Online Series: Star Trek: Discovery - III - Spock's Beard

[peate]

It's finally become unwatchable for me, the worst Star Trek ever, even Enterprise I could sit through an episode without flinching or fast forwarding like when Tilly comes on.

 

[The Nemesis]

As I start this week's episode, the recap segments reminded me of something dumb with Saru.

His ganglia things fall out and he decrees of his species "our whole worldview is a lie"

Buh-wha?

How does he know that this is some newfound natural or evolutionary reason for what happened to him? For all he knows it was the crazy radiation of that big memory planet ball-thing that caused some sort of rapid mutation in him. Or he's an aberrant mutation of his species, like a birth defect or something.

I mean, the equivalent is if someone gets cracked on the head and suffers brain damage that leads to them becoming emotionless and suddenly people just go "Welp, I guess humans are evolving beyond the need for emotion now. Everyone go and be monsters without restraint!"

Granted we're supposed to suspect that what Saru believes (the Kelpians' alleged death cycle isn't fatal and if they stick it out they end up fine in the aftermath) is the actual and proper explanation for what happened, what the **** kind of scientist would take one solitary data point with any number of additional variables in play and go "yeah, that's a pattern. Behold the new normal!"

Also while I'm still like only 15-20 minutes in, I don't like the concept that this "new" Saru is permanent. Making him a 'man without fear' type who's going to be angry and badgering about his people and taking a distinctly humanist worldview is lazy*. It makes him no different than the crusader-like aspect of Burnham. I kinda liked that his skittishness made him a sensible voice of reason among the command officers and the right kind of "I don't think that's a good idea, Michael" foil for Burnham. It feels like they sold that out for the sake of this social revolution subplot with his people which could've played out just fine even with the old Saru.



*Saru's extended rant about the problems of his society and how backwards it is strikes me as an odd inversion from what we usually got with prominent alien cast members who usually either fully embraced their heritage and its juxtaposition with dominant human culture (Worf being the most prominent example), or who embraced elements of broader galactic culture while still retaining significant affection and allegiance to their original culture but also generally showed that their adaptability was inherent in their original characterizations (Quark and Rom, for example, frequently show that they were predisposed to non-traditional thoughts or reactions vs Ferangi society, but at the same time they also continue to value portions of Ferangi culture even after being "civilized", even continuing to embrace the elements of said culture that their new companions found backwards or unpalatable. Even in Quark's eventual acceptance of gender progress on his planet, a) It's almost entirely tied directly to him via his mother, which would seem to make a significant difference in his willingness to accept the change and b) he still resists it and remains linked to the ideals that were ingrained in him for his entire life, taking time and effort to adjust and make peace with his own tolerance for that sort of social upheaval before he reaches a point of being OK with it.). Saru gets one big soapboxy moment to shake the foundation of his cultural view of his peoples' place in the universe and he just goes full-on "this is wrong and bad" for little reason other than it would strike the viewer as wrong and bad and it behooves him to appeal to the viewing audiences socio-cultural leanings.

EDIT: yep, we're doubling down on this. "Evolved" Kelpians vs "Unevolved" ones. And then the nonsensical assertion that the Ba'ul (or however it's spelled) were once hte "prey" species? So say the two physicists and whatever the hell Airiam is. Because **** needing a sociologist or an evolutionary biologist to explain any of this to them.

EDIT 2: In total fairness to everything I ranted above, I don't have an issue with the plotline of the episode on the whole. I don't dislike the story that Saru finds out the truth of his people's history and the lies about their history and social structure. I just dislike that Saru magically reaches this conclusion based on his personal experience with no real external input.

I also dislike that Discovery participates in rejiggering the social structure and balance of their whole homeworld. I get that techincally the Ba'ul are a post-warp society and not bound by the Prime Directive (sorry, "General Order One" because we're afraid of that term for some reason), but jesus this seems like a huge amount of social meddling on an evolved and sentient species that they're totally OK with for whatever reason.

 

[Osprey]

I thought that it was a fairly good episode, relatively speaking. It focused on one of the better characters, Saru, and had little of Burnham and Tilly in it. Unfortunately, it managed to make one of the few likable characters on the show not so likable. I'm not a fan of this new Saru at all. As The Nemesis said, he acted quite a bit like Burnham by challenging the Captain in front of the rest of the crew, disobeying direct orders and acting pushy and self righteous. I hope that this isn't a permanent change and that the freeing of his people means that he doesn't have cause to act this way again.

