Prospect Info: Sean Farrell, C/LW, 124th Overall

I think Farrell has the potential to be a top-6 player, but more complete than Caufield. He has it all - skating, hands, playmaking, shot, hustle, 2-way ability. It would be nice if we got ourselves a late round home run for once.

I think he’s the Habs best prospect after Slafkovsky. He looked better than Slafkovsky at the rookie camp, tbh. Of course I know not to draw too much from that though.
 
I think Farrell has the potential to be a top-6 player, but more complete than Caufield. He has it all - skating, hands, playmaking, shot, hustle, 2-way ability. It would be nice if we got ourselves a late round home run for once.

I think he’s the Habs best prospect after Slafkovsky. He looked better than Slafkovsky at the rookie camp, tbh. Of course I know not to draw too much from that though.

The thing is caufield is an elite goal scorer not sure farrell has an elite trait, maybe playmaking, don’t think it’s elite level but i like him. He’s for sure in front of Josh Roy who everyone has in their top 6.

Him and Caufield would complement each other very well actually but both will probably not play together other than on the PP since they’re both smaller.
 
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The thing is caufield is an elite goal scorer not sure farrell has an elite trait, maybe playmaking, don’t think it’s elite level but i like him. He’s for sure in front of Josh Roy who everyone has in their top 6.

Him and Caufield would complement each other very well actually but both will probably not play together other than on the PP since they’re both smaller.
Aside from goal scoring, to me Farrell looks better at everything than Caufield. He’s bigger and faster than Caufield too, and shows more potential for a two-way game.
 
Aside from goal scoring, to me Farrell looks better at everything than Caufield. He’s bigger and faster than Caufield too, and shows more potential for a two-way game.

I'm one of the biggest Farrell fans on the board and that's not true. Caufield has more quickness to his game, his hands are a higher level.. in fact, Caufield's speed of execution and ability to evade defenders is at such a high level.

Farrell does have a better two way game, always will and does have a lot of really good qualities. High hockey IQ, high end vision, he's got a good shot as well, and he's agile in tight spaces. We'd all love for him to get a separation gear but not sure he will ever get there.

Caufield has star qualities and is already a game breaker. Farrell is more tracking to be that Palat level player which is obviously an incredible get.
 
The thing is caufield is an elite goal scorer not sure farrell has an elite trait, maybe playmaking, don’t think it’s elite level but i like him. He’s for sure in front of Josh Roy who everyone has in their top 6.

Him and Caufield would complement each other very well actually but both will probably not play together other than on the PP since they’re both smaller.
For me, Roy and Farrell will be competing for that 3rd line LW in the future. The future top 6 is already stacked the way I see it: Suzuki, Caufield, Slafkovsky, Dach, the presumptive 2023 top 5/10 pick, and probably Dubois.
 
A 5'11 ft 195 pounds player may very well be stronger than a 6'3 ft 225 pounds player.
That is very unlikely or at least very uncommon among athletes in the same sport.

Perhaps if the taller player was much closer to the shorter players weight but 4 inches and 30 lbs is just too vast for the smaller player to overcome in almost any case.
 
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Agree.

People are hypnotized by Roy’s points production in the Q but lots of work to do.

There were alot of questions about another Hab pick in the 90s.... A skinny guy who smashed the Q, but had questionable skating, among other things. He ended up scoring around 800 points in his NHL career.

Roy, like you said, has alot of question marks, but it's an intereresting canvass to work with, at least.
 
The thing is caufield is an elite goal scorer not sure farrell has an elite trait, maybe playmaking, don’t think it’s elite level but i like him. He’s for sure in front of Josh Roy who everyone has in their top 6.

Him and Caufield would complement each other very well actually but both will probably not play together other than on the PP since they’re both smaller.
a big playmaking center like Dach flanked by caufield and farrel could be a cool line one day. Or whoever we get in 2023
 
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There were alot of questions about another Hab pick in the 90s.... A skinny guy who smashed the Q, but had questionable skating, among other things. He ended up scoring around 800 points in his NHL career.

