Prospect Info: The 2021 NHL Entry Draft Thread

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GumbyCan2

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I dont see why Heinola can't play with either and have success. He is a smart player with good puck moving. I think him and Morrissey would be good if Heinola can play RD.
As brought up earlier, though. Can't overlook when heavier forward-laden teams who employ a heavy forecheck could easily wear them down and take their effectiveness out. JMo has experienced this 2 previous, especially near playoff times and in the playoffs. Last summer Flames smothered Morrissey's abilities very effectively for 4 games straight. Heavy forecheck and out-muscling him at every turn, burned out JMo's efforts. With no Buff, that has been the opposition mantra.
Good to see Stanley having an impact and doing some policing! And Forbort has shown some steady heavy-hitter challenges with poise. They do nit quite provide enough game-in/ gameout to sustain a full series success easily, I don't believe.
Heinola & JMo could be "easy targets" to Montreal and Edmonton's bigger forwards relentless attack schemes.
 

GumbyCan2

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True, it is not written in stone that every pair must have 1 big guy and 1 smaller one. The question is if we insist on doing it that way, how does it work?

I would be more inclined to play Heinola with Pionk and keep everybody on their natural sides. But if the other works, sure.

I would also like to see Morrissey and Pionk together. They got a very short stretch of that to start last year, might even have been pre-season. I don't recall for certain. But I do remember that they seemed to play very well together.
Why can't a team plan for 3 very comparably talented Dpairings and run them evenly minutes, adjusting which pairs stack up best against certain oppositions?
 
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surixon

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As brought up earlier, though. Can't overlook when heavier forward-laden teams who employ a heavy forecheck could easily wear them down and take their effectiveness out. JMo has experienced this 2 previous, especially near playoff times and in the playoffs. Last summer Flames smothered Morrissey's abilities very effectively for 4 games straight. Heavy forecheck and out-muscling him at every turn, burned out JMo's efforts. With no Buff, that has been the opposition mantra.
Good to see Stanley having an impact and doing some policing! And Forbort has shown some steady heavy-hitter challenges with poise. They do nit quite provide enough game-in/ gameout to sustain a full series success easily, I don't believe.
Heinola & JMo could be "easy targets" to Montreal and Edmonton's bigger forwards relentless attack schemes.

Morrissey handled Calgary's forechwcknjust fine and him and DeMelo neutralized the Geudreau line which was what their role was. I think you are thinking of Pionk and how he got forechecked into oblivion.

You don't need size to beat a forecheck, what you need is fast retrievals and quick/smart puck movement.
 

Mortimer Snerd

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Why can't a team plan for 3 very comparably talented Dpairings and run them evenly minutes, adjusting which pairs stack up best against certain oppositions?

No reason why they can't. But plenty of reason why they don't. It is tough to get 2 good top pairing Dmen. Having 6 second pairing Dmen doesn't really compensate for the lack of talent at the top. Though 6 2D's is better than 6 3D's, or 4 2D's + 2 3D's, etc. Now, if you could get 4 1D's, or 6 1D's, sure, great plan.

Right now, Jets 2 best Dman are split between to first 2 pairs and the 3rd best Dman is playing on the 3rd pair. That looks like PM is trying to do what you suggest except the talent is not that even and neither is the TOI. He doesn't have the other 3 Dmen to do that. Each of his top 3 is having to carry a weaker partner.
 

Bob E

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If Samberg and Heinola develop quickly, the Jets could ice very solid 3 pairings with only one FA signing.

Morrissey-DeMelo
Samberg-Pionk
Heinola-Savard

PB: Stanley/Poolman

Good blend of size/skill/offence/defence on each pairing.
 
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lanky

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Right now, Jets 2 best Dman are split between to first 2 pairs and the 3rd best Dman is playing on the 3rd pair..... Each of his top 3 is having to carry a weaker partner.

To be fair, if you split your best three then each of them will always, by definition, have a weaker partner.
 

Mortimer Snerd

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To be fair, if you split your best three then each of them will always, by definition, have a weaker partner.

Sure ...... but who are you being fair to? :laugh:

What goal are you accomplishing? It does not create the situation where all 3 pairs are near equal and split TOI near equally. I'm not saying it is, or isn't the best way to utilize what we have. But it is not ideal. The only way to get a more nearly ideal arrangement is to get more talent.
 

surixon

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Mortimer Snerd

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The point I was trying to make was, is Harkins or Berdin worth wasting a 1st on to protect? To me the answer is no.
My memory is questionable on the best of days and trying to remember the ins and outs of an expansion draft 3 years ago is really asking to much of my waning memory. I do remember how pissed people were and the outright disdain of Chevy to maneuver the way he did to simply lose those players anyways. Whether I got the facts exactly right are moot to me and I would hope people would just see the point I am trying to make. Sorry if I pissed people off in the process, you should see what my wife puts up with...

Berdin is easily a no. Harkins, not so much. He looked pretty good last year when he got some actual opportunity. Right now, he still projects as a pretty good bottom 6 winger.

People have talked about this being a weak draft and us having a late pick, etc. The odds may be that we would be doing well to get a player as good as Harkins with that pick. Players of that calibre are supposed to be easy to get. I'm not convinced of that, but that is another debate.