 

[Cloned]

As I start this week's episode, the recap segments reminded me of something dumb with Saru.

His ganglia things fall out and he decrees of his species "our whole worldview is a lie"

Buh-wha?

How does he know that this is some newfound natural or evolutionary reason for what happened to him? For all he knows it was the crazy radiation of that big memory planet ball-thing that caused some sort of rapid mutation in him. Or he's an aberrant mutation of his species, like a birth defect or something.

I mean, the equivalent is if someone gets cracked on the head and suffers brain damage that leads to them becoming emotionless and suddenly people just go "Welp, I guess humans are evolving beyond the need for emotion now. Everyone go and be monsters without restraint!"

Granted we're supposed to suspect that what Saru believes (the Kelpians' alleged death cycle isn't fatal and if they stick it out they end up fine in the aftermath) is the actual and proper explanation for what happened, what the **** kind of scientist would take one solitary data point with any number of additional variables in play and go "yeah, that's a pattern. Behold the new normal!"

Also while I'm still like only 15-20 minutes in, I don't like the concept that this "new" Saru is permanent. Making him a 'man without fear' type who's going to be angry and badgering about his people and taking a distinctly humanist worldview is lazy*. It makes him no different than the crusader-like aspect of Burnham. I kinda liked that his skittishness made him a sensible voice of reason among the command officers and the right kind of "I don't think that's a good idea, Michael" foil for Burnham. It feels like they sold that out for the sake of this social revolution subplot with his people which could've played out just fine even with the old Saru.



*Saru's extended rant about the problems of his society and how backwards it is strikes me as an odd inversion from what we usually got with prominent alien cast members who usually either fully embraced their heritage and its juxtaposition with dominant human culture (Worf being the most prominent example), or who embraced elements of broader galactic culture while still retaining significant affection and allegiance to their original culture but also generally showed that their adaptability was inherent in their original characterizations (Quark and Rom, for example, frequently show that they were predisposed to non-traditional thoughts or reactions vs Ferangi society, but at the same time they also continue to value portions of Ferangi culture even after being "civilized", even continuing to embrace the elements of said culture that their new companions found backwards or unpalatable. Even in Quark's eventual acceptance of gender progress on his planet, a) It's almost entirely tied directly to him via his mother, which would seem to make a significant difference in his willingness to accept the change and b) he still resists it and remains linked to the ideals that were ingrained in him for his entire life, taking time and effort to adjust and make peace with his own tolerance for that sort of social upheaval before he reaches a point of being OK with it.). Saru gets one big soapboxy moment to shake the foundation of his cultural view of his peoples' place in the universe and he just goes full-on "this is wrong and bad" for little reason other than it would strike the viewer as wrong and bad and it behooves him to appeal to the viewing audiences socio-cultural leanings.

EDIT: yep, we're doubling down on this. "Evolved" Kelpians vs "Unevolved" ones. And then the nonsensical assertion that the Ba'ul (or however it's spelled) were once hte "prey" species? So say the two physicists and whatever the hell Airiam is. Because **** needing a sociologist or an evolutionary biologist to explain any of this to them.

EDIT 2: In total fairness to everything I ranted above, I don't have an issue with the plotline of the episode on the whole. I don't dislike the story that Saru finds out the truth of his people's history and the lies about their history and social structure. I just dislike that Saru magically reaches this conclusion based on his personal experience with no real external input.

I also dislike that Discovery participates in rejiggering the social structure and balance of their whole homeworld. I get that techincally the Ba'ul are a post-warp society and not bound by the Prime Directive (sorry, "General Order One" because we're afraid of that term for some reason), but jesus this seems like a huge amount of social meddling on an evolved and sentient species that they're totally OK with for whatever reason.

I think the problem is that every episode this season so far has felt rushed. They’re trying to do too much with themes and plot when it would be better served to spread out some of these things over several episodes.

TNG would have spent an entire episode segment on the debate over whether or not to amplify the evolutionary signals. This episode spent 10 seconds on that debate.

I think their intentions and general plotting are more closely in line with what Star Trek is known for, but they’re trying to integrate a serial storyline with episodic themes - and their inexperience with that kind of complex writing and screenplay development is causing the entire season to feel unbalanced and uneven.