Roy, like you said, has alot of question marks, but it's an intereresting canvass to work with, at least.

There’s a lot of recency bias here. After the Q season everyone was pencilling roy into the top 6, after dev camp now it’s farrel. They both have their qualities. Roy has a certain level of offensive poise that I haven’t seen in really any of our forward prospects. Very kucherov-esqe in how he decieves defenders with subtle movements. He doesn’t need to be a speedster, just passable to be an effective offensive player imo.
 
For me, Roy and Farrell will be competing for that 3rd line LW in the future. The future top 6 is already stacked the way I see it: Suzuki, Caufield, Slafkovsky, Dach, the presumptive 2023 top 5/10 pick, and probably Dubois.

Moving forward, we should steer clear of the line separating the top 6 to the 3rd line. I think we roll lines where the 5/5 ice time from the first 3 lines don't change that much but the PP and PK is where guys get more time over others.

Habs are not tracking to be a top heavy team. We will have good talent but the secrete to success is depth on all 3 lines.

Farrell could end up playing with Suzuki/Caufield or he could end up with Evans on the 3rd line. It's too dam hard to predict at this stage. People have Slaf with Suzuki/Caufield and it appears to fit but for all we know, he fits well with Dach or Dubois or another center we end up drafting. Line chemistry is more important than stacking the talent 1 by 1 as you move down the lines.
 
Moving forward, we should steer clear of the line separating the top 6 to the 3rd line. I think we roll lines where the 5/5 ice time from the first 3 lines don't change that much but the PP and PK is where guys get more time over others.

Habs are not tracking to be a top heavy team. We will have good talent but the secrete to success is depth on all 3 lines
Every great team has a clear top 6. Tampa had a clear top 6. Same with Colorado. Same with Washington. Same with Pittsburg. Same with Chicago. Same with LA, same with Boston. The difference between those teams and other teams that weren't as successful is having a great third line. The most notable one probably being the HBK line in Pittsburg. And yes it is possible to have one of the better players on the third line and fill the extra top 6 spot with a complimentary player but even so there would still be a defined top 6. When people refer to being top heavy, they're talking about a single top line or having 4 star forwards and nothing else like the leafs. Having a good top 6 and a good third line is not top heavy. My take is Habs need to hit on 2-3 of their prospects to be third liners. Whether it's Roy, Farrell, Mesar, Kidney, Heineman, etc.
 
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Every great team has a clear top 6. Tampa had a clear top 6. Same with Colorado. Same with Washington. Same with Pittsburg. Same with Chicago. Same with LA, same with Boston. The difference between those teams and other teams that weren't as successful is having a great third line. The most notable one probably being the HBK line in Pittsburg. When people refer to being top heavy, they're talking about a single top line or having 4 star forwards and nothing else like the leafs

Agreed but Habs won't have those stars at the top end so we need 3 very very good lines.
 
Agreed but Habs won't have those stars at the top end so we need 3 very very good lines.
I mean Suzuki, Caufield, Slafkovsky, Dubois, the 2023 pick, etc won't be superstars but they have a good chance at being stars. A great counter to your point is that because habs don't have major superstars, they won't be fishing out the same amount of cap. That can then be used for a good third line pivot. But like I said, at some point Habs need to hit on a few of their prospects (non 1st)
 
I mean Suzuki, Caufield, Slafkovsky, Dubois, the 2023 pick, etc won't be superstars but they have a good chance at being stars. A great counter to your point is that because habs don't have major superstars, they won't be fishing out the same amount of cap. That can then be used for a good third line pivot. But like I said, at some point Habs need to hit on a few of their prospects (non 1st)

Not sure where they top out at but doubt it's Matthews or McDavid level.

