The core players are showing their true colors again

[Stephen]

Matthews has been masking a ton of holes in this line up, we say where they are when he’s cold.

His job is to mask a ton of holes in the lineup and put the team on his back.

 

[LeafsandSharksfan]

His job is to mask a ton of holes in the lineup and put the team on his back.

Not too many of those types of teams have playoff success.

 

[colchar]

Except in the playoffs.

Matthews,Marner,Nylander,Rielly,Kadri,
Kapanen,jonsson,Jvr,Hyman,brown.
A very young,very fast,skilled core.
Just work on improving the D and watch them grow.
Dubas then went after Tavares.
He was supposed to be a superstar difference maker. A mini crosby.
Look at what happened.
Fire the whole management team.
And for me i would keep Matthews,Marner, and Rielly and move the rest or at least try.

Which explains why you're sitting in your basement eating Cheetos and not managing an NHL team.

 

[colchar]

My allegiance is cracking when it comes to marner. I never understood why everyone is so hell bent picking on Nylander, when marner shows the least heart out of the 4. Nylander still crashed the net a good 5 times before he pissed everyone off. Marner makes 2 blocks in 2017 on Pasta and suddenly nobody can question his work ethic in the playoffs even to this day because he hides behind his xGF.

When did his ex-girlfriend become an issue?

 

[colchar]

It's the players.

Blaming the coach is an easy way out.

The players, coach, and GM all need to go.

 

[Stephen]

Marner still seems to bring a lot of that OHL juniors mentality to the attack game where he wants to ankle break and humiliate instead of just putting in the work to get the W.

The more they keep the core together, the more you see. And the more I’m okay turning the page.

 

[francis246]

The whole top line is awful

But I think in particular Matthews has looked the most unlike himself. Matthews is shooting at what 4/5%? It’s not like his line mates haven’t gotten him the puck. He’s not finishing and my main issue with Marner playing with Matthews has always been that Matthews’ cookies always have to come first. I argued it before on here, Marner plays better with Tavares because he’s free to just kind of play and create.

When he’s with Matthews you see how much he is forcing plays to try and get Matthews to score instead of focusing on what he needs to do to be successful.

A lot of people will disagree but the more I watch, the more I’ve come to the conclusion that Matthews does bring his teammates play down when he isn’t playing well because the rest of the line is hyper focused on getting him the puck to score instead of making plays for themselves to score.

Marner still seems to bring a lot of that OHL juniors mentality to the attack game where he wants to ankle break and humiliate instead of just putting in the work to get the W.

The more they keep the core together, the more you see. And the more I’m okay turning the page.

I also find it pretty interesting that as soon as stuff goes wrong Marner is the first guy that gets blamed lol. Fairly or unfairly

 

[kevsh]

There's also something to be said about the losing mentality and how it's being carried year to year with the same group (and I'm talking beyond the big 4, also Reilly, Brodie, Muzzin, Holl, Kerfoot, Engvall).

All those guys have the baggage of multiple playoff defeats with this team hanging over them. Sometimes maybe the best thing is to replace even a few of those guys with players that come in fresh, hungry and not haunted by what happened the last few, or six, years. - even if the trades, talent/cap-wise are considered a lateral move.

I can't speak for anyone on that team but after another blown series lead last year, I'm trying to imagine what each of those guys felt coming to camp and seeing basically the same faces from last Summer. I find it hard to believe there was a huge amount of enthusiasm and excitement, with cheers of "Okay, guys, we'll get 'em this time!"

 

[SeaOfBlue]

Matthews,Marner,Nylander,Rielly,Kadri,
Kapanen,jonsson,Jvr,Hyman,brown.
A very young,very fast,skilled core.
Just work on improving the D and watch them grow.
Dubas then went after Tavares.
He was supposed to be a superstar difference maker. A mini crosby.
Look at what happened.
Fire the whole management team.
And for me i would keep Matthews,Marner, and Rielly and move the rest or at least try.

Are we really pretending like most of these guys have been excellent players elsewhere?

Kapanen was on the verge of getting non-tendered last year.

Johnsson was literally waived and nobody claimed him.

Brown has played a crap ton in Ottawa but has been mediocre for most of the time.

Hyman has done well riding shotgun with McDavid, but that contract is still awful.

JvR has been an albatross for Philly since the day he has left.

Other than Kadri for one year after two underwhelming years with more suspensions that cost his team at the worst time, none of these guys have exactly made us regret us letting them go or have otherwise not been effectively replaced by the likes of Kerfoot, Bunting, Mikheyev, Engvall, etc. over the years.

If this whole thing fails, it is at the feet of the players. They just would not have had what it took to reach their potential, despite having the complete faith and support of their coach, GM, team, and fans behind them. It sucks, it happens, and the players have only themselves to blame.

 

[Gabriel426]

But I think in particular Matthews has looked the most unlike himself. Matthews is shooting at what 4/5%? It’s not like his line mates haven’t gotten him the puck. He’s not finishing and my main issue with Marner playing with Matthews has always been that Matthews’ cookies always have to come first. I argued it before on here, Marner plays better with Tavares because he’s free to just kind of play and create.

When he’s with Matthews you see how much he is forcing plays to try and get Matthews to score instead of focusing on what he needs to do to be successful.

A lot of people will disagree but the more I watch, the more I’ve come to the conclusion that Matthews does bring his teammates play down when he isn’t playing well because the rest of the line is hyper focused on getting him the puck to score instead of making plays for themselves to score.



