Roster thread: Get To Work (2022-2023 Season)

[TehDoak]

So, I'm not sure this is the best place to put this, but I think its a discussion worth having:

When do we as a team address that our top line is the worst defensive lines in hockey. To the point where is xGA is greater than it's xGF. Is it a system issue or a personel issue? And what can be done to fix it? I think its especially egregious considering the offensive deployment is something like 61%

 

[Duddy]

Where did I say that in my post? You are just assuming something I never wrote.

Its also naive to think he would be worse than Bryson or Clague.

Well, what problemy would he solve than? If not the problems we have with Clague and bryson?

Why is it naive? As shocking as it may be t o you, Bryson and Clague were good in juniors as well. Johnson is not a sure fire NHLer, he is a decent prospect, just like Bryson was.

 

[WhereAreTheCookies]

So, I'm not sure this is the best place to put this, but I think its a discussion worth having:

View attachment 646294

When do we as a team address that our top line is the worst defensive lines in hockey. To the point where is xGA is greater than it's xGF. Is it a system issue or a personel issue? And what can be done to fix it? I think its especially egregious considering the offensive deployment is something like 61%

As opposed to their actual goals % which is over 60%. While I myself do take a look at advanced stats for players and lines, they also miss some things that are difficult to quantify, and never tell the entire story.

I'm not disagreeing that I'd like to see them get better defensively, I think a lot comes down to the system they are playing right now under Granato.

Just for reference

 

[Djp]

Any interest in any players from teams that should be in a cap bind next season?

Looking at Calgary in particular. Mangiapane, Toffoli?
Could Mangiapane push a guy like Peterka or Quinn to the 3rd line?

id do Anderson+Mangiapani for Joker (50%) and Mitts/ Olofsdon at 50% as a framework. It gives thrm needed cap space.

Calgary isn’t getting anything valuable to take on Mangiapani/ Toffoli contract to help them out of the cap problem.

 

[TehDoak]

id do Anderson+Mangiapani for Joker (50%) and Mitts/ Olofsdon at 50% as a framework. It gives thrm needed cap space.

Calgary isn’t getting anything valuable to take on Mangiapani/ Toffoli contract to help them out of the cap problem.

That's a terrible deal for Calgary. Neither are toxic contracts. They aren't going to give up Andersson when someone will take on one of those two (Toffoli/Magiapane) at a reduced rate.

Calgary simply needs to decide who isn't there next year.

Dustin Wolf is probably the best target they have if you want to squeeze someone out in exchange for salary help.

 

[toddkaz]

Setting naiveity aside, Johnsson needing no time in the AHL seems optomistic. I think this roster has moved to a different phase of on-the-job training, and going forward the threshold for a roster spot and definition of NHL-ready will get more restrictive and have higher standards. This group is allowed to make mistakes and grow up until now. That is not a perpetual state or philosophy this team will continue to take IMO.

So are you saying Johnson doesn't help solve problems on the roster? I don't understand why people would think he wouldn't.

I never said he would step in and play. Some people here like to make arguments up that don't exist.

Well, what problemy would he solve than? If not the problems we have with Clague and bryson?

Why is it naive? As shocking as it may be t o you, Bryson and Clague were good in juniors as well. Johnson is not a sure fire NHLer, he is a decent prospect, just like Bryson was.

Depth on defense, defensive prospects in the pool.

Like I said, why not ask instead of accusing me of something I never said.

 

[Der Jaeger]

If Dylan Larkin was truly available (he'll very likely not available), I'd be in on that for a Horvat-like price.

 

[thewookie1]

You want to avoid bad long term deals? That's fine. You want to let the young kids grow at the NHL level? Also no problem there, though, I'd argue some of the kids could have benefitted from more AHL time. The issue is having glaring issues (for multiple seasons) and doing nothing to resolve them when you have more more draft picks than you can develop and essentially unlimited short term cap space.

We're are probably going to be the 1st team in NHL history with a Norris Nominee and a Hart Nominee at the same time that misses the playoffs in a league where half the teams make the playoffs. Why? Because the ownership refused to address obvious issues and opted for the cheapest possible

Quinn, Peterka and Krebs didn’t need more AHL time and Power was certainly not going to Rochester.

Picking up garbage short contracts for assets would have been useful but where are we exactly sending these players? Most of them wouldn’t be willing to play in the AHL and our youngsters don’t need some overpaid JAG breathing down their neck and possibly disrupting the vibes.

Team issues are ever changing, especially with a young team. The only way to know what you need is to see the young players try and fail. Outside of goaltending which UPL has seemingly grabbed at this time; there wasn’t room for “filler vets” if you wanted to maximize the youth experience.

 

[TehDoak]

Quinn, Peterka and Krebs didn’t need more AHL time and Power was certainly not going to Rochester.

Peterka: 7 points in his last 25 GP
Quinn: 9 points in his last 25 GP

Those strike you as players who couldn't use some time in the AHL?

Especially in their role as scoring wingers who aren't scoring?

Krebs is playing a bit of a different role, though I'd argue he'd probably develop more playing 19 minutes a. night in the AHL vs 12 minutes a night in the NHL.

I get they had strong AHL years and do need NHL time. But, I think keeping the young players working to keep their roster spots rather than gifting them spots is a better approach.

