SSM Greyhounds 2022-23 Off-Season Thread (Part 2)

[Fischhaber]

A pick not reporting wouldn't be the worst thing, considering we would get the 4th pick in a draft that will probably be stronger in addition to a bunch of extra picks.

 

[HockeyPops]

I don't really blame these kids for their sense of entitlement. Minor hockey in Southern Ontario has catered to their every whim. Changing teams every time the wind blows. Parents forking over money to buy teams and the teams themselves already turning on this year's group of recruits in favour of next year's recruits. Nobody has any allegiance to anybody any more. It's everyone for themselves. Why would we expect everyone to suddenly change when they turn 16 is beyond me.

 

[Houndzfan20]

A pick not reporting wouldn't be the worst thing, considering we would get the 4th pick in a draft that will probably be stronger in addition to a bunch of extra picks.

pretty sure we'd get the 5th pick.

but i agree, we need to take him and get a haul for him if he won't report.

 

[DWI Dale]

I don't really blame these kids for their sense of entitlement. Minor hockey in Southern Ontario has catered to their every whim. Changing teams every time the wind blows. Parents forking over money to buy teams and the teams themselves already turning on this year's group of recruits in favour of next year's recruits. Nobody has any allegiance to anybody any more. It's everyone for themselves. Why would we expect everyone to suddenly change when they turn 16 is beyond me.

i don't expect the kids to change. it's no different than Lindros refusing to report everywhere he got drafted. i expect the league GM's to flex their muscles and pick these entitled kids anyways. it's the only way.

we picked Lindros even though he tried to manipulate the draft and that worked out OK for us.

 

[dirty12]

add one more team to that group

Brantford? Missasauga?

 

[DeletedAccountt]

Brantford? Missasauga?

Ssm

 

[dirty12]

I think what's happening is someone took the article about Martin where it says in a perfect situation thats where he'd like to play, and made it into this rumor that he said that he would only play there.

"If Martin had his way he’d be bound to nearby clubs such as the Kitchener Rangers or the Guelph Storm, where his family has had season’s tickets for the past seven years. That might be difficult since Kitchener holds the 10th and 11th picks while Guelph doesn’t select until 14th overall.

Whoever drafts him will be getting someone special, Ertel said."

I feel like the Greyhounds have kept open communication with Martin, and I feel confident he will report. Hounds will take him at 3 for sure, unless something crazy happens before we pick.

Martin said in the video the OHL posted today that he's been working for 10 years to get to the OHL. The way everyone has spoke of his character, The Hockey News posting an article about him, it doesn't sound like he's a kid who's going to pull this move. I don't know him personally or anything like that but just judging his character based off what I've read/heard.

It’s not always a character issue, some or their mom is just not ready to be that far from home

 

[DWI Dale]

It’s not always a character issue, some or their mom is just not ready to be that far from home

I'd defer to my previous answer that if a kid or his family isn't ready for them to move away, they aren't ready for the OHL and they can play Jr A at home.

 

[DeletedAccountt]

It’s not always a character issue, some or their mom is just not ready to be that far from home

I guess.... but a parent that's been supporting their childs goal to be a NHL player should be preparing for that and be supportive of it.

How does every parent send their kid to college or university... lol

I don't have any insight but I just don't buy the story that he has a list of only 2(maybe 3) OHL teams he'd go to.

 

[dirty12]

I guess.... but a parent that's been supporting their childs goal to be a NHL player should be preparing for that and be supportive of it.

How does every parent send their kid to college or university... lol

I don't have any insight but I just don't buy the story that he has a list of only 2(maybe 3) OHL teams he'd go to.

There is a two year difference between true OHL rookie and university. One example was Vierling 2nd overall pick reporting to Flint going home twice before traded at his 2nd trade deadline. It was mostly a waste of two years for him. He was too good to develop in the OJHL, and too young to be more than 30-45 minutes from home.

 

[DWI Dale]

This is carry over from another thread but I really feel like Raftis et al has to knock it out of the park at the draft this year. In my opinion we haven't had a good draft since 2018 and it just cost us our mem cup bid. I hope our scouts have a good "feel" for this years draft class and that Raftis is ready to roll up his sleeves to get these kids to report.

 

[HockeyPops]

The 2019 draft was just a disaster from start to finish. It's really tough to build a competitive program that includes a draft as disasterous as that one.

2020 I thought wasn't bad. Even without a 2nd round pick, if you can have a draft like the 2020 draft every year, you are going to be in good shape. That includes taking a flyer on McGroarty. The problem of course is they haven't had a draft like 2020 every year.

2021 - I am not quite ready to pass judgement on this draft class, but it is certainly not as good a draft as 2020.

2022 - Too early to tell.

Here is the 2020 draft for us all to review:
1 - 4 - Soo - McConnell-Barker, Bryce
3 - 44 - Soo - Toms, Connor
4 - 79 - Soo - McGroarty, Rutger
5 - 84 - Soo - Carlisle, Caeden
5 - 91 - Soo - Schenkel, Charlie
6 - 104 - Soo - Bellwood, Jax
7 - 124 - Soo - Allard, Owen
8 - 144 - Soo - Varner, Justin
8 - 157 - Soo - Davis, Nathaniel
9 - 164 - Soo - Hookey, Landen
10 - 184 - Soo - Spurrell, Justin
11 - 204 - Soo - Dunn, Nolan
12 - 224 - Soo - Ryan, Jackson
13 - 244 - Soo - Van De Ven, Caleb
14 - 264 - Soo - West, Owen
15 - 284 - Soo - Muszelik, Tyler

 

[DWI Dale]

2020 I thought wasn't bad. Even without a 2nd round pick, if you can have a draft like the 2020 draft every year, you are going to be in good shape. That includes taking a flyer on McGroarty. The problem of course is they haven't had a draft like 2020 every year.

