Rumor: Rumors and Proposals Thread: Hallsy Take 2?

[GOilers88]

Arizona Coyotes second line wingers are grabner and hinnestroza, calgaries last game were Sam Bennett and Allan Quinne, Bo Horvat currently centres Tanner Pearson and Jake Vitrtanen.

These are the teams we’re competing with. I’m sick of hearing how hard done by Nuge is.

And how many points are those centers putting up?

 

[ManofSteel55]

Arizona Coyotes second line wingers are grabner and hinnestroza, calgaries last game were Sam Bennett and Allan Quinne, Bo Horvat currently centres Tanner Pearson and Jake Vitrtanen.

These are the teams we’re competing with. I’m sick of hearing how hard done by Nuge is.

Grabner and Hinnestroza are better than Neal and a revolving door. Ditto with Pearson and Virtanen. Calgary's second line is garbage right now,

 

[TheRebuild]

Next to Yakupov he’s the worst 1st overall pick of this decade. Hischer might challenge him but he’s a very disappointing player. The fact he can’t anchor even a second line at this point is just nuts to me.

While I agree with that. I don't really blame Nuge though for where he was picked, anyone from the top of that draft class outside of Landeskog would hold the title of second worst draft pick in the last decade. Just a weak ass draft class in general.

 

[Took a pill in Sbisa]

Ah yes, the hoping for failure because that's what this team really is view, always fun.

Referring to statistics = hoping for failure

Okay

Guess I should go with the 'everything will be okay' attitude that's worked so well around here for the last decade

 

[GOilers88]

McDavid was his most common linemate last year.

40 of his 69 points were with him.

40 at ES and PP?

 

[frag2]

40 at ES and PP?

I dont remember the site where you can break everything down in detail but NHL does have him with 28 total PP points and he was on PP1 for most of last year IIRC

 

[Soundwave]

RNH needs to be the 2nd best player on his line and the other player needs to push the pace of the line. The problem then is where do you find the winger that fits that mold. You're basically asking for Taylor Hall or that tier of winger.

 

[MessierII]

Grabner and Hinnestroza are better than Neal and a revolving door. Ditto with Pearson and Virtanen. Calgary's second line is garbage right now,

Neal is hands down the best player out of all of those guys.

 

[MessierII]

RNH needs to be the 2nd best player on his line and the other player needs to push the pace of the line. The problem then is where do you find the winger that fits that mold. You're basically asking for Taylor Hall or that tier of winger.

The other option is to find a winger for McDavid and make Nuge and Drai your second line duo.

 

[nabob]

What's Neal? Enough with the excuses that he has no one to play with.

He's only anchoring the 2nd line because he's the only other center we have unless we split up Drai and McD. For a 1st overall, guy can't drive anything. He still relies on another player to do the heavy lifting. He's supposed to make his line mates better but he doesn't do that at all.

Neal has looked good on the PP, but he’s still a below average player at EV. Then toss in a random 4th liner and you have Nuge still playing with leftovers.

 

[Soundwave]

Neal has looked good on the PP, but he’s still a below average player at EV. Then toss in a random 4th liner and you have Nuge still playing with leftovers.

Neal is still on pace for 20 goals at even strength to go with his amazing PP production, RNH is on pace for 14 points at even strength total and hasn't scored a single even strength goal this year yet.

RNH is part of the weak link on that line.

Neal is doing his job. RNH and Chiasson are not.

 

[MaxR11]

haha that’s actually quite funny. Gagner is basically done as a NHL player. There’s no need to continue your hatred of RNH in an attempt to prop up your boy. From the day RNH took the #1C spot from little Sammy you have hated him. Just let it go brother.

Gagner should not be in the nhl. Even in his prime he was a bit of a pretender. He's an AHLer. Every team Gags has been on in the NHL was a bad team outside of the Blue Jackets one year where he was mainly a PP specialist. And they chose not to keep him around next year. It's no coincidence he's bounced from team to team. Usually poor teams that are desperate.

At best he arguably clings on to the NHL with his finger nails and it makes no sense why he gets so complacent and lazy at times out there. He's one of the last guys who can afford to not give 110% every single second on the ice.

he's basically an AHLer who can come up and fill in for clubs with poor depth and might get hot for a few games. But in no way should he be a regular NHLer.

 

[Snowpants]

- UFA's actually have to choose to come here and, news flash: we are not a preferred destination. Boyle was never going to choose us over Florida.

- Alternatively, other teams actually have to agree to trade us good players for the pieces we're willing to give up.​

- We have no cap space.
- Holland recognized the bottom six as a weakness and brought in six new players to help address it.

You're talking like Holland had his choice of elite bottom sixers, all willing to sign for the league minimum on a one year contract with a perennial last place team. And he simply chose not to, because he's an idiot.

yoy can make excuses for Tambolland if you want. If you like how this teams depth looks then you can do that to. But some of us do not just take the party line... sons of us want to see them make the playoffs

 

[guymez]

yoy can make excuses for Tambolland if you want. If you like how this teams depth looks then you can do that to. But some of us do not just take the party line... sons of us want to see them make the playoffs

So after 12 games into a season where Holland was forced to clean up Chias mess he is already being equated to Tambo?

