The future of international hockey

[aquaregia]

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The problem is the NHL has no idea how to grow the game--they only care about money and nothing else
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IMO it's not that the NHL don't know how to grow the game, it's that they're not incentivised to think about doing it in the first place.
The league as you probably already know is run by the owners for the benefit of the owners, not the fans, players or good of the sport in general. That's partially why you have such an insane number of fixtures in order to squeeze out as much broadcast revenue as possible.

Secondly, as far as the NFL goes, it's pretty much synonymous with the sport of American football all across the world. When the NFL hosts games in Britain, it's not so much about 'growing the game' as advertising their product to new customers across the Atlantic. There's no chance of a rival professional league spawning as a result of that exposure and challenging their market.

Contrast that to the NHL, which doesn't have that same one-to-one relationship between league and sport that the NFL does; professional leagues are already well established across Europe, and as such, new interest in the sport is more likely to flow into those leagues than into the NHL. All they'd be doing is creating new incentives for good players that might otherwise only have a shot of making it in North America to go and play in Europe instead, thus diluting the NHL's product.

 

[Albatros]

You might want to rethink that.

The deciding Euro qualifying match against Liechtenstein in 2019 averaged 1.02 million viewers.

The hockey final against Canada last month averaged 2.35 million viewers.

A fifth of the population watched a November weekday qualification match against the absolute minnows Liechtenstein despite it having been released to free-tv only at a short notice. In hockey you need a built-up festival atmosphere with gold on the line before people get interested.

 

[member 305909]

My impression is that Finns who follow the NHL only do so because they are interested how Finns who are playing there are doing.

In football there is a long tradition of watching English football which people follow for its own sake and they have followed it long before there were any foreigners there.

Well, in football-sense the Scottish and the Irish are foreigners but those were the only foreigners unlike today.

 

[NyQuil]

Secondly, as far as the NFL goes, it's pretty much synonymous with the sport of American football all across the world. When the NFL hosts games in Britain, it's not so much about 'growing the game' as advertising their product to new customers across the Atlantic. There's no chance of a rival professional league spawning as a result of that exposure and challenging their market.

Hey now, the London Monarchs and the World League of American Football!

 

[member 305909]

American cultural imperialism has been successful in things like music, movies and games.

However, there's one aspect where they have failed and that is sports.

I know that baseball is popular in some countries outside the USA but not anywhere in Europe.

The same with American football. Some people who have watched it have told it is a very tactical game. Much more complex than soccer.

However, 99.9% of Europeans consider it as foreign rubbish.

 

[NyQuil]

American cultural imperialism has been successful in things like music, movies and games.

However, there's one aspect where they have failed and that is sports.

I know that baseball is popular in some countries outside the USA but not anywhere in Europe.

The same with American football. Some people who have watched it have told it is a very tactical game. Much more complex than soccer.

However, 99.9% of Europeans consider it as foreign rubbish.

Basketball is a conspicuous omission.

 

[aquaregia]

Basketball is a conspicuous omission.

Honestly soccer's more the exception rather than the rule when it comes to team sports and the number of different nations that play them.

If we're being realistic basketball's quite a decent success in terms of how its international following has developed.

 

[NyQuil]

If we're being realistic basketball's quite a decent success in terms of how its international following has developed.

Particularly in Europe.

 

[member 305909]

I think one measure how popular a sport is in any country is when you suddenly stop performing well.

Like Slovakia where I think hockey is still popular though the national team has been in a decline for some time.

If Finland were to be in a bronze-medal game in a tournament hardly anybody in Finland would bother to watch it.

There wasn't a playoff-format in the tournaments in the 1980s but if there had been and Finland had been in a bronze medal-game there would have been half the nation watching the game.

 

[Albatros]

Honestly soccer's more the exception rather than the rule when it comes to team sports and the number of different nations that play them.

There are some sports though that are definitely global despite somewhat lesser popularity, like volleyball for example.

 

[Sanf]

There wasn't a playoff-format in the tournaments in the 1980s but if there had been and Finland had been in a bronze medal-game there would have been half the nation watching the game.

