GDT: The Pittsburgher Thread: The Steelers out-stupid the Raiders!

[Coastal Kev]

Nothing like another nice long week of Spider-Man-pointing-at-Spider-Man for Steelers fans trying to figure out what the biggest problem is/who shoulders the most blame.

Bottom line: yesterday was flat out unacceptable. It's one thing to lose that game to a garbage team decimated by injuries who basically tanked their season, but to lose that game after how the last 2 weeks went, with playoff hopes in jeopardy? Yikes...

Season looks grim, but isn't over just yet - they can redeem themselves by winning out. Not confident they can do that. I do think there's a slight chance they could get their act together and win 2 of the last 3, but that won't be easy.

The shame of it all is that every team to some extent this year has shown some heavy weaknesses and faults. We'd be losing our **** too had our team lost the way New England did to Miami, lost to the Lions, and got blown out by the Titans. But that's still an elite team with a proven track record of success, and at the end of the day I believe they'll still win the AFC.

Based on what? Coaching? Their inconsistent offense? Their spectacular D that does not create turnovers and cannot make a stop when they have to? Or maybe it's their Special teams........ I mean it has to be the Special teams that provides you with so much hope right??

I don't ask my teams to win every year, that would be boring. I do expect them to put their best foot forward and to have a roadmap for success. The problem as I see with Tomlin Ben era is that they actually are a perfect match for each other. They don't have a plan or identity. Throw crap up against the wall and see what sticks.

When it sticks, they look like the best team in the league. But most time, it runs and it's a big ole mess.

 

[Rossi Rat]

Based on what? Coaching? Their inconsistent offense? Their spectacular D that does not create turnovers and cannot make a stop when they have to? Or maybe it's their Special teams........ I mean it has to be the Special teams that provides you with so much hope right??

I don't ask my teams to win every year, that would be boring. I do expect them to put their best foot forward and to have a roadmap for success. The problem as I see with Tomlin Ben era is that they actually are a perfect match for each other. They don't have a plan or identity. Throw crap up against the wall and see what sticks.

When it sticks, they look like the best team in the league. But most time, it runs and it's a big ole mess.

I probably wasn't clear - that team I was referring to that I say will win the AFC is New England.

I don't think there's a soul out there that honestly thinks this Steelers team can win the AFC. Sure the conference is pretty open - but all else equal, you just can't trust these guys. They're more likely than not to miss the playoffs right now I'd say (and most would probably agree). We're hedging our hopes on Baltimore just sucking more, and make no mistake about it, they did choke yesterday. But overall turned in a pretty solid performance against a much better team than Oakland, obviously, and they tend to take care of business at home better than the Steelers do, with an easier schedule to boot.

Watch Cleveland win out and the Steelers/Ravens both lose out.

 

[JimmyTwoTimes]

Mike Tomlin left Ben Roethlisberger and the Steelers’ playoff chances on the bench

This will be a fun week

We may finally get what weve been waiting for if we miss the playoffs. You add this(these 3 losses, especially yesterday and missing the playoffs this year) with what happened last season? Dont see how he could keep his job. With it happening that recently he still didnt learn his lesson to overlook an opponent?

Only way I see him keeping his job is if we beat the Pats and Bengals at least...and make the playoffs.

Question is if we should just root for them to miss this year. Get a higher draft pick(likely 15-18 which would be a much better prospect) and see Tomlin gone.

Lets see how this plays out this week. Im sure they are already coming up with something to say in response to that original comment.

 

[domaug]

I'm sorry but i just don't see THIS Steelers team winning another game this season.

they're probably going to get decimated by the Patriots.

they're going to have a close one with the Saints IMO but the Saints should have the edge.

the Bengals are playing for pride and i see Burfict looking for some heads. couple that with the Steelers always playing down to competition and i think that will be the final nail in this season's coffin.

oh also i predict Brees will throw for over 400 passing yards on this Steelers defense.

 

[Coastal Kev]

Mike Tomlin left Ben Roethlisberger and the Steelers’ playoff chances on the bench

This will be a fun week

We may finally get what weve been waiting for if we miss the playoffs. You add this(these 3 losses, especially yesterday and missing the playoffs this year) with what happened last season? Dont see how he could keep his job. With it happening that recently he still didnt learn his lesson to overlook an opponent?

