Confirmed with Link: The new coach of the Philadelphia Flyers is John Tortorella

[Hollywood Cannon]

O'Conner: “The key people in the front office obviously liked Ristolainen from the start. But my understanding of part of why they wanted to re-sign him so badly is because they felt like his physical style was needed for the Flyers. That whole “Flyers should be hard to play against” thing.”

Friedman: “There was a report out there that Ristolainen turned down 6×6.35 or something like that, I don’t think that’s correct in this particular case. I think the offer was somewhere between 4-4.75.”

Flyers GM Fletcher on the trade deadline: “We’re looking to aggressively retool here. Everything is on the table.”

Are you seriously inferring that Chuck Fletcher, the President and General Manager of the team, isn’t one of the key people in the front office?

Once again, the man has said that he targeted Ristolainen for YEARS. Stop picking and choosing what statements you believe out of this man’s mouth when it benefits you.

 

[bauer]

How about we find someone without grey hair

 

[HAL 1000]

Guy must not have cable to watch these playoffs.

If you don't play to score, you don't have a chance.

You can debate the finer points of defense with him.

NHL: Bowman says defense wins Stanley Cup championships | HeraldNet.com

The man who coached the Pittsburgh Penguins to their last Stanley Cup championship, Scotty Bowman, was also behind the bench for the Detroit Red Wings’ most recent victory, in the spring of 2002.

www.heraldnet.com

 

[ajgoal]

In the absence of information, any scenario is possible.

But, c’mon. You think Fletch, who openly coveted Risto for longer than he has been with the Flyers, and traded a 1st, a 2nd, and Hagg, and opened cap space to fit him by giving away a top 4 defenseman, another 2nd, and a 7th … just decided, nah, I want to trade him?

I can't remember where I saw it, might have been on 32T but more likely something more local, that said they were going to deal Risto, but then the whole Provorov PP fallout happened and they signed him because they decided that Provorov had to go in the offseason and didn't want to have to replace half of their top 4.

Please take it with a grain of salt as I can't cite the source. But gets a bit of believability if they do move Prov before the season.

 

[FLYguy3911]

You can debate the finer points of defense with him.

NHL: Bowman says defense wins Stanley Cup championships | HeraldNet.com

The man who coached the Pittsburgh Penguins to their last Stanley Cup championship, Scotty Bowman, was also behind the bench for the Detroit Red Wings’ most recent victory, in the spring of 2002.

www.heraldnet.com

Can you find an older article?

 

[Magua]

You can debate the finer points of defense with him.

NHL: Bowman says defense wins Stanley Cup championships | HeraldNet.com

The man who coached the Pittsburgh Penguins to their last Stanley Cup championship, Scotty Bowman, was also behind the bench for the Detroit Red Wings’ most recent victory, in the spring of 2002.

www.heraldnet.com

It would be a pretty short debate lmao.

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

Winning Teams GF this post season:

1 x1
2 x2
3 x1
4 x10
5 x16
6 x3
7 x4
8 x1
Lots of poor defensive teams out there...

Updated through the Panthers game tonight.

 

[deadhead]

Are you seriously inferring that Chuck Fletcher, the President and General Manager of the team, isn’t one of the key people in the front office?

Once again, the man has said that he targeted Ristolainen for YEARS. Stop picking and choosing what statements you believe out of this man’s mouth when it benefits you.

If it was Fletcher's decision, why would Charlie refef to "key people" in the front office? Just say Fletcher decided to add a year and a million dollars - but the “Flyers should be hard to play against” thing predates Fletcher by decades.

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

If it was Fletcher's decision, why would Charlie refef to "key people" in the front office? Just say Fletcher decided to add a year and a million dollars - but the “Flyers should be hard to play against” thing predates Fletcher by decades.

 

[mja]

If it was Fletcher's decision, why would Charlie refef to "key people" in the front office? Just say Fletcher decided to add a year and a million dollars - but the “Flyers should be hard to play against” thing predates Fletcher by decades.

You realize Fletcher was molded by that mindset, right? He's Clarke's boy. Always has been.

 

[PDX Flyer]

Fletcher lowballed Risto with the contract? The moment it was signed everyone in hockey laughed besides rational Flyers fans, who cried. It is a terrible contract that is probably double of what he would have got as FA

 

[Lindberg]

If it was Fletcher's decision, why would Charlie refef to "key people" in the front office? Just say Fletcher decided to add a year and a million dollars - but the “Flyers should be hard to play against” thing predates Fletcher by decades.

You need help. I'm serious.

 

[Striiker]

Winning games is what wins championships.

