Buffalo Bills Season's End: The Off-Seasons Starts Now

[misterchainsaw]

Point taken that Allen isn't patient, but that's no easy 7 yd 1st down. Diggs is open for 2-3 yds and would have to bust through a couple tacklers before he got to 7.

It was 1st and 10. It was an easy 7 yards on first down. Not for a first down. The safety was about 8-10 yards away from him, and the other corner on the screen was dropping back to follow Davis' (?) route. He would have gotten 7 easy and more if he broke a tackle.

 

[Dirty Dog]

I have read so many legal complaints. And the vast majority contain MULTIPLE allegations that are simply false. That is not an exaggeration

I would never give any credibility to solely a legal complaint

 

[misterchainsaw]

It's the exact reason the Jets ran a dline stunt there, created the illusion of a rushing lane when in reality there's a 300lb d-lineman about to pop you. The Dolphins stunted the crap out of them last year and did the same thing.

The quick pass was there, Allen needs to trust the system, protection, and his weapons.

Yep. If he stays in the pocket the piece McGovern gets of the stunter allows Allen to more naturally step up into the pocket and then run if he has to (on this particular play he didn't have to since the ball should have gotten out). This is absolutely what we're talking about when we talk about how Josh doesn't make things easy on an o-line and has had happy feet problems of late.

His pocket presence has seemed to regress over the last half of last year and now into this year. He was clearly uncomfortable and not reading the Jets defense well at all.

 

[Jim Bob]

I have read so many legal complaints. And the vast majority contain MULTIPLE allegations that are simply false. That is not an exaggeration

I would never give any credibility to solely a legal complaint

Well, this allegedly happened on a zoom call with dozens of people. So, good luck covering it up if he actually did say it.

 

[Der Jaeger]

I like this post a lot.

I wonder if it dovetails with my main complaint about the Bills especially since Daboll left (but even with him a bit), which is I find the Bills offense is so often behind script on the down and distance. They just need too many clutch plays all the time. It just doesn't seem realistic. Is that a problem with a vertical offense?

Potentially. A lot of why offenses work goes back to why an offense was invented. There are 4 major offensive schemes in the NFL: Ehrhardt-Perkins, horizontal timing (West Coast offense), vertical timing (Air Coryell), and sight adjustment (first seen in the run and shoot). Each was designed to do something specific against a defense.

EP: base offense. Lots of high-low, in-out concepts. Get defenses moving in different directions. Base offense in the 60s and 70s for almost all NFL teams. Concepts and formations still survive but few teams use EP as the base of their playbook. The Pats and Brady were a heavy EP team. Vegas probably has a heavy EP playbook based on McDaniels' experience.

VT: invented to force defenses to either play up on the power run, or stay back for a vertical attack. The power run, or persistent run, forces DBs closer to the LOS, and then fast receivers take advantage. Think 1990s Dallas Cowboys, 2000s Steelers. This is the base of the Bills offense.

Sight Adjustment: Receivers and QBs come to the LOS with a series of pass route options, which become more solid with pre-snap and post-snap reads. This offense was primarily brought to the NFL by the run-and-shoot offense. The 1990s Bills were a sight adjustment passing attack. The 2000s Giants were heavy sight adjustment.

WC: invented to get the ball out of the QBs hands quickly, with a lot of trap blocking on runs (Bill Walsh invented the scheme in Cincinnati because his OL couldn't block the Steelers' front 4). Negates a strong pass rush, doesn't require elite offensive linemen. QB must be a very good decision maker. Receivers can fill roles. 1980-1990 49ers, 1990-2000s Packers, current Chiefs are heavy WC users.

When you use a WC scheme, you gain a lot of advantages on a defense, particularly if you have strong tight ends. The routes break sooner than other schemes, so a QB under duress can move the ball quickly. Linemen aren't asked to hold blocks forever. And the team is on a schedule, with maintaining manageable down and distance as the key. That's different than Dorsey keeping a receiver short.

Allen's closest comparison is Brett Favre. Favre was once a wild horse throwing interceptions like crazy. But the WC scheme always gave him easy options early in his progressions, and once he learned to use them, he became the QB we knew. That's where Allen needs to go.

 

[yahhockey]

Well, this allegedly happened on a zoom call with dozens of people. So, good luck covering it up if he actually did say it.

Lawsuit accuses Bills co-owner Terry Pegula of making racist remarks; he denies claim

Pegula in a statement released by the team said the comment attributed to him in the filing is "absolutely false."

buffalonews.com

Seems the alleged comment was said at a dinner then brought up by a reporter on a Zoom call which is when Trotter heard about it. The league supposedly investigated and the Pegulas denied the comment was made and others at the dinner could not recall the comment being made. So a reporter heard about Pegula making the comment from an unknown source, mentioned it during a NFL Network team meeting, which eventually led to a NFL investigation after Trotter was persistent.

 

[sabresfan129103]

Well, this allegedly happened on a zoom call with dozens of people. So, good luck covering it up if he actually did say it.

