The Management Thread | Live, Play, Repeat Edition

[Mr. Canucklehead]

It certainly feels like the mainstream media are beginning to sharpen their knives. Gord Miller's mea culpa last night was fairly epic, and a lot of the talking heads (LeBrun is one I noticed in particular) are now acknowledging the brutal off-season Benning experienced in terms of letting quality players walk due to a cap crunch monster of his own design.

Whether the straw keeps piling up enough to finally break Aquilini's back and cause him to act remains unclear. But I think his patience has to be wearing thin.

 

[MadaCanuckle]

I think I accidentally clicked this and was confused, to say the least, as to why Alex Jones was yelling at me. In context, it works 100%.

What can I say? The Canucks reddit changed...
By thew way, should we put some "Missing person" posters around here ? Some people completely disappear...

 

[Dab]

Man, one thing for sure- when the city’s media and fanbase turns on a coach/GM you can feel it. Its everywhere in the city, unavoidable.

 

[Hit the post]

What can I say? The Canucks reddit changed...
By thew way, should we put some "Missing person" posters around here ? Some people completely disappear...

Wait until the Canucks manage to win a couple games in a row.

..will return.

 

[Izzy Goodenough]

The end may be near for GMJB /Weisbrod/Green regime unless of course, AF feels comfortable with the current dynamic between himself and GMJB and therefore feels cornered as the team collapses.

We may be in for a long wait while AF swallows his pride and decides to give up some autonomy to a new GM.

 

[MadaCanuckle]

Wait until the Canucks manage to win a couple games in a row.

..will return.

I can see maybe 1 game out of 4 against Calgary in the next 6.

 

[xtra]

Is it wrong that I’m loving this....the final gradual turn of the mainstream media, casual fans and idiot fans we know (one guy wants to play oj over edler) to realizing how incompetent benning really is.

it could also be that I really don’t see this team being better than a bubble playoff team if not worse the next two years.


Also my pivot point to realizing benning was an idiot was during the flames series and after when he saw how bad we were and didn’t pivot to a rebuild.

 

[moog35]

Benning has done a good job at brining in young talent but has failed at surrounding that young talent with affordable veterans. At this point we have enough young talent in place that a GM with better pro scouting would be beneficial to advancing this young core forward so we don’t end up like the Oilers / Sabers

 

[tantalum]

At this stage I think the most likely scenario is as follows:
-team misses playoffs (finishes 2nd to last in the division) and gets a top 10 pick.
-JB/management let go after season - per media reports there are outs on the 2 years remaining on his contract.
-new management hired (please Lawrence Gilman) and they do the Gillis/Vigneault thing with Green. i.e. interview process to see if he is the guy to continue as coach or not.

This makes so much sense from a COVID cost savings standpoint. A capable first time GM like Gilman will be relatively inexpensive. JB buyout will probably be much less than 2 years. If decision is to move on from Green there is nothing owed to him. This will all happen after the season because it will cost $$ to do it mid season and the last game is only 13 weeks away.

And, lets face it, this next summer will likely be the most consequential in terms of contract signings for the next decade. I have to believe that ownership recognizes that that's the weakest part of current management's "tool box".

If the disastrous performances continue there is no way all these people last until the end of the season. Once the market turns they will need to address things immediately...and the market is getting close to turning.

 

[MS]

The day I lost faith in this regime.

Yeah, up until that point there were some concerning moves and signs but you could find excuses and reasons for them.

When we gave Luca Sbisa a $10 million extension, that was the Rosetta Stone for understanding that these guys were operating in a different dimension of incompetence.

 

[4Twenty]

Benning has done a good job at brining in young talent but has failed at surrounding that young talent with affordable veterans. At this point we have enough young talent in place that a GM with better pro scouting would be beneficial to advancing this young core forward so we don’t end up like the Oilers / Sabers

Dude you’ve loved every move to get here

 

[Burke's Evil Spirit]

Yeah, up until that point there were some concerning moves and signs but you could find excuses and reasons for them.

