Speculation: Sabres Roster Speculation - Pre-season 2023 Edition

[Jim Bob]

Sorry for the intrusion, but I had a quick question about what the Sabres are currently sitting with. What are fans expecting their D pairs to look like going into next year? I have seen a few Sabres fans say on the main boards that Buffalo may still be interested in adding another RD, but I'm not sure I see the roster spots for it.

My guess is that the D pairs are currently:

Samuelsson-Dahlin
Power-Johnson
Bryson-Clifton
Jokiharju

But I don't think Jokiharju as a healthy scratch makes much sense at all. Is Dahlin going to slide to LD and push Bryson out of the lineup?

I think Stillman & Lyubushkin are ahead of Bryson in the pecking order.

 

[Push Dr Tracksuit]

And therein lies the paradox / challenge (and to which ONG anticipated and responded). Even if a forward roster with an oversized number of youngsters is more than likely to get caved in the playoffs, if those are the best players available to get the Sabres to the playoffs, then guess what, those youngsters will play. RE: ONG's response: As long-time hockey fan the Mandalorian said - "this is the way".

So there’s a little clause in the cba that allows the rights to a player to be traded and you can get back other players in those trades that might mitigate the issues presented by posters above. The lesser know Wookiee saying “grrrlraaa ra ya ya grlrya”. Which loosely translates to “go treat the coyotes like a professional farm club”

The issue is how can you insulate the kids. You obviously need a match up line, and then your top 2 scoring lines. Can you effectively run a 3rd line that is geared to feast on match ups? Can they get heavy O zone starts against 3rd pairings and lower tier forwards? If you look back at the Afinogenov line, they ran them to create havoc, not to do heavy lifting

And if the Sabres had Drury and Mike Grier there would probably be a much better opportunity to replicate that foster construction. Instead they have largely offensive top lines that can’t win faceoffs. So the juicy insert the kids moments are being used by Tage or Cozens and aren’t laying around like breadcrumbs to be scooped up by the sheltered but talented third line. Again, as proved by Peterka and Quinn last season.

 

[Zman5778]

Sorry for the intrusion, but I had a quick question about what the Sabres are currently sitting with. What are fans expecting their D pairs to look like going into next year? I have seen a few Sabres fans say on the main boards that Buffalo may still be interested in adding another RD, but I'm not sure I see the roster spots for it.

My guess is that the D pairs are currently:

Samuelsson-Dahlin
Power-Johnson
Bryson-Clifton
Jokiharju

But I don't think Jokiharju as a healthy scratch makes much sense at all. Is Dahlin going to slide to LD and push Bryson out of the lineup?

You got Samuelsson-Dahlin right. Our collective best guess is that Clifton is given the 1st chance to be Power's partner. That said, I could see Clifton and Johnson splitting time with Power.

3rd pair left side will more than likely come down to Stillman vs. off-hand Stillman vs. off-hand Lyubushkin.

Bryson gets evacuated into the sun (or waived).

 

[Jim Bob]

You got Samuelsson-Dahlin right. Our collective best guess is that Clifton is given the 1st chance to be Power's partner. That said, I could see Clifton and Johnson splitting time with Power.

3rd pair left side will more than likely come down to Stillman vs. off-hand Stillman vs. off-hand Lyubushkin.

Bryson gets evacuated into the sun (or waived).

Stillman vs off-hand Stillman is a show down we are all waiting for.

 

[Gras]

Sorry for the intrusion, but I had a quick question about what the Sabres are currently sitting with. What are fans expecting their D pairs to look like going into next year? I have seen a few Sabres fans say on the main boards that Buffalo may still be interested in adding another RD, but I'm not sure I see the roster spots for it.

My guess is that the D pairs are currently:

Samuelsson-Dahlin
Power-Johnson
Bryson-Clifton
Jokiharju

But I don't think Jokiharju as a healthy scratch makes much sense at all. Is Dahlin going to slide to LD and push Bryson out of the lineup?