I also find it pretty interesting that as soon as stuff goes wrong Marner is the first guy that gets blamed lol. Fairly or unfairly

It takes two to dance.
AM esp back in the North Division started to flow around and just waited for MM to pass him the puck to score. AM played better and didn’t wait around last season.
MM’s problem has always been making those pretty passes to get into highlights instead of doing the simple thing. A lot of times when it is a 2 on 1, MM doesn’t even bother looking at the goalie which makes his moves predictable.

The thing is that when AM is not scoring, it usually means MM can’t get any assists. Personally, I think both of them are playing bad currently and they tend to struggle whenever the opposing teams play tight against them. They are actually better off playing against opposing top line bc it will lead to more space than playing against opposing checking line or 4th line where all they do is defend and trying to get out of their own zone.

 

[ANDI P IS CUTE]

even though the coach is charmin soft like keefe and shany? REALLY?! We got HUGE PROBLEMS here if thats the case. Is it really from that one single true comment last week by Keefe? Good gosh. Unbelieveable. Marners gotta go. Holl needs to go, and all 3 of keefe/shany/dubas need gone NOW.

 

[ACC1224]

The coach and GM have very little clue to what they’re doing.

Yep

 

[hfman]

even though the coach is charmin soft like keefe and shany? REALLY?! We got HUGE PROBLEMS here if thats the case. Is it really from that one single true comment last week by Keefe? Good gosh. Unbelieveable. Marners gotta go. Holl needs to go, and all 3 of keefe/shany/dubas need gone NOW.

Just look at them. Watch their interviews. It's all kids. No men. They might be 20's but honest-to-god their personalities scream of rich entitled teenagers. No one's in charge over there.

They better get their act together in a hurry or they can forget about their highest-paying-contracts-in-the-league come their next deals...

 

[Racer88]

Dubas needs to trade one of these guys now. Perferably Marner. They continue to not reward you for your faith in them. You will actually be respected for it.

One of them needs to be gone for sure but I sure wouldn’t trust Dubas to handle that serious deal

 

[leafsfan5]

We need a re-tool and a culture change. Fire Shanahan/Dubas/Keefe. Trade one of the core 4. The team is rotten

Unfortunately, this likely will not happen until the offseason. In the mean time, the team will likely get hot soon, go on a run and make the playoffs easily. But the underlying issues will remain, and we'll lose in round 1

 

[Matthews4Calder]

even though the coach is charmin soft like keefe and shany? REALLY?! We got HUGE PROBLEMS here if thats the case. Is it really from that one single true comment last week by Keefe? Good gosh. Unbelieveable. Marners gotta go. Holl needs to go, and all 3 of keefe/shany/dubas need gone NOW.

You're bang on my friend. I've been saying it for years with this core and how they screwed the team over with their signings albeit Dubas' fault for giving it to them. They hadn't accomplished anything and basically handcuffed the team to fill the rest of the roster with some decent depth. Reilly took a discount nobody else did. Said it for a long time soft bunch that are not built to win a cup. regular season doesn't mean crap. Dubas is the guy I'm most pissed with because he keeps trying to fill out the roster with other teams cast offs because he can't do anything else until some part of the core are gone. Team is worse this year than last.

 

[Apotheosis]

Honestly? Yeah probably. I don't know if it's a blunt just giving up, but we see time and time again that the team is barely able to fight through adversity and cannot get it done. It starts from the top down but choices by the players make a huge impact. Marner holding up for more money despite his comparable peers taking less. Rielly takes a discount and no one else of the "core" did (maybe technically Matthews since his market value at the time was probably a bit higher). It's just sad.

 

[Bomber0104]

Yes.

And they’ll do it again until they’re dealt.

 

[binop7]

They kind of went from trying to develop a certain kind of program to idolizing the star power in house. We've built a real NBA culture of celebrity Leafs and a vast supporting cast of mercenaries.

And as you said in the past you can't expect the lowest paid guys to be the ones dragging the highest paid guys into war. It makes no sense

 

[hfman]

Which explains why you're sitting in your basement eating Cheetos and not managing an NHL team.

no offence friend but you're also sitting in your basement typing on the internet while also not managing an NHL team

 

[Apotheosis]

honestly who cares anymore. let them play like crap all season and draft Bedard so Dubas/the next GM has an excuse to start trading some of them and cleaning house

 

[Blanche Blanche]

I’d keep Nylander. Everyone else is trade.

Matthews has been a playoff ghost his entire tenure here.

Marner gets bullied too easily.

Tavares is overpaid and is aging.

Blow it up. Let’s do this again. Without Shanny, Dubas and Keefe.

 

[saffronleaf]

Mabe so but in an interview after cup win he was angry at T.O in some statements he made, wearing 91 again could have also been a statement

'seems like a shot at john tavares'

 

[Stephen]

I also find it pretty interesting that as soon as stuff goes wrong Marner is the first guy that gets blamed lol. Fairly or unfairly

From my perspective, I'd just like to separate the Toronto Maple Leafs identity from his. The whole fragility under pressure, drama with coaches, etc.

 

[Stephen]

Mabe so but in an interview after cup win he was angry at T.O in some statements he made, wearing 91 again could have also been a statement

Kadri was a classic 19/91 guy in Kitchener and London so maybe he just wanted to get away from the 43 practice number the Leafs stuck him with all those years.