What we would lose though would be that long shot chance of hitting a blind dumb luck home run with that pick.
 
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ps241

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No one in the OHL ranked in the top 50. I get the kids didn't play this year but the OHL usually pumps out talent. There is the possibility to nab some highly talented kids who are undervalued due to not playing.

This is why it would be nice to keep the 1st and 2nd round picks. It’s not a great draft but there could be real talent in the top 60 that gets overlooked do you the exact situation you mentioned.
 

surixon

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This is why it would be nice to keep the 1st and 2nd round picks. It’s not a great draft but there could be real talent in the top 60 that gets overlooked do you the exact situation you mentioned.

Yeah I wouldn't be opposed to trying to load up on mid round picks through trading back. To me this is the draft where that strategy could be very beneficial.
 

GumbyCan2

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No reason why they can't. But plenty of reason why they don't. It is tough to get 2 good top pairing Dmen. Having 6 second pairing Dmen doesn't really compensate for the lack of talent at the top. Though 6 2D's is better than 6 3D's, or 4 2D's + 2 3D's, etc. Now, if you could get 4 1D's, or 6 1D's, sure, great plan.


Right now, Jets 2 best Dman are split between to first 2 pairs and the 3rd best Dman is playing on the 3rd pair. That looks like PM is trying to do what you suggest except the talent is not that even and neither is the TOI. He doesn't have the other 3 Dmen to do that. Each of his top 3 is having to carry a weaker partner.

My thought was running 3 lines with:
The top-2 as we have it, but hopefully next year upgrading on Poolmn with Morrissey, and ^+Samburg joining Pionk (with resigning him), and then;
VHeinola with DDemelo. Spread out 3 top defenders, assuming Heinola is ready full bore for NHL giving her.
?? Whats wrong with this??
Maybe - Stanley can pair with Heinola and they gel, compliment. (and or Demelo is dealt with a prospect or 2 to get a higher rated RHS; or d Demelo plays with Morrissey, letting JMo green light to explore more offensive play starts and rushes!)
Not possible or plausable??
The only other fixes likely are trading a top forward or 2, plus high picks to get proper talented Defense on the Jets again! So, Morrissey, Pionk, Heinola, maybe Samberg? are all only 2nd pairing peak, top, best level, but none can play with each other to form a make-shift top pairing!? What about your love for Demelo, calling him a top pair/ top 3 defender at season start? He's a valued, sturdy 3rd liner on many other teams.

What is the fix you all suggest? ( instead of questioning others, dissing what/who we have now, Im talking for next year, future)
 
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Daximus

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No one in the OHL ranked in the top 50. I get the kids didn't play this year but the OHL usually pumps out talent. There is the possibility to nab some highly talented kids who are undervalued due to not playing.

There are quite a few OHL kids who went to play in other leagues because the OHL didn't play this year.

Brandt Clarke, Mason McTavish, Daniil Chayka, Francesco Pinelli and Brennan Othmann to name a few in Bob's 1st round.
 

Mortimer Snerd

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My thought was running 3 lines with:
The top-2 as we have it, but hopefully next year upgrading on Poolmn with Morrissey, and ^+Samburg joining Pionk (with resigning him), and then;
VHeinola with DDemelo. Spread out 3 top defenders, assuming Heinola is ready full bore for NHL giving her.
?? Whats wrong with this??
Maybe - Stanley can pair with Heinola and they gel, compliment.

What makes you think I think there is something wrong with this?

Improving on the partners we have for each of our current top 3 Dmen would obviously be better than what we have. A step in the right direction.

But wouldn't you really rather have a top pair with 2 legit top pair players on it?
 

GumbyCan2

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What makes you think I think there is something wrong with this?

Improving on the partners we have for each of our current top 3 Dmen would obviously be better than what we have. A step in the right direction.

Absolutely! How do we convince Chevy/Jets to get "this"?
But wouldn't you really rather have a top pair with 2 legit top pair players on it?
 

GumbyCan2

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There are quite a few OHL kids who went to play in other leagues because the OHL didn't play this year.

Brandt Clarke, Mason McTavish, Daniil Chayka, Francesco Pinelli and Brennan Othmann to name a few in Bob's 1st round.
Where do we find proper scouting on these lads?
 

Mortimer Snerd

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Absolutely! How do we convince Chevy/Jets to get "this"?

I don't think Chevy needs any convincing. It is easier said than done.

I do think Chevy needs to be aggressive in pursuing a real solution. I don't like half-measures.
 

surixon

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There are quite a few OHL kids who went to play in other leagues because the OHL didn't play this year.

Brandt Clarke, Mason McTavish, Daniil Chayka, Francesco Pinelli and Brennan Othmann to name a few in Bob's 1st round.

Ah so that is where they are.
 

GumbyCan2

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I don't think Chevy needs any convincing. It is easier said than done.

I do think Chevy needs to be aggressive in pursuing a real solution. I don't like half-measures.
Gotcha.
3 years of 1/2 measures, and um-teen experienced 7/8 plug-in fillers is all we get and a head coach afraid to insert youngsters with skill & potential to any real playing time in all situations and gaining experience.
Something has to change, and that is most viable with trading a Connor or Ehlers and our Captain $$$$$ -bags. I do not advocate this approach, but...??
 
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