The Fall of Pierre

[Ice-Tray]

No one is doing anything to ‘save their jobs’. Dorion obviously understands that new management most likely means sweeping change, and he’s not likely to do anything to ruin the core he’s assembled as that will be his legacy, and the core reason behind being hired again.

I suspect we’ll see some vets traded, maybe a trial run with a different player of the cost is cheap, or a big deal to bring in a young RD that we all know we need going forward.

 

[Tnuoc Alucard]

No one is doing anything to ‘save their jobs’. Dorion obviously understands that new management most likely means sweeping change, and he’s not likely to do anything to ruin the core he’s assembled as that will be his legacy, and the core reason behind being hired again.

I suspect we’ll see some vets traded, maybe a trial run with a different player of the cost is cheap, or a big deal to bring in a young RD that we all know we need going forward.

doubt we’ll see “sweeping changes “ right away, after the new owner(s) take over….. PD made the big move to acquire Jakob Chychrun, and now he must focus on acquiring a goaltender, as neither of the two that were supposed to play this season, seem to be able to avoid injurie.

 

[Agent Zuuuub]

The manager of a team sets the overall culture of the team.

Does anyone actually think Dorion has winning culture?

 

[SpezDispenser]

The manager of a team sets the overall culture of the team.

Does anyone actually think Dorion has winning culture?

We must wait until next year is played to find out. I think he's built an absolutely fantastic core and now (if healthy) we can utilize our depth with Pinto and Greig being 3rd liners and Brannstrom and Hamonic (if we bring him back) as a solid 3rd pairing with JBD or Thomson waiting in the wings.

Don't knee jerk, this season was really f***ed up by injuries. Assess him at this time next year.

 

[NyQuil]

The manager of a team sets the overall culture of the team.

Does anyone actually think Dorion has winning culture?

To try and be more specific, what do you mean exactly?

Is he too "buddy-buddy" with the players? Bad at pro scouting?

Not sure what you mean by "winning culture".

 

[Xspyrit]

Like @Hale The Villain says, if the team ends up being good, it will have been in SPITE of Pierre Dorion.

Be grateful for the elite/great assets he inherited when taking over then he ended up having to trade 1 year later (Karlsson, Stone, Zibanejad/Brassard, Turris+1st/Duchene, Pageau, etc)

Be grateful for the prospect pool we already had when the rebuild started (Chabot, Batherson, Formenton, Paul, etc)

Be grateful for the high picks we had by sucking so long (Tkachuk + Sanderson, 7th OA used on DeBrincat, ~12th OA used on Chychrun, and despite the 4th OA to Colorado and a 10th OA pick wasted on Tyler Boucher)

Yes we have a lot of talent and the future could still be bright but Dorion mismanaged the organization wealth all the way

 

[Loach]

Like @Hale The Villain says, if the team ends up being good, it will have been in SPITE of Pierre Dorion.

Be grateful for the elite/great assets he inherited when taking over then he ended up having to trade 1 year later (Karlsson, Stone, Zibanejad/Brassard, Turris+1st/Duchene, Pageau, etc)

Be grateful for the prospect pool we already had when the rebuild started (Chabot, Batherson, Formenton, Paul, etc)

Be grateful for the high picks we had by sucking so long (Tkachuk + Sanderson, 7th OA used on DeBrincat, ~12th OA used on Chychrun, and despite the 4th OA to Colorado and a 10th OA pick wasted on Tyler Boucher)

Yes we have a lot of talent and the future could still be bright but Dorion mismanaged the organization wealth all the way

The Dzingle trade sums it up for me.
Dzingle for Duclaire, 2nd, 2nd is a good trade.
Let Duclaire walk.
Traded one second for Stepan.
Traded the other for Murray, signed him to a dumb contract and then we gave up picks and retained salary to get rid of him.
That's not building.

 

[bicboi64]

The Dzingle trade sums it up for me.
Dzingle for Duclaire, 2nd, 2nd is a good trade.
Let Duclaire walk.
Traded one second for Stepan.
Traded the other for Murray, signed him to a dumb contract and then we gave up picks and retained salary to get rid of him.
That's not building.

