OT: The Pittsburgher Thread: Doritos Bowl Match Up - Taylor Swift vs San Andreas Fault

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MrBrightside

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I'd bet $2 billion they don't go offense AGAIN in the first round, particularly not at OT two years in a row.

I think Johnson is overpaid for what he brings but you can’t just trade him without needing to replace him immediately. Neither he nor Pickens are true WR1s but they’re not really in a position where they can afford to move either.

Their WR group is already pretty thin as-is, especially if they cut Robinson like they should. They should be using like a 2nd to draft a WR regardless, but I still don’t think they’re in a position to trade Johnson right now.
This is correct. You can debate Johnson all you want, but if you dump him you've blown open a huge hole in the roster to fill when you already have a number of places you need to invest resources. They'd literally have Pickens, Austin, and special teamers/projects - it would force them into overpaying in free agency or using a top 1-2 pick on one.
 

T1K

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I think my guy in the first round is still Fuaga. Move Jones to LT and have two young bookends that are downright scary. Part of me wants Jones as a RT because he literally breaks the mold of how big and athletic one can be, but that is Fuaga.



With a new offensive scheme. Right on chief.
So why is this logic not applied to DJ then?
 

ChaosAgent

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I'd bet $2 billion they don't go offense AGAIN in the first round, particularly not at OT two years in a row.


This is correct. You can debate Johnson all you want, but if you dump him you've blown open a huge hole in the roster to fill when you already have a number of places you need to invest resources. They'd literally have Pickens, Austin, and special teamers/projects - it would force them into overpaying in free agency or using a top 1-2 pick on one.

Would you really bet $2b they don't go offense again? I think it's OL or CB.
 

Peat

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I think having a strong QB is far more important to this team than having a better LT than Moore. Moore isn’t very good but the OL was performing well in the second half of the year. I don’t think it’s a smart use of money at all to spend more on a backup LT when it should just be a main priority with their 1st.

First off, you can afford to pay out for a FA QB *and* address the line in FA. It's not an either or. Yeah, you have to tell the defence to go f*** itself, but given this is an offence first league and the team is in build mode, where's the problem?

Second... the schedule was shit soft in the second half of the year. Just like it was last year when the OL played pretty good before shitting the bed in the first half of this year. Also the OL got undressed vs Buffalo. The Steelers' OL looks good against bad opponents then promptly looks like a pile of turd vs anything challenging. Let's not get fooled by that again. They are bad and need to be addressed, with Dan Moore and Mason Cole guys who should not be back in starting positions.

Third... there will be no long term strong QB here until the line is fixed. Maybe Cousins - if he came here - would make the situation look okay for a bit but guess what? He's done in 2,3 years, then you've got to go find something new. That probably means the draft. Unless you draft high, that probably means a raw guy who needs help.

That help probably won't be there if they do a Dotson on Broderick Jones.

And tbh Cousins or whoever mightn't do all that great behind an OL that leaks pressure and can't start the run game either.

Fixing the Offensive Line should be the number one priority this off-season. It is the key to fixing the offence, which is the key to having a future that doesn't stink. If there are opportunities to do so in FA - or trade - they should take them. Trade/cut DJ or short the D if you have to. And they should be prioritising making that something they can rely on season to season, and to do that they should make sure Broderick Jones develops right and that means no more moving him around. Do what they have to do make that work.
 

JTG

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So why is this logic not applied to DJ then?

Because I'm not saying DJ sucks as a football player. DJ is going to make more money than we will pay him after next season. Losing him won't hurt that bad and the organization can probably get a decent pick for him.
 

Peat

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Also Pickens' connection with Pickett is good. His stats are good. He's had numerous 100 yard games and big touchdowns. I don't think there's any concern about that.

The connection with DJ is a lot more tenuous but tbh I think it was there last season in the very limited looks it got. I wouldn't get rid of him because I think he can't work with Pickett.

But, if the team gets tight anywhere, then he's in the last year of his contract and I don't want to give him a new one and if traded, you should be able to get back a pick you can use on a new WR to be third target behind Pickens and Muth, which is probably better long term.
 

CheckingLineCenter

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Bolster the offense, both in talent and coaching. Run it back with a KP and Rudolph competition.

