Confirmed Trade: [SJS/DET] Jake Walman and 2024 2nd round pick for future considerations

Reality Czech

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Apr 17, 2017
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Walman has been our best defenseman BY FAR. Like it's not even close. He's been legitimately good, not just "good relative to the rest of the Sharks".

We'll get another top-3 pick no doubt, but it's not because of Jake Walman. He's genuinely been really good. Legit top-4 D. My favorite player to watch so far.

Who's your second best D? No offense but I don't think I've ever seen a more underwhelming lineup of D-men on an NHL roster.

I hope Walman does do well for you guys and it's great he's getting a chance to play top pair minutes, but he's not a guy a contending team wants in their top 4.
 
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Juxtaposer

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Who's your second best D? No offense but I don't think I've ever seen a more underwhelming lineup of D-men on an NHL roster.

I hope Walman does do well for you guys and it's great he's getting a chance to play top pair minutes, but he's not a guy a contending team wants in their top 4.
Hence why I specifically said he's been legitimately good, not just good relative to the rest of the Sharks. He's played a a top-pairing level the first two games, but I'm not gonna crown him top-pairing.

I'm not quite sure what your angle is here. Sour Blues fan? All I know is the Sharks got paid a 2nd round pick to take a 28 year old top-4 defenseman.
 

FMichael

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Dec 22, 2010
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Yeah. The more I watch Wallman the more bewildered I am by the trade.
On a Red Wings subreddit there was a post season review discussion in April…A poster there claiming to have known a current roster player for the Red Wings mentioned that Wallman became a distraction in the locker room - apparently it was getting worse when Larkin was out on injury…Wallman ended up missing some games due to injury, but was kept in the press box upon his return late in the season.

Fast forward to summer and the desire to acquire Trouba from the NYR meant Yzerman needed to free up cap space…Trade fell thru - however Wallman is not our ‘problem’ anymore.
 

Coffee

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On a Red Wings subreddit there was a post season review discussion in April…A poster there claiming to have known a current roster player for the Red Wings mentioned that Wallman became a distraction in the locker room - apparently it was getting worse when Larkin was out on injury…Wallman ended up missing some games due to injury, but was kept in the press box upon his return late in the season.

Fast forward to summer and the desire to acquire Trouba from the NYR meant Yzerman needed to free up cap space…Trade fell thru - however Wallman is not our ‘problem’ anymore.
Makes sense then, I guess he needed a reality check.

Seems like from the videos and interviews he's meshing well with the Sharks and being around a younger roster he has realized he needs to mature.

I guess not a mistake from Detroit, but rather a very lucky strike for the Sharks.
 

FlyguyOX

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Jun 29, 2018
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Stupid trade for the wings from the jump. Luckily, Holl has played well. No idea why he has been benched for this long.
 

Fatass

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Apr 17, 2017
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Everyone got something they wanted. SJ needed a decent dman, Detroit needed cap space. Not seeing the fuss.
Yup. Happens a lot in the league now. A guy making too much for his role on a team trying to compete is traded with sugar added to a rebuilding club. Then that player gets to play without pressure to win and does a good job.
 
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BlueDream

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Hence why I specifically said he's been legitimately good, not just good relative to the rest of the Sharks. He's played a a top-pairing level the first two games, but I'm not gonna crown him top-pairing.

I'm not quite sure what your angle is here. Sour Blues fan? All I know is the Sharks got paid a 2nd round pick to take a 28 year old top-4 defenseman.
Why would Blues fans be sour? Lol.

All I know is two teams have already dumped Walman because he’s not that good, but after two games with the Sharks you are convinced he’s a stud. :laugh:
 

Juxtaposer

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Why would Blues fans be sour? Lol.

All I know is two teams have already dumped Walman because he’s not that good, but after two games with the Sharks you are convinced he’s a stud. :laugh:
I have no idea, which is why I was asking what his beef with Walman is.

All I said is he's been legitimate good, which is objectively factual.
 

LarKing

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Walman was legitimately good with the Wings too. He kind of reminds me of a smarter Brendan Smith. When he's on, he'll have you thinking he could be a legit top pairing or #3 type guy. When he's off, he's turning the puck over right in front of the net. If he finds some consistency, he's a great defenseman to have. Can't comment on the locker room stuff with no actual substance I've seen out there.
 

Pavels Dog

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Holl was legitimately solid the two games he played so far (and has the same production as Walman), but I was moreso poking fun at how dumb it is to draw conclusions after 2 games.
 
