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The Roster Thread, Summer 2024

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Dingo44 said:
How many more wins would the Sabres have had over the last three years if Skinner wasn't on the team?

i know this going back and forth is a pointless exercise because it's really personal with you and Skinner obviously and logical arguments aren't effective in winning arguments against emotional feelings.

I'm not a Skinner fanboy but I can see the numbers and with the NMC it makes zero sense financially to buy out Skinner before next season. I doubt he waves - and Toronto would not be interested even at 50% retention. But the good news is Skinner still scores goals and gets assists and he's not as much of an analytics black hole as Oloffson. I also doubt Adams is even considering a buyout this year.
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I'm not arguing that we should buy him out or trade him -- I agree we're stuck with him.

My argument is that he has made it extremely difficult for any coach to make the playoffs with Buffalo since they are forced to try to use him in a big role because of his contract, before eventually and ultimately giving up and demoting him when it's too late and the damage is already done to the W/L record.

That will also be the case with Lindy so we have to hope that Lindy is good enough, and the rest of the roster is good enough to overcome that handicap this team has had for many years.
 
Beerz said:
We don't need Skinners cap hit THIS year.

We have like 24 million of cap space with only UPL to sign that is going to take any significant cap space... unless we do plan on keeping Joker.
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The Sabres don’t need the cap space to ice a team. Vancouver didn’t need OEL’s space to ice a team either, but they used the space to ice a better team. If properly managed we could ice a better team without Skinner and utilizing an extra $7.55 million in cap space. This is a critical year in team history. Cheap and safe is not a winning strategy.
 
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Archie Lee said:
The Sabres don’t need the cap space to ice a team. Vancouver didn’t need OEL’s space to ice a team either, but they used the space to ice a better team. If properly managed we could ice a better team without Skinner and utilizing an extra $7.55 million in cap space. This is a critical year in team history. Cheap and safe is not a winning strategy.
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We can still do that with Skinner and you're not going to see huge money brought in anyways simply based on the contracts that have to deal with in a few years which would be much more difficult when you're paying Skinner 6.25 mill for not playing plus his replacement
 
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Beerz said:
We can still do that with Skinner and you're not going to see huge money brought in anyways simply based on the contracts that have to deal with in a few years which would be much more difficult when you're paying Skinner 6.25 mill for not playing plus his replacement
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Here is Skinner’s cap hit over the next 3 years based on a buyout in 2024, 2025, 2026 and no buyout:

2024: 1.44, 4.44, 6.44
2025: 9.00, 4.00, 6.00
2026: 9.00, 9.00, 5.66
None: 9.00, 9.00, 9.00

When is it down the road that a Skinner buyout creates this $6.25 million barrier to re-signing players, that is resolved by delaying a buyout?
 
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Skinner will not be bought out so we need to be more creative in team building for next year all the while not hamstringing us from signing futures like Quinn.
 
Jim Bob said:
People thought that about the coaching staff and we saw what happened there...


You have to find the overlap in the Venn diagram of:

- Centers on teams with cap issues
- Centers without trade protection
- Centers that fit what the Sabres need

Cirelli isn't the only guy on that list. But, that list is not huge.
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Brock Nelson...1 year at 6MM
 
Archie Lee said:
This is fair and probably true. If we are not going to be a cap team then a buyout doesn’t make a lot of sense. But, “Pegula won’t spend” is not the same as a buyout makes “zero sense”. Many of the teams in the playoffs, including two still competing, had dead cap hits more than $2.44 million this year. If you are doing all you can to win this off-season, you buyout Skinner.
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If I were the Leafs and had this buyout, I would say no. I would wait until the final year and live with Skinner for two years.
 
Doug Prishpreed said:
Pegula did well - coach contracts don’t impact the team cap so it really doesn’t matter to anyone but Terry.

It’s not a coincidence that Buffalo is paying the least out of anyone. That was likely the primary criteria for a coach.
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The only coach on that list who is a clear cut above Lindy is Rod. They identified their guy and got him. If they chased Berube they would’ve been the last one at musical chairs and we’d have Mike Yeo behind the bench.
 
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Beerz said:
We don't need Skinners cap hit THIS year.

We have like 24 million of cap space with only UPL to sign that is going to take any significant cap space... unless we do plan on keeping Joker.
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no, but I think any real talk about a skinner buyout has to be based around his roster spot in the top 6 and his inability to produce when not playing there. Whether you think that warrants 6 years of cap penalties is the real question. But personally, I think skinner plays as well as his line does so if you're going to play him with a healthy thompson and tuch he will have a fine season. which will placate enough people that he will get 1 more season. at which point he only has a year left and you can buy him out no problem.
 
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MOGlLNY said:
The only coach on that list who is a clear cut above Lindy is Rod. They identified their guy and got him. If they chased Berube they would’ve been the last one at musical chairs and we’d have Mike Yeo behind the bench.
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Another top coach stringing us along just to go to Toronto in the end would have been fairly traumatic. Glad it didn't come to that.
 
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In regards to Mitts, my guess is his agent told Adams he wanted Thompson/Cozens money and Adams balked at it.

The only way I see him making less than Cirelli next year is with an arbitration 1 year deal.
 
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Beerz said:
Cirelli would fit a dire need and has plenty of career left.

The answer to your questions are no I wouldn't trade the 11th OA for him.

And no TB probably doesn't trade him in division. Just like Florida probably doesn't trade Bennett in division or at all

Now imagine Ryan Lindgren was a RHD ... he fits a dire need of a RHD in top 4 for the Sabres .. do you trade 11th OA for him? Need and their role on a successful team is not the determining factors when deciding what to give up in a trade. Talent is.. and Cirelli is not a top third of the draft type of talent.
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Alex Nylander was picked 8th overall.

Grigorenko was picked 12th.

Girgensons was picked 14th.

Zack Kassian was picked 13th.

Marek Zagrapan was picked 13th.

Keith Ballard was picked 11th.

Erik Rasmussen was picked 7th.

There are plenty of guys picked in the range of the 11th pick who I would trade their careers for the remainder of Cirelli on his current contract.

Team building is not just about acquiring talented hockey players.



"I'm not looking for the best players. I'm looking for the right ones."
 
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