Really hard for me to see any other solution as superior to that (besides Cousins on a 1 year which he won’t do).

Sucks but I think the goal needs to be you have your franchise QB in April 2025, whether it’s Pickett, Rudolph, or whoever you just drafted. Everything leading up to that needs to be about putting an offensive structure in place that a bum like me could succeed in.
 
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MrBrightside

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First off, you can afford to pay out for a FA QB *and* address the line in FA. It's not an either or. Yeah, you have to tell the defence to go f*** itself, but given this is an offence first league and the team is in build mode, where's the problem?

Second... the schedule was shit soft in the second half of the year. Just like it was last year when the OL played pretty good before shitting the bed in the first half of this year. Also the OL got undressed vs Buffalo. The Steelers' OL looks good against bad opponents then promptly looks like a pile of turd vs anything challenging. Let's not get fooled by that again. They are bad and need to be addressed, with Dan Moore and Mason Cole guys who should not be back in starting positions.

Third... there will be no long term strong QB here until the line is fixed. Maybe Cousins - if he came here - would make the situation look okay for a bit but guess what? He's done in 2,3 years, then you've got to go find something new. That probably means the draft. Unless you draft high, that probably means a raw guy who needs help.

That help probably won't be there if they do a Dotson on Broderick Jones.

And tbh Cousins or whoever mightn't do all that great behind an OL that leaks pressure and can't start the run game either.

Fixing the Offensive Line should be the number one priority this off-season. It is the key to fixing the offence, which is the key to having a future that doesn't stink. If there are opportunities to do so in FA - or trade - they should take them. Trade/cut DJ or short the D if you have to. And they should be prioritising making that something they can rely on season to season, and to do that they should make sure Broderick Jones develops right and that means no more moving him around. Do what they have to do make that work.
The Steelers allowed the 10th FEWEST sacks in the NFL this year and that was with 10 games of Pickett running himself into sacks when the first read wasn't immediately wide open. I'm not going to argue the OL is that good, but this is back to your Pickett pandering that blames poor QB play on everyone but the QB. The OL has a couple of holes that need filled, absolutely - but the idea you should just keep playing trash at the most important position in the sport because the OL is SO SO BAD that anyone will be reduced to tears playing behind it is absurd.
 
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ChaosAgent

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Bolster the offense, both in talent and coaching. Run it back with a KP and Rudolph competition.

Really hard for me to see any other solution as superior to that (besides Cousins on a 1 year which he won’t do).

Sucks but I think the goal needs to be you have your franchise QB in April 2025, whether it’s Pickett, Rudolph, or whoever you just drafted. Everything leading up to that needs to be about putting an offensive structure in place that a bum like me could succeed in.

I think there's a world in which Pickett/Rudolph gets to an Andy Dalton level (say, Cousins lite) and they aren't a franchise QB but it's the right decision to stick with them regardless.

Like, would anyone say Baker Mayfield is the new Bucs franchise QB? No, but is he the unquestioned starter in 2024 and with great reason? Yes.
 

T1K

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Also Pickens' connection with Pickett is good. His stats are good. He's had numerous 100 yard games and big touchdowns. I don't think there's any concern about that.

The connection with DJ is a lot more tenuous but tbh I think it was there last season in the very limited looks it got. I wouldn't get rid of him because I think he can't work with Pickett.

But, if the team gets tight anywhere, then he's in the last year of his contract and I don't want to give him a new one and if traded, you should be able to get back a pick you can use on a new WR to be third target behind Pickens and Muth, which is probably better long term.
All of Pickens big games with KP came when DJ and Muth were injured. Of course he’s gonna put up stats when he’s competing with ARob and Calvin Austin for targets.
 
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MrBrightside

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I think there's a world in which Pickett/Rudolph gets to an Andy Dalton level (say, Cousins lite) and they aren't a franchise QB but it's the right decision to stick with them regardless.

Like, would anyone say Baker Mayfield is the new Bucs franchise QB? No, but is he the unquestioned starter in 2024 and with great reason? Yes.
Actually he's a free agent so I don't think that's true at all.
 
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T1K

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Because I'm not saying DJ sucks as a football player. DJ is going to make more money than we will pay him after next season. Losing him won't hurt that bad and the organization can probably get a decent pick for him.
Yeah, that’s fair and I get that reasoning. The “KP connection” thing I don’t really buy, but we can leave it at that.
 

