Rumor: Sam Girard for forward help [ MOD warning # 274 ]

[GirardSpinorama]

Girard is basically a better Quinn Hughes when you consider his contract and defensive play.

 

[AvsCOL]

Girard isn’t going anywhere.

 

[Cypher]

Until Byram can stay healthy for a good stretch, Girard isn't moving.

 

[BKarchitect]

Laughable thread. Despite the hyperbolic overreaction of a few fans and talking heads trying to drum up clicks after a slow start plagued with injuries and a ridiculous start-stop schedule, the Avs have no interest in trading a 23 year-old top three defenseman signed through his 28 year-old season for a bargain price.

The Avs will be fine. Girard will be more than fine. Girard wouldn’t return a center of any note or quality? Lol…get lost. What a joke of a take.

 

[Ararana]

Chambers is a joke

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

Yep, Girard showing why he's one of the most valuable Dmen in the league. Top pairing, signed for 5 more years at a ridiculous $5M cap hit....


But, this thread should just get locked at this point. With the Byram injury there's absolutely a 0% chance Girard is traded anytime soon. Maybe they revisit next summer if Byram comes back and plays the rest of the year healthy.


For now, especially if this thread is any indication of the offers Sakic would be getting, we will happily keep one of the best value players in the league.

 

[bossram]

I don't see why Colorado would ever trade Girard. He's locked in at a great price.

They probably won't be able to afford re-signing Toews once his extreme discount deal is over, so I don't see why they'd want to lose another of their vaunted puck-moving defense corps.

 

[Spilot23]

I don't see why Colorado would ever trade Girard. He's locked in at a great price.

They probably won't be able to afford re-signing Toews once his extreme discount deal is over, so I don't see why they'd want to lose another of their vaunted puck-moving defense corps.

We panicked after our offense started slow and still think it's worrisome when Compher is your #1C right now. But we saw after tonight's game and last game that our offense can go through our defense. With a healthy dcorpse (yeah that's alot to ask) I think we have one of (if not) the deepest defense and yeah Jack Johnson has been a freaking surprise so far after we heard we were signing like a worse version of Nemeth which I believed it.

 

[bossram]

We panicked after our offense started slow and still think it's worrisome when Compher is your #1C right now. But we saw after tonight's game and last game that our offense can go through our defense. With a healthy dcorpse (yeah that's alot to ask) I think we have one of (if not) the deepest defense and yeah Jack Johnson has been a freaking surprise so far after we heard we were signing like a worse version of Nemeth which I believed it.

I mean, Mackinnon will be back. Colorado is fine. The mobile blueline is the backbone of the team, and is the reason why Bednar's system works.

JJ has been a tire fire in past seasons, but it's not surprising he looks better in Colorado. He's coming into a better defensive environment, with forwards backchecking hard. And with Avs defensemen given the green light to activate, JJ's in a better system to utilize his athletic tools - rather than have to make more cerebral decisions playing in a more defensive role.

 

[HabsWhiteKnightLOL]

You don't trade Girard , you partner Girard with a good defensive d-man that repair his defensive errors.

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

I don't see why Colorado would ever trade Girard. He's locked in at a great price.

They probably won't be able to afford re-signing Toews once his extreme discount deal is over, so I don't see why they'd want to lose another of their vaunted puck-moving defense corps.

Maybe, maybe not. Toews probably gets a raise but I dont think he'd get like 8-9M or anything. Comparable contract for him is probably the Jeff Petry deal which was 6.25M. We'd likely be able to afford that.

The idea was that Byram was playing so well early on this season, and it is evident that our forward depth needs help. The Avs have not one, not two, but three Top tier LHD and we really only need 2. So you trade from a position of strength(LD) for a position of weakness(Forward depth particularly another 2nd line quality player).

Girard is the most valuable of our LHD with his ridiculous as a Top pairing Dman signed to a ridiculous contract like you said. So he'd also get us the best possible return to improve the forwards.

But not Byram is hurt again, so until that situation gets sorted out there's no chance Girard or Toews are being traded. We dont know how long Byram is going to be out, but I think even if its only for a couple of games or something short term, they likely stick with all three of our LHD guys and just use one on the Right side for now and then maybe make a move in the summer if a move is warranted.