But hey, there was leadership that the young guys benefited from by acquiring those guys

 

[Loach]

But hey, there was leadership that the young guys benefited from by acquiring those guys

Yeah. They learned to do it themselves. Lol

 

[Xspyrit]

But hey, there was leadership that the young guys benefited from by acquiring those guys

Yeah. They learned to do it themselves. Lol

The last young core I can think of that has been "thrown to the wolves" as much as the Brady bunch is the Oilers 2010's circa

That was my point after the 2020 (putrid) Dorion offseason, which had seen a lot of resistance by the same posters as usual... It sure has been paying off

Poor Chabot, look at where his confidence is at. We bred him as a loser. We can't undo what has been done but we need to make the appropriate changes this summer to turn things around

 

[Hale The Villain]

Like @Hale The Villain says, if the team ends up being good, it will have been in SPITE of Pierre Dorion.

Be grateful for the elite/great assets he inherited when taking over then he ended up having to trade 1 year later (Karlsson, Stone, Zibanejad/Brassard, Turris+1st/Duchene, Pageau, etc)

Be grateful for the prospect pool we already had when the rebuild started (Chabot, Batherson, Formenton, Paul, etc)

Be grateful for the high picks we had by sucking so long (Tkachuk + Sanderson, 7th OA used on DeBrincat, ~12th OA used on Chychrun, and despite the 4th OA to Colorado and a 10th OA pick wasted on Tyler Boucher)

Yes we have a lot of talent and the future could still be bright but Dorion mismanaged the organization wealth all the way

Man traded an entire top 6 (Stone, Zibanejad, Duchene, Hoffman, Pageau and Dzingel) in their prime and all we have left to show for it is Greig, Kleven, Brannstrom, JBD, Thomson and Sokolov.

The terrible returns garnered for so much talent traded away is one thing, but it's crazy that coming out of a 5 year tear-it-down rebuild we had to play talentless plugs like Kelly, Gambrell, Brown, etc... in our bottom 6 this year.

We should be overflowing with young talent and the fact that our depth is already getting stretched thin is a function of Dorion's horrid asset and money management during the rebuild.

Not only did he not weaponize our cap space when we were overflowing with it - but he did the opposite - he traded picks for immediate help, and almost all such acquisitions blew up in our face. Now we're starting to pay the price for his mismanagement.

 

[Loach]

Man traded an entire top 6 (Stone, Zibanejad, Duchene, Hoffman, Pageau and Dzingel) in their prime and all we have left to show for it is Greig, Kleven, Brannstrom, JBD, Thomson and Sokolov.

The terrible returns garnered for so much talent traded away is one thing, but it's crazy that coming out of a 5 year tear-it-down rebuild we had to play talentless plugs like Kelly, Gambrell, Brown, etc... in our bottom 6 this year.

We should be overflowing with young talent and the fact that our depth is already getting stretched thin is a function of Dorion's horrid asset and money management during the rebuild.

Not only did he not weaponize our cap space when we were overflowing with it - but he did the opposite - he traded picks for immediate help, and almost all such acquisitions blew up in our face. Now we're starting to pay the price for his mismanagement.

He built the 2008 - 17 Sens. A bubble team, in the playoffs one year and miss the next, hopping to luck out and go on a run. It's all he knows.

 

[NyQuil]

Man traded an entire top 6 (Stone, Zibanejad, Duchene, Hoffman, Pageau and Dzingel) in their prime and all we have left to show for it is Greig, Kleven, Brannstrom, JBD, Thomson and Sokolov.

The terrible returns garnered for so much talent traded away is one thing, but it's crazy that coming out of a 5 year tear-it-down rebuild we had to play talentless plugs like Kelly, Gambrell, Brown, etc... in our bottom 6 this year.

We should be overflowing with young talent and the fact that our depth is already getting stretched thin is a function of Dorion's horrid asset and money management during the rebuild.

Not only did he not weaponize our cap space when we were overflowing with it - but he did the opposite - he traded picks for immediate help, and almost all such acquisitions blew up in our face. Now we're starting to pay the price for his mismanagement.

The Dzingel Effect.

 

[DueDiligence]

The manager of a team sets the overall culture of the team.

Does anyone actually think Dorion has winning culture?

I'm sure he loses on purpose just to piss off the fanbase.

 

[Hale The Villain]

The Dzingel Effect.

Dzingel trade was good. Two 2nds was slightly more than I expected, even if he had 44 points in 57 games at the time. Taking a gamble on Duclair as a replacement sniper was smart too.

But to then deal away the 2nds for Murray and Stepan and let Duclair walk for no freaking reason completely killed it.

 

[NyQuil]

But to then deal away the 2nds for Murray and Stepan and let Duclair walk for no freaking reason completely killed it.

