Tank Nation: Who's In?

[The Apologist]

Then I honestly don't understand how you are happy with this team and especially guys being paid to be the best players, yet aren't. Maybe you're so used to losing it scares you to think there's something else out there, like...winning.

Or maybe you're so brainwashed by tank nation that you don't understand that having a chance at a Kessel or Phaneuf is NOT worth giving up a Kessel or Phaneuf?

 

[The Apologist]

I guess adding age somehow infers promise. Bernier is in his first year. Even raycroft had one of those. Lets give it a year or 2. JVR is a big forward, not a power forward. Simmonds is a power forward. If you can't see the difference, well...lol. 28 year old top pairing dman is hyperbole. This is another poster's mo. Well, he plays 1st line center so he is a 1st line center. Doesn't mean he's a good one

So the fact that Bernier has always been considered a potential franchise goalie and then comes out this season to show that he may in fact be a franchise goalie means we should stop considering his potential to be a franchise goalie?

Our top pairing defenseman is a top pairing defenseman on nearly every team in NHL whether you like it or not.

Based on your statements above why bother drafting at all? The second they get drafted and don't become an instant Gretzky (hell even if they do) you'll just tell us to stop considering their potential an trade em for the next batch.

 

[theIceWookie]

I guess adding age somehow infers promise. Bernier is in his first year. Even raycroft had one of those. Lets give it a year or 2. JVR is a big forward, not a power forward. Simmonds is a power forward. If you can't see the difference, well...lol. 28 year old top pairing dman is hyperbole. This is another poster's mo. Well, he plays 1st line center so he is a 1st line center. Doesn't mean he's a good one

Comparing Raycroft to Bernier...that should explain how much I should look into your post. If you can honestlty draw comparison to that, then I don't really need to take apart your post at all lol.

And age doesn't but it gives context. What does infer promise? 30 goals from JVR and being a former 2nd overall pick.

And the Phaneuf haters have long said that about him. Doesn't change that he's still a top pairing defender. YOu not liking him doesn't change that. All the stats indicate that he is in fact a top pairing defender.

I know posters like you love to hate and cry doom but there are actual stats that indidicate this team has a lot of promise. Age is one of those factors.

It's such an idiotic notion that losing means everything on this team is crap. That's ultra simplistic and not true. And very naive

 

[saffronleaf]

There needs to be success for there to be a bandwagon. Leaf fans are as die hard as they come and being angry with this garbage is pretty justifiable.

well said.

There is no 'bandwagon' for a team as horrible as the Leafs.

Most of us have stuck around with the team despite:

- Missing the playoffs for nearly a decade
- 18 wheeler
- Game 7
- Current debacle

There is no bandwagon for a team like that. Who ever is cheering them on and hoping the best for them, like all of us here, are hardcore fans.

Hoping for a tank is still being a fan of the team; it's just hoping for long-term success over short-term success. Both tankers and non-tankers eventually want the Leafs to win the damn Cup.

 

[Longshot]

The year to tank is next season. Connor McDavid at the top of the board. And the Leafs already have his linemate in their system.

Although, I doubt that happens. Buffalo seems to have that race sewn up and no doubt MLSE will once again ramp up the drive to "make the playoffs and see what happens."

 

[Stephen]

If you honestly think we're right back where we started in 2006-2007, then you really don't know what you're talking about.

I'm loving all the hysteria about the Leafs being awful, but it's really not true.

25 year old franchise goaltender, 25 year old top 3 NHL scorer, 24 year old top line power forward, 19 year old developing top 4 dman with top pairing potential, developing 24 year old top 4 dman with top pairing potential, 28 year old top pairing defender, deveoping 23 year old top 6 center with top line potential, 28 year old top 6 center signed to a very good contract long term.

Those aren't "the same as 2006-2007". And those prospects not worth mentioning? You have no idea what you're talking about lol

And yet the 2007 team was a 91 point team...

 

[Teeder9]

Comparing Raycroft to Bernier...that should explain how much I should look into your post. If you can honestlty draw comparison to that, then I don't really need to take apart your post at all lol.

And age doesn't but it gives context. What does infer promise? 30 goals from JVR and being a former 2nd overall pick.

And the Phaneuf haters have long said that about him. Doesn't change that he's still a top pairing defender. YOu not liking him doesn't change that. All the stats indicate that he is in fact a top pairing defender.

I know posters like you love to hate and cry doom but there are actual stats that indidicate this team has a lot of promise. Age is one of those factors.

