Well, last season he started at a PPG pace and then slowed down significantly. It can be just on the contrary this year. His team actually isn't bad by names. I think it's more with a new coaching and some psychological problems after a bad start. As soon as they win a couple of games, everything can change magically.
RW Pavel Buchnevich (2013, 75th, NYR)
- Thread starter Kshahdoo
- Start date
Well, last season he started at a PPG pace and then slowed down significantly. It can be just on the contrary this year. His team actually isn't bad by names. I think it's more with a new coaching and some psychological problems after a bad start. As soon as they win a couple of games, everything can change magically.
Pavel Buchnevich
"Pavel Buchnevich The Fake"
Fantomas
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- Aug 7, 2012
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He just said that Buchnevich will be ok. And I think he is right; he will be at worst ok.
Pavel Buchnevich
"Pavel Buchnevich The Fake"
Okay, tell me if this works.
I've watched at least parts of over half of the games he's played so far, and he's easily been the best player on the ice for his team in every game I've watched.
He's a phenomenal player. I think he'd have double the amount of points that he has right now if he played for CSKA or SKA. His team is terrible, and he has very little help.
FLYLine27*
BUCH
I sure hope so, since they are ranked 27th out of 28 teams in the standings, and that was with a nice 6 game homestead to start the season.
FLYLine27*
BUCH
He's starting to dominate the games, 3 game goal scoring streak (5 point total), and now leads his team in points.
I've read that Buchnevich has been looking good this year, even early on when he wasn't producing.
Can anyone that watched Kuznetsov and Tarasenko in the KHL comment on how Buchnevich stacks up against these guys when they were in the KHL at his age? Are they on a similar level or were Kuznetsov and Tarasenko on a different level entirely?
Can anyone that watched Kuznetsov and Tarasenko in the KHL comment on how Buchnevich stacks up against these guys when they were in the KHL at his age? Are they on a similar level or were Kuznetsov and Tarasenko on a different level entirely?
SoundAndFury
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He looks very similarly to Kuznetsov, to me Tarasenko looked way better but I was always a fan of his play style and character, he is just a completely different player tho. Playing with Enlund and Lehtera didn't hurt either, obviously.
But overall I think everything is still ahead for him, look at how much time Kuznetsov has to spend adapting, same things will apply to Buchnevich too. Talent was never a question.
But overall I think everything is still ahead for him, look at how much time Kuznetsov has to spend adapting, same things will apply to Buchnevich too. Talent was never a question.
Pavel Buchnevich
"Pavel Buchnevich The Fake"
8 points in 11 games to start the season. Doing whatever he wants to on the ice. If the Rangers are able to add him at the trade deadline, given that Severstal is terrible and very unlikely to make the playoffs, it would probably be a bigger upgrade than any trade acquisition will be. This guy is a legit top 6 NHL forward right now.
Zine
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1. Tarasenko
2. Kuznetsov
3. Buchnevich
...at least up to this point when comparing them at the same ages.
Kuznetsov was scary good as a teen especially internationally, Tarasenko was no slouch either, Buchnevich is a tier below these guys, he failed to be a leader for Russia as expected.
Pavel Buchnevich
"Pavel Buchnevich The Fake"
By what measure?
Kuznetsov has all these younger Russian players in stats in the WJC's and KHL, but Buchnevich has better stats than Tarasenko up to his age 20 KHL season, along with nearly identical WJC stats.
I know its easy to say the guy who you know is a star player in the NHL is better just because he's actually performing as a star player at a high level, but the stats don't back up that Buchnevich is any lesser of a prospect at age 20 than Tarasenko or Kucherov.
24 points in 21 games between the U-18 and U-20 divisions of the WJC is pretty good. Not his fault that his teammates aren't as good as he is.
Also, is your opinion that he's a tier lower from watching all of these players play as prospects? Stats don't back up that argument, and I think he's more complete of a hockey player than Tarasenko, Kucherov and Kuznetsov.
