RW Matvei Michkov (2023, 7th, PHI) Part 4

[MonkeyBusiness]

Stats are important, but the ultimate gauge is the eye test. Michkov is a draft age smurf who, at times, is dominating men... in a league that's better than the AHL. He has some weaknesses, but this IQ never ceases to amaze me. That'll take him far.

But I still hope he grows. I seriously believe is size will be the biggest factor in determining whether he'll be a franchise player or something more.

But that's exactly it though, his IQ might be on par with that of Kucherov, and the sky is the limit with this kid. I don't think size is going to be an issue. He's what, 5'10''? If he grows an inch or two, will that really change much? I think he's going to be dominant even if he doesn't get taller.

 

[Puckstopper]

Eichel’s ”lack of superstardom” isn’t due to lack of skill. He had the skillset to be a top3/5 player in this league.
He’s more of an example of what character means also.


Michkov is a fantastic prospect, I just can’t understand why everything with his hype has to be over the top(generational talk)

Maybe the problem is "character" isn't even defined as a part of skillset apparently. Hockey IQ is continually underestimated in prospects because scouts love to focus on the physical tools a player has. I don't have a horse in a Michkov/Fantilli debate but Fantilli can easily go ahead of him based on what typically happens in drafting. Size, speed, easily projectable traits etc. It's the safe, boring thing to do. That doesn't mean it's the right thing to do.

 

[kudla]

But that's exactly it though, his IQ might be on par with that of Kucherov, and the sky is the limit with this kid. I don't think size is going to be an issue. He's what, 5'10''? If he grows an inch or two, will that really change much? I think he's going to be dominant even if he doesn't get taller.

I think he is still about 5ft 8.5 (that was his listing in KHL at some point)

 

[LetsGoFlyers12]

& what has the competition been during KHL time?
Post 2010 there’s been zero franchise prospects playing their draft years in Russia.

So how does that make one generational vs every prospect in the World?

You can’t make a legit case for Michkov being better player than Matthews/Barkov/Laine.

Matthews 46 points in 36 games in NLA, 9 points in 10 games at the WC, made the World Cup roster on his draft summer.

Barkov 48 points in 53 games in Liiga during an NHL lockout season.

Laine, men’s WC MVP, Liiga playoffs MVP, made the World Cup roster on his draft summer.

You can’t legit say Michkov is already one of the best players playing in European leagues unlike with them you could

Or the last 10 so years add Eichel, Hughes, Dahlin, Kakko, Mackinnon, Marner, can you make a legit argument for Michkov being a better player than all of them on draft day?

No you can’t.
So putting him with generational class with McDavid/Bedard is taking it too far.
He’s a franchise prospect with massive potential

McDavid and Bedard stand alone as prospects over the last 10 years. Michkov is in the conversation with every other guy you listed. There are some I would pick him over, and some I wouldn't. These are all personal opinions, but let's not act like Michkov is worlds below players like Kakko and Marner. That's just not true.

Comparing players from different drafts and leagues is totally subjective. All we know is that he is outscoring players who became HOF NHL players. I don't care where Kucherov or Kaprizov were drafted, they blossomed into top 10 forwards in the world, and Michkov is pulverized their production at every stage. The generational tag is debatable, but the facts of this paragraph are not

 

[MonkeyBusiness]

I think he is still about 5ft 8.5 (that was his listing in KHL at some point)

He's 178cm on the KHL website, which is about 5'10''. It is 5.84 feet, yes, but 0.84 feet is 10 inches.

 

[Hanji]

& what has the competition been during KHL time?
Post 2010 there’s been zero franchise prospects playing their draft years in Russia.

So how does that make one generational vs every prospect in the World?

You can’t make a legit case for Michkov being better player than Matthews/Barkov/Laine.

Matthews 46 points in 36 games in NLA, 9 points in 10 games at the WC, made the World Cup roster on his draft summer.

Barkov 48 points in 53 games in Liiga during an NHL lockout season.

Laine, men’s WC MVP, Liiga playoffs MVP, made the World Cup roster on his draft summer.