Josey Wales

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All of Pickens big games with KP came when DJ and Muth were injured. Of course he’s gonna put up stats when he’s competing with ARob and Calvin Austin for targets.
UMMMM Genius They were Double Covering Pickens with DJ & Muth playing
 

Peat

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All of Pickens big games with KP came when DJ and Muth were injured. Of course he’s gonna put up stats when he’s competing with ARob and Calvin Austin for targets.

Yeah, but either they can connect or they can't. And they can. It's not like Trubisky and Pickens not getting targeted downfield at all and going mental.
 

Peat

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The Steelers allowed the 10th FEWEST sacks in the NFL this year and that was with 10 games of Pickett running himself into sacks when the first read wasn't immediately wide open. I'm not going to argue the OL is that good, but this is back to your Pickett pandering that blames poor QB play on everyone but the QB. The OL has a couple of holes that need filled, absolutely - but the idea you should just keep playing trash at the most important position in the sport because the OL is SO SO BAD that anyone will be reduced to tears playing behind it is absurd.

1) Literally right there at the top of the post you quoted that this isn't an either/or with the QB

2) You see Kenny Pickett like Brandon Tanev sees ghosts. Chill.

3) But since you brought it up, given Pickett's pressure rate was 25%, 5th highest in the NFL, which is not a compliment to his offensive line. However, it's curious that he only took 23 sacks from that. Maybe his happy feet aren't such an awful thing? In fact...

Steelers QBs Sack to Pressure ratio:

Rudolph 6 sacks, 12 pressures, 50%
Trubisky 7 sacks, 21 pressures, 33%
Pickett 23 sacks, 93 pressures, 25%

So Pickett was in fact our best QB at avoiding getting sacked when the pressure was on by those numbers. Fun stat...
 

T1K

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1) Literally right there at the top of the post you quoted that this isn't an either/or with the QB

2) You see Kenny Pickett like Brandon Tanev sees ghosts. Chill.

3) But since you brought it up, given Pickett's pressure rate was 25%, 5th highest in the NFL, which is not a compliment to his offensive line. However, it's curious that he only took 23 sacks from that. Maybe his happy feet aren't such an awful thing? In fact...

Steelers QBs Sack to Pressure ratio:

Rudolph 6 sacks, 12 pressures, 50%
Trubisky 7 sacks, 21 pressures, 33%
Pickett 23 sacks, 93 pressures, 25%

So Pickett was in fact our best QB at avoiding getting sacked when the pressure was on by those numbers. Fun stat...


Clip from the Texans game - since the NFL hates HF Boards and suppresses the preview

Pickett has a clean pocket, bails, spins right into a guy and gets himself injured.
 

Double-Shift Lasse

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I think Johnson is overpaid for what he brings but you can’t just trade him without needing to replace him immediately. Neither he nor Pickens are true WR1s but they’re not really in a position where they can afford to move either.

Their WR group is already pretty thin as-is, especially if they cut Robinson like they should. They should be using like a 2nd to draft a WR regardless, but I still don’t think they’re in a position to trade Johnson right now.
I agree and it sucks because I said the same thing last offseason.
 

Mr Jiggyfly

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Jan 29, 2004
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I’ve already shared my thoughts on Cousins and the “playoff choker” narrative. I’m not going to rehash it.

I don’t know why you feel the need to post in this thread when you always come back to this point. It’s not productive and everyone knows how you feel about MT.

I didn’t know I had to clear it with you why I post here.

I could ask why you post here and whine incessantly about KP and how bad he blows, when it’s clear he will be the starter next year.

Frankly, it’s rather annoying scrolling past your posts drumming the “KP is ass” tired ass line.

We get it, you hate KP - relax.

Makes no sense to me why you beat that to death, and we all know you think KP blows and there’s no hope with him as the starter, but enough is enough.
 

T1K

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I didn’t know I had to clear it with you why I post here.

I could ask why you post here and whine incessantly about KP and how bad he blows, when it’s clear he will be the starter next year.

Frankly, it’s rather annoying scrolling past your posts drumming the “KP is ass” tired ass line.

We get it, you hate KP - relax.