Maybe... but I don´t know if you remember when the national televesion in 1992 did not see it worthy to pay for the rights of WHC. The rights were bought by cable channel called PTV from 1992 to 1994. So majority of Finns could not even see live when Finland won the first WHC medal. I remember watching it from Eurosport with English commentary.

So it was fairly close that Finns wouldn´t have seen the first gold medal live from national tv.

 

[Albatros]

Maybe... but I don´t know if you remember when the national televesion in 1992 did not see it worthy to pay for the rights of WHC. The rights were bought by cable channel called PTV from 1992 to 1994. So majority of Finns could not even see live when Finland won the first WHC medal. I remember watching it from Eurosport with English commentary.

So it was fairly close that Finns wouldn´t have seen the first gold medal live from national tv.

And the World Championship broadcast rights back in 1992 cost something like $90.000, peanuts by modern standards.

 

[Fjorden]

American cultural imperialism has been successful in things like music, movies and games.

However, there's one aspect where they have failed and that is sports.

I know that baseball is popular in some countries outside the USA but not anywhere in Europe.

The same with American football. Some people who have watched it have told it is a very tactical game. Much more complex than soccer.

However, 99.9% of Europeans consider it as foreign rubbish.

American football and baseball, the problem here is too many commercial breaks and the players stand still 99% of the time. It is like watching chess. To many breaks and to little action.

Basketball is quite popular though in many european countries. Spain,France, Germany,Greece, x-Yugoslavia, Lithuania, Turkey and Russia are interested in Basketball.

In Norway also basketball grows. But its still a small sport here, but its getting more and more popular here.
Growth new members under. Among immigrants in Norway basketball is very popular.

 

[member 305909]

I have a funny anecdote from England, where I was there for a conference but my wife joined me for the weekend afterwards.

Chelsea, my EPL team, was playing in the Champions League final against Bayern Munchen so I went to the Hammersmith-Fulham neighbourhood in Chelsea kit to watch the match live at a real supporters pub.

The celebration was pretty epic, but as I took the tube back downtown to my hotel I realized that we were the only ones in the entire car in football jerseys, after being absolutely surrounded by fans in the streets.

A well-dressed woman asked “Was there a football match tonight?”

And I replied, “Yes, the Champions League Final in fact..”

“Ah, that’s nice.”

Still a very classist sport in jolly old England.

I guess you're talking about 2012 when the final was in Munich.

They should have a Plan B over who's hosting the final so that it is on a neutral ground.

 

[Lambo]

American cultural imperialism has been successful in things like music, movies and games.

However, there's one aspect where they have failed and that is sports.

I know that baseball is popular in some countries outside the USA but not anywhere in Europe.

The same with American football. Some people who have watched it have told it is a very tactical game. Much more complex than soccer.

However, 99.9% of Europeans consider it as foreign rubbish.

Although there is also increasing interest in Europe in Am. Football gives. Because Football(Soccer) is not developing in a good direction. There are certainly people who are looking for alternatives. American sport promises more unpredictability than football in Europe. Where everything becomes more and more one-sided.

 

[Czechboy]

you speak of international hockey but clearly look at it from a north American perspective.

The basic problem NA fans have that they do not understand about hockey in Europe is that half the fun the games is the party that goes on around the games

The problem is the NHL has no idea how to grow the game--they only care about money and nothing else

When team Canada announced they would play an X game here in Nottingham a few years ago--the game sold out in 20 minutes--but the nhl did not go oh--lets see if we can plant our flag there.

Compare European football and the NFL to what the NHL does--how often does the NFL play games here in the UK? Every year now.

When the NHL announces games to be played in Europe--owners get pissed they are losing a single home game

until the NHL gets its head out of its ass hockey in North America will continue to lag behind the other big leagues

The NHL wants complete control over everything but they have no idea how to market the game

Also.. dont forget. If a game at a world championships game is played at 10am in Saskatchewan and no one watches it... That means no one is watching the game and it is meaningless!