We have other assets that can get us forward help as well. A winger like Kessel or Rakell wont cost nearly as much as a high end 2C would cost.

 

[Tetsuo]

Byram does not make Girard expendable. What a ridiculous rumor. Teams win primarily when they are well-rounded and deep. Tampa, just this past TDL, with a top 4 of Hedman, McDonagh, Sergachev and Cernak still paid a high price to bolster their bottom pair to acquire Red Wings' legend Savard. Colorado is now on their way to establishing a similarly-scary top 4, why would they rob Peter to pay Paul now? Especially when Girard is on one of, if not the, best contracts in the league.

 

[Grand Admiral Thrawn]

Kulak + Drouin
For
Girard

JD needs out on Montreal.
Colorado has enough star power to have Drouin be left alone.

 

[Shane Diesel]

When have you? I've never argued anything specifically. Nice blanket statement and non-answer.
Of all of the insufferable posters on this site, you have the privilege of being the only one on my ignore list, so you needn't reply.
Bravo!

"Mean words hurt my feewings."

 

[Pierce Hawthorne]

Kulak + Drouin
For
Girard

JD needs out on Montreal.
Colorado has enough star power to have Drouin be left alone.

Not close

 

[Freudian]

Byram does not make Girard expendable. What a ridiculous rumor. Teams win primarily when they are well-rounded and deep. Tampa, just this past TDL, with a top 4 of Hedman, McDonagh, Sergachev and Cernak still paid a high price to bolster their bottom pair to acquire Red Wings' legend Savard. Colorado is now on their way to establishing a similarly-scary top 4, why would they rob Peter to pay Paul now? Especially when Girard is on one of, if not the, best contracts in the league.

I suspect Avs would only do it if they get a very good young 2C in return, and those are few and far between.

Since both EJ and Murray has had signifiant injury issues and even Makar and Byram has had minor injury problems, I don't think Sakic wants to move Girard.

 

[Arto Kilponen]

Byram does not make Girard expendable. What a ridiculous rumor. Teams win primarily when they are well-rounded and deep. Tampa, just this past TDL, with a top 4 of Hedman, McDonagh, Sergachev and Cernak still paid a high price to bolster their bottom pair to acquire Red Wings' legend Savard. Colorado is now on their way to establishing a similarly-scary top 4, why would they rob Peter to pay Paul now? Especially when Girard is on one of, if not the, best contracts in the league.

We're talking here about trading a player who delivered a -10 during the final few games when it mattered last season. That's not a top-4 d-man who gets paid 5M.

 

[Hasbro]

4 points tonight.

 

[BKarchitect]

We're talking here about trading a player who delivered a -10 during the final few games when it mattered last season. That's not a top-4 d-man who gets paid 5M.

We’re talking about trading a player who delivered over a much larger sample size over the entire season 32 points in 48 games with a +15, averaging 23:13 of ice per night for the team with the best record in the NHL while having advanced stats across the board that were excellent including defensively and some of the best Corsi and zone exit numbers in the league. As a 22 year-old. Or since 2019, a combined 75 points in 128 games with a +14 and 22:01 of ice time per night in his 20, 21 and 22 year-old seasons.

So yeah, he struggled in the playoffs but nah, that doesn’t mean he isn’t a top three defenseman and great value when everything about a much larger statistical sample says he is.

If those ten games are all that matters then I’d be hard pressed to consider Mitch Marner or Johnny Hockey top six forwards…except that’s an absurd take despite a much larger sample size of playoff ineffectivity.

 

[biturbo19]

The problem as i see it, with getting "value" for Girard in a deal like this...is that he's one of those players with a bit of a disconnect between "how useful he is" and "what you'd actually pay for him". He may well be an extremely useful puck-moving defenceman who can eat some decent 2/3 minutes for you in the right situation...but he's got a bit of a confused, or poorly defined "role". The players that GMs and Fans alike tend to go "all in" for with big trade offers, are ones that are easy to plug neatly into a specific role on a team and fill a big and obvious hole. Even if they come with some weaknesses in another area. Whereas Girard is more of a "jack of all trades, master of none", who also still comes with some obvious drawbacks/weaknesses.

