OT: The Pittsburgher Thread: They Killed Kenny!

[Buddy Bizarre]

IF KP leads him, blowed up.

Stop the video at the 55-56 second mark and tell if that defender is squared up directly in KP's face. It's amazing he got the pass through.

But if KP releases the pass in time like 95% of NFL QB's are able to do in this situation, the ball is gone before the defender can get in that lane. I count 3 seconds from snap to release . If KP releases it at the 2.5 sec or 2.75 mark this is an easy of a TD. Also the Oline surely knows that this is a quick play so they can't give up ground/pushed back. The interior lineman correctly post up their men.

Only 1 man didn't do their job on that play and it was #8. And I'm not a KP hater either.

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

Two points here:

1. DJ can't stop and sit down- he correctly reads it's man coverage on his side. If he slows, then the DB trailing can chase him down/close the window

2. KP didn't have a "free rusher in his face". That is not an accurate statement. That defender was stymied and was starting to "slip free", but there was a passing window available for KP, he was late on it. If he throws it on time, that rusher hasn't slipped passed the LG by that moment

If you look at the goal line cam at :50 he clearly has #44 right in his face as he throws the ball.

That’s exactly why he makes an inaccurate throw there, but that’s more on him than the line.

He starts to lean away and his mechanics go way off.

He needed to stand tall there and just deliver the strike and take the hit.

That’s just the NFL.

 

[Coastal Kev]

But if KP releases the pass in time like 95% of NFL QB's are able to do in this situation, the ball is gone before the defender can get in that lane. I count 3 seconds from snap to release . If KP releases it at the 2.5 sec or 2.75 mark this is an easy of a TD. Also the Oline surely knows that this is a quick play so they can't give up ground/pushed back. The interior lineman correctly post up their men.

Only 1 man didn't do their job on that play and it was #8. And I'm not a KP hater either.

I don't understand presnap reads, we need Kurt Warner, to know if he should have looked right to start the play or was his first read DJ. As soon as his head comes back to DJ, he releases the ball.

My point, it' wasn't just a bad throw. Defender in his face changed his throwing lane. Defender coming from the right prevents him from leading DJ.

Baldinger probably was drunk and needed to fire of 15 hot takes before bed. I would really love to hear from Kurt Warner regarding this play and I will reach out to him for a breakdown.

 

[DanielPlainview]

On the right, they expect a zone coverage and intend to flood that zone to get a receiver free.
On the left, they have man to man.

100% of NFL offenses run this same concept, there is nothing wrong with this playcall and I've wanted to strangle Canada for 2 years now.

KP looking right actually opens DJ up EVEN MORE. If KP looks at the middle of the field we could even give him a pass bc there wasn't a throwing window.

This is a flat out bad throw. There's zero context or excuse for KP here. None

Again, KP ISNT BEING TOLD TO LOOK LEFT. Clearly. And he’s not been coached up enough to know the difference. You think Pat Narduzzi was giving him good QB tips? lol

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

Again, KP ISNT BEING TOLD TO LOOK LEFT. Clearly. And he’s not been coached up enough to know the difference. You think Pat Narduzzi was giving him good QB tips? lol

I've addressed this: if KP looks left, DJ isn't wide the f*** open bc that middle safety is reading KP's eyes and essentially playing "spy/rover". If he looks left first, no one is open and it's a sack

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

Watching this a few times again, I’m 99% sure DJ is the primary and KP was looking right to pull the safety over, which worked.

Then the middle was cleared out for what should have been an easy TD.

#44 got in KPs face as he threw it, and either KP thought DJ was going to squat on his route or he didn’t see him when #44 was in his face and just guessed where he was.

If he couldn’t see DJ anymore it makes sense why he threw it weird, if not he has to make a way better read there.

 

[Josey Wales]

And we saw the Steelers defense call out there stuff.
Half of the playbook is because of KP. They don’t do rpo and motion he rarely throws it over the middle of the field and when he does he is late

OH it is KP not Canada

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

Another unbelievable Stat. The last time the Steelers beat a playoff bound team by more then 1 score was.................

2020 vs the Browns.

The last time they beat a non division playoff opponent by more then 1 score was..................

2017 vs the Titans.

 

[TimmyD]

And we saw the Steelers defense call out there stuff.
Half of the playbook is because of KP. They don’t do rpo and motion he rarely throws it over the middle of the field and when he does he is late

In your opinion is Kenny Pickett the biggest problem with the Pittsburgh Steelers?

 

[MrBrightside]

It really doesn't have to be one or the other. Because Matt Canada sucks it doesn't mean that Kenny Pickett is a real NFL starting QB. There's a ton of evidence to support that both of them are the problem.