Only way I see him keeping his job is if we beat the Pats and Bengals at least...and make the playoffs.

Question is if we should just root for them to miss this year. Get a higher draft pick(likely 15-18 which would be a much better prospect) and see Tomlin gone.

Lets see how this plays out this week. Im sure they are already coming up with something to say in response to that original comment.

Hint: They'll never sniff winning again with this current regime.

 

[domaug]

Mike Tomlin left Ben Roethlisberger and the Steelers’ playoff chances on the bench

This will be a fun week

We may finally get what weve been waiting for if we miss the playoffs. You add this(these 3 losses, especially yesterday and missing the playoffs this year) with what happened last season? Dont see how he could keep his job. With it happening that recently he still didnt learn his lesson to overlook an opponent?

Only way I see him keeping his job is if we beat the Pats and Bengals at least...and make the playoffs.

Question is if we should just root for them to miss this year. Get a higher draft pick(likely 15-18 which would be a much better prospect) and see Tomlin gone.

Lets see how this plays out this week. Im sure they are already coming up with something to say in response to that original comment.

I'm of the belief that Tomlin has to do something especially egregious to even have the thought of firing him be a real consideration for the Steelers.

I'm talking something as bold as kicking his feet up during a press conference with a tooth pick in his mouth boasting things like "Hell no the Steelers aren't gonna fire me! They're too scared!!"

 

[JimmyTwoTimes]

Hint: They'll never sniff winning again with this current regime.

Would have to on talent alone. Which was usually the case. Even was when we won our last Superbowl. I dont think Fichtner is a problem...Munchak is a great OLine coach...Saxton is a solid RB coach. Butler and Tomlin are the problem. Colbert refuses to trade at the deadline for some reason but hes not bad like some think he is. Look at some other teams drafts to compare. Look at 2017 for recent example....Watt, Juju, and Conner. Shazier was a helluva pick and would probably be the best ILB in the league right now. And so on. He did have a few bad drafts but that was when we were rebuilding our defense at the same time the league was changing(pass happy league, needing more athletic players on D and they fell for that..picking guys who fit one criteria but not others)...but hes made up for that the past few drafts(to go along with all the great ones he had before) so im not worried about him. We arent the Browns...we arent far off from being a top franchise again. Its just the refusal to fire Tomlin. Thats the problem.

So this loss yesterday was perfect...especially when you add it with what happened last year(interview with Dungy and losing to Jags).

This team has plenty of talent. On offense we know but even on Defense. Imo a new HC and coord would get the most out of these players

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

Interesting thing here re: Tomlin. Is he really that much different than McCarthy?

Both inherited HOF QB's.
Both have won a Super Bowl.
Both have had countless playoff exits since said Super Bowls, including a few one & dones (McCarthy with a 15-1 team, Tomlin with a 13-3 team.)
Both missed the playoffs 4 times, if Tomlin misses this year.

Overall records:
Tomlin: 123-65-1 (8-7 playoffs)
McCarthy: 125-77-2 (10-8 playoffs)

Difference is one guy got lucky enough to work for an org that gives coaches lifetime jobs....

 

[TimmyD]

Mike Tomlin left Ben Roethlisberger and the Steelers’ playoff chances on the bench

This will be a fun week

We may finally get what weve been waiting for if we miss the playoffs. You add this(these 3 losses, especially yesterday and missing the playoffs this year) with what happened last season? Dont see how he could keep his job. With it happening that recently he still didnt learn his lesson to overlook an opponent?

Only way I see him keeping his job is if we beat the Pats and Bengals at least...and make the playoffs.

Question is if we should just root for them to miss this year. Get a higher draft pick(likely 15-18 which would be a much better prospect) and see Tomlin gone.

Lets see how this plays out this week. Im sure they are already coming up with something to say in response to that original comment.

Mike Tomlin getting fired after missing the playoffs one time is about as likely as the Steelers trading for a corner at the deadline was.... in other words buckle up because it’s going to be a bumpy ride. Tomlin isn’t going anywhere

 

[Shrimper]

It's nearly 12.