When we gave Luca Sbisa a $10 million extension, that was the Rosetta Stone for understanding that these guys were operating in a different dimension of incompetence.

Beyond that, Benning made some of his best acquisitions - specifically Bonino and Vrbata - in his first off-season. Even Desjardins looked like a great coaching hire.

Then the Sbisa and Dorsett extensions happened, and then the Flames series happened, and we all knew where we were at.

 

[Intoewsables]

I'm surprised some of you lasted so long on the Benning train. I was cautiously optimistic when we first brought him in, but drafting Virtanen and signing Miller had me pretty worried about his vision for the team. The Dorsett and Sbisa contracts were definitely the breaking point but let's not ignore about a year's worth of ineptitude leading up to that!

 

[m9]

It wasn't a consequential trade, but the day for me was the Kassian & a pick for Prust trade. There were other things prior and certainly after, but trading a young player & pick for a washed veteran was the sign that the team would not be going in the direction I wanted and pro scouting was a major issue.

What should have been the absolute end was after the 2016-17 season. There is no justification for Benning keeping his job at that point given the disaster he overlooked during the previous 12 months including trades, signings, and draft picks.

Hopefully the end is near.

 

[moog35]

Dude you’ve loved every move to get here

Yup I’ve liked most of Bennings moves. I wasn’t a fan of the Eriksson contract. We have one of the best young cores in the league. He’s done a good job at assembling young talent

 

[SeawaterOnIce]

Is it wrong that I’m loving this....the final gradual turn of the mainstream media, casual fans and idiot fans we know (one guy wants to play oj over edler) to realizing how incompetent benning really is.

it could also be that I really don’t see this team being better than a bubble playoff team if not worse the next two years.


Also my pivot point to realizing benning was an idiot was during the flames series and after when he saw how bad we were and didn’t pivot to a rebuild.

It was not even August and I knew we were screwed after the following:

3rd round pick for Dorsett

Trading Kesler and adding a 3rd round pick for the a late 1st, Bonino, Sbisa and later 3rd round pick.*

*What was done after made the trade look way worse.

2nd round pick for Lidnen Vey

Picking Virtanen

Signing a washed up Ryan Miller to a 6x3 deal which was grossly inflated and did the team no good.

It got worse during the season:

Out:
Forsling, 2nd round pick, 6th round pick

In:
Pedan (pointless acquisition), Clendenning (pointless acquisition) and Baertschi (unnecessary risk).

It was evident after 1 season what the mandate was and how poor of a talent evaluator Jim Benning was. Furthermore it was also evident how spiteful ownership and management was towards the previous regime as demonstrated by the subsequent dealings over the next few years that would see a weird trend of cost effective depth be jettisoned out for no other reason than being a Gillis target. Players like Santorelli, Richardson and Hamhuis may not stand out, but they were really cost effective in a depth role. Instead we saw Sutter, Dorsett and a wide variety of overpriced junk make their way in.

 

[krutovsdonut]

i am thinking that we are at the point benning cannot replace green right now. the problems are too obviously at the feet of the gm's offseason decisions, and there is an element of the team reacting to those decisions as well. plus nobody will take the coaching job expecting the guy who hired them to be fired.

so we skip a step and go directly to replace the gm and now aquaman is going to be panicking about resigning petey and hughes in the summer so it happens soon.

when does rutherford complete his 14 days?

i kid.

or do i?

 

[4Twenty]

Yup I’ve liked most of Bennings moves. I wasn’t a fan of the Eriksson contract. We have one of the best young cores in the league. He’s done a good job at assembling young talent

And surrounded it with similar crap to the Oilers and Sabres

 

[4Twenty]

i am thinking that we are at the point benning cannot replace green right now. the problems are too obviously at the feet of the gm's offseason decisions, and there is an element of the team reacting to those decisions as well. plus nobody will take the coaching job expecting the guy who hired them to be fired.

so we skip a step and go directly to replace the gm and now aquaman is going to be panicking about resigning petey and hughes in the summer so it happens soon.

when does rutherford complete his 14 days?

i kid.

or do i?

