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Online Series: Star Trek: Discovery - III - Spock's Beard
- Thread starter Blender
- Start date
Nurmagomedov
Registered User
"There's enough here for Federation scientists to pour over for hundreds of years"
...
"BTW, I reviewed the sensor logs from the exploded living planetoid, i know where Spock is"
...
"BTW, I reviewed the sensor logs from the exploded living planetoid, i know where Spock is"
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Osprey
Registered User
"There's enough here for Federation scientists to pour over for hundreds of years"
...
"BTW, I reviewed the sensor logs from the exploded living planetoid, i know where Spock is"
Burnham is smarter than everyone in the Federation, even the scientists, didn't you know?
Seriously, I suppose that, if it would take 200 years to read 100,000 years of logs, just the last year could, technically, be read in less than a day. On the other hand, that assumes that the sphere sent them in order and in a language that she knew. I doubt the former because it probably doesn't have a great sense of time or organization and I doubt the latter because it tried to communicate with them via a virus. Come to think of it, if the sphere knows no languages known to the Federation, how could Burnham have read the logs and extracted important information from them, especially so quickly? Man, lesson to self: don't try to defend the writing because you'll just realize that it's even dumber than you initially thought.
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Blender
Registered User
Maybe she...yea I have nothing either.
Jussi
Registered User
The sphere taught them it's language, so the universal translator had been updated. I assume the computers on the Discovery allow a simple search parameter of "sensor logs, last 24 hours". Boom.
Osprey
Registered User
I don't understand how the sphere could teach them its language when it doesn't know their language. Regardless, if it could teach them, it could've simply done so in the first place by injecting the translation into the universal translator.
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Blender
Registered User
Shaka, when the walls fell.
The Nemesis
Semper Tyrannus
The way I figured, the sphere could comb their systems and probably use the languages it picked up over 10,000 years or however long it's been out there to rosetta stone its way to a workable translation for Discovery, but it couldn't do that without that initial contact that screwed the ship up.
As for Burnham finding the Spock stuff, I have to imagine the sphere's data dump includes some amount of timestamp. She'd just have to look at the most recent non-Discovery data it had when it blew up.
Sokath, his eyes uncovered.
Osprey
Registered User
That was a back and forth exchange over a period of time that was natural. It doesn't seem very natural to me for an entity to go from not knowing the other's language in the first exchange to knowing it in the second exchange. If the entity is just that smart and fast, that's an explanation, but a rather "god machine"-like one, it seems to me.
That seems a little convenient and an example of lazy writing to me. Regardless, if it could comb through and inject something into the universal translator while the shields were up in the first place, why couldn't it have injected the translation as soon as it finished it? Why did it have to wait until they lowered their shields (aside from the obvious, that it would've eliminated 30 minutes of the episode and its most suspenseful scene)?
johnjm22
Pseudo Intellectual
Another bad episode.
It starts out promising and feels more grounded, but soon falls apart.
The quippy dialog isn't funny or cute. It's just dumb and immature. Kills the verisimilitude. The juvenile aspects of this show continues to be a problem.
The twist with Kelpiens was a good idea. The moment with Saru and Micheal at the end was reasonably well written and acted, but it wasn't earned. This show never invested enough in their relationship for that scene to carry any real weight.
The sphere is an interesting concept, but the STD writers aren't talented enough to make it compelling without "humanizing" it. There's also tons of pseudo-science-fiction nonsense in this episode as usual.
It starts out promising and feels more grounded, but soon falls apart.
The quippy dialog isn't funny or cute. It's just dumb and immature. Kills the verisimilitude. The juvenile aspects of this show continues to be a problem.
The twist with Kelpiens was a good idea. The moment with Saru and Micheal at the end was reasonably well written and acted, but it wasn't earned. This show never invested enough in their relationship for that scene to carry any real weight.
The sphere is an interesting concept, but the STD writers aren't talented enough to make it compelling without "humanizing" it. There's also tons of pseudo-science-fiction nonsense in this episode as usual.
Blender
Registered User
Saru was actually pissed at her and thought she was a reckless know it all that gets people killed. They didn't spend any time building up the relationship they tried to claim they have.
johnjm22
Pseudo Intellectual
Exactly. For that scene to really pay off they would've had to have previous episodes showing growth and connection in their relationship.
I find it annoying that every character seems to go to Micheal for anything. Saru probably could've had that end-scene with plenty of other characters and it probably would've held just as much weight. Micheal is totally forced as the main character.
I also agree with your comments that this episode was too cluttered as is almost every episode. They never fully develop any individual story thread.
Blender
Registered User
Based solely on this season, Tilly would have made the most sense. As annoying as she is, no one can deny that they have been showing the growth of a mentor/mentee relationship between the two of them.