The idea that the guy needs time to determine if he's any good is getting pretty laughable and whomever suggested that this is how Brady and Manning were early in their careers is, um, something. Manning was 2nd in the MVP voting his 2nd season. Brady was 3rd in the MVP voting in his 3rd season. TOTALLY THE SAME THING.

Pickett started 52 college games. He's probably the most experienced QB to come out of college into the NFL in 20 years. The idea that he just needs time belies the very reason he was supposedly drafted - "plug and play him." His ceiling is Ryan Tannehill and the floor is not very high.

 

[TimmyD]

Pickett objectively screwed up on that missed pass there but I also think saying he sucks because he missed a throw on a single play is pretty silly.

Maybe DJ could have caught it if he didn't slip, but Pickett threw it behind him and I think you can pretty easily argue that DJ wouldn't have slipped if Pickett would have thrown it directly to him.

People aren’t saying he sucks because he missed one open throw. People are questioning him because he’s been missing layups most of the season and this was the latest example of it

 

[MrBrightside]

People aren’t saying he sucks because he missed one open throw. People are questioning him because he’s been missing layups most of the season and this was the latest example of it

The corpse of Ben Roethlisberger threw for 3740 yards and 22 TD's in this coordinator's offense in 16 games in 2021 with an 86.8 passer rating.

In 19 games, Pickett has thrown for 3734 yards and 12 TD's with a 78.0 passer rating.

Ben was absolutely done as dirt in 2021 and in the same shit offense still put up far better numbers. The fact Pickett can't even match that season and is actually significantly worse is not a good sign.

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

The corpse of Ben Roethlisberger threw for 3740 yards and 22 TD's in this coordinator's offense in 16 games in 2021 with an 86.8 passer rating.

In 19 games, Pickett has thrown for 3734 yards and 12 TD's with a 78.0 passer rating.

Ben was absolutely done as dirt in 2021 and in the same shit offense still put up far better numbers. The fact Pickett can't even match that season and is actually significantly worse is not a good sign.

Would be a cool data dive to split that QBR into "Canada Called Plays" vs "Ben calling the plays"

I bet Ben's plays would give him close to a 100 QBR and Canada plays would be in the 70's (near KP)

Ben could more often than not overcome Canada's chicanery due to his skill level (even diminished).
KP isn't elite at anything (Yet) and we're seeing a middling QB operate in a JV level offense. So yea it's both of these men leaving plays on the field every Sunday.

 

[MrBrightside]

Would be a cool data dive to split that QBR into "Canada Called Plays" vs "Ben calling the plays"

I bet Ben's plays would give him close to a 100 QBR and Canada plays would be in the 70's (near KP)

Ben could more often than not overcome Canada's chicanery due to his skill level (even diminished).
KP isn't elite at anything (Yet) and we're seeing a middling QB operate in a JV level offense. So yea it's both of these men leaving plays on the field every Sunday.

Yeah. The one thing that gives you some hope for Pickett, or the one thing that gives me hope anyway, is the way the offense can work late in games when it's more ad hoc and unscripted. Or maybe that's just sample sizes and circumstances...but that is the one argument for Pickett that I can see having some legs.

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

Yeah. The one thing that gives you some hope for Pickett, or the one thing that gives me hope anyway, is the way the offense can work late in games when it's more ad hoc and unscripted. Or maybe that's just sample sizes and circumstances...but that is the one argument for Pickett that I can see having some legs.

I guess the gist of it is this:

With the OC and the QB, you can have 1 be bad and still eek out some wins. Ben was bad for most of the game bc of the crappy OC.
You can't have BOTH be bad and expect success. KP and Canada are both bad at their jobs. The difference is that Canada has 3 years of poor tape. KP is what, on his 18th pro game = 1 season?

The only reason the Steelers have a winning record (barely) is entirely due to the defense. And that is not sustainable in 2023 NFL ball.

 

[JTG]

If you really are going to argue that missing a guy who was wide open 8 yards away from him isn't on the QB, well, H2P FOREVER PITT ROCKS KENNY!!! as there's no defense of that.


Pickett is in his 20th NFL game. If he can't ascertain mismatches at the LOS at this point he's never going to.

To be fair, we had yet another incident where a defensive play caller stated that they knew exactly what was going to happen a majority of the time and that the offense was predictable.

A QB matters - he needs to hit that first throw down the middle, and he sails FAR too many throws. This offensive scheme is in such shambles though, it's like trying to play football in a gauntlet. The defense knows when the pass is coming, they know when the run is coming, and there is almost no playbook. NFL pros have stated that the plays Canada is utilizing are like 2000's football. There is nothing original or creative about any of it.

