Speculation: Speculation, rumours and trade & free agency ideas thread

[Daximus]

I think bucky gets moved and that people will be disappointed in the return we get back.

That all depends on what people are expecting the return to be. Those who haven't looked into the history of what returns goalies get will likely be dissapointed.

 

[jamiebez]

People actually think that:

A) Torts is a good idea?

And

B) TNSE (who treat their players as well as anyone in the league) would actually entertain it?

That's actually hilarious

Chevy interviewed Torts before hiring Bowness. He mentioned spending the whole day at Torts' house with him at some point.

The vibe I got is that Torts said "no" but it sounded like he was a top candidate they wanted at the time.

 

[JohnnyKnox]

That all depends on what people are expecting the return to be. Those who haven't looked into the history of what returns goalies get will likely be dissapointed.

I agree, this Lundell, 1st and Prospect is just not going to happen.

 

[flin flon bombers]

Yeah Torts has a shelf life. All he does is just piss players off after awhile.

Torts reminds me of a push we had drilling on the tundra,paid to push you no matter if it was 60 below with a wind chill,it didn't matter that the steel was literally cracking from the elements all from the comforts of his truck,I was one of the few tasked with getting him in line lol,the boss realized shit was going sideways instead of forward because of his attitude, bye bye he went.

 

[Buffdog]

That all depends on what people are expecting the return to be. Those who haven't looked into the history of what returns goalies get will likely be dissapointed.

It's tough to say

I don't think that there have been enough deals involving a goalie like Helle to make a decent comp

For example... lets say that Corvettes generally depreciate at a certain rate (for arguments sake)

While that may be true about general, run of the mill Corverttes... what about the super special edition "one of one" Corvette that might be sought after hy multiple Corvette collectors? It's very tough to put a value on a car like that, and ultimately the price ends up being whatever the seller can get one of those collectors to pay for it

 

[Buffdog]

Chevy interviewed Torts before hiring Bowness. He mentioned spending the whole day at Torts' house with him at some point.

The vibe I got is that Torts said "no" but it sounded like he was a top candidate they wanted at the time.

Interesting. I don't remember hearing that

 

[gojetsgo]

I don't think chevy trades him if he just gets what goalies typically get and the last time a goalie of this stature got traded was 30 years ago lol, I don't think anyone can actually pinpoint his value

 

[Daximus]

It's tough to say

I don't think that there have been enough deals involving a goalie like Helle to make a decent comp

For example... lets say that Corvettes generally depreciate at a certain rate (for arguments sake)

While that may be true about general, run of the mill Corverttes... what about the super special edition "one of one" Corvette that might be sought after hy multiple Corvette collectors? It's very tough to put a value on a car like that, and ultimately the price ends up being whatever the seller can get one of those collectors to pay for it

I don't know but if Helle is a super special edition Corvette then prime Roy and Hasek are if Corvette made starships and they never returned anything close to what some people think Helle will.

Hope I'm wrong but history often repeats itself.

 

[gojetsgo]

Chevy interviewed Torts before hiring Bowness. He mentioned spending the whole day at Torts' house with him at some point.

The vibe I got is that Torts said "no" but it sounded like he was a top candidate they wanted at the time.

it sounded more of an information gathering process then an actual interview, keep in mind the one year torts spent in vancouver he actually still lived in the states, I think it was pretty obvious he wasn't going to be willing to come coach here

 

[KingBogo]

I think bucky gets moved and that people will be disappointed in the return we get back.

That’s why everything seems to point to Florida as very rarely does a now team have a top 10 pick available to trade. We won’t get Lundell on top of that but maybe if we also got picks 40 and 48 there is enough draft juice to keep #8 and find a way to improve the roster in subsequent deals.

 

[gojetsgo]

That’s why everything seems to point to Florida as very rarely does a now team have a top 10 pick available to trade. We won’t get Lundell on top of that but maybe if we also got picks 40 and 48 there is enough draft juice to keep #8 and find a way to improve the roster in subsequent deals.

I don't think chevy sells helle for draft picks

 

[Buffdog]

I don't know but if Helle is a super special edition Corvette then prime Roy and Hasek are if Corvette made starships and they never returned anything close to what some people think Helle will.

Hope I'm wrong but history often repeats itself.

Somewhat different situations in terms of both eras and circumstances, but you may be absolutely right

Imagine trying to compare McDavid's trade value to Gretzky's (as a not great example lol)

 

[tbcwpg]

What you need to do is draft some fresh leaders into the group. Leaders set the tone. Not the coach, not the GM. The guys in the room are the ones who everyone falls in line behind. Nobody goes to war for the coach, they go to war for the guys standing beside them on the front lines.

If we want to change the culture we need to draft guys that will help do that. We'll never get good vets that will buy into our market.

They do, but we've seen some younger teams get some veteran, professional guys to help insulate them for a bit while they do that. Chicago did it with Nick Foligno, TJ Brodie was there with Bedard, San Jose has done it with Toffoli and Goodrow, Anaheim brought in Kreider and Trouba, then Carlson for a bit at the deadline, to help acclimate the younger guys. Ultimately, yes, the younger guys will end up creating the culture but you need to have some solid vets who've been a part of that before to help get them there. It's not required necessarily but I think it's important. A lot of these guys have no idea what its like to travel across the continent and play 82 games as a pro, if you can make that part easier for them, they can focus on setting the tone.

