HF Habs: The official 2023-2024 tank thread

[SlafySZN]

maybe there plan from the start was to be a heap of garbage for 4-5 years with limited improvement, pick up projects early, fill the D, still suck enough so coming into the 3-5 years you can pick up offensive talent on your way up

wishful thinking

I mean… yeah.

That’s what a rebuild is lol

 

[Habbietat]

I mean… yeah.

That’s what a rebuild is lol

I got the impression before that the management thought they were taking a step forward this season, around a 10-15 pick, and after the 1st and 5th pick and picking up Dach and Newhook would "speed up" the rebuild considerably, but I dont think that is whats happening and I have no idea how they planned it out, I just hope they werent over the mark on their expectations of the players because we have seen where that leads, I hope it turns into a full 5 years build but I honestly dont think they planned it that way so it worries me a little

 

[WeThreeKings]

The Sens killed the 2020 draft (Stutzle and Sanderson). It will set them up for years.

It was one of the only drafts they killed.

 

[Miller Time]

I won't go on about the tank. But I will say this after watching the Sens last night.

We will be extremely fortunate if 3 of Guhle, Mailloux, Hutson or Rein develop into our version of Sanderson, Chabot and Chych. I really hope we get there.

I don't see how our 3 young guys Suzuki, Cole and Slaf measure to Stutzle, Tkachuk and Norris as of right now. Similar ages, but if I am being truthful with myself I would probably go with the Sens three. Hopefully that changes in the future. I really hope they can match those guys or be better.

We still need another #1 at something. Top line centre (via draft), #1 winger (via draft) or top pairing defender via development.

I bring up the Sens because we will be competing with them in the 3-4 year mark.

Blah.....the eternal optimist is feeling down today guys.

Don't lose sight of the reality that the Sens youth have also been surrounded by UFA & trade upgrades to their top 6/4.

Gallagher, Armia, Savard (13.5M) are not
Giroux, Tarasenko, Chychrun (16M).

I don't think there's much doubt that the Habs group & youth have far less established talent supporting them then the Sens do.

The Habs are still digging out of Bargainbin's terrible cap management & have yet to make any significant intentional UFA/trade additions of established talent... Choosing instead to target adding unproven youth with high potential (Dach, Newhook) & accepting the bumps that come with icing a young roster lacking the veteran talent the Sens were in a position to go out and get.

Upgrading Petry to Matheson, waiving Armia, jettisoning Hoffman for futures... These were all tinkering moves to slowly restructure the roster & cap. That approach means Suzuki/CC/Slaf aren't surrounded by vet talent that can share the burden of nightly performance.

Over next 2 years, I think we'll see some legit reinforcements brought in, until then we will have to take our lumps & avoid making apples to oranges comparisons.

 

[WeThreeKings]

If we finish bottom 5 the next two seasons, it would be not so fun to watch as a fan but we'd be set up long term.

Having 4 consecutive top 5 picks would stack any team, regardless of your opinions of who they chose over who.

 

[therocket9]

Cope.

Truth.

 

[JoelWarlord]

I won't go on about the tank. But I will say this after watching the Sens last night.

We will be extremely fortunate if 3 of Guhle, Mailloux, Hutson or Rein develop into our version of Sanderson, Chabot and Chych. I really hope we get there.

This is kinda what I was getting at the other day about evaluating a team that's started buying against a team that hasn't. Chychrun is someone they traded picks for, Ottawa is a good example of how you don't have to build your core entirely through internal development.

I certainly won't disagree that their top 3 young forwards are ahead of ours, but it's probably too early in the process to be particularly worried about doing direct comparisons of our top 3 young forwards and top 3 young defencemen vs. theirs, especially when one of those core pieces was added via trade (technically Norris too but that's different with him being traded as a prospect like Suzuki was of course)

 

[Tyson]

Don't lose sight of the reality that the Sens youth have also been surrounded by UFA & trade upgrades to their top 6/4.

Gallagher, Armia, Savard (13.5M) are not
Giroux, Tarasenko, Chychrun (16M).

I don't think there's much doubt that the Habs group & youth have far less established talent supporting them then the Sens do.

The Habs are still digging out of Bargainbin's terrible cap management & have yet to make any significant intentional UFA/trade additions of established talent... Choosing instead to target adding unproven youth with high potential (Dach, Newhook) & accepting the bumps that come with icing a young roster lacking the veteran talent the Sens were in a position to go out and get.

Upgrading Petry to Matheson, waiving Armia, jettisoning Hoffman for futures... These were all tinkering moves to slowly restructure the roster & cap. That approach means Suzuki/CC/Slaf aren't surrounded by vet talent that can share the burden of nightly performance.

Over next 2 years, I think we'll see some legit reinforcements brought in, until then we will have to take our lumps & avoid making apples to oranges comparisons.

Well written post. This lays things out well.

 

[Harry Kakalovich]

3 games in and we're already brainstorming lines with Celebrini.

Tacklin' for Macklin

Be A Weenie for Celebrini

 

[waitin425]

Don't lose sight of the reality that the Sens youth have also been surrounded by UFA & trade upgrades to their top 6/4.

Gallagher, Armia, Savard (13.5M) are not
Giroux, Tarasenko, Chychrun (16M).

I don't think there's much doubt that the Habs group & youth have far less established talent supporting them then the Sens do.