Stillman plays over Bryson

 

[Irie]

This is a wildly inaccurate statement. 23 is starting prime years. Even a rookie can be excellent in playoffs. By your logic we have like 2 more years before Quinn and Peterka can be substantial contributors.

The discussion was about a specific group of prospects and having several of them producing like top line players in the postseason.

I clearly said I did not think they would BEFORE the age of 23, nothing more. You are free to disagree. I feel like I am being realistic in this situation and setting healthy expectations on these young kids.

While it is just my opinion on these specific players, I do not think one can honestly say it is wildlyy inaccurate that most prospects are not dominant in the playoffs at 20-22, which was the timeframe given in the post I responded to.

I feel it is pretty important to curb expectations on teenagers, especially physically under-developed prospects. I really do not expect any of them to be sustantial playoff contributors before the age of 23, and for Savoie, Ostlund, and Kulich we are talking about 2027, and 2028 for Benson.
.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I think Stillman & Lyubushkin are ahead of Bryson in the pecking order.

Stillman plays over Bryson

You got Samuelsson-Dahlin right. Our collective best guess is that Clifton is given the 1st chance to be Power's partner. That said, I could see Clifton and Johnson splitting time with Power.

3rd pair left side will more than likely come down to Stillman vs. off-hand Stillman vs. off-hand Lyubushkin.

Bryson gets evacuated into the sun (or waived).

Gotcha, this makes sense to me. I think that confirmed what I was thinking regarding Buffalo not needing a RD, so it seems like I was on the right track with my initial thoughts. Thanks for clarifying!

 

[Push Dr Tracksuit]

You got Samuelsson-Dahlin right. Our collective best guess is that Clifton is given the 1st chance to be Power's partner. That said, I could see Clifton and Johnson splitting time with Power.

3rd pair left side will more than likely come down to Stillman vs. off-hand Stillman vs. off-hand Lyubushkin.

Bryson gets evacuated into the sun (or waived).

Donny has said he sees EJ as the second pairing dman to start camp

 

[TehDoak]

Actually the plan should have been continuous improvement, weaponizing cap space and draft capital to add pieces from outside of the org a little bit each offseason the last 3 summers until we have a contending team with a good mix of vets and young players. We had enough draft picks we could have spent 25% of our draft picks and still had a top tier prospect pool

by acquiring what? What picks? Ehat would have happened to the cap?

I love this.

The idea that the GM should be improving the team every summer is met by "well give me the very specific picks and cap consequences of deals that didn't happen"

C'mon. You just want to knit pick on whatever my suggestions are rather that acknowledge Adams has been an absentee GM since the Eichel trade.

 

[Push Dr Tracksuit]

I love this.

The idea that the GM should be improving the team every summer is met by "well give me the very specific picks and cap consequences of deals that didn't happen"

C'mon. You just want to knit pick on whatever my suggestions are rather that acknowledge Adams has been an absentee GM since the Eichel trade.

so you want to be able to claim that "they should try to get better" is a post that has content, merit, and is worth a thought out response

if you cant articulate how you think the GM should have approached improving then you arent saying anything a toddler couldnt say

in the words of Toby Ziegler "Well get one! Have an idea! Don't come in here with half a thing and not be able to - you know, after you've walked me to the brink, and say 'we've got to do this, it's important, though I have no earthly idea how.' Like one of those guys who buys a big new thing, but doesn't really know how to get the most out of it!"

either get andy to marry you or spare us

 

[TehDoak]

so you want to be able to claim that "they should try to get better" is a post that has content, merit, and is worth a thought out response

if you cant articulate how you think the GM should have approached improving then you arent saying anything a toddler couldnt say

Because that isn't a real response. Go back through 3 years of my post history if you want to see my historical ideas of improving the team. It's a pointless exercise that will only lead to non sensical arguments and nit picking.

The fact is that the GM has done very little to improve the active roster post Eichel trade despite having oodles of cap space and a mountain of cap picks. The idea that 'he should have been constantly finding improvements' isn't a controversial one. It's the literal job of the GM.

 

[Irie]

I love this.