 

[Daximus]

Somewhat different situations in terms of both eras and circumstances, but you may be absolutely right

Imagine trying to compare McDavid's trade value to Gretzky's (as a not great example lol)

I'd imagine if McDavid forced Edmonton to trade him to a select few spots then his value would be very tough to gauge.

 

[Xavier Laflamme]

It's tough to say

I don't think that there have been enough deals involving a goalie like Helle to make a decent comp

For example... lets say that Corvettes generally depreciate at a certain rate (for arguments sake)

While that may be true about general, run of the mill Corverttes... what about the super special edition "one of one" Corvette that might be sought after hy multiple Corvette collectors? It's very tough to put a value on a car like that, and ultimately the price ends up being whatever the seller can get one of those collectors to pay for it

Yeah I think it comes down his worth being whatever someone is willing to pay at this point in time, if FLA for example views him as crucial to get another cup then perhaps they are willing to pay a steeper price than many think.

In any case what we do know is that Chevy won't be moving him for scraps, if that is all that is being offered then he will simply just not move him.

 

[Daximus]

They do, but we've seen some younger teams get some veteran, professional guys to help insulate them for a bit while they do that. Chicago did it with Nick Foligno, TJ Brodie was there with Bedard, San Jose has done it with Toffoli and Goodrow, Anaheim brought in Kreider and Trouba, then Carlson for a bit at the deadline, to help acclimate the younger guys. Ultimately, yes, the younger guys will end up creating the culture but you need to have some solid vets who've been a part of that before to help get them there. It's not required necessarily but I think it's important. A lot of these guys have no idea what its like to travel across the continent and play 82 games as a pro, if you can make that part easier for them, they can focus on setting the tone.

Sure and I'm not advocating trading the entire roster. You can hang onto guys like Lowry, Perfetti (if he'll stay), Samberg. Maybe even Morrissey if he's willing to stick around.

 

[tbcwpg]

I don't know but if Helle is a super special edition Corvette then prime Roy and Hasek are if Corvette made starships and they never returned anything close to what some people think Helle will.

Hope I'm wrong but history often repeats itself.

I think Luongo is the most recent example of a goalie trade where he was in a similar situation of wanting a move. He returned Markstrom and Jets legend Shawn Matthias.

 

[Buffdog]

That’s why everything seems to point to Florida as very rarely does a now team have a top 10 pick available to trade. We won’t get Lundell on top of that but maybe if we also got picks 40 and 48 there is enough draft juice to keep #8 and find a way to improve the roster in subsequent deals.

Would all y'all do:

Helle + Samberg + Lambert

For

9th + Lundell + Samoskevich

IF Smits is on the board still?

Use 8th on Rudolph and 9th on Smits and throw him in the deep end

 

[Daximus]

Yeah I think it comes down his worth being whatever someone is willing to pay at this point in time, if FLA for example views him as crucial to get another cup then perhaps they are willing to pay a steeper price than many think.

In any case what we do know is that Chevy won't be moving him for scraps, if that is all that is being offered then he will simply just not move him.

That festers different things though. He was reluctant to move Kane after repeated trade requests and look how that turned out. Ever since then when a player wants out he moves them, he's patient but they are generally moved.

 

[WolfHouse]

I think Luongo is the most recent example of a goalie trade where he was in a similar situation of wanting a move. He returned Markstrom and Jets legend Shawn Matthias.

I thought that was a result of the Canucks being against the cap and not being able to afford two elite goalies?

 

[gojetsgo]

That festers different things though. He was reluctant to move Kane after repeated trade requests and look how that turned out. Ever since then when a player wants out he moves them, he's patient but they are generally moved.

he held on to both trouba and pld for years lol

 

[Daximus]

I think Luongo is the most recent example of a goalie trade where he was in a similar situation of wanting a move. He returned Markstrom and Jets legend Shawn Matthias.

Yeah there is a chance we could maybe make a lateral move for a goalie.

Perhaps UPK in Buffalo if we aren't on his NTC or Hill if he'd waive in Vegas.

 

[KingBogo]

I don't think chevy sells helle for draft picks

He might have to if that gives him the assets to make a further deal using at least some of those draft picks to get the now player he wants. Seems unlikely the team Helly agrees to go to is the team that has what Chevy wants and is willing to give it up. Seems much more likely to me a Helly trade is the first step to another trade.

 

[tbcwpg]

Sure and I'm not advocating trading the entire roster. You can hang onto guys like Lowry, Perfetti (if he'll stay), Samberg. Maybe even Morrissey if he's willing to stick around.

I think, of that list, only Lowry would be willing to hang around. Even then, I think it might be better to not have the guys responsible for creating the last environment around to help create the new one. As long as Lowry was ok with taking a back seat to the young group, sure, it might be fine keeping him around out of necessity more than anything.

I thought that was a result of the Canucks being against the cap and not being able to afford two elite goalies?

Luongo asked for a trade after Eddie Lack started the outdoor game over him. Schneider had already moved on the year prior.

 

[Daximus]

he held on to both trouba and pld for years lol

Trouba sort of came to a head though and I didn't know PLD requested a trade before the season he was moved.