fair assessment...but why are we comparing Adams to the shittiest GM ever in Murray and not good GMs like Nill? I want to win a cup, not just be a perennial first-round exit. The drafts in the rebuilding phase need to be better for that to happen. Especially when it's the sole focus of the franchise.

Because it was a reply to a statement about the previous incarnations of the Sabres management?

I get it, you're upset about the Sabres. Not everything needs to come back to just being pissed.

Just imagine if that 41st overall had been used on Lane Hutson like everyone on this board was clamoring for at the time. It would already be our greatest draft ever.

I was clamoring for Luca Del Bel Belluz who's crushing the AHL playoffs for Cleveland.

The fate of 2022 rests on the big 3, with some nice secondary shots in the Russians.

 

[Doug Prishpreed]

Hilarious. I know I contributed to those searches myself.

 

[Nikolajs Sillers]

Those teams tend to be solid playoff teams before adding such players. Those short term deals tend not to work out great for teams in Buffalo's spot.

Tarasenko to Ottawa, PKane to Detroit, and Domi & Bertuzzi to Toronto are in the similar boat for me in that they could not take teams to that next level.

Hall to Buffalo?

 

[Doug Prishpreed]

Those teams tend to be solid playoff teams before adding such players. Those short term deals tend not to work out great for teams in Buffalo's spot.

Tarasenko to Ottawa, PKane to Detroit, and Domi & Bertuzzi to Toronto are in the similar boat for me in that they could not take teams to that next level.

Domi worked out shockingly well in Toronto, relative to expectations and past performance. Arguably Bertuzzi as well.

DeSmith and Zadorov worked out well too, same with a lot of others. Every year, just as many work out well as poorly. You just need a good GM and pro scouts.

You mainly just need to stay away from one-way wingers, that may be the key to having it work out well.

 

[KeyserSoze81]

I used to say "he sucks at everything but drafting" but now I'm not even loving his draft picks. Especially watching Johnston get a Conn Smythe and we're sitting here trying to convince other teams that they should trade us their good players for Rosen because he's utterly redundant.

All I remember from that draft was being infuriated that they didn't take Jesper Wallstedt (a great prospect at a position of need) and chose a slight winger. This was somewhat mitigated by the Levi trade, but I still don't like it. I was further agitated when they felt the need to force draft a goalie the following year and passed on some really nice names in the second round.

Rosen has developed nicely relative to his projection, which is still pretty awful considering he was the de facto 13th overall.

>50% of those Jeff Skinner buyouts on CapFriendly came from Lindy Ruff's IP address...