Kenny is an issue, but Kenny isn't being set up for success either. If anyone believes he is, we are watching totally different games.

We are talking about Kenny but has anyone looked at our rushing stats yesterday? Not one runner had more than 20 yards!

Warren - 5 for 19
Trubisky - 3 for 18
Harris - 7 for 13
Pickett - 1 for 10
Austin - 2 for 10

 

[DanielPlainview]

I've addressed this: if KP looks left, DJ isn't wide the f*** open bc that middle safety is reading KP's eyes and essentially playing "spy/rover". If he looks left first, no one is open and it's a sack

Then what the hell are you bitching about?

A veteran QB knows there could be a matchup problem and to look left EVENTUALLY. He doesn’t have to stare the guy down

 

[JTG]

Anyone who has watched Pitt football has seen this version of Pickett before - it was his first 3 years when he was totally shellshocked from horrendous line play and he had zero faith that the 5 guys in front of him were going to protect him. It's literally like watching a rewind of Pitt football from 7 years ago.

 

[DanielPlainview]

And the idea that he has to be coached up...good lord...what do all of the following players have in common?

Trevor Lawrence
Jalen Hurts
Tua Tagovailoa
Justin Herbert
CJ Stroud
Brock Purdy

They are all younger than Kenny Pickett.


Yeah when Randle-El and Cedric Wilson are your #2 and #3 WR it's definitely evidence that Ben was a product of the offense.

I swear.

Quit being a baby.

Hines and Randel El were good vets and Nate Washington was a good rookie along with Heath Miller.

It certainly says something about the state of this team when that group was far more productive than what we have now even though the offense objectively has better weapons now.

 

[Coastal Kev]

Anyone who has watched Pitt football has seen this version of Pickett before - it was his first 3 years when he was totally shellshocked from horrendous line play and he had zero faith that the 5 guys in front of him were going to protect him. It's literally like watching a rewind of Pitt football from 7 years ago.

In fairness, most qb's will crumble from horrific line play, outside of Ben. I can remember several games peak Brady would melt when he got immediate pressure up the middle all game.

Its the chicken or the egg argument. Kenny may not be the answer, but I can't get on that bandwagon watching this OLINE Play this season.

 

[Buddy Bizarre]

Then what the hell are you bitching about?

A veteran QB knows there could be a matchup problem and to look left EVENTUALLY. He doesn’t have to stare the guy down

I'm not sure what YOU are bitching about. I gave you a reasonable response yet you don't see to like it for some reason?

Pick any QB you'd like and ask them to run that same play while first looking left. I promise you no one can make that thrown in that tight of a window with a safety coming down hard on that in/slant. That play is sunk no matter who is throwing the ball.

Reads and looking off coverage are just as important as accuracy.

 

[Empoleon8771]

Tomlin is a dolt

 

[BackToTheBrierePatch]

To be fair, we had yet another incident where a defensive play caller stated that they knew exactly what was going to happen a majority of the time and that the offense was predictable.

A QB matters - he needs to hit that first throw down the middle, and he sails FAR too many throws. This offensive scheme is in such shambles though, it's like trying to play football in a gauntlet. The defense knows when the pass is coming, they know when the run is coming, and there is almost no playbook. NFL pros have stated that the plays Canada is utilizing are like 2000's football. There is nothing original or creative about any of it.

Kenny is an issue, but Kenny isn't being set up for success either. If anyone believes he is, we are watching totally different games.

We are talking about Kenny but has anyone looked at our rushing stats yesterday? Not one runner had more than 20 yards!

Warren - 5 for 19
Trubisky - 3 for 18
Harris - 7 for 13
Pickett - 1 for 10
Austin - 2 for 10

They had 12 designed plays for the RBs yesterday? I know the running game hasn’t been good all season but how can these get into rhythm with so few play calls

Tomlin is a dolt

Holy shit what a stupid comment from Tomlin

 

[pistolpete11]

Would be a cool data dive to split that QBR into "Canada Called Plays" vs "Ben calling the plays"

I bet Ben's plays would give him close to a 100 QBR and Canada plays would be in the 70's (near KP)

Ben could more often than not overcome Canada's chicanery due to his skill level (even diminished).
KP isn't elite at anything (Yet) and we're seeing a middling QB operate in a JV level offense. So yea it's both of these men leaving plays on the field every Sunday.

So....Ben for OC?

Tomlin is a dolt

I can't believe anybody takes this guy seriously anymore.

 

[TNT87]

Yes, the interception in the end zone didn't really matter. I mean it only took points off the board for them that's all. What a f***ing idiot this guy is.



Good thing what happens in the first quarter doesn't matter right Coach Cliche?