Salary Cap: Salary Cap & Roster Building | Yeah, I got nuthin' ....

[Peat]

What issues are those? Reaves can fight, hit and I guess skate but he's not worth what we gave up imo. Yeah I heard the "but it's only 20 spots" bs but really it's not about the spots it's about who's available. And let's say that JR really wasn't interested in Kostin and STL were really pushing to get the pick. Then in that case he had leverage and could've gotten Reaves for way cheaper. I'm pretty sure most teams value Kostin more than a 4th line physical player. Archibald, Wilson and Rowney can all dish hits, they might not be as good at it but they can certainly do the job.

I mean... he got a player St Louis didn't really want to trade for a player we have no particular further use for and moving 20 spots down the draft for, which I'm guessing didn't mean going very far down our internal board if any.

What exactly are we expecting here? I guess we could have got something else for trading Sundqvist elsewhere...

 

[WheresRamziAbid]

No. The pens could've still gotten Lauzon and Kostin. Draft Kostin and if You REALLY like Lauzon, trade for a 2nd. Hell most rankings had him going in the 3rd or 4th round.

Why are these rankings legit?

What makes you think someone else doesnt draft Lauzon, it was rumored MTL takes him with their next pick?

What makes you think Kostin is any good?

What makes you think the Pens have ANY interest in Kostin.

They CLEARLY believe a combination of Reaves and Lauzon is better than Kostin and Sundqvist.

 

[Gurglesons]

It wasn't a mediocre draft though. The top 5 was weaker than the previous drafts but that doesn't mean it's mediocre. I mean a guy like Kostin was available at the 31st pick.

It is extremely strange because Kostin is cut from the same cloth as Kapanen and Sprong.

I'd much rather taking those types of risky picks then what our defensemen picks have looked like under Rutherford.

As an organization I would draft players we can hopefully plug in the next two or three years. Instead we are drafting defensive d-men. So weird.

 

[FreeBobbyFarnham]

It depends on what your definition of a bust is. Bennett is probably an average scoring 3rd line winger. Is he a bust? When I think of a bust, I think of someone like Angelo Esposito.

2017: Didn't have a 1st
2016: Didn't have a 1st
2015: Didn't have a 1st
2014: Kapanen, got traded but looks pretty solid for the Leafs rn
2013: Didn't have a 1st
2012: Pouliot and Maatta, Pouliot sucks but Maatta is a legit top-4 D
2011: Morrow, Morrow sucks
2010: Bennett, probably wouldn't be a bust
2009: Despres, was a legit top-4 D before concussions destroyed him

So of those, I'm seeing 2 busts (and it's still possible Morrow and Pouliot end up becoming serviceable like Bennett), a promising young prospect, 2 top-4 D and a 3rd line scoring winger. That's really not that bad. It's not like the Blues pulling Schwartz and Tarasenko 2 picks from each other in the 1st round, but it's fine. There are teams who have done worse in the 1st round than the Penguins have.

Bennett has a hard time earning a 4th line role. To me he's a bust. But you are right though they're not that bad. They just need to hang onto picks more.

 

[cheesedanish87]

http://tass.ru/sport/4583635

A Russian website that talked to Zaripov.

"As for the NHL, everything is quiet, there is no point in talking about it, there were proposals from several clubs, but they did not suit me, I'm not going to say what exactly and which clubs I will wait for other proposals that will suit me," the hockey player said.

I'm guessing hes waiting for the pens.

 

[Empoleon8771]

It is extremely strange because Kostin is cut from the same cloth as Kapanen and Sprong.

I'd much rather taking those types of risky picks then what our defensemen picks have looked like under Rutherford.

As an organization I would draft players we can hopefully plug in the next two or three years. Instead we are drafting defensive d-men. So weird.

That's a kinda weird comparison to make. Kapanen didn't really fall in the draft, Rutherford wanted to trade up with Nashville to draft him earlier, and Sprong fell because of perceived attitude issues. Kostin didn't fall for reasons like that, he fell because he missed all of last year with an injury essentially.

How can anyone possibly say if the picks JR has made have been good or bad yet? Like how can you possibly say the defensemen picks JR has made have been bad picks? What is your basis for saying that?

Bennett has a hard time earning a 4th line role. To me he's a bust. But you are right though they're not that bad. They just need to hang onto picks more.

