Prospect Info: Ryan Johnson, D, 2019 #31 overall: Signed, Rochester (AHL), Recalled 12/5/24

[Mattilaus]

That's also the messaging from Appert for one to someone like Rousek - he's said as much publicly in the last few weeks.


I've addressed this in other parts of this very thread, but Anaheim in particular is stocked with more quality and variety of defense prospects than one could shake a bundle of hockey sticks at. There is no path there. As for San Jose, they've gone out and back-filled their LHD with Okhotyuk, Mukhamadullin, and Thrun in a way that is going to very much impeded anyone from stepping in immediately unless they have a better pedigree than any of these folks - and that ain't Johnson.

I have no problem admitting I am unfamiliar with some of these teams' prospects or depth. I also just picked those teams as teams being close to his home. Maybe being close to his home isn't as important to him. I am just giving ideas for why he might not want to sign here. If this isn't the reason that is fine. However, people keep saying this is the absolute ideal spot for him and that clearly is not the case or he would be signed already.

You can't have it both ways where we are the top destination for Johnson but also undesirable to him. There needs to be something else at play.

 

[Bendium]

You always want players to be striving to be the best version of themselves, but you can't be everything, and one of the most important aspects of maturing, is coming to understand your own strengths and weaknesses. You work on your weaknesses, but you make bank by taking on roles that bring your strengths to bear. I want a player like Rousek to know his own strengths, target the role he believes he can best excel at the NHL level, and go all out becoming the best he can be in that role. Thats not shooting for less, unless you think a bottom six two way, high energy, penalty killing winger is not important to winning.

 

[TageGod]

Sucks if he leaves but we need a top 4 D and he is not that (yet). That pushes him to a bottom pairing role, which is easily replaceable. Take the compensation draft a new D for down the road.

 

[Mattilaus]

You always want players to be striving to be the best version of themselves, but you can't be everything, and one of the most important aspects of maturing, is coming to understand your own strengths and weaknesses. You work on your weaknesses, but you make bank by taking on roles that bring your strengths to bear. I want a player like Rousek to know his own strengths, target the role he believes he can best excel at the NHL level, and go all out becoming the best he can be in that role. Thats not shooting for less, unless you think a bottom six two way, high energy, penalty killing winger is not important to winning.

I have no argument against knowing your strengths. I just always want players to want to be better and to constantly try to be better. That's all I was saying. Clearly I am out to lunch on this one as it seems most of the board disagrees with me.

 

[Chainshot]

I have no argument against knowing your strengths. I just always want players to want to be better and to constantly try to be better. That's all I was saying. Clearly other people don't feel that way.

I guess it comes down to parsing out what one would consider "Better". Appert for example has told a bunch of his guys who play top 6 roles in Rochester to look at who they would have to displace in Buffalo if they want a top 6 role OR look at what they could do to be in the NHL in another role. That role is then what that player is trying to be best at - it may not be scoring the same number of points any longer, but trying to be the best PKer or best defensive forward, or the best forechecker without as much regard for if they are also at the same time the best scorer they can be. As we know, someone being their best scoring self while ignoring the rest of the ice isn't really helpful to winning.

As for Johnson, it may be that it came down to their unwillingness to burn the year at the end of the season. That would be the risk in presenting the deal in the way they did. (Just to point out, I had no issue if they gave him a game in the final 2. They have a need and to borrow from poet George Herbert: Do not wait; the time will never be 'just right.' Start where you stand, and work with whatever tools you may have at your command, and better tools will be found as you go along.)

 

[Jim Bob]

I guess it comes down to parsing out what one would consider "Better". Appert for example has told a bunch of his guys who play top 6 roles in Rochester to look at who they would have to displace in Buffalo if they want a top 6 role OR look at what they could do to be in the NHL in another role. That role is then what that player is trying to be best at - it may not be scoring the same number of points any longer, but trying to be the best PKer or best defensive forward, or the best forechecker without as much regard for if they are also at the same time the best scorer they can be. As we know, someone being their best scoring self while ignoring the rest of the ice isn't really helpful to winning.

