The Core Has To Go

[MCR74]

Look who's talking now:

Where was Peel during the first round? Oh right...

 

[ULF_55]

He'd be moved based on lacking the NMC that Tavares, Matthews and Marner have or will have, and also the need to change the team in a way that's meaningful enough.

Putting a big salary on the 4th line or in the press box just isn't going to accomplish all that much in a cap league.

I'd quite honestly prefer a coaching change over the moving out of a core player. I'm actually not sure which is the more likely move of the two to occur, if either?

Maybe a huge trade at the draft?

If they haven't been talking, then he should be traded before July 1st.
If they have been talking there should be the basis of a deal.

Tkachuk was upfront with the Flames, does Matthews have less character?

 

[stealth1]

how do we know it would be a couple of seasons, what happens if we end up with the basic leafs luck and miss the playoffs for a decade like Buffalo?

there are no guarantees in the NHL and if you're willing to tear it down and rebuild you'll likely have to be ok with probably 7ish years again before becoming a contender. People here got spoiled because we made it to the playoffs literally the year after tanking. What if that doesn't happen again? do we tear it down again and rebuild again?

Making the playoffs isn't the goal. Winning the cup is the goal.

 

[ULF_55]

If you have to choose you keep Matthews over Marner. The center and goal scorer.

I don't really have a preference, but yes the big center is part of the strength down the middle.

Matthews
Tavares
O'Reilly
PenaltyKiller

I'm okay with that.

I'd also be okay if they kept marner, just don't see 3 double digits being effective.

3 players in the top 10 for cap hit isn't working.

Moving out Rielly or Nylander doesn't enable the team to add 2 top 6 forwards.

Leafs have to address their top heavy players, Tavares, Matthews, marner.
This is where the problem exists, not players getting paid Tier 2 money.
O'Reilly, Rielly and Nylander are not the problems.

 

[usernamezrhardtodo]

Don't worry, the odds of an actual rebuild are very very low. Even trading a single one of the core forwards is probably only like 30%. The reality is, if it's Dubas or someone else, they won't be given the green light to rebuild, or even retool to trade a single star. MLSE board will want to milk these guys until they literally have to throw out jerseys, until then, thanks for the money. Being decent in the regular season and selling the idea that maybe this year is different is all they need to print money. Why would they jeprodize that by risking a big step back?

Great points. I do know a few years ago an executive from Rogers mentioned that they only cared that the Jays were contenders until around June in order to make money. If they sold hope and the crowds came in...they made money. They wouldn't have to pay big bucks for UFA's because the "Hope" would fill the seats until reality set in. I would not be surprised if they pushed the same type of agenda on the Leafs.

You realize he might not resign right?

The way you lot talk you would think that choke job who's going to demand massive money is definitely going to want to stay here
If he walks for nothing next season everybody in management should never work in the industry again

Jesus we may not even make the playoffs you say, holy hell how are we ever going to exist without the magnificent success we've all become accustomed to year after year

True...God help us if we don't play an extra 2 weeks after the season is over...the success is palpable.

 

[ULF_55]

Lost in this idyllic vision of the future is that we are very likely going to take a large step back by dismantling the core of this team and there's a very good chance of being back in the wilderness if it's not done right.

I'm not saying we run it back, as some change is clearly needed. I'm just surprised how eager so many seem to be for teardown. I'm not excited about it, just sad.

If moving one player is dismantling the core, then it is already broken.

 

[AvroArrow]

What would be an appropriate way to spend the next day? How did all the other players around the league spend the next day after being eliminated?

Back in the gym working on your craft, like all the real greats across any sport do. Check what Kobe did after big losses and playoff losses, the last thing on his mind was celebrating and chilling. Marner doesn't have the championship mentality.

Not trying to sound full of myself but I get up at 5AM every single day and put in my work, there's absolutely no reason why I should be in better shape and be putting in more effort than these professional athletes demanding 11M a year when they have failed year after year. It shows where his mindset is at, he's not about winning a championship.