I wasn't a fan of the "flyer" pick with a 4th rounder in a year we didn't have a 2nd. I think picks like that were made assuming we were still drafting as strong as we were pre-2019, and contributed to our lack of forward depth in the present. I'm also not sold on Toms in the 3rd. Allard was a nice pick in the 7th however.

Gibson is a great pick in 2021 but otherwise feel pretty meh about that year class so far. There's still time but I expected a little more from the top 3 picks. Maybe they'll have a big 2023?

 

[HockeyPops]

My personal opinion is a successful draft should find at least 4 OHL players including 2 first liners in the top 5 rounds. There are supplemental players you are going to get through later rounds/ U18 draft/ import/ free agents/ trades but you need success in the first 5 rounds to build your core from.

I think 2020 did that with McConnell-Barker and Schenkel.
2021 is probably going to fall a little short with Gibson likely being the only first liner.
2022 has a chance to satisfy my criteria but too early to know for sure.

2019 as mentioned was a huge disaster and didn't even find one first liner and only 3 OHLers.

I think it's unfair to paint the last 4 drafts as all failures. Sure there are individual picks within each draft that probably didn't work out as hoped, and that is true for any team. But looking at the draft as a whole, the team needs to add a certain amount of equity through the draft and I think they have done that more recently than 2018.

 

[DWI Dale]

I think it's unfair to paint the last 4 drafts as all failures.

There's still time for 21 and 22. But I don't see 2020 being very impressive. A 4th overall SHOULD net an elite player and that's the age class that should have been the core of our team next year... the team that doesn't look very good lol. A 2nd rounder definitely would have helped but that goes back to our lack of rebuilding. It's a vicious cycle!

 

[HockeyPops]

But I don't see 2020 being very impressive. A 4th overall SHOULD net an elite player and that's the age class that should have been the core of our team next year... the team that doesn't look very good lol.

I am pretty sure our team will be good next year. The problem is that we don't have the assets to put it over the top because of our lack of rebuilding.

 

[DeletedAccountt]

Firebirds’ Kartye wins Red Garrett Award

theahl.com

 

[HockeyPops]

I also heard Tye referred to as the "surprise of the year"

 

[HockeyPops]

How is Deaner doing at the U18s? Anyone heard?

https://thehockeynews.com/news/u-18-world-championship-canada-falls-flat-in-opening-game

 

[DWI Dale]

obviously it's not deaners fault but damn that's an ugly way to start a tournament. lol.

 

[BeliveauFan4ever]

Problem is they won't " rot" at home. They will just cross the border to open arms and play just about anywhere they want.

Oh well.

Better than the tail wagging the dog.

 

[DWI Dale]

delete

 

[jjhound]

The 2019 draft was just a disaster from start to finish. It's really tough to build a competitive program that includes a draft as disasterous as that one.

2020 I thought wasn't bad. Even without a 2nd round pick, if you can have a draft like the 2020 draft every year, you are going to be in good shape. That includes taking a flyer on McGroarty. The problem of course is they haven't had a draft like 2020 every year.

2021 - I am not quite ready to pass judgement on this draft class, but it is certainly not as good a draft as 2020.

2022 - Too early to tell.

Here is the 2020 draft for us all to review:
1 - 4 - Soo - McConnell-Barker, Bryce
3 - 44 - Soo - Toms, Connor
4 - 79 - Soo - McGroarty, Rutger
5 - 84 - Soo - Carlisle, Caeden
5 - 91 - Soo - Schenkel, Charlie
6 - 104 - Soo - Bellwood, Jax
7 - 124 - Soo - Allard, Owen
8 - 144 - Soo - Varner, Justin
8 - 157 - Soo - Davis, Nathaniel
9 - 164 - Soo - Hookey, Landen
10 - 184 - Soo - Spurrell, Justin
11 - 204 - Soo - Dunn, Nolan
12 - 224 - Soo - Ryan, Jackson
13 - 244 - Soo - Van De Ven, Caleb
14 - 264 - Soo - West, Owen
15 - 284 - Soo - Muszelik, Tyler

When everyone complains about our bad drafts, selling to reload, please remember we were hurt big tike by poorly managed NHL teams. Jared McCann and Barret Hayton were both set to be traded as 19 year Olds after we added the year before, just like everyone asks the team to do!! Except, Vancouver and later Arizona kept them both, when they were not ready.
Imagine the picks that would have been recouped in the second and third rounds of the very years you accuse Kyle Raftis of having bad drafts.

 

[jjhound]

I also heard Tye referred to as the "surprise of the year"

Terrible 8 th round pick by Raftis.

 

[jjhound]

I wasn't a fan of the "flyer" pick with a 4th rounder in a year we didn't have a 2nd. I think picks like that were made assuming we were still drafting as strong as we were pre-2019, and contributed to our lack of forward depth in the present. I'm also not sold on Toms in the 3rd. Allard was a nice pick in the 7th however.

Gibson is a great pick in 2021 but otherwise feel pretty meh about that year class so far. There's still time but I expected a little more from the top 3 picks. Maybe they'll have a big 2023?

So 2021 gets criticism, Cloutier had 16 goals as a 17 year old, was picked real late in a draft year that had no real hockey, pick up hockey really.
Guess how many goals Tyler Kennedy scored as a17 year old- 16.