Girard isn't the bigger/rugged/dependable/physical more stay-at-home defenceman who you're going to pencil in to anchor your "shutdown pairing" loaded up with tough minutes, zone starts, matchups. Nor is he really the pure offensive dynamo who you're going to run your whole offense through. So when you're talking about where Girard fits in terms of lineup and deployment, most people are going to immediately start framing his position relative to another defenceman either as a partner, or as anchoring the other pairing to define his role by what is "left over" in minutes. And you're going to want a bigger presence beside him either way. ie. People are going to tend to frame Girard's prospective contributions, relative to the sort of defenceman that is actually highly coveted, and oftentimes seen as "overvalued" around the league.


It doesn't mean Girard can't be a highly effective Top-4D. He just comes across as a bit of a "compromise" whichever way you end up deploying him. More of a "utility minutes" guy who is going to fill out some generic "leftover minutes", rather than a linchpin piece that situates the rest of your defence corps. Which hurts his value...relative to what Avs fans who already "have" him in their pocket, may see his contributions adding up to. And relative to the sort of rock solid, locked in #2C the Avs want...who does situate a lot of the players and icetime around them up front.


Especially when combined with the wariness over his playoff performance and wilting under a heavy forecheck. Plus, bigger than that...i think other teams/fans have to consider Girard with the context of playing in arguably the most "run 'n gun" system in the league. A system that seems perfectly tailored to make the most of Girard's transition abilities, while mitigating the time he has to spend really defending. That's all well and good if your team has the horses and the coach to play that way, but frankly...most teams do not. So there's risk introduced to an already kind of murky "role projection".

That's where you get different fanbases talking completely different ballparks of perceived "value" for someone like Girard. From the outside looking in, vs from the inside looking out.

 

[keglu]

We're talking here about trading a player who delivered a -10 during the final few games when it mattered last season. That's not a top-4 d-man who gets paid 5M.

No, trading player based on 6 games performance is not good decision
Girard should not be traded unless young forward that can anchor 2line for years to come is going other way. I dont think such player was offered here. Good example would by Nylander and TOR fans are not intrested based on responses in other thread.

 

[Richard88]

snip.


With regards to your Panthers, I'd have interest in Lundell. No idea if he's even remotely available or not but even though he's not a 2C yet I think he will be very soon and would be an excellent fit here behind Mackinnon.

Just skimmed through the whole thread and the only idea that really piqued any kind of intrigue is Lundell.

He'd already be a perfect fit as 3C in the short term, and would going forwards then be a good compliment to MacKinnon and Newhook in the top 9 C spots.

Contract wise Lundell is on an ELC and team-controlled for a few more years, which balances the value of Girard's great 5+ year contract (unlike most other offers which are lopsided in terms of the term/contract value on either side of the proposals).

From Florida's perspective they lack a top pairing LHD, and stylistically Girard would be a great fit next to either Ekblad or Weegar. Despite losing Lundell they'd still have Barkov and Bennett in the top 6 C positions. Not sure who would replace Lundell at 3C but maybe the deal could be expanded to include Jost as well to give Florida a replacement bottom 6 C. Worth noting that there were strong rumours involving Jost and Weegar in the 2020 off-season, but Sakic moved for Devon Toews instead a couple of days later.

To Florida: Girard + Jost
To Colorado: Lundell+ (not sure what + would be, but something reasonably significant)

 

[McJedi]

Kulak + Drouin
For
Girard

JD needs out on Montreal.
Colorado has enough star power to have Drouin be left alone.

Go ahead and remove Kulak and add Caufield + 2nd round pick.

girard for Caufield, 2nd round pick and Drouins awful contract.

 

[Skinnyjimmy08]

What a difference how opinions change that a few games make lol

Alot of Avs fans and rival fans wanted him traded just last week haha.. there were comments in threads all over the place!!

....when really, if Avs fans do actually want him still traded like they did all year up till a few games ago, this is the time to do it... when his trade value just increased massively!!

 

[Cenzo_]

Go ahead and remove Kulak and add Caufield + 2nd round pick.

girard for Caufield, 2nd round pick and Drouins awful contract.

I truly understand how tired you must be of Drouin trades to Avs but come on now.

Caufield and Girard have similar values, two midget one proven in the regular season the other proven in the playoffs