Like I said, to each their own, his life he can do whatever he wants but it's obvious he doesn't have a championship mindset. Take a look at how Crosby and other true greats handled their off-seasons especially immediately coming off a loss.

Sounds about right. Didn't he post a picture of him packing up for the cottage after last year's loss?

Doing back flips off a yacht

 

[Buds17]

Maybe a huge trade at the draft?

If they haven't been talking, then he should be traded before July 1st.
If they have been talking there should be the basis of a deal.

Tkachuk was upfront with the Flames, does Matthews have less character?

There potentially exists an important distinction to make between the respective situations of Tkachuk then and Matthews now though. That is, Tkachuk was out of contract and evidently only going to renew with Calgary as part of a sign-and-trade proposition, whereas Matthews still has a year remaining on his Leaf contract.

 

[ACC1224]

Where was Peel during the first round? Oh right...

I'm sure he was in line with the rest of the flip floppers.

 

[ULF_55]

Supposedly his wrist that was finally healed late in the season was hurt again? If that is the case it has been bad a lot more often than good the last couple years and a goal scorer with a bum wrist isn’t a goal scorer so…

As far as the contract, if he’s willing to agree to an extension before the nmc kicks in then fine.. but I’m not sure they can sign on the dotted line before it kicks in?

If not, see ya.. can’t risk losing him for nothing and the team already bent over backwards on money AND term this deal.

He can sign on July 1st., when he's protected by NMC.

As I've mentioned if they aren't already talking they should trade him before July 1st., perhaps at the draft because if they aren't talking it is already and issue.

It is character time, if he screws the Leafs that would be my answer. Normally a 50 goal scorer over 82 games, but he doesn't play 82 games. He doesn't carry the team on his back in the playoffs, so they'd be losing an entertainment piece. Ovechkin has been that in Washington. Still is. One Cup, but annually he provides entertainment.

 

[ULF_55]

There potentially exists an important distinction to make between the respective situations of Tkachuk then and Matthews now though. That is, Tkachuk was out of contract and evidently only going to renew with Calgary as part of a sign-and-trade proposition, whereas Matthews still has a year remaining on his Leaf contract.

Yes, there is that, but from my understanding he said he'd sign a 1 year deal, and then leave.
EXPIRY STATUS: RFA (Arb)

But would agree to a sign and trade.

 

[ACC1224]

Back in the gym working on your craft, like all the real greats across any sport do. Check what Kobe did after big losses and playoff losses, the last thing on his mind was celebrating and chilling. Marner doesn't have the championship mentality.

Not trying to sound full of myself but I get up at 5AM every single day and put in my work, there's absolutely no reason why I should be in better shape and be putting in more effort than these professional athletes demanding 11M a year when they have failed year after year. It shows where his mindset is at, he's not about winning a championship.

Like I said, to each their own, his life he can do whatever he wants but it's obvious he doesn't have a championship mindset. Take a look at how Crosby and other true greats handled their off-seasons especially immediately coming off a loss.



Doing back flips off a yacht

So you assume that every player throughout the league the day after the season ends is at the gym at 5am?
(I don't know Kobe and neither do you, perhaps you're not serious but there is no reason to believe you're in better shape than a professional athlete)

 

[Apex Predator]

Back in the gym working on your craft, like all the real greats across any sport do. Check what Kobe did after big losses and playoff losses, the last thing on his mind was celebrating and chilling. Marner doesn't have the championship mentality.

Not trying to sound full of myself but I get up at 5AM every single day and put in my work, there's absolutely no reason why I should be in better shape and be putting in more effort than these professional athletes demanding 11M a year when they have failed year after year. It shows where his mindset is at, he's not about winning a championship.

Like I said, to each their own, his life he can do whatever he wants but it's obvious he doesn't have a championship mindset. Take a look at how Crosby and other true greats handled their off-seasons especially immediately coming off a loss.



