Confirmed with Link: The new coach of the Philadelphia Flyers is John Tortorella

[BlackandOrange]

I wanted Hischier over Patrick due to injury concerns. Makar wasn't on my radar in the slightest. Heiskanen was my number 2 choice. Patrick was 3rd, and my 4th choice was Casey Mittelstadt followed by Pettersson. I tend to like European players as they frequently have a good defensive base.

Also my first name is Patrick, so I was really hoping Patrick would work out so I could buy a Flyers jersey with that on the back. Glad I never pulled the trigger.

 

[Larry44]

I don't think they were pinning the "downfall" on Patrick. Just that it's a setback.

Agreed, Injuries hurt the development of Patrick, Rubtsov and O’Brien, which stripped the C prospect depth.

Watching the Rangers go to the ECF is frustrating because their picks have turned out. Being a great market helped them get guys like Fox, Trouba and Panarin who would only play in NYC.

 

[deadhead]

If who you draft at 2 or 27 is positional dependent, you’re already a poorly fun franchise. No one is smart enough to keep passing up talent for fit early in drafts and come out ahead in the long run.

No, who you draft determines your free agency, trades and contract extension moves, however.
If Cooley falls to the Flyers instead of say Nemec, that will impact other moves this summer.

 

[JojoTheWhale]

No, who you draft determines your free agency, trades and contract extension moves, however.
If Cooley falls to the Flyers instead of say Nemec, that will impact other moves this summer.

I appreciate that you think this will make me feel better. Unfortunately, that's still horrendous process. This isn't Eichel going 2 because of McDavid and you want the kid to hit the ground running on day one. This is the 5th pick in a perfectly fine 2nd tier. Just get the best talent you can. Do it in the draft. Do it in trade. Do it in free agency. I know I repeat myself often on this, but I struggle mightily in accepting how hard it is for NHL teams to set a reasonable talent vs fit prioritization. The entire subculture is so far up its own ass it can't even do that right.

Unless you think this team is ready to contend or something. I do not and I don't see a reasonable angle to even argue it.

 

[BrindamoursNose]

Did Brind'amour get fired yet?

 

[Ghosts Beer]

This "the team didn't do it's research on Patrick's health history" narrative is revisionist bs. No one was saying it was anything more than a slight concern pre-draft.

Who had Patrick significantly dropped in their rankings pre-draft as a result of health concerns relating to migraines/concussions?

Please read:

Much like Monahan, some concerns about Patrick’s effort away from the puck, skating speed and overall competitiveness all crept in as he was under more intense scrutiny in his draft year.

“We faced Patrick quite a few times this year,” said one eastern conference WHL head coach. “Nothing against the kid whatsoever, but what I saw this year and what our coaching staff saw last year are two different players. No question he’s a player, smart and everything else, but I’m not seeing what everybody talked about last year.

“I saw him play against Moose Jaw one night and he was downright lazy. When he has the puck he’s fine..but when he doesn’t…I’ve expected more. What I heard from last year was that this guy was going to be a handful this year…and he hasn’t been a handful with that hockey club.”

Monahan was able to overcome the competitiveness and skating concerns and has developed into a solid top-two NHL center, but there are no guarantees that Patrick can follow the same path, especially when issues about his character are also becoming more prevalent in the scouting community from several different sources.

“He’s not the greatest kid I don’t think,” said a scout of one team picking in the top ten. “I don’t know if he’s a great teammate either. That’s what I’ve heard. Maybe just a little bit about himself.”

“Our guys aren’t keen on him,” said the scout of another team slated to pick in the top ten. “I would be really surprised if we took Nolan Patrick. Unless it’s a no brainer. If we’re at 4 or 5…then you’ve gotta do it. “If (club management) hear a peep on a player we’re not taking him…and they’ve heard some things that concern them.”

Also:

Steve Kournianos‏ @TheDraftAnalyst

Not going to lie. The whole Nolan Patrick injury thing is disconcerting. I'm not waiting for the combine.

