Fjordsen
Soul Dancing in the Dark
- Jun 20, 2018
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Not all teams play defensive hockey and not all teams have great and deep defense. This can't be an excuse for the GM that he couldn't find a goaltender.
Speculation: Sabres Roster Speculation - Pre-season 2023 Edition
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in this thread:
a lot of rational people who understanding finding a goalie is hard
a couple ppl who think you can just go out and get a bonafide starter at a moments notice.
a lot of rational people who understanding finding a goalie is hard
a couple ppl who think you can just go out and get a bonafide starter at a moments notice.
It's been explained time and time again how much 80% of these guys are a crapshoot year to year, changing systems & teams, GM's don't know, coaches don't know, fans sure as shit don't know, but here we are...over and over and over...
Beerz
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I don't think 2 years is a "moments notice"
WhereAreTheCookies
Registered User
It's not an excuse, it's a fact. The team played terrible defensively, and they need to clean that mess up. It's not just a simple replace the goalie fix.
I really struggle to figure out what people expect from a goalie here. Especially the ones who watch the games. Did Comrie and UPL let in some bad goals? Absolutely. They also had the defense fall apart in front of them many nights. People complained about Ullmark when he was here also, and he was far better than anyone else they had. People complained about Lehner, and still do despite him keeping them in a lot of games. Yes he sucked in the shootout, but another goalie probably would have lost in regulation on those teams because they couldn't score. The bar constantly changes, and the goalies are always the first to be blamed.
Fjordsen
Soul Dancing in the Dark
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I didn't complain about Lehner (other than the shootouts) and especially Ullmark, I liked them.
I'm not saying that we don't need to fix the defense, although it's not as bad as I think, there were teams with the worst defense last season and in some of these teams goalies played better than UPL and Comrie.
UPL even in AHL did not look good, he is a very inconsistent goalie who plays in sections and he has flaws.
Comrie was actually an AHL goaltender. He played one really good season in Winnipeg, where he played 19 games and he wasn't good in half of those games. That is, he played about 10 good games in the NHL by the age of 27 before signing with the Buffalo.
Again, even retired Anderson gave me more hope than UPL or Comrie.
I'm still waiting for Adams to add goalie this offseason to get the team into the playoffs.
OkimLom
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- May 3, 2010
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I think the bigger issue for the team, and I've been saying it for years, is the team in front of the goalie. Until you fix the defenseman/forward relationship for the structure for the team defense, the goalie in the crease won't matter.
The forwards as a group are bad at defense, though there are some outliers, and potential outliers. But there's not enough of them to make up for the weaknesses of the group. They gave up a good amount of shots (that doesn't fall on the goalies) and they allowed a lot of goals (not every goal against should be weighed squarely on the goalies).
I'm not entirely satisfied so far with the decisions to help improve the defensive capabilities of the team overall. Clifton is an improvement over our 3rd pairing guys, but I don't think he's a guy that is a top 4 defenseman. I also don't think he's a good pairing guy to play with Power, as both guys have moments of pure confusion and poor decision making without the pick. Power is young so he gets a pass somewhat. Clifton is signed and paid to be a better player than he has shown which was a bad defenseman on an elite defensive structured team.
EJ is an aging vet, that if Okposo was not re-signed, I would've been fine with for our 3rd pairing for the vet in the room. I wanted a bigger improvement for those areas of the team. I don't see him being much of a factor on the team. He was already a below average defender. I don't see him improving here.
But the biggest concern of the team, is that Granato did nothing internally to fix what is a huge weakness for this organization, and that is the assistant coaches that oversaw this bad team defense. This organization was at a time, where taking the next step of being competitive on all levels for the team should've been welcomed. Instead, they want to run it back with practically the same crew, while their competition pushes forward in their processes. I feel it's a misstep.
The forwards as a group are bad at defense, though there are some outliers, and potential outliers. But there's not enough of them to make up for the weaknesses of the group. They gave up a good amount of shots (that doesn't fall on the goalies) and they allowed a lot of goals (not every goal against should be weighed squarely on the goalies).
I'm not entirely satisfied so far with the decisions to help improve the defensive capabilities of the team overall. Clifton is an improvement over our 3rd pairing guys, but I don't think he's a guy that is a top 4 defenseman. I also don't think he's a good pairing guy to play with Power, as both guys have moments of pure confusion and poor decision making without the pick. Power is young so he gets a pass somewhat. Clifton is signed and paid to be a better player than he has shown which was a bad defenseman on an elite defensive structured team.