I was harping on Dorsey, but a lot of it was definitely Josh. I mean there were people posting videos from last season a few months ago showing how Allen either didn't see or flat out refuses to hit the wide open underneath guy. Not sure what his issue has been the last 8 or 9 games. It's almost like he's cocky and feels like he doesn't have to look for that kind of play. Christ, Brady made a career out of hitting the open guy for short yardage. Mahomes regularly burns teams by running short passes to Kelce.

 

[Sabresfansince1980]

Lawsuit accuses Bills co-owner Terry Pegula of making racist remarks; he denies claim

Pegula in a statement released by the team said the comment attributed to him in the filing is "absolutely false."

buffalonews.com

Seems the alleged comment was said at a dinner then brought up by a reporter on a Zoom call which is when Trotter heard about it. The league supposedly investigated and the Pegulas denied the comment was made and others at the dinner could not recall the comment being made. So a reporter heard about Pegula making the comment from an unknown source, mentioned it during a NFL Network team meeting, which eventually led to a NFL investigation after Trotter was persistent.

This is the type of rumor mill stuff that gets laughed out of a federal prosecutors office when prepping for what and what will not be examined during testimony during a trial.

 

[WeDislikeEich]

 

[TheAngryHank]

I didn't care for the number of sacks , just creates un needed pressure, get rid of the ball.
Have the Raiders secondary next week , all will be forgotten.

 

[SundherDome]

My $0.02

Milano and Diggs were incredible I thought.

Rousseau was very good as well.

Kincaid, Cyrus, Benford and Bernard inspired confidence.

Allen, Dawkins, Tre, Oliver and Davis really disappointed given what they're all capable of.

Brown and Epenesa are both running out of runway.

Epenesa played very well last night. Brown, well he was pretty bad along with McGovern.

 

[Fezzy126]

That's gotta be the most unbrotherly postgame hug of all time

 

[SundherDome]

I was harping on Dorsey, but a lot of it was definitely Josh. I mean there were people posting videos from last season a few months ago showing how Allen either didn't see or flat out refuses to hit the wide open underneath guy. Not sure what his issue has been the last 8 or 9 games. It's almost like he's cocky and feels like he doesn't have to look for that kind of play. Christ, Brady made a career out of hitting the open guy for short yardage. Mahomes regularly burns teams by running short passes to Kelce.

I said this yesterday but it seemed like Josh was almost having a teenage melt down.

The first int, he had about 3-4 yards of wide open space on the roll-out and a CB to beat (he routinely does) for the remaining 4 yards. Instead he chucks a terrible ball to Harty who is double covered. It felt like "well this is what happens when I don't use my legs, Sean".

In the second quarter he took off and got the first down and then tried to split two defenders for a huge gain but was hit by both. McDermott then told him to use his head.

He then inexplicably took a huge hit towards halftime on a play that was never converting, it was such a stupid play but he felt he needed to do it for some reason.

The second half seems like he just abandoned everything Dorsey was saying in check downs and it ultimately cost his team the game. Dorsey isn't free and clear but this was definitely a Josh problem.

I am really hoping that whatever this is/was humbled Josh, Sean and Ken because they all need to figure it the f*** out.

Josh needs to stop the happy feet, if that is throwing with anticipation or taking what the defense is giving, f***ing do it. He also needs to slide or avoid these big hits.

Sean needs to understand Josh is gunna take risks, live with them but work with Dorsey to figure out how to get him his fix without it killing him.

Ken needs to work with Josh, throw in some designed QB runs, get creative with protection (bring in a 6th lineman for all I care) so that he can let his cannon lose.

Josh did *seem* humbled after the game in his presser, let's see if it is all talk because we still have KC/Cinci/Dallas/Philly/Dolphinsx2/Jets. All have good to great dlines who will push the pocket

 

[stokes84]

This is the type of rumor mill stuff that gets laughed out of a federal prosecutors office when prepping for what and what will not be examined during testimony during a trial.

Well it’s a civil case sooooo…

 

[valet]

weeks 1-6 are always random and seem fake, so no reason to freak out. josh had a bad game and offense just looked generally out of sorts. defense played great pretty much the entire game.

losing on a punt return is the worst part about the game tbh. the jets are good, it shouldn’t surprise anyone that the game was so close in the end. but to just forget how to cover a punt then throw in all those missed tackles….. that’s not it

refs also made some questionable calls of meaning but i am not going to expound there because there’s nothing that can be done

full season ahead. better to lose some now and finish strong than the other way around imo. obviously this is disappointing but there is still plenty of runway left

 

[oldgoalie]

If there’s any proof of those comments Terry might be forced to sell. That’s Donald Sterling bad.

Be better.

https://www.wigdorlaw.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/09/Trotter-Complaint.pdf

Full lawsuit. The stuff about Pegula is on page 31.

It sounds like he supposedly said that quote in a zoom meeting with 40 other people on the call. So it should be pretty easy to confirm or deny.

Man I really hope Terry’s not lying. Again, I’ll choose to believe Terry for now.

Edit - actually, I reread it and they aren’t claiming it was said in front of 40 people. The lawsuit claims that it was said to 1 reporter and that reporter said it in that zoom meeting.