He's no longer No. 1 overall.

11:46 AM - 5 Apr 2017

 

[Rebels57]

Did Brind'amour get fired yet?

Imagine that?

That would be like Tampa firing Cooper after they lost in the 1st round in the 2019 Playoffs in his 7th season as coach

Of course we know what happened the next 2 seasons lol

Jon Cooper (b.1967) Hockey Stats and Profile at hockeydb.com

Records of Jon Cooper, a hockey coach from Prince George, BC born Aug 23 1967 who was active from 2000 to 2024.

www.hockeydb.com

 

[ponder719]

Did Brind'amour get fired yet?

Wouldn't matter if he did. He could name his price and place, and I would be floored if that place was here, for any price.

 

[Rebels57]

Wouldn't matter if he did. He could name his price and place, and I would be floored if that place was here, for any price.

I keep forgetting Vegas has a coaching vacancy and there's no way anyone is picking the Flyers over Vegas, alumni or not. They are much closer to a Cup despite their holes.

 

[renberg]

No, who you draft determines your free agency, trades and contract extension moves, however.
If Cooley falls to the Flyers instead of say Nemec, that will impact other moves this summer.

Hopefully this is true. Most likely any player that he Flyers draft at 5 will not be an impact player this coming season. Maybe they make the opening night roster; maybe not.
Players need to be moved around to fill holes at different positions in the organization. Move a defenseman for a forward; move a forward for a defenseman. Perhaps drafting a defenseman makes a surplus there that eases moving one out from the active roster. Maybe drafting a forward gives that position more of a surplus that allows a forward on the roster to be moved. Whatever. Fluidity matters.
What we don't need to see is for TPTB to fixate on acquiring one single player in a trade to the point that they become willing to waste assets in order to do that. If the Flyers can shuffle things so that acquiring Gaudreau is a feasible move then do it. If it costs too much, move on to Kadri, Forsberg or no one. Just don't do a Ghostisbehere/Ristolainen shuffle again. That was a disaster in many ways the will cost the organization for years to come.

 

[ponder719]

I keep forgetting Vegas has a coaching vacancy and there's no way anyone is picking the Flyers over Vegas, alumni or not. They are much closer to a Cup despite their holes.

Let's also not forget that Andrew Brunette is only interim HC in Florida. While I'm about 99.99% sure they'll make it official soon, Brind'Amour suddenly becoming available is that 0.01%.

 

[Rebels57]

Let's also not forget that Andrew Brunette is only interim HC in Florida. While I'm about 99.99% sure they'll make it official soon, Brind'Amour suddenly becoming available is that 0.01%.

I actually don't think Brunette keeping that job is a guarantee. Didn't do a very good job in the Playoffs. They were outplayed by Washington then dominated by Tampa. That team has too much talent to play that poorly in the Playoffs. A lot of that comes down to preparation and special teams..two areas you can point to coaching on.

 

[ponder719]

I actually don't think Brunette keeping that job is a guarantee. Didn't do a very good job in the Playoffs. They were outplayed by Washington then dominated by Tampa. That team has too much talent to play that poorly in the Playoffs. A lot of that comes down to preparation and special teams..two areas you can point to coaching on.

I think it's more likely than that, simply because it's hard to move on from the guy who kept the ship righted to the point of winning the President's Trophy after the whole Q saga (and his results are in line with the majority of recent President's Trophy winners, tbh), but it might be a short-term extension and a prove-it contract. A good year next year probably means a long-term deal, but I think he gets at least one full year behind the bench unless a ridiculously good coach knocks on their door.

 

[flyersnorth]

Please read:







“Our guys aren’t keen on him,” said the scout of another team slated to pick in the top ten. “I would be really surprised if we took Nolan Patrick. Unless it’s a no brainer. If we’re at 4 or 5…then you’ve gotta do it. “If (club management) hear a peep on a player we’re not taking him…and they’ve heard some things that concern them.”