When I think of a bust, I think of someone who couldn't even establish themselves in the NHL as regulars. You don't need to become a top-6 forward or a top-4 D to not be a bust of a 1st round pick. Bennett is a NHL regular player, although not a great one and probably just a mediocre scoring 3rd line winger. I wouldn't call him a bust. Joe Morrow, on the other hand, can't even hold down a spot full time on an ass defense.

 

[PensandCaps]

Why are these rankings legit?

What makes you think someone else doesnt draft Lauzon, it was rumored MTL takes him with their next pick?

What makes you think Kostin is any good?

What makes you think the Pens have ANY interest in Kostin.

They CLEARLY believe a combination of Reaves and Lauzon is better than Kostin and Sundqvist.

I'm saying you could have both. We know Lauzon would've been a reach at 31 because he didn't get picked till 51. Love him that much, trade for a 2nd. Rather than trade for Reaves.

 

[Gurglesons]

That's a kinda weird comparison to make. Kapanen didn't really fall in the draft, Rutherford wanted to trade up with Nashville to draft him earlier, and Sprong fell because of perceived attitude issues. Kostin didn't fall for reasons like that, he fell because he missed all of last year with an injury essentially.

How can anyone possibly say if the picks JR has made have been good or bad yet? Like how can you possibly say the defensemen picks JR has made have been bad picks? What is your basis for saying that?

Who is being contrarian now? Lol

I mean Kostin is an offensive forward that dropped. Just like Sprong and Kappy. Seemed like the type of player we would've grabbed in a second given our history with JR.

In terms of the defensemen, defensive d in juniors are more difficult to hope to pan out. As an organization I'm just saying I'd like to see a different approach. I'm not saying anything else.

 

[SCPens]

What issues are those? Reaves can fight, hit and I guess skate but he's not worth what we gave up imo. Yeah I heard the "but it's only 20 spots" bs but really it's not about the spots it's about who's available. And let's say that JR really wasn't interested in Kostin and STL were really pushing to get the pick. Then in that case he had leverage and could've gotten Reaves for way cheaper. I'm pretty sure most teams value Kostin more than a 4th line physical player. Archibald, Wilson and Rowney can all dish hits, they might not be as good at it but they can certainly do the job.

Earth to Mr. Farnham, 30 teams passed on the sure thing that is Kostin! Do you remember Angelo Esposito? So yeah, moving down 20 spots and losing a waiver eligible centre who continued to fall down the depth chart to conceivably get the player they wanted to draft anyhow AND an experienced NHL'er who addresses a need that the Pens had to fill is a slam dunk every day of the week and twice on Sunday. But oh yeah...Archy, Wilson and Rowney can all dish out hits too!!!

 

[Empoleon8771]

I'm saying you could have both. We know Lauzon would've been a reach at 31 because he didn't get picked till 51. Love him that much, trade for a 2nd. Rather than trade for Reaves.

So what would you have traded for a 2nd? Are you going to shell out Scott Wilson for a 2nd?

 

[FreeBobbyFarnham]

I'm saying you could have both. We know Lauzon would've been a reach at 31 because he didn't get picked till 51. Love him that much, trade for a 2nd. Rather than trade for Reaves.

Exactly. The thing is Reaves is noting special. I've seen no praise from the media. Not even a single mention. And that's because he's just a physical player that can skate and that's about it. He's a Laraque with wheels.

 

[SCPens]

It is extremely strange because Kostin is cut from the same cloth as Kapanen and Sprong.

I'd much rather taking those types of risky picks then what our defensemen picks have looked like under Rutherford.

As an organization I would draft players we can hopefully plug in the next two or three years. Instead we are drafting defensive d-men. So weird.

Well then why don't you send in your resume? Jimmy shouldn't be around too much longer!

 

[steelcityassault]

They got Aston-Reese and A.Johnson for free.. that makes up for a 1st rd'er I'd say..

 

[PensandCaps]

Earth to Mr. Farnham, 30 teams passed on the sure thing that is Kostin! Do you remember Angelo Esposito? So yeah, moving down 20 spots and losing a waiver eligible centre who continued to fall down the depth chart to conceivably get the player they wanted to draft anyhow AND an experienced NHL'er who addresses a need that the Pens had to fill is a slam dunk every day of the week and twice on Sunday. But oh yeah...Archy, Wilson and Rowney can all dish out hits too!!!

Reaves addresses no need. When we already have 4 other RWs who can play 4th line RW just as good as him. Two i think better than him.. What need do the back to back champs need? We just won based off speed and skill not toughness. That's not a need. That's living in the past.