Why Rutherford? Didn’t he retire?

 

[Izzy Goodenough]

I also think his recent bout of mendacity was unfortunate where he said he asked players to wait while he cleared cap room when in fact he could go 10% (8M) above the cap in the off season, like Tampa etc.

I also think Holtby's contract, in retrospect, will also become a bigger issue when GMJB could have used the money for Tanev or Toffoli and sign a cheaper backup who I am sure would have been happy to let in 5 goals a night on a regular basis.

 

[MS]

Beyond that, Benning made some of his best acquisitions - specifically Bonino and Vrbata - in his first off-season. Even Desjardins looked like a great coaching hire.

Then the Sbisa and Dorsett extensions happened, and then the Flames series happened, and we all knew where we were at.

I think his first offseason was bad, but the Vrbata signing definitely turned out very well and took a lot of heat on focus off the rest of the deals.

As did the fact that the team was winning games.

I'm surprised some of you lasted so long on the Benning train. I was cautiously optimistic when we first brought him in, but drafting Virtanen and signing Miller had me pretty worried about his vision for the team. The Dorsett and Sbisa contracts were definitely the breaking point but let's not ignore about a year's worth of ineptitude leading up to that!

I really didn't like the 2014 offseason and was one of his biggest critics here through that period ... but thought it was mainly the rash offseason of an overconfident GM who didn't properly assess what he had when he came in.

I didn't think at that point we were dealing with an all-time terrible GM. But the Sbisa/Dorsett extensions ushered in a period where it became very obvious we were looking at probably the stupidest GM in NHL history, and only the fact that his Lucic and Subban trades were turned down saves him from being the overall worst GM in NHL history.

 

[Fire Benning]

I was actually a Benning apologist on here in 2015. Was a huge Bonino and Vrbata fan. The 2015 draft / free agency made me completely switch. That Kassian trade was absolutely laughable. When that Bonino trade went down I thought Benning was learning impaired.

 

[MS]

i am thinking that we are at the point benning cannot replace green right now. the problems are too obviously at the feet of the gm's offseason decisions, and there is an element of the team reacting to those decisions as well. plus nobody will take the coaching job expecting the guy who hired them to be fired.

so we skip a step and go directly to replace the gm and now aquaman is going to be panicking about resigning petey and hughes in the summer so it happens soon.

Agreed.

There is no way Benning can be allowed to fire the coach right now. His position is too precarious to be allowed to make such an important decision, and nobody with any qualifications would take the job in such an unstable situation.

Moreover, the media heat right now is far more on the GM than on the head coach.

It is also a season where it would be possible to change a GM mid-season (new guy could do most of his job from his office during a 14-day quarantine) but changing a coach mid-season is nearly impossible unless you're just promoting an assistant.

The simplest thing to do would be to wait for the summer but as pressure ramps up I don't know if that will be possible.

 

[Hit the post]

Why Rutherford? Didn’t he retire?

He's the schmuck that took NoGoodbranson off our hands.

 

[Hit the post]

Agreed.

There is no way Benning can be allowed to fire the coach right now. His position is too precarious to be allowed to make such an important decision, and nobody with any qualifications would take the job in such an unstable situation.

Moreover, the media heat right now is far more on the GM than on the head coach.

It is also a season where it would be possible to change a GM mid-season (new guy could do most of his job from his office during a 14-day quarantine) but changing a coach mid-season is nearly impossible unless you're just promoting an assistant.

The simplest thing to do would be to wait for the summer but as pressure ramps up I don't know if that will be possible.

Just how much damage can an interim GM do? Plenty if his name is Weisbrod.