Makes no sense to me why you beat that to death, and we all know you think KP blows and there’s no hope with him as the starter, but enough is enough.
Hey dude, you’re the one who keeps replying to me. All good though, won’t be a problem any longer.
 

Peat

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Clip from the Texans game - since the NFL hates HF Boards and suppresses the preview

Pickett has a clean pocket, bails, spins right into a guy and gets himself injured.


I mean... yeah? We know he's got happy feet that causes eye catching mistakes.

We don't have a video study or extensive stats that shows how big a deal they are. The one stat I could think of to prod at that, pressure to sack ratio, suggest continuing to prod at that. Pressure is a very blunt and unnuanced stat so maybe it's misleading. But then maybe the fact all the Steelers QBs are quite high suggests that when the Steelers' OL lets through pressure, they let through screaming hot pressure.

In any case, this is a tangent. The subject is the OL sucks. It's affected everything depending on it hard. Let's make fixing that a big, big priority. People want to put QB above it? Cool, the team can do multiple things at once.
 

Honour Over Glory

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Delusional KP dick riders - "IF KENNY HAD A BETTER OC, GUIDANCE, OFFENSIVE LINE, BIONIC ARM, LIFTS IN HIS SNEAKERS, BIGGER HANDS, AND BETTER TARGETS HE'D BE A TRUE #1!"

Tomlin & Co literally went and got a tosser from his school that he sort of worked with and that failed, it wasn't even like the play calling improved drastically after that walnut was fired either, it just had a QB that was making plays in the huddle that he knew would work and they just stuck to the status quo for plays that worked even with morons like Haley & Fichtner were OC.

Also, you know who else would do better with all of that support? Mason.

Or how about Mason did better in 4 f***ing games than Kenny Child Hands and Mitch Dipshit combined and he had zero f***ing support from the coaching staff during that time he sat there wondering why Mitch was seen as a better #2 than he was. Blokes are more inclined to believe Kenny will magically become something he's never really shown he can be vs Mason doing his insane impersonation of Geno Smith'ing for the Steelers and maybe deserving another look, this time with a coach that didn't f*** him over for 2yrs.

I also f***ing want to say to those that say - "If you don't want Tomlin, then who? You don't know how good you have it until you lose him and there's no one better!" or some dumb shit.

Mike Tomlin was a Defensive Coordinator that most had no f***ing clue who he was until he was hired after Cowher, those mouth breathing morons can't realize that there might be, just maybe might be, other f***ing potential coaching candidates that are Coordinators or otherwise that are waiting for their f***ing shot that might be good? Mike was a solid DC, I think most now know that given the research most put in when he was hired at the time, influence of Dungy and (ironically) Gruden, his coaching leading to some great results at times and some not so great warts we later saw for years for the Steelers. In any case, he had a total of 1yr of being a DC, 4yrs being a backs coach before he got the job.

Bragging about his win % and wins after 17yrs is hilarious - It's the same shit blokes say about Pens' Mike Sullivan and even Dan Bylsma. Voices get stale, especially that long, Pens figured it out with Bylsma and then went radio silent on Sully. Steelers? Some weird ignorance of not firing coaches and the optics of firing Tomlin or parting ways is something they are scared of or just don't want to deal with or whatever. I think Tomlin should move on because at this point, what is he trying to prove? He's tried to do this over and over with the squad and it just isn't happening.

He also wasn't a fan of Bruce Arians and so he picks Todd Haley (LOL, bloke could barely hold a highschool gig these days), Randy Fichtner, and then Matt Canada - the latter - they had scouted enough when watching Kenny at home and still f***ed it up. Sure he has winning records, but a lot of the major issues is him not picking the right hires.

Not a fan of him returning.
 

Empoleon8771

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I honestly don’t see the downside of bringing in Cousins if you can afford it. Pickett is more suited as a backup at this point anyway, and while I haven’t written him off but it would likely benefit him to sit behind a proven starter like Cousins. Bringing in Cousins also let you “maximize” the remaining years with Watt, at least in terms of what could reasonably be possible.

They’re less likely to be contending in 3 years than they are next year because Watt and Minkah will be declining. I don’t think worrying about future cap penalties really makes any sense, they don’t have any potential future superstars on the roster right now like they have current superstars in Watt and Minkah.
 
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