The fact that it's 6pm in Europe and the arena is sold out and thousands of fans are outside celebrating and the beer gardens are full while euros are sitting in front of the tv to record numbers... That does not matter at all because no one watched it in Regina that morning lol.

 

[Jumptheshark]

Also.. dont forget. If a game at a world championships game is played at 10am in Saskatchewan and no one watches it... That means no one is watching the game and it is meaningless!

The fact that it's 6pm in Europe and the arena is sold out and thousands of fans are outside celebrating and the beer gardens are full while euros are sitting in front of the tv to record numbers... That does not matter at all because no one watched it in Regina that morning lol.

I love the party outside of the arenas at the world championships--that is one reason why there will be a boycott if Paris tries to host again

 

[Vakarte]

At this point, I don't think we'll get an international tournament we'll all appreciate cause of how messed up the leagues and communities try to gatekeep hockey.

 

[WarriorofTime]

American cultural imperialism has been successful in things like music, movies and games.

However, there's one aspect where they have failed and that is sports.

I know that baseball is popular in some countries outside the USA but not anywhere in Europe.

The same with American football. Some people who have watched it have told it is a very tactical game. Much more complex than soccer.

However, 99.9% of Europeans consider it as foreign rubbish.

lol, conveniently not mentioning that Basketball went from a game that was not played at all outside of the United States to the 2nd most popular sport in the world primarily in the last 30-40 years. You go anywhere and you will likely see NBA jerseys.

This is also pretty obviously "Eurocentric"... like "oh baseball is extremely popular in eastern Asia and Latin America? That doesn't matter because it's not Europe"

funny how Europeans rip on "Americentrism" yet are always ready to speak for the "world"

 

[Albatros]

You go anywhere and you will likely see NBA jerseys.

MLB caps are even more common, yet 90+ % of the wearers don't actually follow the game.

 

[Urbanskog]

lol, conveniently not mentioning that Basketball went from a game that was not played at all outside of the United States to the 2nd most popular sport in the world primarily in the last 30-40 years. You go anywhere and you will likely see NBA jerseys.

This is also pretty obviously "Eurocentric"... like "oh baseball is extremely popular in eastern Asia and Latin America? That doesn't matter because it's not Europe"

funny how Europeans rip on "Americentrism" yet are always ready to speak for the "world"

I have to say I can't even remember the last time I've seen an NBA jersey, whether in Finland or elsewhere in Europe. They are not a common sight at all.

 

[MadArcand]

This is also pretty obviously "Eurocentric"... like "oh baseball is extremely popular in eastern Asia and Latin America? That doesn't matter because it's not Europe

It's really only popular in a small handful of countries in those regions (Japan, South Korea, Venezuela, Cuba and Dominican Republic), that's like saying bandy is extremely popular in Europe because it's played in Finland and Sweden...

Basketball is a global sport. Baseball is not.

 

[WarriorofTime]

I have to say I can't even remember the last time I've seen an NBA jersey, whether in Finland or elsewhere in Europe. They are not a common sight at all.

Finland is a small country, doesn't represent Europe as a whole. I think Lauri Markkanen is the only recent NBA player to come out of there.

It's really only popular in a small handful of countries in those regions (Japan, South Korea, Venezuela, Cuba and Dominican Republic), that's like saying bandy is extremely popular in Europe because it's played in Finland and Sweden...

Basketball is a global sport. Baseball is not.

Yes, Basketball is a much more popular global sport than Baseball, but Baseball is much more popular than Bandy. You can look at the salaries of top Baseball players compared to top Bandy players. Almost a third of MLB players are from outside the United States. So you shouldn't downplay it too much just because Europe doesn't like it much.

 

[Urbanskog]

Finland is a small country, doesn't represent Europe as a whole. I think Lauri Markkanen is the only recent NBA player to come out of there.

And hence I said "...or elsewhere in Europe".

 

[WarriorofTime]

And hence I said "...or elsewhere in Europe".

Have you been to countries, including, but not limited to, Serbia, France, Greece, Italy..?