When Don Cherry harps on Malkin's omission from the top 100 list, you know someone really f'd up. What possible argument could be made for Toews over him?
Sidney Crosby Top 5 player of all time
- Thread starter edog37
- Start date
-
Xenforo Cloud will be upgrading us to version 2.3.5 on March 3rd at 12 AM GMT. This version has increased stability and fixes several bugs. We expect downtime for the duration of the update. The admin team will continue to work on existing issues, templates and upgrade all necessary available addons to minimize impact of this new version. Click Here for Updates
- Status
When Don Cherry harps on Malkin's omission from the top 100 list, you know someone really f'd up. What possible argument could be made for Toews over him?
missingjibbsclub
Bobby Heaters
Those careers are over, Crosby's isn't. He has two to three years of quality hockey still in him. He will be up there in cups, PPG and playoff multiple points to cement his legacy. To me he is the most complete center and maybe player ever.
McBaevid
Lottery Dynasty
He isn't and never will be able to top Gretzky
Orr
Howe
Lemieux
By the time he retires he'll prob have an argument for #5
Orr
Howe
Lemieux
By the time he retires he'll prob have an argument for #5
I don't know if he is top 5. I'm a huge fan, but there is still some time to play it out. It's funny, though, the mental gymnastics people are performing to claim he isn't.
On the one hand Beliveau has 10 cups, so he's better than Crosby. The next post, cups are team achievements so you can't really count those for Crosby. The "debatable" Smythes come up, because "stats in the final", yet these are probably the same people who have thought Toews was on Crosby's level the past several years. It's insane.
What you do have is this: 12th fastest to reach 1000 points, in a very low scoring era. In fewer than 800 games is already 77th all time in scoring. In a career with possibly the greatest goal scorer in the history of the game, he has 2 goal scoring titles and is the second highest goal scorer for his time in the league(even with all the missed games). He is 19th all time in playoff points. He has 3 Cups, 2 Smythes, 2 Harts and Pearsons.
What I do know is that when you need to parse and nitpick and frame things certain ways in order to discredit him as top 5, it suggests to me the case is a lot stronger than some would like to admit.
On the one hand Beliveau has 10 cups, so he's better than Crosby. The next post, cups are team achievements so you can't really count those for Crosby. The "debatable" Smythes come up, because "stats in the final", yet these are probably the same people who have thought Toews was on Crosby's level the past several years. It's insane.
What you do have is this: 12th fastest to reach 1000 points, in a very low scoring era. In fewer than 800 games is already 77th all time in scoring. In a career with possibly the greatest goal scorer in the history of the game, he has 2 goal scoring titles and is the second highest goal scorer for his time in the league(even with all the missed games). He is 19th all time in playoff points. He has 3 Cups, 2 Smythes, 2 Harts and Pearsons.
What I do know is that when you need to parse and nitpick and frame things certain ways in order to discredit him as top 5, it suggests to me the case is a lot stronger than some would like to admit.
Everyone forgetting about Jagr. Gretz, Lemeuix, Jagr, Howe, Orr. Don't think he's passed any of those guys yet
Always love lists that forget goalies and defenseman not named Orr
1 gold medal
4 Stanley Cups
1 Comm Smythe
7 Norris Trophies
Crosby is amazing but let's not pretend other amazing players don't get their due. The person list above typically isn't even in people's Top 5 for Dmen, let alone all time. And yet he was widely regarded as the best dman in the league in the last 30 years.
1 gold medal
4 Stanley Cups
1 Comm Smythe
7 Norris Trophies
Crosby is amazing but let's not pretend other amazing players don't get their due. The person list above typically isn't even in people's Top 5 for Dmen, let alone all time. And yet he was widely regarded as the best dman in the league in the last 30 years.
ChickenBurrito
Registered User
- Apr 8, 2013
- 3,697
- 88
bombers15
5-14-6-1
- Mar 17, 2008
- 6,644
- 82
Jagr does tend to get overlooked. Peak Jagr was right up there with the greats. I think the knock on him though is he could never get it done in the playoffs (without Lemieux).
Yo HF hivemind, no matter how many posts you make like this, it still doesn't change the fact he's won 2 Smythes.
bombers15
5-14-6-1
- Mar 17, 2008
- 6,644
- 82
Questionable is the wrong word. "Close" would be the right one.
Could have given this year's to Crosby or Malkin - it was basically a toss up. Could have given last year's to Crosby, Kessel, or Murray - and the voting was close because it was truly debatable. And 2009 you could have given it to either Malkin or Crosby - could make a good case for either.
Datsyukian Deke
The Captain is Home!!
Because both men faced 10x better teams & opposition during their careers compared to today. Can you see Crosby surviving the 90's with the likes of Scott Stevens & Chris Pronger in their prime? Doubtful.
- Apr 27, 2005
- 36,162
- 36,105
Yes very easily.
You do know that Crosby and Sakic had overlapping careers, yes?
Sakic was a very well conditioned athlete and was still very much a dominant player at 35-36, but he was vastly overshadowed by Crosby.
I have him in the top 5, hope he can make his way into the top 3 by some miracle one day. One of the most committed hockey players I have ever witnessed, one of a kind.
Datsyukian Deke
The Captain is Home!!
You must not have been watching the sport in the 80's & 90's.
Not sure how someone in their 17th NHL season can be "overshadowed" by Crosby during that time in his career. Sakic was on the way out, and the likes of Crosby & Ovi were on the way in, pretty much sums it up.
bombers15
5-14-6-1
- Mar 17, 2008
- 6,644
- 82
This isn't a great argument for a lot of reasons. One obvious one being that Crosby beat Nick Lidstrom in the finals in '09.
- Aug 12, 2008
- 3,610
- 2,067
think he was implying the much rougher era he would have had to survive in. Stevens and Prongers hits would be assault charges in todays pansy NHL
bombers15
5-14-6-1
- Mar 17, 2008
- 6,644
- 82
Same exact thing was said about Gretzky and he seemed to do okay.
Not to mention that Pronger and Crosby did overlap...
Datsyukian Deke
The Captain is Home!!
Right, because Lidstrom being speared in the testicles in the previous round that caused him having to have surgery before the finals, nor Rafalski's herniated disc at the same time, had nothing to do with that success.
Especially seeing as you saw what they both did to Crosby the previous year when they were both healthy, even at 38 & 35.
Last edited:
Datsyukian Deke
The Captain is Home!!
Exactly. The level of hard hitting/shutdown defensemen during that era is night & day compared to today.
Also, he would have to go up against the likes of Hasek, Brodeur, Roy, Joseph, Belfour, Richter, Vernon, among many others, in their prime.
Can't compare era's. No question in their time Gretzky, Mario, and many others were great. Crosby is great now. But there is one difference that today's players are superior to those other times. Howe is a great player but he certainly wouldn't have the physical edge he enjoyed then. Mario was a monster but is he today with the size and strength of the players today? Goalies are so much better in today's game. Get past a couple big names of prior era's and that about it. In short, Crosby is a great player of this time. I don't take anything away from others accomplishments, but Crosby is the very best as he is now.
- Status