The Habs are still digging out of Bargainbin's terrible cap management & have yet to make any significant intentional UFA/trade additions of established talent... Choosing instead to target adding unproven youth with high potential (Dach, Newhook) & accepting the bumps that come with icing a young roster lacking the veteran talent the Sens were in a position to go out and get.

Upgrading Petry to Matheson, waiving Armia, jettisoning Hoffman for futures... These were all tinkering moves to slowly restructure the roster & cap. That approach means Suzuki/CC/Slaf aren't surrounded by vet talent that can share the burden of nightly performance.

Over next 2 years, I think we'll see some legit reinforcements brought in, until then we will have to take our lumps & avoid making apples to oranges comparisons.

Thanks brother. Was feeling blue....needed that pick me up!

 

[Sorinth]

I won't go on about the tank. But I will say this after watching the Sens last night.

We will be extremely fortunate if 3 of Guhle, Mailloux, Hutson or Rein develop into our version of Sanderson, Chabot and Chych. I really hope we get there.

I don't see how our 3 young guys Suzuki, Cole and Slaf measure to Stutzle, Tkachuk and Norris as of right now. Similar ages, but if I am being truthful with myself I would probably go with the Sens three. Hopefully that changes in the future. I really hope they can match those guys or be better.

We still need another #1 at something. Top line centre (via draft), #1 winger (via draft) or top pairing defender via development.

I bring up the Sens because we will be competing with them in the 3-4 year mark.

Blah.....the eternal optimist is feeling down today guys.

On the forward side the sens group still have to show that they can succeed in the playoffs which is something that Suzuki/Caufield have already proven. So it's not that clear cut that Ottawa is the better group, especially since you have to factor Tarensenko/Giroux helping way more then Anderson/Pearson.

Also Slaf over Dach is a weird choice for such a comparison.

 

[SOLR]

If we finish bottom 5 the next two seasons, it would be not so fun to watch as a fan but we'd be set up long term.

Having 4 consecutive top 5 picks would stack any team, regardless of your opinions of who they chose over who.

I think it's possible to miss a 5 year period in the top 5, see Buffalo & Edmonton. We also need success out of the top 5 and we need more picks in the top 20. You kind of need one good first overall (not Slaf), or it's more 6 years in the top 5 (Red Wings, Arizona, etc.)

Chicago was lucky to get an excellent 1st overall on an early tanking schedule.

Dach might be one top 15 pick in the wind (I wouldn't fault it on management per say, the Oilers/Sabres had the same kind of bad luck with some of their picks)

Let see how Newhook turns out.

 

[JT3]

@Hannibal you're welcome!

That's quite the tilt. I wonder if Florian will end up getting moved later this season as it doesn't look like Brantford will be very good. Although I think he could play one more year as an overager, so maybe they hold on to him.

 

[Jabba11]

If we finish bottom 5 the next two seasons, it would be not so fun to watch as a fan but we'd be set up long term.

Having 4 consecutive top 5 picks would stack any team, regardless of your opinions of who they chose over who.

Unless we pulled an Arizona or New York Islanders type of drafting:

Hayton, Dylan Strome, Kyle Turris..
Griffin Reinhart, Nino Niedereitter, Michael Dal Colle, Ryan Strome..

 

[Tyson]

All Habs coaches eventually all start spewing the same bullshit. MSL is no different. The way this team is being coached from preparation when the puck drops to special teams is starting to show how unqualified these guys are. At least MSL has great quotes.

 

[WeThreeKings]

Unless we pulled an Arizona or New York Islanders type of drafting:

Hayton, Dylan Strome, Kyle Turris..
Griffin Reinhart, Nino Niedereitter, Michael Dal Colle, Ryan Strome..

Even the enviable Sabres and Senators blew a lot of those picks.

I'll change would to should

 

[Kwikwi]

We need that big Def

 

[HabsWhiteKnightLOL]

MSL interview today just wants to make me fire him

Ugh

 

[Frank JT]

Maybe there's no Élite star this year after de top3, but we need highend talent for sure. So, let's tank.

 

[Tyson]

MSL interview today just wants to make me fire him

Ugh

Yep the honeymoon is over with this coaching staff.
It's not about wins and losses in a rebuild, it's about an entertaining product. Like all coaches they are deathly afraid of pissing off their vets and it's easier to park an offensive young player like Ylonen on the 4th line. Idiots.

 

[morhilane]

MSL interview today just wants to make me fire him

Ugh

The post-practice scrum or another one?

 

[Miller Time]

MSL interview today just wants to make me fire him

Ugh

Didn't hear it... anything that he said in particular you found bothersome?

 

[HabsWhiteKnightLOL]

The post-practice scrum or another one?

yes , I feel like it's only excuses. He has no plan whatsoever. No 1 is punished

Didn't hear it... anything that he said in particular you found bothersome?

He's starting to sound like Ducharme , that's my point (minus the rumbling)

 

[The Real Timo]

...

If we finish bottom 5 the next two seasons, it would be not so fun to watch as a fan but we'd be set up long term.

Having 4 consecutive top 5 picks would stack any team, regardless of your opinions of who they chose over who.

and then the entire stack will get injured.

Didn't hear it... anything that he said in particular you found bothersome?

I wanted to fire him since last season... I think now that Caufield has been ressuracted, MSL's served his purpose and I don't feel like he has anything else to offer. The team is as disorganized as they come.

 

[Adriatic]

Next year should be fun. 2024 top 3 pick, Reinbacher, Mailloux, Roy, Dach and a free agent will all be added to the roster. And that's without accounting for any trades Hughes will make.