Doing back flips off a yacht

Maybe a couple do that. Honestly after a lose I think you just guy home and chill for a few days. Stays out of media attention. Spend time with friends and family.

 

[Buds17]

Yes, there is that, but from my understanding he said he'd sign a 1 year deal, and then leave.
EXPIRY STATUS: RFA (Arb)

But would agree to a sign and trade.

Which is essentially the equivalent of a player wanting out of his current situation.

What if Matthews isn't exactly at that point? What if he waits until early into the new season to re-sign like Rielly did? Do the Leafs absolutely have to make this trade in the absence of Auston's signature on a new contract by a certain date?

 

[AvroArrow]

So you assume that every player throughout the league the day after the season ends is at the gym at 5am?
(I don't know Kobe and neither do you, perhaps you're not serious but there is no reason to believe you're in better shape than a professional athlete)

To the first sentence, no they don't have to be there at 5 am, but they have to be there. I expect players to be working on their game in the off-season. Especially when they demand nearly max contracts and haven't shown up or gotten anything done.

PM me if you want, you can add me on social media if you like lol. I am in better shape than about 99% of these professional athletes, that's why it pisses me off when these privileged guys don't put in the work. If a guy working an average job like myself can commit himself to training and bettering himself and nutrition etc, there's no excuse why they can't. The reason why Marner can't and never has, he doesn't have the mindset, he doesn't have what it takes mentally or physically to get it done.

It's pathetic, that after a performance like his. Like I said multiple times to each their own, but it's clear that he doesn't want to put in the work. Everyone wants a Stanley cup, very few guys are willing to do what it takes to win the Stanley cup, and it's clear that Marner isn't one of them. All talent with no work ethic.

 

[MCR74]

It's pathetic, that after a performance like his. Like I said multiple times to each their own, but it's clear that he doesn't want to put in the work. Everyone wants a Stanley cup, very few guys are willing to do what it takes to win the Stanley cup, and it's clear that Marner isn't one of them. All talent with no work ethic.

That's my impression as well.

 

[IPS]

To the first sentence, no they don't have to be there at 5 am, but they have to be there. I expect players to be working on their game in the off-season. Especially when they demand nearly max contracts and haven't shown up or gotten anything done.

PM me if you want, you can add me on social media if you like lol. I am in better shape than about 99% of these professional athletes, that's why it pisses me off when these privileged guys don't put in the work. If a guy working an average job like myself can commit himself to training and bettering himself and nutrition etc, there's no excuse why they can't. The reason why Marner can't and never has, he doesn't have the mindset, he doesn't have what it takes mentally or physically to get it done.

It's pathetic, that after a performance like his. Like I said multiple times to each their own, but it's clear that he doesn't want to put in the work. Everyone wants a Stanley cup, very few guys are willing to do what it takes to win the Stanley cup, and it's clear that Marner isn't one of them. All talent with no work ethic.

I don't doubt you're in "better shape" in the sense you have a better physique (hockey players don't have impressive physiques for the most part) but in terms of functionality you're nowhere near pro hockey players.

I really believe Marner puts the work in - he just gets mindf***ed by the pressure come playoff time and has no physical attributes to make up for his mental deficiencies.

 

[sittler rules!!!]

This fan base literally rages every single loss. Be it a meaningless regular season game or a second round loss. You guys are only happy when we are winning and only one team gets to win every season so guess what, you guys are always miserable. Now that I think about it, the only time that you guys weren't raging was when Babcock took us to last overall. Weird huh?

I'm not going to keep repeating myself but I will for you. The Covid flat cap kept us unbalanced and top heavy with 4 guys consuming almost half the cap but the plan was solid. Because of that, we have two top lines and no LW. Because of that and the fact that in the playoffs you play the same team 7 games in a row, the opposing coaches learn how to shutdown our 4 stars because they are basically short handed with our horrible LW like Hands, Bunting and Jarnkrok especially with Knies and Robertson down. The flat cap also hurts other areas. Keeping both ROR and JT at center was a mistake. If you want to fire Keefe that's cool, we can do better.