Why is Boswell still on the team?

 

[Mr Jiggyfly]

Mike Tomlin getting fired after missing the playoffs one time is about as likely as the Steelers trading for a corner at the deadline was.... in other words buckle up because it’s going to be a bumpy ride. Tomlin isn’t going anywhere

Steeler fans are stuck in purgatory.

Tomlin would have to have a few seasons of missing the playoffs before he gets fired, and that’s not likely with a HOF QB covering for his stupidity.

If you root agt them, it’s the same as kissing Roth’s career bye bye, if you root for them, you know it will end in disappointment.

 

[Rossi Rat]

Difference is one guy got lucky enough to work for an org that gives coaches lifetime jobs....

I told my Ravens fan friend I would swap Tomlin for Harbaugh in a heartbeat. At least he values special teams and has pretty good defenses - he's just generally been plagued by having pretty weak offensive talent, as well as a slew of injuries.

 

[TimmyD]

It's nearly 12.

Why is Boswell still on the team?

Oh you thought he would be cut? How cute... that would mean someone gets held accountable and that’s not the “Steeler Way”

 

[PensandCaps]

Anyone saying to bring in McCarthey is so laughable.

He is much worse than Tomlin...and Tomlin SUCKS.

Never have i ever seen a worse coach than McCarthey. Single handily held back the best QB ever.

 

[TimmyD]

Steeler fans are stuck in purgatory.

Tomlin would have to have a few seasons of missing the playoffs before he gets fired, and that’s not likely with a HOF QB covering for his stupidity.

If you root agt them, it’s the same as kissing Roth’s career bye bye, if you root for them, you know it will end in disappointment.

Watching the Steelers as an opposing fan brings so much fun to me because you can always look forward to them derailing themselves in spectacular fashion, yet continue to employ the people most responsible for it

 

[Rossi Rat]

Anyone saying to bring in McCarthey is so laughable.

He is much worse than Tomlin...and Tomlin SUCKS.

Never have i ever seen a worse coach than McCarthey. Single handily held back the best QB ever.

Agree with this. But Tomlin, despite having a worse (but still HOF) QB, has generally had teams with more talent than Green Bay at RB, WR... better o-lines. Hell, even the defenses have been better, generally. Not by much.

 

[TimmyD]

Anyone saying to bring in McCarthey is so laughable.

He is much worse than Tomlin...and Tomlin SUCKS.

Never have i ever seen a worse coach than McCarthey. Single handily held back the best QB ever.

The only player Mike McCarthy has ever had with more talent then anyone on the Steelers is Rodgers. The rest of the supporting casts have been far and away better for Tomlin then McCarthy.... he would be a better coach for the Steelers then Tomlin

 

[ziggyjoe212]

It would be so Steeler-esque to lose to Oakland and then beat the Saints.

 

[Goalie_Bob]

Or the Patriots. I have this strange feeling they are going to beat the Patriots but lose the final 2 games and miss the playoffs.

 

[pistolpete11]

Watching the Steelers as an opposing fan brings so much fun to me because you can always look forward to them derailing themselves in spectacular fashion, yet continue to employ the people most responsible for it

But at least we can have that same fun watching the Bungles.

 

[Al Smith]

Or the Patriots. I have this strange feeling they are going to beat the Patriots but lose the final 2 games and miss the playoffs.

To the extent anyone had any positive expectations re Pats and Saints, they should be dashed by now. So the Steelers can do nothing but surprise to the upside. Kind of comforting.

 

[JimmyTwoTimes]

Mike Tomlin getting fired after missing the playoffs one time is about as likely as the Steelers trading for a corner at the deadline was.... in other words buckle up because it’s going to be a bumpy ride. Tomlin isn’t going anywhere

Probably right.

Which is why each year I say we need to stay healthy heading into the playoffs. We can win it all with Tomlin as coach...on talent alone. Weve already seen it. But definitely not with key players missing, leaving us with less talent. All he has to do is not mess things up which is exactly what he did yesterday with Dobbs. Lol still cant believe what I watched. How he hasnt learned by now is beyond me.