EJ is an aging vet, that if Okposo was not re-signed, I would've been fine with for our 3rd pairing for the vet in the room. I wanted a bigger improvement for those areas of the team. I don't see him being much of a factor on the team. He was already a below average defender. I don't see him improving here.
But the biggest concern of the team, is that Granato did nothing internally to fix what is a huge weakness for this organization, and that is the assistant coaches that oversaw this bad team defense. This organization was at a time, where taking the next step of being competitive on all levels for the team should've been welcomed. Instead, they want to run it back with practically the same crew, while their competition pushes forward in their processes. I feel it's a misstep.
WhereAreTheCookies
Registered User
And I'm not saying they can't improve on Comrie and UPL in net. What I am saying is that IF they go in to next season with those 2, an improved defense could help make them look a little more acceptable than they looked this past season. Even if that ends up being nothing more than league average, that's still an improvement.
Four. We are in Adams fourth offseason of needing to address the goaltender position.
Beerz
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I know, I know....NTC but....
I think the perfect trade for us, to solidify goaltending and bring in a veteran forward....
Instead of the Pesce dream, which includes significant pieces to get, and a monster-ish contract...ugh
Markstrom & Backlund from Calgary. Add those two and it would create a center spine of Thompson, Cozouns and Backlund....
I think the perfect trade for us, to solidify goaltending and bring in a veteran forward....
Instead of the Pesce dream, which includes significant pieces to get, and a monster-ish contract...ugh
Markstrom & Backlund from Calgary. Add those two and it would create a center spine of Thompson, Cozouns and Backlund....
Zman5778
Moderator
Mike McKenna for one loved it. Here's an analysis he did after he stole 2 points from Edmonton:
Analysis: Why Eric Comrie stunned the Edmonton Oilers – and why he can do it again
The Sabres goaltender’s incredible 46-save win wasn’t a fluke. He’s showing some promising traits suggesting he’s the real deal.
www.dailyfaceoff.com
I think Friedman had good things to say in a 32 Thoughts last summer, and I feel like a couple of The Athletic writers said good things.....I'll search them out when I get home but holy hell does their search engine blow.
Zman5778
Moderator
Unless Calgary is blowing it up, Markstrom for sure isn't available. And Calgary has given EVERY indication that they want to compete next year and not blow it up.
Beerz
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Don't bother.. not that serious lol was just curiousMike McKenna for one loved it. Here's an analysis he did after he stole 2 points from Edmonton:
Analysis: Why Eric Comrie stunned the Edmonton Oilers – and why he can do it again
The Sabres goaltender’s incredible 46-save win wasn’t a fluke. He’s showing some promising traits suggesting he’s the real deal.
I think Friedman had good things to say in a 32 Thoughts last summer, and I feel like a couple of The Athletic writers said good things.....I'll search them out when I get home but holy hell does their search engine blow.
Der Jaeger
Generational EBUG
Off-season 1: is 37 games some magic number? Ullmark started 34 games for two straight seasons, so sure there were injury doubts, but that's a lot different than neglecting starting goaltending. Adams thought he had his starting goalie. You're really reaching to criticize him during this off-season.Hutton was terrible the previous season. He admitted to unresolved vision issues. Ullmark also had never started more than 37 games in a season due to him have well documented, nagging injury issues. Nearly everyone had 'a veteran goalie to pair with ullmark' as a need that summer. Also, it should be noted: both goalies were pending UFAs, so a goalie was needed to be added regardless of if Ullmark resigned or not.
It should be noted that this was the summer of expansion draft. No need to sign anyone! We have a free expansion slot to use! Oh wait...Adams wasted it on a pending UFA who wasn't going to sign here.
How did he pass on UFAs when that trade was supposed to happen at the draft? Plenty of better options out there than Old Man and the Career waiver wire backup.
Off-season 2: Who was Adams going to use that slot on? The mythical goalie that was going to sign in Buffalo? The starting goalie he was going to trade for? It was a straight up tear down and rebuild year. If not for Thompson breaking out, Skinner's resurgence, and Dahlin arriving, the Sabres were competing for the lottery. Bad asset management to acquire a goalie during a rebuild. Look at the goalies Murray iced before the 2015 draft. That's how you do it, and it's what Adams did. Hard to criticize this.