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Petes2424

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Aug 4, 2005
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Justin Holl has been better so far than Walman.
He actually has been in his two games, but lazy people like analytics and advanced stats , most GMs laugh at, to judge players. Especially dmen.

There’s a lot of fans today, who would’ve sworn Paul Coffey was the greatest dman to ever play the game. They just don’t watch games anymore. They follow advanced stats that mean very little in judging a player, and think they’re experts.

The amount of times a player’s analytics and advanced stats do a 180 after a trade, is exactly why most GMs have halted using them to the extent some were starting to. They use them as supporting evidence. Nothing more.

We’ve also seen the results of GMs who’ve dove head first into using them. Once again, especially with dmen.

It’s funny because Jake Walman himself brought up this exact subject shortly before he was traded. He talked about how coaches basically roll their eyes to a analytics, during a Detroit podcast.

Fact is, Detroit was a much better team defensively after benching Walman last year. For every good play he makes, there’s 3 to 4 passes to his invisible friends. He’s a turnover machine.

It took a lot of Detroit fans a minute to figure him out too, but there’s a reason he’s been traded twice now, after being 25 years old.

As for Justin Holl, you have accept the good with the bad when evaluating a player. He’s been more than serviceable so far. He’s actually been good.. But like Walman, we know that’s probably not gonna last. It helps he’s playing with a partner who recovers extremely well.

We 100% expect it not to last though.
 
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Reality Czech

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I have no idea, which is why I was asking what his beef with Walman is.

All I said is he's been legitimate good, which is objectively factual.

I have no beef with Walman and I'm happy he's playing well. But it will take a much longer stretch of excellent play to convince me he's anything other than a mediocre d-man.

I watched some Blues fans lose their minds that we traded him despite him making no impact in St. Louis and then Detroit fans go wild when he played decently well getting prime ice time with Seider. Then things eventually regressed to the mean. I don't think he's a real difference maker, but if he can have a career best season in a big role with the Sharks then I'll be happy for him and Sharks fans.
 
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Panda Bear

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He actually has been in his two games, but lazy people like analytics and advanced stats , most GMs laugh at, to judge players. Especially dmen.

There’s a lot of fans today, who would’ve sworn Paul Coffey was the greatest dman to ever play the game. They just don’t watch games anymore. They follow advanced stats that mean very little in judging a player, and think they’re experts.

The amount of times a player’s analytics and advanced stats do a 180 after a trade, is exactly why most GMs have halted using them to the extent some were starting to. They use them as supporting evidence. Nothing more.

We’ve also seen the results of GMs who’ve dove head first into using them. Once again, especially with dmen.

It’s funny because Jake Walman himself brought up this exact subject shortly before he was traded. He talked about how coaches basically roll their eyes to a analytics, during a Detroit podcast.

Fact is, Detroit was a much better team defensively after benching Walman last year. For every good play he makes, there’s 3 to 4 passes to his invisible friends. He’s a turnover machine.

It took a lot of Detroit fans a minute to figure him out too, but there’s a reason he’s been traded twice now, after being 25 years old.

As for Justin Holl, you have accept the good with the bad when evaluating a player. He’s been more than serviceable so far. He’s actually been good.. But like Walman, we know that’s probably not gonna last. It helps he’s playing with a partner who recovers extremely well.

We 100% expect it not to last though.
...surely we can agree, though, that Coffey is still one of the greatest ever defenceman to ever play though?
 
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canuckslover10

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Apr 10, 2014
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My Guess is they probably wanted to trade Chariot or Holl but they both had the Sharks on their 10 team NTC, I'm just surprised no one was willing to take on Walman for free, a team like Chicago, leafs, philly, flames, and Blues (before the offersheets) should have been all over this.
 

Sandisfan

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He actually has been in his two games, but lazy people like analytics and advanced stats , most GMs laugh at, to judge players. Especially dmen.

There’s a lot of fans today, who would’ve sworn Paul Coffey was the greatest dman to ever play the game. They just don’t watch games anymore. They follow advanced stats that mean very little in judging a player, and think they’re experts.

The amount of times a player’s analytics and advanced stats do a 180 after a trade, is exactly why most GMs have halted using them to the extent some were starting to. They use them as supporting evidence. Nothing more.

We’ve also seen the results of GMs who’ve dove head first into using them. Once again, especially with dmen.

It’s funny because Jake Walman himself brought up this exact subject shortly before he was traded. He talked about how coaches basically roll their eyes to a analytics, during a Detroit podcast.

Fact is, Detroit was a much better team defensively after benching Walman last year. For every good play he makes, there’s 3 to 4 passes to his invisible friends. He’s a turnover machine.