You can’t legit say Michkov is already one of the best players playing in European leagues unlike with them you could

Or the last 10 so years add Eichel, Hughes, Dahlin, Kakko, Mackinnon, Marner, can you make a legit argument for Michkov being a better player than all of them on draft day?

No you can’t.
So putting him with generational class with McDavid/Bedard is taking it too far.
He’s a franchise prospect with massive potential

This isn't helping your case. All it shows is that, unlike the KHL, the Finnish League is relatively easy for young players to excel in. Here are some players you conveniently missed:
Puljujarvi - 28 pts
Kotkaniemi - 29 pts
Kakko - 38 pts
Lundell - 28 pts
Kemell - 23 pts

There hasn't been a single draft age player to put up those points in the KHL since like forever; and it's not because of a lack of talent.
It just shows that comparing stats from players in different leagues will get you nowhere. Scouting is much more complicated than that.

 

[kp61c]

He's 178cm on the KHL website, which is about 5'10''. It is 5.84 feet, yes, but 0.84 feet is 10 inches.

He looks smaller than that.
The KHL lists Tyanulin (stands next to Michkov in the picture below) as having the height of 175 cm, he seems to be taller than Michkov

 

[Zine]

......and I'm not sure how much Michkov will grow. His father isn't very tall (who btw is the typical controlling hockey parent).
His father is 2nd from left.

 

[kudla]

And this is not how 5'10" looks next to 6'2" (187). Michkov is nowhere near 178

 

[MonkeyBusiness]

He looks smaller than that.
The KHL lists Tyanulin (stands next to Michkov in the picture below) as having the height of 175 cm, he seems to be taller than MichkView attachment 649174

Eh, from that angle they look about the same height. It's not that important in the end.

 

[NatusVincere]

& what has the competition been during KHL time?

Talking about competition, here is the TOP 10 U19 draft eligible in their respective draft years for the KHL:

Half of this list are stars or superstars.

The NCAA in the same timeframe:

Very impressive... I mean, I understand that Matthews wanted to play in a real league.

 

[Kshahdoo]

Talking about competition, here is the TOP 10 U19 draft eligible in their respective draft years for the KHL:

Half of this list are stars or superstars.

The NCAA in the same timeframe:

Very impressive... I mean, I understand that Matthews wanted to play in a real league.

Half of that NCAA list are stars, superstars or gonna be either stars or superstars, though...

 

[BB88]

Who would you take, prime Kucherov or Mathews-Barkov-Laine? And Michkov had better better stats than Matthews at the same tournaments at the same age...

So you have nothing to show how Michkov is a better prospect than any of them?

Matthews scored 46 points in 36 NLA games and was one of the best players in Europe, just like Barkov, just like Laine.

Michkov is not that right now.
So please show by his current play how he’s better than Matthews was

Kucherov was seen as a top talent by russian posters

Late 2nd round pick was not a franchise prospect on draft day

 

[BB88]

Talking about competition, here is the TOP 10 U19 draft eligible in their respective draft years for the KHL:

Half of this list are stars or superstars.

The NCAA in the same timeframe:

Very impressive... I mean, I understand that Matthews wanted to play in a real league.

None of them were before the draft.

Some of you are just moving goalposts as you wish

 

[Caser]

Late 2nd round pick was not a franchise prospect on draft day

Who cares that they weren't considered as such on the draft day, what matters is that they really were franchise prospects.

 

[BB88]

This isn't helping your case. All it shows is that, unlike the KHL, the Finnish League is relatively easy for young players to excel in. Here are some players you conveniently missed:
Puljujarvi - 28 pts
Kotkaniemi - 29 pts
Kakko - 38 pts
Lundell - 28 pts
Kemell - 23 pts

There hasn't been a single draft age player to put up those points in the KHL since like forever; and it's not because of a lack of talent.
It just shows that comparing stats from players in different leagues will get you nowhere. Scouting is much more complicated than that.

I didn’t forget them.