 

[HolyGhost]

interesting twist with Naru and it sort of makes sense

 

[Jussi]

interesting twist with Saru and it sort of makes sense

Yes, it does make sense for him to challenge his superiors more and not be so submissive.

Still hoping the Red Angel is either a Preserver or Iconian.

Funny mistake in the episode, pay attention the restraint on Saru's left hand at the end before he breaks free. It accidentally opened.

 

[The Nemesis]

The Red Angel is Future Burnham. Her journey to full-on Space Jesus-dom will then be complete.

 

[LeafalCrusader]

In a Discovery pitch meeting

One, Burnham should be more self-righteous and condescending and be portrayed with even more wooden acting by our lead actress. Two, whenever Burnham's not on screen all the other characters should be asking where's Burnham!

 

[Osprey]

The Red Angel is Future Burnham. Her journey to full-on Space Jesus-dom will then be complete.

You may be joking, but I've considered that possibility several times. The Red Angel is definitely a 30-ish female from the hips that we've seen on her, especially in this last episode. Also, the writing on the show champions a "small universe" where everything and everyone is related to something else in the story, so the Red Angel is liable to end up being a female character that we've seen before, if not on this show (whatever happened to Pike's #1 after she was introduced, BTW?), then in another iteration of Star Trek (future Uhura wears red, right? ).

 

[The Nemesis]

You may be joking, but I've considered that possibility several times. The Red Angel is definitely a 30-ish female from the hips that we've seen on her, especially in this last episode. Also, the writing on the show champions a "small universe" where everything and everyone is related to something else in the story, so the Red Angel is liable to end up being a female character that we've seen before, if not on this show (whatever happened to Pike's #1 after she was introduced, BTW?), then in another iteration of Star Trek (future Uhura wears red, right? ).

Oh my god, that's it. It's going to be Yeoman Rand!

And number one went back to the enterprise after her one little scene. I have to believe she'll show up again though because you don't hire Rebecca Romijn to play a noteworthy character for a 3 minute cameo scene.

Alternate theory: it's Lt. Airiam because that will finally pay off the fact that we have this interesting looking character that they're doing nothing interesting with.

 

[Harbinger]

With the way this series is going, I won't be surprised if the Red Angel turns out to be a Q.

It would also be nice to know more about that robot on the bridge.

 

[Blender]

It would also be nice to know more about that robot on the bridge.

She was searching files at Data speed. I mean they can't just have this robot character in the series and not explain that shit. Lt. Ariam needs some backstory...

 

[The Nemesis]

She was searching files at Data speed. I mean they can't just have this robot character in the series and not explain that ****. Lt. Ariam needs some backstory...

It's about time you joined me on the winning team.

 

[johnjm22]

Usually a main character in any story has an obvious path or purpose. I know what Daenerys Targaryen in Game of Thrones is trying to do. I understand what Picard is trying to achieve in All Good Things.

I don't really see Burnham's purpose or path any more. I guess you could say it's to find Spock, but that would mean her character's purpose is completely dependent on another character. In season one it was supposed to be some sort of redemption story, but it never got fleshed out and she was a regular officer after a few episodes.

She's only the main character because the people making the show tell us she is. In the actual context of STD's story there isn't much of reason. Any character like Tilly, or Saru or Stamets could be the main character and be just as interesting (which isn't saying much).

A characters 'agency' is defined as:
"Agency demonstrates the ability to make decisions that affect the story. A character’s agency pushes, creates and changes the plot. The characters contribute to the existence of the story, and the audience then connects with characters based on empathy, sympathy, and pathos; therefore, one of the most basic and fundamental aspects of creating a character is making them feel and seem human."

Aside from the season one premiere, Burnham doesn't have much agency. Things are happening, she just there and reacts to them. Her character isn't taking actions that push the overall narrative forward.

This is writing 101. Daenerys for example regularly takes actions and makes decisions that impacts the overall story of Game of Thrones.

 

[Osprey]

A characters 'agency' is defined as:
"Agency demonstrates the ability to make decisions that affect the story. A character’s agency pushes, creates and changes the plot. The characters contribute to the existence of the story, and the audience then connects with characters based on empathy, sympathy, and pathos; therefore, one of the most basic and fundamental aspects of creating a character is making them feel and seem human."

Well, there's your problem. I actually have to keep reminding myself that Burnham is human because she seems like an android half of the time and superhuman the other. When she has moments of emotion, they seem to come out of nowhere and on cue, like Data trying to mimic emoting.