The idea that the GM should be improving the team every summer is met by "well give me the very specific picks and cap consequences of deals that didn't happen"

C'mon. You just want to knit pick on whatever my suggestions are rather that acknowledge Adams has been an absentee GM since the Eichel trade.

And you don't want to admit that waiting and stockpiling assets while the team's core develops into a playoff team BEFORE making all in moves is a legitimate strategy.

Many rebuilds have crashed and burned and never made the jump because GMs make their moves too early, and the young core and farm are not yet ready to play the role they are needed to play when those teams went for it.

What you call absentee, I see as smart patience.

This core has not yet hit it's window, and giving up a lot of assets to add the older complimentary pieces is silly when those pieces will all most likely bolt before this core hits it's window.

All the optimistic posters on this board seem to think that once Buffalo is a playoff team, all the UFAs will want to flock here at discount prices for a chance to win, and all the team's UFAs will want to stay and give Adams a discount.

It's like no one remembers the past.

Remember when the team was one of the best in the league and then won the presidents trophy the following year? Remember all the UFAs begging to come to Buffalo for reasonable contracts? No? Yeah, me either. Remember all the Sabres UFAs just dying to re-sign with the club during that span and not bolt to other cities? Like Drury, Dumont, McKee, Campbell, Grier, Briere, Zubrus....

The critical time to address the holes is still just around the corner, (due to the position of the core in their development imo). Until that time comes, Adams plan of being patient gets a pass from me.

Sometimes it is more about knowing when not to make the big moves that leads to more future success.

 

[Gras]

And you don't want to admit that waiting and stockpiling assets while the team's core develops into a playoff team BEFORE making all in moves is a legitimate strategy.

Many rebuilds have crashed and burned and never made the jump because GMs make their moves too early, and the young core and farm are not yet ready to play the role they are needed to play when those teams went for it.

What you call absentee, I see as smart patience.

This core has not yet hit it's window, and giving up a lot of assets to add the older complimentary pieces is silly when those pieces will all most likely bolt before this core hits it's window.

All the optimistic posters on this board seem to think that once Buffalo is a playoff team, all the UFAs will want to flock here at discount prices for a chance to win, and all the team's UFAs will want to stay and give Adams a discount.

It's like no one remembers the past.

Remember when the team was one of the best in the league and then won the presidents trophy the following year? Remember all the UFAs begging to come to Buffalo for reasonable contracts? No? Yeah, me either. Remember all the Sabres UFAs just dying to re-sign with the club during that span and not bolt to other cities? Like Drury, Dumont, McKee, Campbell, Grier, Briere, Zubrus....

The critical time to address the holes is still just around the corner, (due to the position of the core in their development imo). Until that time comes, Adams plan of being patient gets a pass from me.

Sometimes it is more about knowing when not to make the big moves that leads to more future success.

Doing something is better than doing nothing, even if doing something creates negative consequences compared to doing nothing, so therefore we must always do something. Or something to that effect.

 

[elchud]

We need Barbashev and Howden types on the ice. Each line should have that kind of guy. They make it easier for the goal scoring guys to score goals.

Net front guys. Need.

 

[Irie]

Doing something is better than doing nothing, even if doing something creates negative consequences compared to doing nothing, so therefore we must always do something. Or something to that effect.

Well technically, "waiting and developing the core" is "doing something".

Doing nothing is a misnomer, as it really is just being applied to roster changes, when there is plenty of roster improvement happening each season from development now outside of roster moves.

"Stockpiling assets" is also doing something.

Both are critical aspects to the patient "build through the draft" plan that has worked for many cup winners.

The teams that usually circumvent the patience part and still find success are usually the teams that have a high level of attractiveness for UFAs.

If you can attract superstars, you can just retool vs fullblown long rebuild. Sabres do not have that luxury, so their rebuild is always going to be a little trickier.

 

[sabres4ever]

You don't think he will grab another one when Okposo and GIrgensons leaves?

If KA thinks one of the Rochester kids can legitimately play, then he won't.

Even if he doesn't, and grab another vet or two, I don't think he has enough on the team.