I don't.

 

[Sabresfansince1980]

Well it’s a civil case sooooo…

Sooooo...the point is that the information is weak for even a civil case.

 

[truthbluth]

Well, this allegedly happened on a zoom call with dozens of people. So, good luck covering it up if he actually did say it.

That’s not what happened. A person reported it second hand on a zoom call. I’m not saying it did t happen. But the fact is, the comment in question was paraphrased by a reporter on a zoom call. The plaintiff was not present at the supposed uttering. I’ll refrain from casting judgement at this time. But I will keep my ears open.

 

[buffalowing88]

Trotter has had a media campaign against the NFL since he lost his job. It's on him to get someone...anyone...to corroborate him or else he's a liar. What's crappy, though, is that this stuff is going to stick with Pegula regardless. It's already on the front page of all the major sports sites and all over social media.

Scary the stuff people can get away with claiming without evidence and still get traction these days.

 

[tmlms13]

Has anyone else had this weird feeling ever since the bye week last year that something is just off with this team. They're winning but they feel like hallow wins.

It's like Allen is terrible but the D is great and they win 13-10. Then the next week Allen is great and the D is terrible and they win 35 - 31.

Or they play a great first half and build a big enough lead to hold on. Or are down 14 at half but win the second half 21-0.

I can't remember the last time they played a "complete" game.

 

[buffa dud]

Epenesa played very well last night. Brown, well he was pretty bad along with McGovern.

Did he though? I'm not about to pay for All-22 access, so I can waste more of my life watching replays of a horrendous game I didn't particularly enjoy watching the first time around. Especially for the sake of an online argument. But I'm having trouble finding anything to support that.

I said this yesterday but it seemed like Josh was almost having a teenage melt down.

The first int, he had about 3-4 yards of wide open space on the roll-out and a CB to beat (he routinely does) for the remaining 4 yards. Instead he chucks a terrible ball to Harty who is double covered. It felt like "well this is what happens when I don't use my legs, Sean".

In the second quarter he took off and got the first down and then tried to split two defenders for a huge gain but was hit by both. McDermott then told him to use his head.

He then inexplicably took a huge hit towards halftime on a play that was never converting, it was such a stupid play but he felt he needed to do it for some reason.

The second half seems like he just abandoned everything Dorsey was saying in check downs and it ultimately cost his team the game. Dorsey isn't free and clear but this was definitely a Josh problem.

I am really hoping that whatever this is/was humbled Josh, Sean and Ken because they all need to figure it the f*** out.

Josh needs to stop the happy feet, if that is throwing with anticipation or taking what the defense is giving, f***ing do it. He also needs to slide or avoid these big hits.

Sean needs to understand Josh is gunna take risks, live with them but work with Dorsey to figure out how to get him his fix without it killing him.

Ken needs to work with Josh, throw in some designed QB runs, get creative with protection (bring in a 6th lineman for all I care) so that he can let his cannon lose.

Josh did *seem* humbled after the game in his presser, let's see if it is all talk because we still have KC/Cinci/Dallas/Philly/Dolphinsx2/Jets. All have good to great dlines who will push the pocket

Man, that is just a whole lotta senseless conjecture. I mean, to suggest that Allen would make any play other than the best play he perceived to be available just to make a point to his own coaches... that's hot garbage.

 

[Cirris]

I'm not going to lie. With all the pregame over-the-top ass-kissing Rogers and Jets were getting from the media, i was hoping something would happen to ruin their narrative.

But not like that. I feel sad for Rogers.

As for Allen. his mindset was not right for the game. Which is why i miss Daboll. Daboll is on the sidelines screaming at you if your not mentally with it. Dorsey is up in the booth to busy breaking shit to coach his QB out of his funk.

 

[buffa dud]

Has anyone else had this weird feeling ever since the bye week last year that something is just off with this team. They're winning but they feel like hallow wins.

It's like Allen is terrible but the D is great and they win 13-10. Then the next week Allen is great and the D is terrible and they win 35 - 31.

Or they play a great first half and build a big enough lead to hold on. Or are down 14 at half but win the second half 21-0.

I can't remember the last time they played a "complete" game.

The cornerstones of this franchise that picked this team out of the gutter are getting older, and the Bills have struggled to find the talent to replace what they brought to the field. It sucks, but that's life in pro sports where there's a salary cap waiting to cut you down and the rules in the draft favor weak teams/management.

 

[truthbluth]

Lost in most of the discussion is Poyer and Hyde both getting absolutely smoked in the open field. That NEVER used to happen. I’m thinks thy are both washed at this point. Vet presence, but they just do not have the physical ability to be elite safeties anymore.

 

[tmlms13]

The cornerstones of this franchise that picked this team out of the gutter are getting older, and the Bills have struggled to find the talent to replace what they brought to the field. It sucks, but that's life in pro sports where there's a salary cap waiting to cut you down and the rules in the draft favor weak teams/management.

True, but that happened mid-season, it was weird. Pre bye-week they were dominating, post-bye week they are scraping by.