Osprey
Registered User
This is one of the disadvantages of serialized series like this, IMO. Each episode occurs almost immediately after the previous one and, so, everything feels like it takes place in a short amount of time. One nice thing about procedural series like earlier Trek series is it can be assumed that a season takes place over a year (TOS' "5-year mission" was even meant to be told over 5 seasons), that weeks (or even months) go by between each episode and that there are lots of adventures and interactions that the crew have in-between episodes that we never see. That fills in lots of issues of pacing. In a procedural series, Burnham and Tyler falling in love or Burnham and Saru becoming close friends over only a handful of episodes would seem more believable because you'd assume that it happened over several months, at least. In Discovery, it feels like it happens over several days, so, of course, it doesn't feel believable or earned.
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The Nemesis
Semper Tyrannus
Can't do that. It'd undercut Burnham's character arc of being Space Jesus.
Osprey
Registered User
I completely forgot that there was an episode last night.
I find this juxtaposition of posts amusing.
I find this juxtaposition of posts amusing.
The Nemesis
Semper Tyrannus
#1) Does everyone on Discovery know exactly who Section 31 is? When it was introduced in DS9 it was a rumor. I conspiracy theory about a secret black-ops division that didn't officially exist and was spoken about as hearsay and conspiracy theories like some sort of illuminati. But Pike and Burnham blatantly recognize exactly what Georgiou's uniform badge represents and everyone talks about Section 31 as if it's no big deal and an everyday fact that Starfleet has a secret grimy wetworks squad going out and doing unseemly things "for the greater good."
#2) The whole point of Section 31 as a plot element in DS9 was that it was a mirror to hold up to the idealism of Starfleet for them to be made uneasy by the revelation that the utopia they take for granted has a slimy underbelly and less than squeaky clean means that created it. It's the unsettling idea that the Federation turns a blind eye to the hypocrisy of Section 31 because it would rather not deal with the uncomfortable nature of its existence in the face of their principles. But here it's just treated like a cost of doing business or a pseudo-moral-compass for humanity's more unstable or inscrutable elements. I mean, for the love of god, this:
precedes what's going on now where it's like "huh, you work for the off-the-books murder-spies. Cool." And yet it's like 150 years in the future.
Also dear lord, can the characters stop just shilling everyone? They don't show us Burnham is smart and compassionate and perfect, they speak it. They don't show the desire to save Tilly, they have 3 different characters gush about how great she is. Stop doing that. It's lazy.
#2) The whole point of Section 31 as a plot element in DS9 was that it was a mirror to hold up to the idealism of Starfleet for them to be made uneasy by the revelation that the utopia they take for granted has a slimy underbelly and less than squeaky clean means that created it. It's the unsettling idea that the Federation turns a blind eye to the hypocrisy of Section 31 because it would rather not deal with the uncomfortable nature of its existence in the face of their principles. But here it's just treated like a cost of doing business or a pseudo-moral-compass for humanity's more unstable or inscrutable elements. I mean, for the love of god, this:
precedes what's going on now where it's like "huh, you work for the off-the-books murder-spies. Cool." And yet it's like 150 years in the future.
Also dear lord, can the characters stop just shilling everyone? They don't show us Burnham is smart and compassionate and perfect, they speak it. They don't show the desire to save Tilly, they have 3 different characters gush about how great she is. Stop doing that. It's lazy.
The Nemesis
Semper Tyrannus
So Stammets does the research to figure out Tilly's not dead, comes up with the plan to save Tilly, enacts the risky part so he can find Tilly, and leads the way to Tilly.
So of course Tilly hugs Burnham and not Stammets when they meet up. That right there symbolizes what's wrong with this show. That and the over-emotional way that everyone reacts to everything.
Also we get more "nobody explains anything because that would negate the conflict necessary to sustain the level of melodrama." Tilly turns on her spore-friend rather than explain what's going on like a rational ****ing scientist because we need the drama of her pointing a gun at shroom-lady.
So of course Tilly hugs Burnham and not Stammets when they meet up. That right there symbolizes what's wrong with this show. That and the over-emotional way that everyone reacts to everything.
Also we get more "nobody explains anything because that would negate the conflict necessary to sustain the level of melodrama." Tilly turns on her spore-friend rather than explain what's going on like a rational ****ing scientist because we need the drama of her pointing a gun at shroom-lady.
Blender
Registered User
I can tell where this Section 31 plot is going, it's blatantly obvious. They are being presented like a CIA type organization that sometimes does shady things, but is generally official, above board, and most important sanctioned and regulated by Starfleet. I am betting that Georgiou is going to do some horrendous shit that forces Starfleet to officially disavow and dissolve Section 31, but it just goes underground to the organization we see in DS9. They will call this plot great world building.
This show is brutal for applied attributes. It was one of the worst parts of season 1, and it's just as strong in season 2. It's incredibly lazy writing, but hardly surprising from the hack running this franchise as he's none of that kind of low quality effort.
Osprey
Registered User
It's so incredibly pretentious, not just of the writers who must think that they're writing great (perhaps even Emmy worthy) television, but also of Burnham to put so much effort into philosophizing as though the universe will pore over her words after she becomes its savior. Personal logs have always been very handy for Star Trek to do exposition, but this show is abusing them to make the writers look better and their main character look smarter.
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