Roster Moves: Roster Thread Talk 2021: it never ends

[GapToothedWonder]

what teams have won cups just by playing youth that's 25 and under with just your own picks? why does every playoff gm get vets even the tampa lightning that won two cups?

What team exclusively built through free agency to win a cup?

News for you most of the "young guys" you think saturate the Flyers aren't even that young anymore.

Also go look at the rosters of cup winners the last 15 years. They always have tons of home grown talent, much of it young home grown talent.

Lmao, why did I even waste the time typing that. I know you won't. You'll just keep smashing your head against the wall of your own ignorance.

 

[SolidSnakeUS]

Frost is better than Bunnaman and Thompson.

Thompson was a bigger liability than Frost. You need to do more than just be trapped in your own zone getting shelled every shift to win games, you know.

A lot of players struggled in no small part because the coaching was a horror show; surrounding players with trash tends to harm them, too. Playing towards stupid plans against a team picking those plans apart effortlessly will harm player results. Coaching is super important, they have a lot of influence. They aren't money sponges soaking up pay while watching to see how the roster congeals on its own without their biased inputs, or whether the goalie singlehandedly determines the whole team's fate.

Considering AV thought Thompson was the only one wearing their big boy pants in the playoffs, it shows that AV is willing to not play those that can actually become a positive on the ice just so he can play favorites and throw others under the bus.

 

[deadhead]

Cup winning teams play their share of "trash" players, it's hard to develop enough home grown talent to fill 22 slots and you can't afford to pay real money to players at the end of the roster. Yandle, Braun, Brassard and Thompson are typical.

TB 2020-21: L Schenn, Maroon,
TB 2019-20: Bogosian, Coburn, L Schenn, Maroon
STL 2018-19: Gunnarsson, Steen, Maroon, Burtuzzo
WASH 2017-18: Orpik, Beagle, Chassion

Thompson and Grant sucked, so did the alternatives. The problem with that team is it lacked depth, the idea that Frost would have played better in the playoffs than he did in the regular season is silly, he'd been eaten alive, both the Habs and Islanders would have run him into the ice.

 

[Adtar02]

If you look at my post above, the only young players who might be blocked by Brassard are NAK and Laczynski. NAK was a disappointment last year and has yet to show he's more than a 4RW, Laczynski is questionable to be 100%, at least in the fall.

Frost's only competition is with himself, if he can't play at a top 9 level he should be back at LHV. The 3C job is his for the taking.

York and Zamula will probably start at LHV, York is 20, and the last two years played 54 college games, 12 Int'l games, and 11 pro games. Zamula the last 3 seasons had 100 WHL games, 18 Int'l games and 27 pro games, or about 2 total years of experience and he's just 21. COVID has cost both players a fair amount of experience, so starting them in the AHL is not the worst thing you can do. If they're NHL ready, it'll be pretty obvious in a few months, they'll dominate the AHL.

Hogberg is actually the player who is closest to the NHL in terms of experience, last four seasons 191 SHL/All games, 23 Int'l, 26 AHL. If he's made the adjustment to NA hockey, he might be the first callup from LHV.

Experience isn’t what gets you in the nhl.

 

[Adtar02]

Anyone who is wavier exempt will most likely start in AHL. That’s the mo of the coach and gm.

 

[flyerslducks]

Ya the Habs and their small ass forwards would definitely have run frost into the ground lmao.

 

[flyerslducks]

If Ive learned anything...its that training camp and the roster it produces is meaningless. It is better to see Frost come up mid year and stick than to see him penciled in as 3C at the start of the year and the team get impatient with him when he hits a rough patch early on. Impatience leads to deadline "depth" acquisitions that the team will feel obligated to play, like Thompson and Grant. Id rather see Thompson be the one who gets replaced midseason than be the one brought in.

Frost will get his chance at some point this year to prove himself and then it will be on him to do so. I like his chances of doing that mid season instead of in october.

I feel like this is what might happen sadly which is why it would’ve been nice to have frost play before so he can come into this year with nhl experience already a la farabee.

 

[deadhead]

Anyone who is wavier exempt will most likely start in AHL. That’s the mo of the coach and gm.

Well, it'll be a tiebreaker, why expose a player you like when you can option an equivalent player and get them some AHL experience?
Bunnaman, NAK and Morin all have to be waived, which gives them an edge, but only if they exploit it in camp.
NAK is likely to be claimed now that he has NHL experience, the other two are more "iffy" given their NHL film is pretty marginal.

 

[Tripod]

Cup winning teams play their share of "trash" players, it's hard to develop enough home grown talent to fill 22 slots and you can't afford to pay real money to players at the end of the roster. Yandle, Braun, Brassard and Thompson are typical.

TB 2020-21: L Schenn, Maroon,
TB 2019-20: Bogosian, Coburn, L Schenn, Maroon
STL 2018-19: Gunnarsson, Steen, Maroon, Burtuzzo
WASH 2017-18: Orpik, Beagle, Chassion

Thompson and Grant sucked, so did the alternatives. The problem with that team is it lacked depth, the idea that Frost would have played better in the playoffs than he did in the regular season is silly, he'd been eaten alive, both the Habs and Islanders would have run him into the ice.