Zine
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- Feb 28, 2002
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Wait a second, aren't you the guy on the Rangers' board who always says not to judge Buchnevich on his stats? But now you use stats as part of your argument when they are in his favor?
I'm going by what I've seen in the KHL and internationally. The eye test. Buchnevich isn't quite as dynamic as Tarasenko and Kuznetsov were. He also has never shown the ability to carry a team on his back like Tarasenko and Kuznetsov did....especially in the clutch.
I think his ceiling is similar to Kucherov's. Slightly under the ceiling of Tarasenko and Kuznetsov. In fact, I like fellow 1995 Nichushkin slightly more than Buchnevich also.
Let's temper expectations a bit here. Buchnevich is a great player (probably will be 1st line NHLer), but he's not the next greatest thing for Russian hockey.
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SoundAndFury
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Is it just me or "8 points in 11 games" and "doing whatever he wants on the ice" kinda contradict one another? But whatever.
Furthermore, Severstal can trade Buchnevich themselves and it would be a sensible thing to do so the fact that Severstal won't make the playoffs doesn't really matter yet.
Saying that Buchnevich is "a legit top 6 NHL forward right now" is homerism/wishful thinking at it's finest. He still weights 80 kg and he still plays like someone who weights 80 kg. Players like that get top-6 minutes either because team has no better options or because the guy is too big profile to play in the AHL which might be true in Buchnevich's case but that doesn't make him a legit top 6 forward.
By the ever important eye test.
You are repeating the stats thing again and again when it isn't even relevant at the slightest than we are talking about those 3.
Tarasenko, unlike the other two, was always a two-way and not offense-first player. One could make a point Kuznetsov was a one-way player altogether during his time in the KHL that's why he always played wing if only Traktor had options. Which brings us to the second part, their teams.
During the 10/11 season; aka the season Russia won WJC gold and both Tarasenko and Kuznetsov were 19; aka the Kuznetsov's breakout season Traktor had nothing, absolutely nothing when it comes to offense. Deron Quint, the defenseman led team in scoring, 19 y.o. Kuznetsov was second, 22 y.o. Glinkin, who will be later relegated to 4th line role when Traktor actually got a competitive team, was third. Team was horrible and missed the playoffs (which is quite a feet since only 3 teams per conference would miss the playoffs back then) and were utterly horrible but Kuznetsov got 1st line minutes and all the PP time they could give him. Tarasenko's scoring, meanwhile, dropped from 24 points in 09/10 to 19 in 10/11 because he had to play on the 3rd line mostly because Sibir actually had a good team and his competition on the right wing were Igor Mirnov and Ville Nieminen. And if you know about European hockey as much as you act like you do, you sure know these are pretty big names.
If you actually looked at their draft years where all 3 teams were kinda similar in strength (all borderline playoff teams) Buchnevich had 2 points in the KHL, Kuznetsov had 8 and Tarasenko had 24. Pretty decisive I'd say even though Tarasenko was 4-5 months older. Obviously, he had more minutes than other two that season but that's because he was ready to get those minutes, he wasn't a liability even at 18 and that's what Zine means. Not "but stats stats stats".. Yeah, right.
Also it's funny how you are questioning posters (I mean me and Zine in this case) who are watching KHL daily and have probably seen 10s of times as many games as you have throughout the whole existence of the league when your only argument is "but stats man, stats" and you obviously have no idea about the thinner points of what you are talking about since you probably started following KHL after Rangers drafted your boy Buch. If you did at all, that is.
kp61c
Registered User
yep, that's about right. but in his last season in the khl kuz looked like he's degrading, maybe because of his problems with shoulder, who knows. so it's close between him and buch.
1Gold Standard
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- Jun 13, 2012
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I don't know how well he speaks it, but in actual fact, Russian is really quite easy to learn. Russian grammar is a ***** though.
boston college i guess. hes apparently good enough at it to trash talk malkin during games lol.