And as bad as things look right now, we are still healthy overall. We have some guys out but not for the year. Playoffs start this week. Wouldn't surprise me at all if the Steelers win out to end the season now that their backs are finally against the wall...where they "have" to win. Which will just piss us off even more because we know they could do this every week.

Tomlin wont get fired, but this happening definitely put a huge spotlight on him...even in the media finally. Not just with the diehard fans who truly see everything. So maybe that fixes things for the rest of this season. And im talking about the offense. Putting up over 30 the rest of the way. We still have a problem with the D under Butler. And this D has a ton of talent. But he has them out of place so many times..not getting the most out of them. Put these guys on the Bears and I guarantee they are doing the same thing or close to it. I still actually think Burns can be a solid corner but the Steelers ruined him. He could be doing what Kyle Fuller is doing right now..and if Fuller was here? Could be on the bench. Think about it for a second before thinking thats ridiculous.

Hargrave is having a breakout season.

Bud Dupree...put him on a team with great coaching and you are looking at double digit sacks. Watt is great and overcoming the bad coaching but even he isnt what he "should" be. If we do miss the playoffs I do think Butler is gone. They already got rid of the other coaches on D...he has no more excuses.

Mike Hilton...Sean Davis..would excel under a diff scheme. We already see flashes of Hilton making great plays..but then letting up another because of this defense.

Point is we have the pieces(need a few more replacing both ILBs...and a higher draft pick would help along with the extra cap space we have this offseason) ...its either stay fully healthy and hope we arent in a situation where Tomlin ruins a game(clock management..etc) or we lose. That shouldn't be the case but thats where we are at. Thats why Ive been pissed about the last 4 years...having key players out for the playoffs. Thats 4 years of excuses for Tomlin. Hoping this year we stay healthy and make the playoffs. I want to see what happens then.

They could really turn this team around quick if they had the balls to do it...but it wont happen. Id hate to see Ben not win another title, but that will likely be the case. Unless like I said, we stay healthy and win on talent. Ben gets into a "rhythm"( not the way Dobbs did) and takes this team all the way. Its up to him at this point, starting this Sunday. Hes always been better when back against the wall(4th quarter when down) so we'll see what happens these next few weeks. Games we have to win.

And I think that can happen, but also think we will lose a top player like Juju for the playoffs...because thats been the theme the last 4 years.

So yeah..purgatory.

By the time we fix this defense...thru draft and FA(its coming..Colbert had a bad 3 years but he adjusted) Ben will be gone. We better hope Rudolph has what it takes to learn in the meantime. We saw what our offense looks like without Ben. Our luck we finally have a great D again(like we had for 40 years straight til now lol) but then our O goes back to being avg.

 

[Rossi Rat]

Probably right.

Which is why each year I say we need to stay healthy heading into the playoffs. We can win it all with Tomlin as coach...on talent alone. Weve already seen it. But definitely not with key players missing, leaving us with less talent. All he has to do is not mess things up which is exactly what he did yesterday with Dobbs. Lol still cant believe what I watched. How he hasnt learned by now is beyond me.

And as bad as things look right now, we are still healthy overall. We have some guys out but not for the year. Playoffs start this week. Wouldn't surprise me at all if the Steelers win out to end the season now that their backs are finally against the wall...where they "have" to win. Which will just piss us off even more because we know they could do this every week.

I like to think we're "due" to beat the Patriots, and Saints for that matter (lost the last 2 to them)... but I'm starting to think the whole "due" thing is out shadowed by the fact that teams just have their number and beat them very frequently. They usually seem to struggle @ Denver, and the Jaguars would have done it again too if they had at least a competent QB.

Regardless, I'll still cling to whatever slim hope there is and watch with anticipation next week. But boy - they couldn't take the whole "backs against the wall" approach after losing 2 straight with playoff hopes in jeopardy? It's one thing to lose this game. But to lose it with these stakes? The Bears game was considered the "Tomlin stinker" last year, but that was one of only 3 losses, early in the season, and the Bears ended up being a surging team on the upswing this past year.

Some very depressing stats coming out of this one. One of them being that the Tomlin (+ Cowher in '06 to boot) Steelers have lost to a crap Raiders team every season that they missed the playoffs.