 

[FreeBobbyFarnham]

Earth to Mr. Farnham, 30 teams passed on the sure thing that is Kostin! Do you remember Angelo Esposito? So yeah, moving down 20 spots and losing a waiver eligible centre who continued to fall down the depth chart to conceivably get the player they wanted to draft anyhow AND an experienced NHL'er who addresses a need that the Pens had to fill is a slam dunk every day of the week and twice on Sunday. But oh yeah...Archy, Wilson and Rowney can all dish out hits too!!!

Oh no! 30 teams passed on him so he must suck! Come on you should know better. Despres was ranked way higher than 30th yet he fell to to us and became a pretty good top 4 defenseman.

Oh and you know who else slipped in the draft? Daniel Sprong.

And let me be clear, I'm not against having Reaves I'm against passing on a guy like Kostin. Sundqvist and a late pick for Reaves is what he's really worth.

 

[PensandCaps]

They got Aston-Reese and A.Johnson for free.. that makes up for a 1st rd'er I'd say..

Exactly...they got Aston-Reese and Johnson. Who can come in and be totally fine at 4th line RW. So why trade for Reaves?

 

[AjaxTelamon]

Exactly. The thing is Reaves is noting special. I've seen no praise from the media. Not even a single mention. And that's because he's just a physical player that can skate and that's about it. He's a Laraque with wheels.

You're not after Reaves the player, though those wheels of his will help him fit in with our system. What you're after is Sid having the confidence to play in the dirty areas vs. being perimeter Sid. We've all seen the difference.

And does anyone really think Archi will produce more than Reaves in that spot? What's the alternative? The asset value couldn't be less of a deal considering success chances of pick 30 vs pick 50. Those are pick 'em areas of the draft.

 

[PensandCaps]

So what would you have traded for a 2nd? Are you going to shell out Scott Wilson for a 2nd?

If Bennett got a 3rd. Is it that far of a reach that DP wouldn't fetch a 2nd?

 

[Empoleon8771]

They got Aston-Reese and A.Johnson for free.. that makes up for a 1st rd'er I'd say..

Exactly, they keep recuperating losing those picks by signing free agent prospects. In the last year and a half, they've added Bengtsson, Prow, DiPauli, Bellerive, D'Orio, ZAR, Johnson, DeSmith and Rowney to their farm system (I include DeSmith and Rowney since they weren't on NHL deals while with WBS). What is that the equivalent of in terms of picks? Probably 2 second round picks and like 5 3rd-5th round picks?

If Bennett got a 3rd. Is it that far of a reach that DP wouldn't fetch a 2nd?

Yes, it is that far of a reach

 

[SEALBound]

Oh my god...can the season PLEASE start already...

 

[Saints11]

Exactly. The thing is Reaves is noting special. I've seen no praise from the media. Not even a single mention. And that's because he's just a physical player that can skate and that's about it. He's a Laraque with wheels.

Funny, I don't recall Laraque being used on the PK. Also, didn't Reeves score a shortie against us last year. I think the regard held for Reeves in the locker room, with the coaching staff, and with management is far great than that given by some on this fan board.

 

[Gurglesons]

Well then why don't you send in your resume? Jimmy shouldn't be around too much longer!

This is exactly my point.

I'm trying to pull a Charles Green Ballers type move and get into the Pens management by saying it's strange we didn't take Kostin.

 

[Sidney the Kidney]

Exactly...they got Aston-Reese and Johnson. Who can come in and be totally fine at 4th line RW. So why trade for Reaves?

Besides the fact neither of those guys are RWers, sure, good solution.

 

[XanderCrews34]

Exactly...they got Aston-Reese and Johnson. Who can come in and be totally fine at 4th line RW. So why trade for Reaves?

I guess JR was serious when he said he was looking for a physical guy. Reaves just offers something neither of those other guys can offer. Whether it ends up working out like JR envisions is one thing, but it's pretty clear he wanted a specific type of player and Reaves fit that mold.

 

[SCPens]

Reaves addresses no need. When we already have 4 other RWs who can play 4th line RW just as good as him. Two i think better than him.. What need do the back to back champs need? We just won based off speed and skill not toughness. That's not a need. That's living in the past.

Well unfortunately in the democratic society we live in everyone's entitled to their opinion....as completely out to lunch that it may be. I guess it's time we move on from Rutherford. I mean the guy's accomplished absolutely nothing in the past 3 years with the club.