Goals are what win games.

Offensive play is what creates goals.

So actually offense is what wins championships and that's not even debatable. Scoring is literally the sole objective of the sport.

Defense is just what the dinosaurs fetishize because they've been brainwashed since childhood by guys who were too shitty at hockey to have an offensive impact and other guys who were previously brainwashed.

 

[Lindberg]

Winning games is what wins championships.

Goals are what win games.

Offensive play is what creates goals.

So actually offense is what wins championships and that's not even debatable. Scoring is literally the sole objective of the sport.

Defense is just what the dinosaurs fetishize because they've been brainwashed since childhood by guys who were too shitty at hockey to have an offensive impact and other guys who were previously brainwashed.

You can win a game by scoring a goal, you'll always lose every game by not scoring a goal.

 

[PDX Flyer]

Winning games is what wins championships.

Goals are what win games.

Offensive play is what creates goals.

So actually offense is what wins championships and that's not even debatable. Scoring is literally the sole objective of the sport.

Defense is just what the dinosaurs fetishize because they've been brainwashed since childhood by guys who were too shitty at hockey to have an offensive impact and other guys who were previously brainwashed.

I played soccer but I’m sure it translates over. It is a hell of a lot easier to play defense than offense. Especially in a team setting.

 

[DrinkFightFlyers]

1) Do we think the Flyers are going to do the classic Flyers thing and instead of proactively hiring a coach they will embark on a long and fruitless search for a coach and wind up having to pick from a bunch of losers after the good candidates get hired elsewhere?

and

2) I think we should see if Jagr wants to be a player coach. I just can't get enough Jagr.

 

[deadhead]

You can win a game by scoring a goal, you'll always lose every game by not scoring a goal.

Except you can also create offense off good defense, good backcheckers can flip the ice and lead to odd man rushes.

The Islanders and Blackhawks tried the "offense first" approach, how'd that work for them?

Less talented teams play conservatively b/c their relative lack of talent is exposed in wide open games, disciplined defense and an above average goalie can take a team with average talent a long way.

However, the optimum balance may be good defenders who are good finishers - that is, they can take advantage of the opportunities created by disciplined defense and wear down "flashy" teams by pouncing on their mistakes and making them pay.

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

Or... as a franchise you focus on both sides instead of spending an entire year harping about being poor defensively while completely ignoring the fact that you were just as poor offensively.

 

[flyersnorth]

O'Conner: “The key people in the front office obviously liked Ristolainen from the start. But my understanding of part of why they wanted to re-sign him so badly is because they felt like his physical style was needed for the Flyers. That whole “Flyers should be hard to play against” thing.”

Friedman: “There was a report out there that Ristolainen turned down 6×6.35 or something like that, I don’t think that’s correct in this particular case. I think the offer was somewhere between 4-4.75.”

Flyers GM Fletcher on the trade deadline: “We’re looking to aggressively retool here. Everything is on the table.”

That wasn't really my question.

Do you - deadhead - honestly believe that Fletcher used all those assets to acquire Risto, then wanted to trade him at the deadline, and then was overruled? Is that the chain of events you believe happened?

 

[deadhead]

Or... as a franchise you focus on both sides instead of spending an entire year harping about being poor defensively while completely ignoring the fact that you were just as poor offensively.

There are limited resources, and path dependence (if the BPA is better on defense, sometimes you're aligned that way just out of happenstance). You can't just create an offensively skilled roster (unless you want to ignore defense, you can always find offensive players who are bad on defense) without skilled players.

Often it comes down to whether a few elite offensive players fall into your lap, or a top two way center, or the right D-man.

Coaching can help, but it depends on the player, Sidney became a legitimate Selke candidate while scoring 100+ a year, Kane still has the attitude "defense, we don't need no stinkin' defense."

Your bottom six doesn't have to consist of slugs who can't finish, guys like Cates, Desnoyers and Wisdom give me hope.
Laczynski not so sure about, can his college production translate?
Allison can't stay on the ice, Frost and Tippett have to play a whole season like they did for a month.

I'm not worried about offense from the 1st two lines next year, Farabee, TK, Couts, Hayes, Atkinson, have all shown they can score > 2.0 pp/60, Brink has potential, Lindblom should finally be 100% (last year his lack of stamina showed in his up and down performance) - they could use one or two more top offensive forward(s).

If Ellis is back, the defense should be much better at driving play. Without Ellis, York has to take a big step up.

But that's why I'm hoping they go with the "development" HC over the "win now" HC.

 

[deadhead]

That wasn't really my question.