I dislike building a top 6 where the 3rd line don't matter. We have seen teams like Tampa and the Avs go after depth pieces in their recent cups. You need a full team to win now

Think top 9F, not just top 6F. I think that an old way of thinking and the game is changing. Build a strong top 9 and try go lock them in for their prime as early as you can so you have a stable cap strategy
 
looks like it was a 2010 link... and yes, more recent data suggests the average weight has gone down a bit.

so splitting hairs aside, remains that Farell, Mesar, Kidney, Mysak, Rohrer, Roy and Ylonen are all on the "smallish" side of the equation (below average height or weight or both).

Like Suzuki, some of them may well develop the kind of thickness as to play "bigger" than their physical stature, that's always possible (though with that, also runs the risk of adding too much bulk, as we've at times seen happen).

As someone who far more values skill and grit over "size", I was certainly not suggesting we should dump some of them in favor of Hugh Jessiman clones. Far from that.

It is, however, a trend in prospect pool and roster makeup that the management will need to pay close attention to as they roster-build and manage/optimize assets over time.

I think they did consider the "size" in the makeup of the team with getting Slaf and Dach. We got Anderson as well.

if each line has a combination of above average, average and below average size guys (which seems like the trajectory at the moment), then I don't think size gonna be a huge issue.

I think its also understated a few of the prospects you mentioned won't make it. None of them are surefire NHLers, and size wise only Ylonen scares me a bit with his reported weight of 167lbs (very thin).
 
Not sure where they top out at but doubt it's Matthews or McDavid level.

I dislike building a top 6 where the 3rd line don't matter. We have seen teams like Tampa and the Avs go after depth pieces in their recent cups. You need a full team to win now
That was the point of my last post. Because habs don't have those superstars, they won't be paid an obsene amount. A precedent was already set with the Suzuki signing at 7.8 mil even if it was done by MB. Now I do understand the cap may go up in the next few years but it wouldn't drastically change salary demands by a substantial margin. Anyways because you aren't paying superstars 9-10+ mil, now you can go out a spend on let's say a good top 6 W or C and put them on a third line. But again, certain prospects have to hit to have a successful team. Now I don't know if what you're arguing for is to have 3 balanced lines but if so, I'd retort with which successful team has ever had that? There is always a top 6 and a great third line. If that wasn't was you're implying then forget what I just said lol
 
That was the point of my last post. Because habs don't have those superstars, they won't be paid an obsene amount. A precedent was already set with the Suzuki signing at 7.8 mil even if it was done by MB. Now I do understand the cap may go up in the next few years but it wouldn't drastically change salary demands by a substantial margin. Anyways because you aren't paying superstars 9-10+ mil, now you can go out a spend on let's say a good top 6 W or C and put them on a third line. But again, certain prospects have to hit to have a successful team. Now I don't know if what you're arguing for is to have 3 balanced lines but if so, I'd retort with which successful team has ever had that. There is always a top 6 and a great third line. If that wasn't was you're implying then forget what I just said lol

I love Suzuki's contract cause it has the chance to be a bench mark but I'm not sure how long Hughes can hold others on par or below it. If Caufield comes out this year with 80 pts and 40 goals, he might ask for more than Suzuki. Not saying he produces like that for sure but if he does, he's not signing a 8 year deal under Suzuki IMO. Hughes is likely playing the chance he will have around 60-70 pts and 30 goals. Maybe we can get him signed around Suzuki then.

Cap growth might not change salary demands for a lot of players but it's the timing of events that matter. Look at when Subban was bridged and then look at the growing cap when he exited that bridge? Horrible timing where I was expecting $8M or under but he got $9M.

Timing is everything. Hard to predict it very accurate but something that should be part of the strategy formula.

Back to the main point, If Farrell is playing on the 3rd listed line, it don't really mean his is just a 3rd line talent. Same as Armia on our 4th line where some fans think he is just some 4th line bum now.
 
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I'll never not think about this. 4 picks in close proximity, all from the same area. The first guy is the absolute worst, a total stinker.. while Biondi is good, he's behind the other two. Farrell being our best forward prospect not named Slafkovsky and Dobes our best goalie prospect.
I would have loved to hear their discussion about Jack Smith. The guy has been awful. What they saw in him? Farrell is a huge miss from the whole scouting community. The talent is apparent the only negative was his size.
 