My point is, he has too few vets on the team.

 

[brian_griffin]

Sorry for the intrusion, but I had a quick question about what the Sabres are currently sitting with. What are fans expecting their D pairs to look like going into next year? I have seen a few Sabres fans say on the main boards that Buffalo may still be interested in adding another RD, but I'm not sure I see the roster spots for it.

My guess is that the D pairs are currently:

Samuelsson-Dahlin
Power-Johnson
Bryson-Clifton
Jokiharju

But I don't think Jokiharju as a healthy scratch makes much sense at all. Is Dahlin going to slide to LD and push Bryson out of the lineup?

(and)

You got Samuelsson-Dahlin right. Our collective best guess is that Clifton is given the 1st chance to be Power's partner. That said, I could see Clifton and Johnson splitting time with Power.

3rd pair left side will more than likely come down to Stillman vs. off-hand Stillman vs. off-hand Lyubushkin.

Bryson gets evacuated into the sun (or waived).

(and)

Gotcha, this makes sense to me. I think that confirmed what I was thinking regarding Buffalo not needing a RD, so it seems like I was on the right track with my initial thoughts. Thanks for clarifying!

Others have answered. Just wanted to note that Bryson's hefty contract (signed last offseason) was an intentional poison pill to keep Bryson from being claimed on waivers.

I love this.

The idea that the GM should be improving the team every summer is met by "well give me the very specific picks and cap consequences of deals that didn't happen"

C'mon. You just want to knit pick on whatever my suggestions are rather that acknowledge Adams has been an absentee GM since the Eichel trade.

It's "nit pick", without the "k" - and the irony is not lost on me.

And you don't want to admit that waiting and stockpiling assets while the team's core develops into a playoff team BEFORE making all in moves is a legitimate strategy.

Many rebuilds have crashed and burned and never made the jump because GMs make their moves too early, and the young core and farm are not yet ready to play the role they are needed to play when those teams went for it.

What you call absentee, I see as smart patience.

This core has not yet hit it's window, and giving up a lot of assets to add the older complimentary pieces is silly when those pieces will all most likely bolt before this core hits it's window.

All the optimistic posters on this board seem to think that once Buffalo is a playoff team, all the UFAs will want to flock here at discount prices for a chance to win, and all the team's UFAs will want to stay and give Adams a discount.

It's like no one remembers the past.

Remember when the team was one of the best in the league and then won the presidents trophy the following year? Remember all the UFAs begging to come to Buffalo for reasonable contracts? No? Yeah, me either. Remember all the Sabres UFAs just dying to re-sign with the club during that span and not bolt to other cities? Like Drury, Dumont, McKee, Campbell, Grier, Briere, Zubrus....

The critical time to address the holes is still just around the corner, (due to the position of the core in their development imo). Until that time comes, Adams plan of being patient gets a pass from me.

Sometimes it is more about knowing when not to make the big moves that leads to more future success.

Rush - "Freewill" If you choose not to decide you still have made a choice.

Doing something is better than doing nothing, even if doing something creates negative consequences compared to doing nothing, so therefore we must always do something. Or something to that effect.

Or maybe it's nothing like that at all...

 

[Djp]

Because that isn't a real response. Go back through 3 years of my post history if you want to see my historical ideas of improving the team. It's a pointless exercise that will only lead to non sensical arguments and nit picking.

The fact is that the GM has done very little to improve the active roster post Eichel trade despite having oodles of cap space and a mountain of cap picks. The idea that 'he should have been constantly finding improvements' isn't a controversial one. It's the literal job of the GM.

many of them were short fixes that might have improved the team a bit in 21/22 and 22/23 but we would have gotten worse draft picks and Sabres would be handcuffed by the cap. In the near future

I don’t have a problem trading young players ..I’m just not trading them for short term fixes as values brliw thrir full potential.