It took a lot of Detroit fans a minute to figure him out too, but there’s a reason he’s been traded twice now, after being 25 years old.

As for Justin Holl, you have accept the good with the bad when evaluating a player. He’s been more than serviceable so far. He’s actually been good.. But like Walman, we know that’s probably not gonna last. It helps he’s playing with a partner who recovers extremely well.

We 100% expect it not to last though.
Here in San Jose the bar for good play is lower than in Detroit. So bad play for your team may be OK or better than average play for the Sharks. Getting and moving puck up to forwards has been a big problem for San Jose. In the preseason and first two games it is a notable improvement, though we will see if it lasts.
 

AcerComputer

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Aug 4, 2014
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Holl is a Right-handed shot. Walman being a left shot, likely made the decision easier as to which one to dump.
 

The Zetterberg Era

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My Guess is they probably wanted to trade Chariot or Holl but they both had the Sharks on their 10 team NTC, I'm just surprised no one was willing to take on Walman for free, a team like Chicago, leafs, philly, flames, and Blues (before the offersheets) should have been all over this.
There are plenty of rumors out there and before the off-season that there was an event that changed things in February/March of last year.

At Larkin’s press conference to open the season. He named Ghost and Perron as guys they would miss. Then he took a side swipe openly that some guys weren’t committed, didn’t compete hard enough on ice, and weren’t doing what they needed to were gone. It is a pretty clear shot at Walman and Sprong. Who both wound up healthy scratched in March with rumors the team including the dressing room were displeased with both.

I hope Walman does well. He did seem popular at the onset of his tenure, not sure what really played out. I have heard various things but that would be unfair. What is gathering a clarity especially with Larkin identifying culture problems that they hope to fix and the guys they truly need to replace it seems pretty organizational.

I am curious why no other team made an offer, but I agree with other Wings fans it seemed to be to go get Trouba. They seem to have wanted to move on from Walman for quite a bit before that. Chariot was the Wings actual second best dman last year, despite a few angry fans it never seems the organization is actually upset with him.
 

Petes2424

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Aug 4, 2005
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...surely we can agree, though, that Coffey is still one of the greatest ever defenceman to ever play though?
He was atrocious defensively. The funny part is, Bowman put up with him in both Pittsburgh and Detroit (for awhile), because of his offensive ability, and puck possession, even though they got into it many times.. It’s funny how much better Detroit became after he was sent packing, because you never think of how bad he is, when was skating the puck at will.

Look, Im a big Coffey fan, but he was a wing playing D in the NHL and very few players ever got away with it at that level of success, being that bad defensively. I was on the ice with him a few times when he was playing in LA and I was in Long Beach. I’d played with and against some great players who went on to great success in the NHL. He could do things I couldn’t even comprehend as a dman. When you’re a 21 year old kid thinking you have a chance and step on the ice with players like Coffey, you have a long look in the mirror afterwards. I still thought the boards were my best friend, and that I’d be benched for passing the puck anywhere near the middle of the ice, and this guy could skate through the best of the best, at will.

At the end of the day though, he still hurt teams as things get tighter in the playoffs. It’s why he played for so many teams.

In no way would I ever compare Walman with Coffey except to say, people in SJ are making the same mistake many in Detroit made originally, and some still do. They judge him purely off of the good, and ignore all the bad. He literally couldn’t play in Detroit, with anyone but Seider.

He’s in the best situation for himself right now, because there’s no expectations. Nobody’s gonna be breaking down every shift because SJ isn’t going to be in the playoff hunt. So they’ll concentrate on the good. I thought maybe he had turned the corner too, for about a month in Detroit, but he quickly went back to the old Jake Walman. Where Seider spent half of his shifts, recovering from Walman’s turnovers.

It just became too much and they tried moving him down to the bottom pairing, and it didn’t last a complete game. He was stapled to the press box for the remainder of the season.

Jake’s a filler Dman. That’s what he’ll likely be the rest of his career. Someone you can play minutes because he’s physically capable, in a Top 4 role on teams rebuilding, etc. Once you start having your young Dmen getting ice time, you really don’t want players like him and his bad habits, taking their ice time, and he’s not good enough to protect them defensively, as a partner. Like a Maatta for example.

The Sharks will move on from him as soon as their young kids are starting to demand ice time, and their games become more important.. Very rarely will you have a young kid like Seider, who can already protect other players at 21-22 years old. Detroit now has 2 more of their prospects playing now, so it was time to send Jake to his next bad team, as Detroit was taking that next step. Guarantee, the same outcome happens in SJ.
 

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