As for Johnson, it may be that it came down to their unwillingness to burn the year at the end of the season. That would be the risk in presenting the deal in the way they did. (Just to point out, I had no issue if they gave him a game in the final 2. They have a need and to borrow from poet George Herbert: Do not wait; the time will never be 'just right.' Start where you stand, and work with whatever tools you may have at your command, and better tools will be found as you go along.)

If it fell apart because the Sabres were unwilling to let him burn that first season, that would seem really short sighted. Johnson with a shorter ELC is way better than a late 2024 2nd round pick for me.

 

[Chainshot]

If it fell apart because the Sabres were unwilling to let him burn that first season, that would seem really short sighted. Johnson with a shorter ELC is way better than a late 2024 2nd round pick for me.

I'm of a similar mind - a very late 2nd round pick next year does not help in its raw form professionally until 2027 or so at best. In trade, it's something yet with a mild value but they would still have to complete a deal elsewhere to get that more immediate assistance.

 

[dotcommunism]

If it fell apart because the Sabres were unwilling to let him burn that first season, that would seem really short sighted. Johnson with a shorter ELC is way better than a late 2024 2nd round pick for me.

If that did end up being the deal breaker, I don't even think it's a case of the team being penny wise pound foolish. The odds are far greater that after coming off his ELC short of RFA eligibility that he would just end up taking his QO than getting a big contract right away. There would likely be no significant financial difference between his ELC starting at the end of the season, and starting next year.

What it feels more like to me, again if not burning the ELC year did end up being the issue, is that the team was absolutely unwilling to cede any control over Johnson's development. That concerns me in different ways than it would if it were just a case of the team being cheap.

 

[joshjull]

If that did end up being the deal breaker, I don't even think it's a case of the team being penny wise pound foolish. The odds are far greater that after coming off his ELC short of RFA eligibility that he would just end up taking his QO than getting a big contract right away. There would likely be no significant financial difference between his ELC starting at the end of the season, and starting next year.

What it feels more like to me, again if not burning the ELC year did end up being the issue, is that the team was absolutely unwilling to cede any control over Johnson's development. That concerns me in different ways than it would if it were just a case of the team being cheap.

I’m somewhat confused as to why this would concern you. Isn’t the team supposed to be in full control of his development once he signs.

 

[Irie]

He is from california i believe? I could be wrong on this, someone please correct me if I am. Both Anaheim and San Jose have more opportunity on the blue line than we do. And if the argument is that he should want to play with Dahlin and Power, well maybe he wants to play with Karlsson AND still live closer to his home.

Playing in San Jose he'd be about as close to his home town as if he were playing for the Coyotes in Arizona.

A comparable would be being from Buffalo and playing for the Devils to be close to home

But I hear what you are saying.

The kings don't have much in the way of LHD in their system, I wonder if that would be a target for him. Vegas would be the second closest team to Anaheim behind LA, and I think their prospect pool is rather depleted.

Seattle also may be attractive too, they have very little blue line depth in their system and their minor league team is a two hour drive from his hometown.

 

[Bendium]

I have no argument against knowing your strengths. I just always want players to want to be better and to constantly try to be better. That's all I was saying. Clearly I am out to lunch on this one as it seems most of the board disagrees with me.

I don't think you're out to lunch. Some of it is just the definition you seem to be setting for what trying to get better mean. If Rousek's goal is to be a 1st line center, then his goals and strengths are not matched, and he will 99.9% fail to achieve his goal. I think many posters are just redefining the goal to something Rousek can reasonably achieve, and saying he should be working to be great at that. The key is to not be satisfied when you achieve your goal. Always be looking to improve.

 

[dotcommunism]

I’m somewhat confused as to why this would concern you. Isn’t the team supposed to be in full control of his development once he signs.

But he is not signed. If they'd rather let the player walk than make any sort of compromise, then I find that concerning.