It's such an idiotic notion that losing means everything on this team is crap. That's ultra simplistic and not true. And very naive

If you really can't understand why I would compare Bernier in his first full season to another guy who was pretty great in his first season as a retort to you calling Bernier a franchise goaltender than why exactly should I care about anything past that in your post. Your inability to put 2 and 2 together up to that point is rather unimpressive for a guy who at times has come across as actually understanding hockey. As far as hate? No. Be disappointed that anyone with any type of hockey background could look at some of these players, Phaneuf in this case, and think he deserves to be called "top pairing"? Absolutely. Your whiny verbiage after that only furthers to play out your lack of, and as your post shows, intensifying disdain for anyone who disagrees with you, like the other "kids" who can't spare another opinion different than yours. At least you used more than 1 line in doing it though. That's a step up from the others who are probably punching their pillows just reading this thread

 

[Celly Hard]

#DraftNylander

 

[HoweHullOrr]

I said this - I will never cheer for the team to lose, but the Management can't keep cycling in no man's land. If we miss the playoffs - we''ll be what? 14th? 10th? so basically anything of worth is already gone, and we'll be going on a song and a prayer and hope for the best.

We either need to SUCK. or make the playoffs. It wouldn't even matter if it's first round struggles, because like I said - Chicago/LA struggled in the playoffs for years. (first round, loss, second round loss, struggle to clinch the playoffs, struggle to get to the third round, etc etc).

but we can't be like LOOK HOW DOMINANT WE ARE... oh wait crap, we're out again.

This is why I don't understand why people miss/want Burke. we can all agree something is severely wrong with this core at this point, but who put it together? right. that would be Burke. who set the process back? that would be Burke again. And I'm fine with Nonis protecting the babies of the team [Rielly], but ... yah. whatever, I'm to heartbroken right now.

Some good draft picks in that range. We just need a little luck, good scouting and good judgement, with more emphasis on the last two factors. Karlsson comes to mind. He was 15th I think. Giroux was 22nd. McDonagh was 12th overall. Also, Subban was a 2nd rounder, as was Stephan.

 

[Teeder9]

Some good draft picks in that range. We just need a little, good scouting and good judgement. Karlsson comes to mind. He was 15th I think. Subban was a 2nd rounder as well.

So, we are back to finishing 9th and hoping the Gods stop hating us when it comes to the draft like 5 years ago? Great. Well, not sure why this thread has garnered so much hate from some. We're saved by mediocrity. They should be happy

 

[Cor]

As many as 4 teams have a realistic shot as surpassing us when you take into account game in hand everyone has on us.

 

[HoweHullOrr]

Some good draft picks in that range. We just need a little luck, good scouting and good judgement, with more emphasis on the last two factors. Karlsson comes to mind. He was 15th I think. Giroux was 22nd. McDonagh was 12th overall. Also, Subban was a 2nd rounder, as was Stephan.

So, we are back to finishing 9th and hoping the Gods stop hating us when it comes to the draft like 5 years ago? Great. Well, not sure why this thread has garnered so much hate from some. We're saved by mediocrity. They should be happy

Don't try to read too much in to what I said, or lump me into some imaginary category.

I merely said that a midling 1st round pick can turn out to be a good/very good player. I'm not happy with this season's results either.

I think drafting is an important part of building teams, and timing is important. If you've developed a (true) solid core, then think about adding some peices through alternative methods.

IMHO many Leaf GMs have jumped the gun in the process, and this has been a problem in many current, near-term and former Leaf regimes ..... IMHO.

 

[Teeder9]

Don't try to read too much in to what I said, or lump me into some imaginary category.

I merely said that a midling 1st round pick can turn out to be a good/very good player. I'm not happy with this season's results either.

I think drafting is an important part of building teams, and timing is important. If you've developed a (true) solid core, then think about adding some peices through alternative methods.

IMHO many Leaf GMs have jumped the gun in the process, and this has been a problem in many current, near-term and former Leaf regimes ..... IMHO.

I wasn't lumping you in, although I do apologize for being opportunistic with your post. I also agree about the GM's, including our current one

 

[HoweHullOrr]

Don't try to read too much in to what I said, or lump me into some imaginary category.

I merely said that a midling 1st round pick can turn out to be a good/very good player. I'm not happy with this season's results either.

I think drafting is an important part of building teams, and timing is important. If you've developed a (true) solid core, then think about adding some peices through alternative methods.