People on here seem to devalue Ostlund because thry don’t see him, Rosen because they didn’t like thr pick, and Savoie because they fail to factor in the fact he despises team Canada and the CHL. Many would move thrm for quick fixes.

the GMs that move top 20 recent 1st round picks before thry even play in the nhl are either idiots, it’s not their pick/ player, or they are in panic/ pressure mode.

as GM Adams tried when he was in an i term role and did what the coach wanted. He was gone then theytraded their 3 big names which amounts to taking a step back.

I look at the team aiming for playoffs runs in 26 and 27 for a deep playoff run if the young players develop the next 2 seasons

 

[Chainshot]

We need Barbashev and Howden types on the ice. Each line should have that kind of guy. They make it easier for the goal scoring guys to score goals.

Net front guys. Need.

I mean, there was an excellent one who was available in trade last season who they didn't go after in Meier. He's one of the best net front shot generators out there and would have solved a lot of that for the non-Tuch line.

 

[Djp]

(and)

(and)

Others have answered. Just wanted to note that Bryson's hefty contract (signed last offseason) was an intentional poison pill to keep Bryson from being claimed on waivers.

I would not be surprised to see Johnson sent down when Quinn is ready to work with Ryan Johnson in Rochester during January then called up . His salary deters a team claiming him. I think the plan is to have RJ on Sabres in 24/25.

It's "nit pick", without the "k" - and the irony is not lost on me.

Rush - "Freewill" If you choose not to decide you still have made a choice.

Or maybe it's nothing like that at all...

One little problem that confronts you
Got a monkey on your back
One more fix, Lord might do the trick
One hell of a price to get your kicks

That Smell~ Lynard Skynard

 

[brian_griffin]

I would not be surprised to see Johnson sent down when Quinn is ready to work with Ryan Johnson in Rochester during January then called up . His salary deters a team claiming him. I think the plan is to have RJ on Sabres in 24/25.

One little problem that confronts you
Got a monkey on your back
One more fix, Lord might do the trick
One hell of a price to get your kicks

That Smell~ Lynard Skynard

Do you mean former #1 overall draft choice Erik Johnson, whom the Sabres signed to a 35+ contract and overpaid in order to get veteran help and mentoring for their two other #1 OA defensemen? The Sabres aren't sending Erik Johnson down. If the wheels fall off, they'll just keep him out injured. More importantly, they aren't going to expose him to waivers for assignment to Rochester. Talk about a signature move which would guarantee no other veteran mercenary ever signs in BUF as a UFA under Kevyn Adams tenure. You're on point on a number of topics on this board, but your dart is in the drywall, completely off the dart board on this one.

 

[Push Dr Tracksuit]

Because that isn't a real response. Go back through 3 years of my post history if you want to see my historical ideas of improving the team. It's a pointless exercise that will only lead to non sensical arguments and nit picking.

The fact is that the GM has done very little to improve the active roster post Eichel trade despite having oodles of cap space and a mountain of cap picks. The idea that 'he should have been constantly finding improvements' isn't a controversial one. It's the literal job of the GM.

I disagree with your basic premise. So either tell me what he could have done or I’m just gonna say you’re wrong.

 

[Der Jaeger]

I mean, there was an excellent one who was available in trade last season who they didn't go after in Meier. He's one of the best net front shot generators out there and would have solved a lot of that for the non-Tuch line.

Have to:

- Draft them
- Pay a premium to acquire them
- Take a leap of faith and acquire before they break out

Haven’t done the 1st way and won’t do the second way. I think Adams has to take a risk with someone like Comtois as a free agent, trade for someone like Grundstrom, or trade assets for kids like Tuch or Nelson.

 

[Push Dr Tracksuit]

Have to:

- Draft them
- Pay a premium to acquire them
- Take a leap of faith and acquire before they break out

Haven’t done the 1st way and won’t do the second way. I think Adams has to take a risk with someone like Comtois as a free agent, trade for someone like Grundstrom, or trade assets for kids like Tuch or Nelson.

not being willing to give up the prospects to get chychrun or meier are big negatives in my book

 

[TheMistyStranger]

not being willing to give up the prospects to get chychrun or meier are big negatives in my book

Disagree on Chychrun. He's not the player we needed or need.