I was listing players that were legit elite level players in Europe during their draft years.

Did you not see me say how Laine was named the MVP at the WC, + he’s the only Liiga playoffs MVP from the group.
Also made the World Cup roster.

Barkov went close to ppg during lockout when Liiga had ton of NHL players in it and still was elite.

Or read my Matthews comment.

It’s not about blind stat watching, it’s them legit being elite in Europe, something you can’t say for Michkov today

 

[Kshahdoo]

So you have nothing to show how Michkov is a better prospect than any of them?

Matthews scored 46 points in 36 NLA games and was one of the best players in Europe, just like Barkov, just like Laine.

Michkov is not that right now.
So please show by his current play how he’s better than Matthews was



Late 2nd round pick was not a franchise prospect on draft day

I unlike you I'm not sure how is it even possible to compare prospects who play in different leagues. Michkov could have scored the same or better numbers as Matthews if he played in the NLA in that season, who knows. The only fact is he outscored Matthews at WJC U18 being younger. Everything other is speculations.

 

[BB88]

Who cares that they weren't considered as such on the draft day, what matters is that they really were franchise prospects.

Of course it matters.

I unlike you not sure how is it even possible to compare prospects who play in different leagues. Michkov could have scored the same or better numbers as Matthews if he played in the NLA in that season, who knows. The only fact is he outscored Matthews at WJC U18 being younger. Everything other is speculations.

So can you legit say Michkov is an elite level player in Europe right now without a bias?

 

[Kshahdoo]

Of course it matters.



So can you legit say Michkov is an elite level player in Europe right now without a bias?

He's 7 points in the last 6 games in the KHL. His 13 points in 20 games on the generationally terrible team don't look bad either. So yes, he's pretty good.

 

[bsu]

Of course it matters.



So can you legit say Michkov is an elite level player in Europe right now without a bias?

He's one of the best prospects in a long time, so yes.

 

[NatusVincere]

Half of that NCAA list are stars, superstars or gonna be either stars or superstars, though...

That’s the Top 10 list in a timeframe over 10 years. Hughes as a D already at 10. People talking here about Eichel as of he outscored Gretzky and Mario in their respective draft years. I don’t see the bunch of star forwards the NCAA produced that Eichels stats should be a benchmark for anything.

 

[NickH8]

So you have nothing to show how Michkov is a better prospect than any of them?

Matthews scored 46 points in 36 NLA games and was one of the best players in Europe, just like Barkov, just like Laine.

Michkov is not that right now.
So please show by his current play how he’s better than Matthews was



Late 2nd round pick was not a franchise prospect on draft day

The KHL is a much different beast than the NL or Liiga or even SHL.

 

[Deleted member 339941]

 

[BB88]

He's 7 points in the last 6 games in the KHL. His 13 points in 20 games on the generationally terrible team don't look bad either. So yes, he's pretty good.

You know there’s something between pretty good and generational?

Matthews was a legit dominant player in Europe.
Michkov is not better than him or the rest today.

Maybe he ends up but he’s not today and you have nothing to back that up

The KHL is a much different beast than the NL or Liiga or even SHL.

This KHL is worse than it has been, it lost a lot of talent.

& as I’ve said and shown those players were elite at the men’s WC level as well and there’s a massive difference in production as well in their pro leagues

He's one of the best prospects in a long time, so yes.

It doesn’t mean he’s one of the best players in Europe today.

He’s a franchise prospect for sure but it’s about impossible to make a legit argument for him to be better today than the players I listed, whom weren’t generational prospects either.

Massive amount of Michkovs generational status is put on potential vs what he is actually today

 

[Fantomas]

You know there’s something between pretty good and generational?

Matthews was a legit dominant player in Europe.
Michkov is not better than him or the rest today.

Matthews had a stong year in the Swiss league yes, but this is a league where David Rundblad dominated around the same time. Two years later Rundblad joined SKA St. Petersburg and finished 21st in team scoring.

The KHL is a much different beast than the NL or Liiga or even SHL.

Yup.