I love Suzuki's contract cause it has the chance to be a bench mark but I'm not sure how long Hughes can hold others on par or below it. If Caufield comes out this year with 80 pts and 40 goals, he might ask for more than Suzuki. Not saying he produces like that for sure but if he does, he's not signing a 8 year deal under Suzuki IMO. Hughes is likely playing the chance he will have around 60-70 pts and 30 goals. Maybe we can get him signed around Suzuki then.

Cap growth might not change salary demands for a lot of players but it's the timing of events that matter. Look at when Subban was bridged and then look at the growing cap when he exited that bridge? Horrible timing where I was expecting $8M or under but he got $9M.

Timing is everything. Hard to predict it very accurate but something that should be part of the strategy formula.

Back to the main point, If Farrell is playing on the 3rd listed line, it don't really mean his is just a 3rd line talent. Same as Armia on our 4th line where some fans think he is just some 4th line bum now.
I'd also like to add that Suzuki's contract was not given for his then current production. It was a contract that the management believed that he'd grow into. So it was a projection. That angle will definitely be important in negotiations. I trust Hughes with negotiations seeing what his previous career was lol but its really important that he uses Suzuki as a benchmark instead of other players league wide because the those other GM's that gave those deals are dumb*****
 
I'd also like to add that Suzuki's contract was not given for his then current production. It was a contract that the management believed that he'd grow into. So it was a projection. That angle will definitely be important in negotiations. I trust Hughes with negotiations seeing what his previous career was lol but its really important that he uses Suzuki as a benchmark instead of other players league wide because the those other GM's that gave those deals are dumb*****

It was a contract he would both grow into and it also overlapped UFA years with a growing cap. Look at all the 6-8 year contracts awarded in the last year or two. Most got more than what they were worth at the point of signing.

Hughes can try to use Suzuki's contract and it might work but it's not working forever. All it takes is someone like Caufield or Slaf or Dach to have a bust out year in the coming seasons and their agent will look at the bump in cap and do their job. It's always a two sided approach and timing of events matters.

I as well think the Suzuki contract is a good benchmark and I hope it plays out that way but it's difficult to project when the NHLPA pays off all their balance and how the NHLPA/NHL manages the cap growth after that. We are looking at a $90M cap sooner than most realize IMO.
 
I think they did consider the "size" in the makeup of the team with getting Slaf and Dach. We got Anderson as well.

if each line has a combination of above average, average and below average size guys (which seems like the trajectory at the moment), then I don't think size gonna be a huge issue.

I think its also understated a few of the prospects you mentioned won't make it. None of them are surefire NHLers, and size wise only Ylonen scares me a bit with his reported weight of 167lbs (very thin).

I don’t think Ylonen will make it as a NHLer, not enough offence for top6 and not enough size/grit/compete/2-way play for bottom6 (he’s 22 so he won’t gain weight).
 
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It was a contract he would both grow into and it also overlapped UFA years with a growing cap. Look at all the 6-8 year contracts awarded in the last year or two. Most got more than what they were worth at the point of signing.

Hughes can try to use Suzuki's contract and it might work but it's not working forever. All it takes is someone like Caufield or Slaf or Dach to have a bust out year in the coming seasons and their agent will look at the bump in cap and do their job. It's always a two sided approach and timing of events matters.

I as well think the Suzuki contract is a good benchmark and I hope it plays out that way but it's difficult to project when the NHLPA pays off all their balance and how the NHLPA/NHL manages the cap growth after that. We are looking at a $90M cap sooner than most realize IMO.
I don't think Ufa years matter as much anymore. Paying for rfa years has been super expensive now probably even moreso than ufa years because teams have started waking up and realizing that giving a 30 year old 7 years isn't really good. Most of those big contracts were given to young players. I think the timing of signings is also really important. Hughes might have to take risky investments with players before they break out.
 
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