More of the same. Not "due and finally broke through".

Another note: The Cowboys were on their way to being a laugher of a team this year. What'd they do? Identified a weakness (offense/WR in particular), made a bold trade to address said weakness, and now it's paying dividends and suddenly they're better than the Steelers this year. From 3-5 to 8-5. The Steelers on the other hand turned 7-2-1 into 7-5-1.

 

[Andy99]

It's nearly 12.

Why is Boswell still on the team?

He’s owed more money being cut apparently than being on the team, so I understand why they don’t cut...not to say they still couldn’t bring in another kicker...

My question is why Tomlin is still there...it’s his defense...Munchak is good and can be elevated to interim head coach...

 

[Andy99]

Probably right.

Which is why each year I say we need to stay healthy heading into the playoffs. We can win it all with Tomlin as coach...on talent alone. Weve already seen it. But definitely not with key players missing, leaving us with less talent. All he has to do is not mess things up which is exactly what he did yesterday with Dobbs. Lol still cant believe what I watched. How he hasnt learned by now is beyond me.

And as bad as things look right now, we are still healthy overall. We have some guys out but not for the year. Playoffs start this week. Wouldn't surprise me at all if the Steelers win out to end the season now that their backs are finally against the wall...where they "have" to win. Which will just piss us off even more because we know they could do this every week.

Tomlin wont get fired, but this happening definitely put a huge spotlight on him...even in the media finally. Not just with the diehard fans who truly see everything. So maybe that fixes things for the rest of this season. And im talking about the offense. Putting up over 30 the rest of the way. We still have a problem with the D under Butler. And this D has a ton of talent. But he has them out of place so many times..not getting the most out of them. Put these guys on the Bears and I guarantee they are doing the same thing or close to it. I still actually think Burns can be a solid corner but the Steelers ruined him. He could be doing what Kyle Fuller is doing right now..and if Fuller was here? Could be on the bench. Think about it for a second before thinking thats ridiculous.

Hargrave is having a breakout season.

Bud Dupree...put him on a team with great coaching and you are looking at double digit sacks. Watt is great and overcoming the bad coaching but even he isnt what he "should" be. If we do miss the playoffs I do think Butler is gone. They already got rid of the other coaches on D...he has no more excuses.

Mike Hilton...Sean Davis..would excel under a diff scheme. We already see flashes of Hilton making great plays..but then letting up another because of this defense.

Point is we have the pieces(need a few more replacing both ILBs...and a higher draft pick would help along with the extra cap space we have this offseason) ...its either stay fully healthy and hope we arent in a situation where Tomlin ruins a game(clock management..etc) or we lose. That shouldn't be the case but thats where we are at. Thats why Ive been pissed about the last 4 years...having key players out for the playoffs. Thats 4 years of excuses for Tomlin. Hoping this year we stay healthy and make the playoffs. I want to see what happens then.

They could really turn this team around quick if they had the balls to do it...but it wont happen. Id hate to see Ben not win another title, but that will likely be the case. Unless like I said, we stay healthy and win on talent. Ben gets into a "rhythm"( not the way Dobbs did) and takes this team all the way. Its up to him at this point, starting this Sunday. Hes always been better when back against the wall(4th quarter when down) so we'll see what happens these next few weeks. Games we have to win.

And I think that can happen, but also think we will lose a top player like Juju for the playoffs...because thats been the theme the last 4 years.

So yeah..purgatory.

By the time we fix this defense...thru draft and FA(its coming..Colbert had a bad 3 years but he adjusted) Ben will be gone. We better hope Rudolph has what it takes to learn in the meantime. We saw what our offense looks like without Ben. Our luck we finally have a great D again(like we had for 40 years straight til now lol) but then our O goes back to being avg.

Wow...you’re super optimistic still? I’d say delusional...team needs to push the reset button while we still have Ben...some other ideas are needed if we want a chance at the SB...it’s Tomlin defense and he needs to go, like pronto...it’s not just the scheme...Tomlin (his choices) and Colbert have missed on too many D players and Dupree is one of them...we need to do something good with the veteran offense we have now before it’s too late