"Thompson sucked"

So Thompson sucked at age 35.....how do you think he will do at age 37?

 

[Beef Invictus]

Cup winning teams play their share of "trash" players, it's hard to develop enough home grown talent to fill 22 slots and you can't afford to pay real money to players at the end of the roster. Yandle, Braun, Brassard and Thompson are typical.

TB 2020-21: L Schenn, Maroon,
TB 2019-20: Bogosian, Coburn, L Schenn, Maroon
STL 2018-19: Gunnarsson, Steen, Maroon, Burtuzzo
WASH 2017-18: Orpik, Beagle, Chassion

Thompson and Grant sucked, so did the alternatives. The problem with that team is it lacked depth, the idea that Frost would have played better in the playoffs than he did in the regular season is silly, he'd been eaten alive, both the Habs and Islanders would have run him into the ice.

If only our trash players were as good as those guys.

The players didn't suck equally. They weren't all equivalent. But let's pretend for a second they all were. You go with the upside in that situation, not players with only decline left.

 

[SolidSnakeUS]

If only our trash players were as good as those guys.

The players didn't suck equally. They weren't all equivalent. But let's pretend for a second they all were. You go with the upside in that situation, not players with only decline left.

You know how some coaches will sit players because they know the player can do better than what they were doing? AV realizes that Thompson isn't able to do better so he will keep putting him out there.

 

[bennysflyers16]

I Loathe NATE, but he looked way better on Wpg than he did here.

 

[deadhead]

"Thompson sucked"

So Thompson sucked at age 35.....how do you think he will do at age 37?

Keep the press box bench warm.

 

[Beef Invictus]

Keep the press box bench warm.

This is never the case.

 

[Flyer lurker]

seriously, what your fixation with frost? like what makes him so special that he's the next sid the kid?

How about on a team that has garbage speed with

Braun
Yandle
JVR
Hayes
Nate

That Frost actually can skate well. If you are putting a lineup together with the 5 aIl mentioned above you are dead team walking. Do we know if Frost is 2/3c? Of course not he hasn't been healthy. But I far rather see Frost and York in the lineup and hope they are ready then see Braun and Nate in the lineup and know we will be 4 steps behind.
We KNOW Brassard isn't a 3c. We know Nate is horse manure as a 4c. I far rather take the maybe than the sure fire pile of manure.

 

[deadhead]

This is never the case.

How many minutes did Stewart and Andreoff play in 2019-20? And that was with a slew of injuries to forwards.
Last year Prosser got 78 minutes, Andreoff 52.
Morin got 202, you know, the kid with "upside."

Gus got 418, he's also a top scorer over the last three years among defensemen - he was more of a gamble that they could coach up his defense to "below average" instead of "terrible."

 

[Beef Invictus]

How many minutes did Stewart and Andreoff play in 2019-20? And that was with a slew of injuries to forwards.
Last year Prosser got 78 minutes, Andreoff 52.
Morin got 202, you know, the kid with "upside."

Gus got 418, he's also a top scorer over the last three years among defensemen - he was more of a gamble that they could coach up his defense to "below average" instead of "terrible."

Minutes are irrelevant compared to games. I suspect you realize that and you are just grasping at anything to make management look less bad for this decision. Every game they played was one game better players didn't. Over a fifth of the season.

All those points in the standings matter.

 

[deadhead]

How about on a team that has garbage speed with

Braun
Yandle
JVR
Hayes
Nate

That Frost actually can skate well. If you are putting a lineup together with the 5 aIl mentioned above you are dead team walking. Do we know if Frost is 2/3c? Of course not he hasn't been healthy. But I far rather see Frost and York in the lineup and hope they are ready then see Braun and Nate in the lineup and know we will be 4 steps behind.
We KNOW Brassard isn't a 3c. We know Nate is horse manure as a 4c. I far rather take the maybe than the sure fire pile of manure.

There is nothing wrong with Braun on the third pair, 50.37 CF%, 49.54 xGF%, 9.76 HDCA/60 despite being overused. Good luck finding better third pair defensemen at that price.
And Yandle is still a top PP QB, better than Ghost the last few years, you just have to shelter him at 5x5.
The top four D-men all clock 20+ minutes a night so the third pair should see limited usage.

JVR and Hayes aren't speedsters but they could probably keep up with Couts in a footrace, JVR had the 3rd best xGF% and Hayes the 5th (despite his sports hernia which slowed him down the last couple months) so their skating doesn't seem to be a problem.

Frost will probably play with Lindblom/Laughton on his LW and Farabee/Allison on his RW. That's enough speed to keep up with him.

Thompson was solid defensively with Winnipeg last year, the key is limiting his minutes and using him in spots. He's not going to give you much offense, and he shouldn't play more than 10 minutes a night in the games he does dress. Winnipeg used him for 8:10 at 5x5 and 1:22 on the PK.

This holds for Brassard, try to use him with 3rd line minutes and I predict he'll disappoint, keep him down to around 12-13 minutes a night and he should be a useful veteran forward (13:42, 14:48 the last two seasons). AV played Raffl 12:41 last season.