Do you - deadhead - honestly believe that Fletcher used all those assets to acquire Risto, then wanted to trade him at the deadline, and then was overruled? Is that the chain of events you believe happened?

Don't know, but it seems the offer was more 4x4, similar to Chariot and Savard, and suddenly it gets sweetened when Fletcher had hinted he might trade Risto, and would have got a 1st plus for him - which would have both saved face and accelerated a "reload." If he gets a 1st and 3rd for Risto, he can claim it was a one year rental for the cost of moving back from a 2nd to a 3rd.

So it seemed funny to me that Risto suddenly became a must sign - especially after Fletcher beefed up his analytic group which reportedly didn't like Risto - so that sure sounds like the Dino's overriding the analytic guys.

 

[Hollywood Cannon]

There are limited resources, and path dependence (if the BPA is better on defense, sometimes you're aligned that way just out of happenstance). You can't just create an offensively skilled roster (unless you want to ignore defense, you can always find offensive players who are bad on defense) without skilled players.

Often it comes down to whether a few elite offensive players fall into your lap, or a top two way center, or the right D-man.

Coaching can help, but it depends on the player, Sidney became a legitimate Selke candidate while scoring 100+ a year, Kane still has the attitude "defense, we don't need no stinkin' defense."

Your bottom six doesn't have to consist of slugs who can't finish, guys like Cates, Desnoyers and Wisdom give me hope.
Laczynski not so sure about, can his college production translate?
Allison can't stay on the ice, Frost and Tippett have to play a whole season like they did for a month.

I'm not worried about offense from the 1st two lines next year, Farabee, TK, Couts, Hayes, Atkinson, have all shown they can score > 2.0 pp/60, Brink has potential, Lindblom should finally be 100% (last year his lack of stamina showed in his up and down performance) - they could use one or two more top offensive forward(s).

If Ellis is back, the defense should be much better at driving play. Without Ellis, York has to take a big step up.

But that's why I'm hoping they go with the "development" HC over the "win now" HC.

They literally did not mention the offensive side of the game one time last offseason. They thought they were good in that area in 20/21.

All you heard was how poor defensively they were over and over. Chuck “fixed” that going into the season and they got worse.

Is that good management to neglect an entire aspect of the game and at the same time make the area that you “fixed” worse?

 

[prototypical4thliner]

So what do you suggest they should do?

They really are in a position of tear down, rebuild. Our objective isn’t just to make the playoffs, but a cup, wouldn’t you agree?

Even when fully healthy and all players performing at their top level, are we really there? Do we have a roster capable of making it past the second round? I don’t think so, do you?

The team fundamentally lacks elite talent at all positions.

Our three best forwards make for a top 10-15 first line in the league. After that, the depth isn’t great.

Defense, we have two defenders that would best function as number two guys, no true bonafide #1. Then it’s a mess after that with known net losses and a bunch of maybes.

Hart is good but not there consistently yet. Whether that is an indictment of the team or him really is chicken and egg at this point—probably both true.

They need to draft high, with quantity and well to fix this.

 

[ajgoal]

They literally did not mention the offensive side of the game one time last offseason. They thought they were good in that area in 20/21.

All you heard was how poor defensively they were over and over. Chuck “fixed” that going into the season and they got worse.

Is that good management to neglect an entire aspect of the game and at the same time make the area that you “fixed” worse?

The thing that killed me was that last off-season Fletcher specifically mentioned defending better by defending less, moving the puck out more efficiently, etc.

Then made moves that all of us that were paying attention knew would do the exact opposite. He said it again this off-season.

I'm terrified.

 

[flyersnorth]

Don't know, but it seems the offer was more 4x4, similar to Chariot and Savard, and suddenly it gets sweetened when Fletcher had hinted he might trade Risto, and would have got a 1st plus for him - which would have both saved face and accelerated a "reload." If he gets a 1st and 3rd for Risto, he can claim it was a one year rental for the cost of moving back from a 2nd to a 3rd.

So it seemed funny to me that Risto suddenly became a must sign - especially after Fletcher beefed up his analytic group which reportedly didn't like Risto - so that sure sounds like the Dino's overriding the analytic guys.

Or it could also be posturing/low-balling which backfired when Risto and his agent had quotes out there saying he wants to test free agency and feels like playoffs are where he shines - which wasn't going to happen in Philly.

There are rumours out there that the analytics department did their job and presented data that clearly showed Ristolainen was not a good hockey player. Someone posted something recently - I forget who. The decision-makers ignored that advice - which is their prerogative to do so - and doubled-down on a mistake.

It was a game of chicken, and sadly for us fans, we have a whole coop.