Also:

Ouch.

In retrospect, most of those comments are strikingly accurate.

 

[TCTC]

Imagine that?

That would be like Tampa firing Cooper after they lost in the 1st round in the 2019 Playoffs in his 7th season as coach

Of course we know what happened the next 2 seasons lol

Jon Cooper (b.1967) Hockey Stats and Profile at hockeydb.com

Records of Jon Cooper, a hockey coach from Prince George, BC born Aug 23 1967 who was active from 2000 to 2024.

www.hockeydb.com

I do think that Brind'Amour is a good coach and it's the team that's overrated and not the coach. But Cooper had some success even before 2019. He made it to the Stanley Cup Final in his 3rd year and the Conference Final twice. Rod hasn't had near that level of success yet.

 

[renberg]

I actually don't think Brunette keeping that job is a guarantee. Didn't do a very good job in the Playoffs. They were outplayed by Washington then dominated by Tampa. That team has too much talent to play that poorly in the Playoffs. A lot of that comes down to preparation and special teams..two areas you can point to coaching on.

I felt all along that the Panther's achilles heel was their defense. It's why they acquired Chariot and Hagg. IMO, Ekblad is overrated and after that mediocrity sets in.
As an aside, I wonder what Chuck could have squeezed out of Florida for G and Risto before Risto was extended and the Panthers dove in on Chariot and Hagg?

 

[Ghosts Beer]

Ouch.

In retrospect, most of those comments are strikingly accurate.

Yes, spot-on, unfortunately.

 

[Rebels57]

I do think that Brind'Amour is a good coach and it's the team that's overrated and not the coach. But Cooper had some success even before 2019. He made it to the Stanley Cup Final in his 3rd year and the Conference Final twice. Rod hasn't had near that level of success yet.

They need a dependable #1 goalie and maybe 1 more dynamic forward. A guy like Jarvis is only going to get better so he may even fill that need. They are still one of the best teams in the NHL and i'd swap our entire organization out for theirs without giving it a second of thought.

 

[flyersnorth]

Yes, spot-on, unfortunately.

It feels like we're due.

This summer is going to be wild for the Flyers, and I mean that in both the best and worst possible ways.

 

[Rebels57]

It feels like we're due.

This summer is going to be wild for the Flyers, and I mean that in both the best and worst possible ways.

Due for what? More misery? Coming right up!

 

[flyersnorth]

Due for what? More misery? Coming right up!

I really hope not!

My default mode of operation is that Fletcher is woefully inadequate, but maybe, just maybe, things go right for the Flyers for the first time in a while, and Good Things happen.

Wouldn't that be nice for a change?

 

[DrinkFightFlyers]

Ouch.

In retrospect, most of those comments are strikingly accurate.

Yeah but at the same even these quotes aren't damning (without hindsight). Aside from when there is a clear cut guy there's always going to be some scouts who say Player X is lazy/not smart/slow/injury prone/etc. These are pretty tepid quotes. "I've heard..." and isolated examples that I guarantee you could find for almost any draft eligible player. Now again, these guys turned out to be 100% accurate for the most part, but at the time none of this was crazy alarm bells ringing.

 

[PhillyWings]

It feels like we're due.

This summer is going to be wild for the Flyers, and I mean that in both the best and worst possible ways.

And who exactly wants to play here? Can't imagine top tier free agents are tripping over themselves to come Philly.

 

[Curufinwe]

To be fair, I don't remember any mention of migraines or concussions before the draft.
And I think the migraines seem to be more of a post-concussion syndrome. It's becoming obvoius that he's vulnerable to concussions, he's now had what, a half dozen "upper body injuries"
Patrick is Lindros without the great seasons.

You don't remember it cause there was none. All the health concerns in 2017 were about his core.

 

[FLYguy3911]

There's quite the Venn diagram going on with individuals dancing on Carolina's grave and people who defend Flyers' management. Probably just a coincidence though.