IMHO many Leaf GMs have jumped the gun in the process, and this has been a problem in many current, near-term and former Leaf regimes ..... IMHO.

I wasn't lumping you in, although I do apologize for being opportunistic with your post. I also agree about the GM's, including our current one

OK. No worries.

 

[Daisy Jane]

As many as 4 teams have a realistic shot as surpassing us when you take into account game in hand everyone has on us.

are you determined to make me cry?

 

[DaveT83*]

And yet the 2007 team was a 91 point team...

They also had a higher ranked prospect pool!

 

[DaveT83*]

Or maybe you're so brainwashed by tank nation that you don't understand that having a chance at a Kessel or Phaneuf is NOT worth giving up a Kessel or Phaneuf?

Nobody wants another Phaneuf or Kessel. I think that might be the point your missing.

Additonally please refer to ELC contracts.

Please refer to our Core's current and future cap hits.


I have no idea how this is so difficult for some to understand. Its not working. It hasn't worked. Its not going to work. Continuing down this path was dead wrong 10 years ago. It was dead wrong 5 years ago. Its still dead wrong today.


Knowing that people like this exist in society makes me want to pack my family up and move to the ****ing jungles of Bolivia. To think they are on the Highways. They are looking after children. They are making decisions that affect the lives and safety of everyone around them on a daily basis truly scares me to death.

 

[disgruntleddave]

I gave up on this season weeks ago. I really would be content if we didn't get a single more point this season. Help improve a mid 1st draft pick, and more importantly give them a better bet at firing carlyle.

 

[Stephen]

Or maybe you're so brainwashed by tank nation that you don't understand that having a chance at a Kessel or Phaneuf is NOT worth giving up a Kessel or Phaneuf?

No one wants to draft another Phaneuf.

 

[HoweHullOrr]

Nobody wants another Phaneuf or Kessel. I think that might be the point your missing.

Additonally please refer to ELC contracts.

Please refer to our Core's current and future cap hits.


I have no idea how this is so difficult for some to understand. Its not working. It hasn't worked. Its not going to work. Continuing down this path was dead wrong 10 years ago. It was dead wrong 5 years ago. Its still dead wrong today.


Knowing that people like this exist in society makes me want to pack my family up and move to the ****ing jungles of Bolivia. To think they are on the Highways. They are looking after children. They are making decisions that affect the lives and safety of everyone around them on a daily basis truly scares me to death.

If you are thinking about moving to Bolivia and want to avoid the jungle, you could live on the alti-plano .... or LaPaz ....or Cochabamba or ...... Santa Cruz ..... none of which have jungles.

j/k ..... just having a little fun

 

[Teeder9]

No one wants to draft another Phaneuf.

Actually, I wouldn't mind drafting another Phaneuf. I just don't want him to degrade to the 7th rounder Gunnarsson was, which says a lot more for Carl than it does for Dion

 

[saffronleaf]

I gave up on this season weeks ago. I really would be content if we didn't get a single more point this season. Help improve a mid 1st draft pick, and more importantly give them a better bet at firing carlyle.

I gave up on this season in 2003.

 

[jrgtml67]

ya...umm just writing one post cause this is ridiculous...

ya lets tank with 7 games left after tnight...first off Nonis is Coangelo and second even if we did tank we wouldnt get a high enough pick to make it worth while.

 

[Confucius]

Nobody wants another Phaneuf or Kessel. I think that might be the point your missing.

Additonally please refer to ELC contracts.

Please refer to our Core's current and future cap hits.


I have no idea how this is so difficult for some to understand. Its not working. It hasn't worked. Its not going to work. Continuing down this path was dead wrong 10 years ago. It was dead wrong 5 years ago. Its still dead wrong today.


Knowing that people like this exist in society makes me want to pack my family up and move to the ****ing jungles of Bolivia. To think they are on the Highways. They are looking after children. They are making decisions that affect the lives and safety of everyone around them on a daily basis truly scares me to death.

Good Lord no, I don't even want the one we got.

 

[rojac]

Tank Nation takes the long view. When rojac was going all anti-tank in years past, all tank nation wanted was a shot at Patrick Kane, Steven Stamkos, John Tavares, Drew Doughty, etc.

Would that seriously have been so bad if we had lost a half dozen or more games back in the day if we had those kind of players to watch now?

And the truth is, none of us have any idea how things might have turned out if different decisions had been made. And you're lying to yourself and us if you think you do.