The future is bright. If we can sign Matthews and Nylander this offseason while the cap is still low that might help. If we start trading people we might lose some loyalty from the others. If Knies and Roberts are healthy and can play in the top 6 with entry contracts next season could be fun. In two years JT's $11M clears up, the cap should be rising and we can easily re-sign Marner and hopefully find a 2C and a real goaltender by then too. The past few years were rough but it's really no ones fault but the future is bright. I'm off to my tee time. Have a good weekend.

DO NOT BRING MARNER BACK!!! Absolute coward against Florida. Move him now.

Would you guys have interest in Byfield?

Would you take Marner for Byfield?

 

[ULF_55]

Which is essentially the equivalent of a player wanting out of his current situation.

What if Matthews isn't exactly at that point? What if he waits until early into the new season to re-sign like Rielly did? Do the Leafs absolutely have to make this trade in the absence of Auston's signature on a new contract by a certain date?

He has no ties to Toronto, nor Canada.

He's a pure mercenary.

 

[Buds17]

He has no ties to Toronto, nor Canada.

He's a pure mercenary.

Do we know this for certain? Do we stay away from drafting American born players in the future just to be on the safe side?

 

[ACC1224]

Maybe a couple do that. Honestly after a lose I think you just guy home and chill for a few days. Stays out of media attention. Spend time with friends and family.

It’s crazy the takes people have.
It’s fine to criticize their play on the ice but all the rest of the stuff is pretty Pejorative Slured.

 

[Stephen]

Look who's talking now:

Didn't talking out of school sink him in his first career? Welcome to the peanut gallery.

 

[ACC1224]

To the first sentence, no they don't have to be there at 5 am, but they have to be there. I expect players to be working on their game in the off-season. Especially when they demand nearly max contracts and haven't shown up or gotten anything done.

PM me if you want, you can add me on social media if you like lol. I am in better shape than about 99% of these professional athletes, that's why it pisses me off when these privileged guys don't put in the work. If a guy working an average job like myself can commit himself to training and bettering himself and nutrition etc, there's no excuse why they can't. The reason why Marner can't and never has, he doesn't have the mindset, he doesn't have what it takes mentally or physically to get it done.

It's pathetic, that after a performance like his. Like I said multiple times to each their own, but it's clear that he doesn't want to put in the work. Everyone wants a Stanley cup, very few guys are willing to do what it takes to win the Stanley cup, and it's clear that Marner isn't one of them. All talent with no work ethic.

You don’t get to the level they are at by not putting the work in. Your take on this whole thing is absolutely whacked.

 

[Stephen]

He has no ties to Toronto, nor Canada.

He's a pure mercenary.

On the other hand, he's a homegrown, 1st overall player on track to be an all-time great in the organization and a legacy to write. If we take a step back from the Florida series for a moment, Toronto would still be the place in the sport where he has the deepest roots in the sport. It's not like he comes from another hockey hotbed, didn't play juniors in another region, didn't go to a college program with an NHL team nearby. We'll see I guess.

 

[Stephen]

Back in the gym working on your craft, like all the real greats across any sport do. Check what Kobe did after big losses and playoff losses, the last thing on his mind was celebrating and chilling. Marner doesn't have the championship mentality.

Not trying to sound full of myself but I get up at 5AM every single day and put in my work, there's absolutely no reason why I should be in better shape and be putting in more effort than these professional athletes demanding 11M a year when they have failed year after year. It shows where his mindset is at, he's not about winning a championship.

Like I said, to each their own, his life he can do whatever he wants but it's obvious he doesn't have a championship mindset. Take a look at how Crosby and other true greats handled their off-seasons especially immediately coming off a loss.



Doing back flips off a yacht

That’s not fair to the individual athlete though. Imagine if you had an online following of fans and observers and critics wondering why you were busy reading hockey fluff and talking shop and tending to other hobbies and life stuff on the weekend instead of rehearsing and polishing up the PPT presentation for next week.