Not a fan of the Murray and Stepan acquisitions (at the time as well, and I'm always honest), but I still think something fishy happened with Duclair representing himself.

I think his demands were more than what he ended up getting from Florida.

I put a premium on skating so I liked his fit here. A shame how it worked out.

 

[swiftwin]

The Dzingle trade sums it up for me.
Dzingle for Duclaire, 2nd, 2nd is a good trade.
Let Duclaire walk.
Traded one second for Stepan.
Traded the other for Murray, signed him to a dumb contract and then we gave up picks and retained salary to get rid of him.
That's not building.

Had we signed Duclair for 5x5 like he wanted, we wouldn't of had room for Giroux.

Besides, you're conveniently leaving out the fact that the trade tree came full circle when we then re-acquired Dzingel for Paquette (which we got with a free 2nd round pick) and Galchenyuk (who we signed as a free agent).

Cap space is an asset. Right now we don't have a single bad contract on the team.

 

[Micklebot]

Not a fan of the Murray and Stepan acquisitions (at the time as well, and I'm always honest), but I still think something fishy happened with Duclair representing himself.

I think his demands were more than what he ended up getting from Florida.

I put a premium on skating so I liked his fit here. A shame how it worked out.

I mean, had we qualified him, it likely would have gone to arbitration. His expectations were probably in line with comparable arbitration awards, and that was too rich for us so we let him become a UFA. I don't think in a vacuum his demands were likely unreasonable, but the pandemic kind of screwed up a lot of teams cap management and it likely hurt guys like him the most,

 

[JD1]

Not a fan of the Murray and Stepan acquisitions (at the time as well, and I'm always honest), but I still think something fishy happened with Duclair representing himself.

I think his demands were more than what he ended up getting from Florida.

I put a premium on skating so I liked his fit here. A shame how it worked out.

I agree on the duclair thing. Something odd happened there.

He's a bit of a polarizing player. Skates like the wind but often accomplishes little

 

[NyQuil]

Cap space is an asset. Right now we don't have a single bad contract on the team.

I’d like to see Chychrun and Norris play 70 games.

 

[Micklebot]

Had we signed Duclair for 5x5 like he wanted, we wouldn't of had room for Giroux.

That report was not exactly well sourced, and was pretty quickly refuted by Duclaire as absurd,

I mean, the idea that we offered him 3 x 4.25 but he wanted 5x5 falls apart pretty quickly when we didn't qualify him, if we were willing to offer 4.25 x 3 yrs, we'd have qualified him.

 

[Loach]

Had we signed Duclair for 5x5 like he wanted, we wouldn't of had room for Giroux.

Besides, you're conveniently leaving out the fact that the trade tree came full circle when we then re-acquired Dzingel for Paquette (which we got with a free 2nd round pick) and Galchenyuk (who we signed as a free agent).

Cap space is an asset. Right now we don't have a single bad contract on the team.

So don't sign him to that and trade his rights.

The rest of your post is nothing.

 

[bicboi64]

Had we signed Duclair for 5x5 like he wanted, we wouldn't of had room for Giroux.

Besides, you're conveniently leaving out the fact that the trade tree came full circle when we then re-acquired Dzingel for Paquette (which we got with a free 2nd round pick) and Galchenyuk (who we signed as a free agent).

Cap space is an asset. Right now we don't have a single bad contract on the team.

Because Dorion literally paid to move the contracts that he was responsible for. Cap space is a very valuable asset, which is why you don't buyout players to save money, only to spend more money that same season.

 

[swiftwin]

Because Dorion literally paid to move the contracts that he was responsible for. Cap space is a very valuable asset, which is why you don't buyout players to save money, only to spend more money that same season.

You'll be hard pressed to find any team that hasn't had to buyout or pay to dump a contract at any point. The amount of times Dorion has done it, and the cost when he has done it has been minimal. Recently, it's only been Murray, White and MDZ? The cost was minimal on all three. Plus, two of those were exacerbated by injuries.

On the flip side, you have so many good moves, like Giroux, DeBrincat, Chychrun, Hamonic, Holden/3rd, etc.

 

[Loach]

You'll be hard pressed to find any team that hasn't had to buyout or pay to dump a contract at any point. The amount of times Dorion has done it, and the cost when he has done it has been minimal. Recently, it's only been Murray, White and MDZ? The cost was minimal on all three. Plus, two of those were exacerbated by injuries.

On the flip side, you have so many good moves, like Giroux, DeBrincat, Chychrun, Hamonic, Holden/3rd, etc.

Bobby Ryan