 

[Beef Invictus]

There is nothing wrong with Braun on the third pair, 50.37 CF%, 49.54 xGF%, 9.76 HDCA/60 despite being overused. Good luck finding better third pair defensemen at that price.
And Yandle is still a top PP QB, better than Ghost the last few years, you just have to shelter him at 5x5.
The top four D-men all clock 20+ minutes a night so the third pair should see limited usage.

JVR and Hayes aren't speedsters but they could probably keep up with Couts in a footrace, JVR had the 3rd best xGF% and Hayes the 5th (despite his sports hernia which slowed him down the last couple months) so their skating doesn't seem to be a problem.

Frost will probably play with Lindblom/Laughton on his LW and Farabee/Allison on his RW. That's enough speed to keep up with him.

Thompson was solid defensively with Winnipeg last year, the key is limiting his minutes and using him in spots. He's not going to give you much offense, and he shouldn't play more than 10 minutes a night in the games he does dress. Winnipeg used him for 8:10 at 5x5 and 1:22 on the PK.

This holds for Brassard, try to use him with 3rd line minutes and I predict he'll disappoint, keep him down to around 12-13 minutes a night and he should be a useful veteran forward (13:42, 14:48 the last two seasons). AV played Raffl 12:41 last season.

A lot of these what-ifs depend on good player usage from a coach who has habitually exhibited terrible usage decisions. Pretty much nonstop.

 

[Tripod]

Keep the press box bench warm.

Lies.

"Thompson was solid defensively with Winnipeg last year, the key is limiting his minutes and using him in spots."

Like matching him up against Barzal?

 

[SolidSnakeUS]

Lies.

"Thompson was solid defensively with Winnipeg last year, the key is limiting his minutes and using him in spots."

Like matching him up against Barzal?

Or putting him out there for a faceoff right after being scored on?

 

[Flyer lurker]

There is nothing wrong with Braun on the third pair, 50.37 CF%, 49.54 xGF%, 9.76 HDCA/60 despite being overused. Good luck finding better third pair defensemen at that price.
And Yandle is still a top PP QB, better than Ghost the last few years, you just have to shelter him at 5x5.
The top four D-men all clock 20+ minutes a night so the third pair should see limited usage.

JVR and Hayes aren't speedsters but they could probably keep up with Couts in a footrace, JVR had the 3rd best xGF% and Hayes the 5th (despite his sports hernia which slowed him down the last couple months) so their skating doesn't seem to be a problem.

Frost will probably play with Lindblom/Laughton on his LW and Farabee/Allison on his RW. That's enough speed to keep up with him.

Thompson was solid defensively with Winnipeg last year, the key is limiting his minutes and using him in spots. He's not going to give you much offense, and he shouldn't play more than 10 minutes a night in the games he does dress. Winnipeg used him for 8:10 at 5x5 and 1:22 on the PK.

This holds for Brassard, try to use him with 3rd line minutes and I predict he'll disappoint, keep him down to around 12-13 minutes a night and he should be a useful veteran forward (13:42, 14:48 the last two seasons). AV played Raffl 12:41 last season.

1) You can't pair Yandle's speed and lack of D with Braun and his lack of speed.
So are you ok with pairings.
Prov-Ellis
San-Braun
RR-Yandle

If so fine. But if Braun was a train wreck with Ghost we think Braun will be fine with Yandle? I don't.
And if I trusted AV to give bottom pair sheltered 14-15 minutes maybe. But based on history I don't trust AV.

2) You can't play JVR and Hayes together. Separated sure. Together they will be a mess. And if you are having JVR on the ice with Braun, Yandle, you will be VERY slow on the ice. And while Couts isn't a speedster, his hockey iq and instincts make up for that easily. JVR with Couts and or Bee worked well last year. JVR with Hayes I don't want to go near.

3) Frost agreement 1000000 percent all good there.

4) Do u trust AV to play Nate 8 min a night? I don't.

5) Brassard as 4 I like. Not as a 3.

Dream lineup for me

g-couts-tk
bee-Hayes-Atkinson
JVR-Frost-Lindblom
Laughton-Brassard-Allison
scratch Kubel Nate
L-ski on standby

You want to interchange 3rd/4th line players? No issues. You want to switch Atkinson and TK? No issues.

d
If York is ready he is in Yandle or Braun out.

Now how to make it work under the cap.....

 

[deadhead]

Actually JVR and Hayes have worked fine together, give them Atkinson as the RW for a speed bump.
I think we'll see some shuffling of players among lines for the first couple months, since there are a lot of viable combos.
And in games you could match and pair guys, put together a speed line, a big line and so on.

I also think AV is going to use his lines almost evenly, b/c he'll have a talented 4th line and 2nd and 3rd lines that are pretty interchangeable if Frost is ready to handle the load.

 

[flyerslducks]

this is going to be a long year lmao

 

[FLYguy3911]

I Loathe NATE, but he looked way better on Wpg than he did here.

Everyone looks better in Winnipeg.