Pavel Buchnevich
"Pavel Buchnevich The Fake"
Wait a second, aren't you the guy on the Rangers' board who always says not to judge Buchnevich on his stats? But now you use stats as part of your argument when they are in his favor?
I'm going by what I've seen in the KHL and internationally. The eye test. Buchnevich isn't quite as dynamic as Tarasenko and Kuznetsov were. He also has never shown the ability to carry a team on his back like Tarasenko and Kuznetsov did....especially in the clutch.
I think his ceiling is similar to Kucherov's. Slightly under the ceiling of Tarasenko and Kuznetsov. In fact, I like fellow 1995 Nichushkin slightly more than Buchnevich also.
Let's temper expectations a bit here. Buchnevich is a great player (probably will be 1st line NHLer), but he's not the next greatest thing for Russian hockey.
I said after a few games this season not to judge on such SSS stats, but I think its appropriate to judge on a few seasons.
I agree that he's not the type of flashy player as Tarasenko or Kuznetsov and hasn't yet carried a team, although he might this season, but I like his two way game better than any of Tarasenko, Kuznetsov, Kucherov and Nichushkin.
Also, while Kuznetsov might have been great in Russia as a prospect and in the international tournaments, he's 23 years old with nearly 100 NHL games, and he's not even a .5 PPG player. Its not time to panic yet, but I wouldn't put him in the Tarasenko tier. I'd rank the three for now Tarasenko, Kucherov and Kuznetsov, in that order. It could change though.
If Crosby has 8 points in 11 games, would you question if he was was playing really well? If you watched more than a game or two of Buchnevich this season, you know that he was playing just as well early in the season as he is on his current points streak, but he just wasn't getting the points. If he was, and these things usually even out over a season, he'd probably be at about 1 PPG for the season.
Also, I don't think he weighs 80 kg. I believe thats been his listed weight for a few seasons now, and it just hasn't been updated by these websites. I'd put him at about 86 to 88 kg, which is decent enough for a 20 year old. If you've watched him play this season, you'll notice he looks a lot stronger, and its showing in the way he plays. He's protecting the puck a lot easier using his strength.
I also think you are overstating how hard it is to be a top 6 NHL forward early in your career. Kevin Hayes was one last season (although he played on the third line), without any previous professional experience prior to the season. The top level players usually can come into the NHL in their early 20's and produce at the level of a second line winger or center.
Stats are important because not everyone always agrees on the eye test. Its subjective to say "player A" plays better than "player B" where its close between the players.
You are making it seem like I am trying to disparage Tarasenko and Kuznetsov, which I am not. They are very good players. My opinion is more about the constant underrating of Buchnevich by KHL followers because he's not the type of big name player that Tarasenko and Kuznetsov were, while non-KHL followers underrate him because he plays in Russia and they don't watch him play, while also underrating him because he wasn't high on Craig Button or Bob McKenzie or any of these guy's draft lists in his draft year, while also not being drafted high, which doesn't matter at all now. He has been relatively unheralded for years, and he's turned himself into a really good hockey player. I think its time that he starts to get the praise that he deserves, which you don't seem to want to give him.
If you now care about stats a few paragraphs later in your post, Buchnevich was third in points on Severstal in his age 19 season, and that was with missing 12 games, mostly due to the WJC's.
I respect your knowledge of the KHL, but you being an avid KHL fan and me being more of an NHL fan who watches the KHL at certain times does not mean your opinion means a lot more than mine.
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I think Buchnevich will be ready for top6 role in the NHL to this season's end. Playing 18-20 minutes/game in the KHL gives him enough experience and mental toughness for it. But I doubt he'll come to Rangers this season, because Rangers are hardly willing to burn one of his ELC years, and he will try for sure to get into Russian NT roster to play in Moscow WC. There is a posibility of trading him to one of Gagarin Cup contenders as well (like it was done with Tarasenko).
FLYLine27*
BUCH
They did it with Krieder a few years back, they would absolutely do it again with Buch if they felt he could give them a more offensive punch going into the playoffs.