 

[Harbinger]

She was searching files at Data speed. I mean they can't just have this robot character in the series and not explain that ****. Lt. Ariam needs some backstory...

She's as interesting as a roomba at this point in the series. Out of all the characters, she's the one I'm most curious about.

 

[Blender]

She's as interesting as a roomba at this point in the series. Out of all the characters, she's the one I'm most curious about.

Discovery is suffering from the same problem Voyager and Enterprise did right now, most of the characters aren't interesting at all.

 

[Osprey]

Ariam's only purpose on the show is to satisfy a diversity quota. The producers get to say, "Look... another alien on the bridge. Starfleet isn't just Humans." The writers don't have any plans for her. I wouldn't be surprised if even they haven't given much thought to who or what she is. At this point, if she gets an important moment in a scene, especially a character development moment in which we learn something about her backstory or personality, you can bet that she's moments from getting killed off.

Discovery is suffering from the same problem Voyager and Enterprise did right now, most of the characters aren't interesting at all.

Meanwhile, practically every character on The Orville is interesting. Seth MacFarlane understands TV so much better than Kurtzman does. Kurtzman seems to think that he's making a long, drawn out Star Trek movie for the small screen... and doing that only as well as his last actual movie (The Mummy).

 

[Jussi]

Meanwhile, practically every character on The Orville is interesting. Seth MacFarlane understands TV so much better than Kurtzman does. Kurtzman seems to think that he's making a long, drawn out Star Trek movie for the small screen... and doing that only as well as his last actual movie (The Mummy).

I could do with less episodes on Moclan marital and sexual issues.

 

[Osprey]

I could do with less episodes on Moclan marital and sexual issues.

I could, too. I'm with you on that. I would still say that Bortus is interesting, though, even if what we've learned about him so far hasn't been.

 

[Blender]

I really hope Saru doesn't just turn into another Burnham. He was an interesting character, but he was much less interesting last episode.

 

[The Nemesis]

Mildly OT, but about a month and a half ago, I wrote the following as a parody of the way that Paramount/CBS has fudged the Trek spirit to make Discovery, casting that same sort of lens onto other classic CBS shows. First was Bonanza, then this:

OK then.

Johnny Knoxville stars as a burned out, disillusioned lawyer who's secretly having an affair with his secretary while also secretly having another affair with his private detective, all the while dodging the constant accusations of an overzealous DA who believes he's perverting the legal system for personal gain, as well as a crooked homicide detective all too eager to convict an innocent person if it means improving his standing on the force. But will this lawyer find the goodness that once led him to take up the cause of the law, or will he decide that the system isn't worth fixing and people aren't worth saving? Sundays this fall, only on CBS, watch Perry Mason.

Tonight I found out that HBO is apparently set to start production on a Perry Mason reboot. And I can't help but be afraid that what I wrote is going to come to pass because it's HBO and everyone equates edgey profanity, nudity, and violent gore from shows like Game of Thrones with "mature storytelling for adults".

But back on track by quoting a post that's only about 2 weeks old.

I can tell where this Section 31 plot is going, it's blatantly obvious. They are being presented like a CIA type organization that sometimes does shady things, but is generally official, above board, and most important sanctioned and regulated by Starfleet. I am betting that Georgiou is going to do some horrendous **** that forces Starfleet to officially disavow and dissolve Section 31, but it just goes underground to the organization we see in DS9. They will call this plot great world building.

This show is brutal for applied attributes. It was one of the worst parts of season 1, and it's just as strong in season 2. It's incredibly lazy writing, but hardly surprising from the hack running this franchise as he's none of that kind of low quality effort.

This would almost make sense if they hadn't named the organization Section 31 here. Have them be something else, get dissolved/disavowed and come back as section 31 the way they are in DS9. That'd almost work. Except for the parts where they were just like DS9 when they appeared in Enterprise too, which means they go from shadowy black ops group to "open and regulated" sociopaths division and then back to rumor and innuendo.

 

[Jussi]

Renewed for season 3.

 

[RobBrown4PM]

delete

 

[Cloned]

I kinda guessed a connection to

Spoiler

Talos

A few weeks ago.

Also the music in this episode was surprisingly fresh and added to the atmosphere well.

And you got your wish about Airiam now Nem.