 

[NotABadPeriod]

But he is not signed. If they'd rather let the player walk than make any sort of compromise, then I find that concerning.

We know that when they signed Levi, they assured him if he proved well enough they would be willing to fast-track him to the NHL. I find it hard to believe a similar assurance for Johnson wasn't made.

 

[joshjull]

But he is not signed. If they'd rather let the player walk than make any sort of compromise, then I find that concerning.

Thanks for clarifying.

I guess it depends on what Johnson’s camp is asking for to sign.

We know that when they signed Levi, they assured him if he proved well enough they would be willing to fast-track him to the NHL. I find it hard to believe a similar assurance for Johnson wasn't made.

Levi is much more highly touted prospect at a position of greater need.

 

[Jim Bob]

 

[Irie]

Is it time yet to change the title of this thread to "2nd Round Pick Formerly Known as Ryan Johnson"?

 

[Ace]

Is it time yet to change the title of this thread to "2nd Round Pick Formerly Known as Ryan Johnson"?

Let’s be like Johnson and be unable to decide for a few years.

 

[HOOats]

Enjoy the holiday weekend everyone!

 

[TehDoak]

Enjoy the holiday weekend everyone!

I'm curious now. We don't have anymore real carrots we can offer than he won't be able to find on the open market. Maybe we let him talk to other teams to see what his open market value would be and our offer suddenly looks much better?

 

[RefsIdeas]

Honestly it’s a little annoying. Watching the Amerks last night one of my first thoughts was how group could use Johnson, a lot of their defenseman just aren’t great skaters. Having him with this playoff run would’ve not only helped the team, but could’ve been a nice boost to his development too.

 

[Gabrielor]

 

[WhereAreTheCookies]

I'm curious now. We don't have anymore real carrots we can offer than he won't be able to find on the open market. Maybe we let him talk to other teams to see what his open market value would be and our offer suddenly looks much better?

At this point you have to think it's a market issue for him rather than a path or contract issue. There isn't much competition for him in the prospect pool, and realistically he would have to beat out what? Bryson and Stillman? They also haven't seemed to hesitant to offer up performance bonuses on other ELC's to get guys signed.

 

[CaliSabresfan24]

Why would he wait this close to free agency to sign his ELC tho? He just doesn't want to play with the Amerks?

 

[RefsIdeas]

Why would he wait this close to free agency to sign his ELC tho? He just doesn't want to play with the Amerks?

I would think it’s still very likely he winds up on the Amerks next year anyways even if he signs.

 

[Chainshot]

Honestly it’s a little annoying. Watching the Amerks last night one of my first thoughts was how group could use Johnson, a lot of their defenseman just aren’t great skaters. Having him with this playoff run would’ve not only helped the team, but could’ve been a nice boost to his development too.

Eh, watching the Amerks, I don't see him easily displacing the veteran Bartkowski, or their top D-man in Pilut, so that leaves Davies... who draws the hardest assignments yet is probably their most mobile blueliner. That's the LD compliment and at the moment it would be him replacing Davies who is one of the more mobile blueliners in their group. The slow guys are the RD in Prow and Cecconi but again, Prow is on their top minute pair and Cecconi is being used with Davies in the shutdown role.

At this moment in time, the slow ones give them something he would not - experience and applied size - that they would still need even if Johnson were in the Amerks lineup.

Why would he wait this close to free agency to sign his ELC tho? He just doesn't want to play with the Amerks?

He might even go back to Minnesota for next year if he doesn't sign in Buffalo or anywhere else. Who knows, it's not like anyone is finding out directly from him.

I would think it’s still very likely he winds up on the Amerks next year anyways even if he signs.

Yep. Though there is one carrot that seems unlike Adams SOP but that he gets some guaranteed NHL time next year as part of signing.


Perhaps his advisor has found there isn't the demand out there they thought there might be in a particular location, so he's circling back to Buffalo. Also the follow up to the comment is that they are fine with the pick as well. That speaks to what the team thinks of the player and may speak to how Johnson is assessed by others as well.