 

[ManofSteel55]

Neal is hands down the best player out of all of those guys.

That's debatable, but even if it is true, whoever is on the other side is hands down the worst. Neal was underrating coming in here, but our fanbase is quickly overrating what he brings to the table. His goal scoring is great, and much needed, and I'm not trying to downplay it, but he doesn't make the players around him better. He's a finisher. The problem is when they have a slug like Chaisson playing the other side. Chaisson I have no time for in the top six, unless he is stapled to McDavid/Draisaitl in the Kassian spot, because there was some chemistry there, but he truly is a bottom six player and is a huge problem on the Nuge/Neal line. Nuge's lack of production certainly is concerning though, I'd just like to see him have decent wingers on his line before we write him off.

 

[ThreeOfAPerfectPair]

Neat stat.

 

[CaptainSexyPants]

yoy can make excuses for Tambolland if you want. If you like how this teams depth looks then you can do that to. But some of us do not just take the party line... sons of us want to see them make the playoffs

Very noble work you're doing.

 

[Soundwave]

That's debatable, but even if it is true, whoever is on the other side is hands down the worst. Neal was underrating coming in here, but our fanbase is quickly overrating what he brings to the table. His goal scoring is great, and much needed, and I'm not trying to downplay it, but he doesn't make the players around him better. He's a finisher. The problem is when they have a slug like Chaisson playing the other side. Chaisson I have no time for in the top six, unless he is stapled to McDavid/Draisaitl in the Kassian spot, because there was some chemistry there, but he truly is a bottom six player and is a huge problem on the Nuge/Neal line. Nuge's lack of production certainly is concerning though, I'd just like to see him have decent wingers on his line before we write him off.

Isn't RNH supposed to be the playmaking center? Well, Neal definitely is finishing. So shouldn't the playmaking center be able to take advantage of that?

The truth is RNH never pushes the pace ever. He will always let opponents dictate the pace.

 

[McRpro]

So after 12 games into a season where Holland was forced to clean up Chias mess he is already being equated to Tambo?

This is the same board that started a Fire Holland thread before the season even started.

 

[guymez]

This is the same board that started a Fire Holland thread before the season even started.

Good point.

 

[ManofSteel55]

Isn't RNH supposed to be the playmaking center? Well, Neal definitely is finishing. So shouldn't the playmaking center be able to take advantage of that?

The truth is RNH never pushes the pace ever. He will always let opponents dictate the pace.

I will agree with that. Nuge's big flaw is that he isn't assertive enough most of the time. He is reactionary. That doesn't make him a bad player though. I'm not sure why we're piling on Nuge here when its the bottom six that is letting us down again this year, not the 2nd line. More production from line 2 would be nice, but we're losing every battle there is when we have the bottom six out there.

 

[guymez]

Neat stat.

Thats really the deal here.
The issue isnt as much that the bottom 6 arent scoring...its that they are not playing even hockey when they arent scoring. If they arent preventing goals then its a major problem.

 

[frag2]

I will agree with that. Nuge's big flaw is that he isn't assertive enough most of the time. He is reactionary. That doesn't make him a bad player though.

It makes him a disappointing player though. If you factor in his draft position [which I know generally means squat these days], hes definitely treading bad territory.

 

[Soundwave]

I will agree with that. Nuge's big flaw is that he isn't assertive enough most of the time. He is reactionary. That doesn't make him a bad player though.

Unfortunately we can't afford him to have that lackadasical disposition, it's part of the problem.

You're passing on responsibility now to the bottom 6 because RNH isn't doing his job and the bottom 6 guys then start to feel pressure and gripping their sticks and now you got a roster wide issue with the bottom 9 as a whole.

 

[MaxR11]

So after 12 games into a season where Holland was forced to clean up Chias mess he is already being equated to Tambo?

I'm at the point now, i don't care about playoffs this year. i want to see real change... permanent change and growth. Chia messed things up because he felt the heat and did some foolish things as a result.
I'll be happy now if i see growth in the consistency and effort and on ice intelligence and resilience.

For too long now we have mini spurts of good play followed by tremendous sagging when any hint of adversity is faced. It's really time for the culture and resiliency to grow and change. Build that foundation. Be patient with the prospects and make some good shrewd trades if available. Don't do anything rash and stupid. Don't be afraid that you're "wasting" Connor's good years. Do what's right for the franchise.

It's up to the players in the meantime to stick with Tippett and Holland's program and not be selfish. It may take a few years to turn around. But heck it might take one year or less if buy in and development is great. The players' mindset and culture have been so poisoned by what has occured in the last decade that their go to mindset is one of sagging and feeling sorry for themselves and giving up on each other and the coach. You can feel it creeping back in a bit now in the last 4-5 games. It's up to leadership and culture to stop the negativity and continue to work, be resilient and play for each other. Quit being a baby and a pouter and feeling sorry for yourself. Battle no matter what.