Off-season 3: The Murray trade that got nixed is well documented. None of the UFAs were signing in Buffalo without a crazy overpayment. Campbell, Kuemper, etc. Sabres dodged a few bullets here. Imagine the praise Adams would've received for signing Campbell, only to watch him crash and burn. But he probably could've done better than Comrie. Not much better, maybe a little better.
We aren't. I just disproved that. You're literally making this up.
Yeah, defensively responsible teams have no problem finding goalies that are serviceable. Poor defensive teams burn through different pairings season after season with no success.....
It's crazy, but it almost feels like there may be a correlation between playing good defense and the ease in finding good goalies.....
Fjordsen
Soul Dancing in the Dark
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Didn't Adams have four drafts? (Quinn, Rosen, Savoie, Benson). This is probably Adams' fourth offseason.
They can try not to blow it up but after Tkachuk left and ripped out the soul of the team, and last year was so terrible that multiple players want to bolt, the right package could work...
Go young with Joki and UPL as two pieces? Picks? Sure. But if the package being discussed for Pesce is ok, then something similar should be ok...
Joki..... or Boosh or Stillman
UPL.... or Comrie
1st or 2nd
Rosen.... or if I have to Ostlund
Olof at 50% - flip him at deadline
To me, that's a heck of a package, not junk. That pretty much pushes us into the playoffs, gives us solid goalie play for 3 years.
Fjordsen
Soul Dancing in the Dark
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You improve every position and get into the playoffs, that's what good teams do. Devils get goalie, top 4 D and top 6 forward and improved a lot. Adams is still out of the playoffs and I don't really like the overall roster (meaning every position needs to be improved, especially the goaltender). Adams should do the same thing New Jersey did last season, imo.Yeah, defensively responsible teams have no problem finding goalies that are serviceable. Poor defensive teams burn through different pairings season after season with no success.....
It's crazy, but it almost feels like there may be a correlation between playing good defense and the ease in finding good goalies.....
This team needs a defensive system.
1/3 of the players this year will only be in either their first or second full NHL seasons. This team is young and green. They aren't competing for a cup this season, and they are no where near hitting their prime. The notion that this is a panic year pushed by a few posters is stupid.
I watch a lot of NHL hockey, and only the Ducks sold their goalies out worse than the Sabres last season, and even then, they often played more consistent defense on many nights than Buffalo.
I don't care at all what the stats that do not watch the games to draw conclusions using shot location algorithms say about team defense. That is one metric that requires the eye test, and the eye test says the Sabres are the worst in the league.
Granato has openly said that he has not yet even installed his defensive system. What does that even mean? No UFA goalie is coming to Buffalo, and no trade target goalie is going to re-sign in Buffalo until they fix that D structure, regardless of how many 1st round picks Adams throws away to acquire them.
Fjordsen
Soul Dancing in the Dark
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We don't have a defensive system, at least not yet, so you're improving every position.
This is not panic, these are rational decisions. improve roster. You add the right pieces to make the puzzle fit to qualify for the playoffs.
Many here agreed a year ago and now that if last season was a season of development and evaluation, then this season already has a different weight and the core is definitely and the team is ready to go to the playoffs, so a point improvement in the lineup, like Devils did, makes a lot of sense.
If Levi becomes a good starting goalie right away, do we have to go back in time and say Adams actually addressed the goalie position impressively years ago?
It’s clear Levi is the plan. And it’s indisputable that Adams acquired Levi. Soooo, he didn’t ignore it…some people just disagree with his move and decision
It’s clear Levi is the plan. And it’s indisputable that Adams acquired Levi. Soooo, he didn’t ignore it…some people just disagree with his move and decision
Deep Blue Metallic
Modestly successful comedian.
- Mar 5, 2021
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Essentially a minimum of 1 season of development. (Price is the lone exception, but was also the most heralded goalie prospect thus far this century.)
Maybe Adams will get lucky with his prized prospect, but is it worth the risk to Levi's development and the team's playoff chances next season?
NotABadPeriod
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You know better than that. If Levi does take the crease and run with it, the narrative will be that Adams got lucky that a throwaway piece of the Reinhart trade paid dividends.
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