Picking up garbage short contracts for assets would have been useful but where are we exactly sending these players? Most of them wouldn’t be willing to play in the AHL and our youngsters don’t need some overpaid JAG breathing down their neck and possibly disrupting the vibes.

Oh no not the vibes!

Who said they had to be garbage contracts?

Team issues are ever changing, especially with a young team. The only way to know what you need is to see the young players try and fail. Outside of goaltending which UPL has seemingly grabbed at this time; there wasn’t room for “filler vets” if you wanted to maximize the youth experience.

Actually our team issues have been amazingly consistent the past few years

Goaltending
Two Way center
Help on the PK
Defensive depth.

Yet these never get addressed in a meaningful way.

 

[Matt Ress]

To be fair, in recent years, they've had a lot more roster holes that have been addressed. So there are a few lingering but they're not as big of problems and fewer than before.

 

[Jacob582]

We're definitely the All Good Vibes team

View attachment 646262

So Cozy.

 

[Zman5778]

I think Dumba is still a smart rental at this point. His cost shouldn't be prohibitive, he's having a down year. See if he's a fit with Power and it works, if it does, sign him, if not, let him go. Let it be a true 'try before you buy' relationship for both sides.

Dumba + Greenway for Mittelstadt+ 2nd. Make it work. Or just Dumba for a 2nd.

I can't imagine that Adams is going to be interested in a RHD rental. Dahlin is obviously our top RHD and has a good partner in Samuelsson.

Power/Joker just work together, even if it's not pretty sometimes. Boosh has been as advertised lately as long as he stays out of the box.

I could see Adams being interested in Greenway in the offseason, but I just don't see him in on an RHD rental. MAYBE he'll do a cheap (acquisition cost) LHD rental if Bryson's play slips again.

 

[Zman5778]

If Dylan Larkin was truly available (he'll very likely not available), I'd be in on that for a Horvat-like price.

To be our 3rd center? Pass.

 

[Zman5778]

I get they had strong AHL years and do need NHL time. But, I think keeping the young players working to keep their roster spots rather than gifting them spots is a better approach.

You've been consistently saying this and fighting for this........but you're not acknowledging that it's not going to happen. It's abundantly clear that Adams and Granato prefer to play the kids rather than send them to Rochester this year. They're not changing this approach no matter how hard any of us push for the opposite.

 

[TehDoak]

You've been consistently saying this and fighting for this........but you're not acknowledging that it's not going to happen. It's abundantly clear that Adams and Granato prefer to play the kids rather than send them to Rochester this year. They're not changing this approach no matter how hard any of us push for the opposite.

Of course it isn't going to happen. We've been gifting people roster spots for years with one out of left field success and a lot of bad results.

 

[SnuggaRUDE]

I wouldnt bother. Players drop off in their 30s so you are likely overpaying in open market.


i see larkin and Aho asking for 9.5+ given the ca raises Projected.

Aho is 25

 

[Zman5778]

We've been gifting people roster spots for years with one out of left field success and a lot of bad results.

I don't see the "lot of bad results" you're talking about on this team. OK, Mittelstadt was undeniably gifted a roster spot to his detriment. Unquestionably.

Krebs is coming around. Peterka and Quinn have their moments (as all rookies do).

The approach Adams and Granato (specifically Adams and Granato) are taking seems to be working. The kids are progressing. All of them. Even Mitts.

 

[Chainshot]

Of course it isn't going to happen. We've been gifting people roster spots for years with one out of left field success and a lot of bad results.

Gifting?

If you missed it, Bjork and Hinostroza got waived because they -- as vet player place holders -- got beat out as NHL regulars.

 

[Jim Bob]

Why am I doing this to myself?

 

[HaNotsri]

San Jose signs Johnson, Buffalo receives 2nd as compensation.
Buffalo trades a 3rd to San Jose for Johnson.

San Jose gets a free 3rd round pick and we upgrade our "3rd" late 2nd.

Probably some rule in place to prevent this...

 

[Push Dr Tracksuit]

Any interest in any players from teams that should be in a cap bind next season?

Looking at Calgary in particular. Mangiapane, Toffoli?
Could Mangiapane push a guy like Peterka or Quinn to the 3rd line?

id poach a defenseman

 

[Zman5778]

San Jose signs Johnson, Buffalo receives 2nd as compensation.
Buffalo trades a 3rd to San Jose for Johnson.

San Jose gets a free 3rd round pick and we upgrade our "3rd" late 2nd.

Probably some rule in place to prevent this...

@dotcommunism Can confirm this -- but I'm pretty sure that if we don't sign Johnson and another team does, we can't trade for him for the remainder of that NHL year. The part I'm unsure about is if we could even acquire him if he's still on his ELC.

 

[Jacob582]

If you missed it, Bjork and Hinostroza got waived because they -- as vet player place holders -- got beat out as NHL regulars.

Did they? It seems like we all knew last summer that Quinn and Peterk were going to be in the lineup and Hino was going to be the extra (barring injury).

 

[Ace]

The problem was not leaving spots for young players…it was failing to upgrade the talent around them. Particularly on defense. They should have acquired two better D than they’re skating out there. Everyone looks a lot better if Power has a partner who can do something more than be carried by a rookie and Bryson never sees the ice.

People can argue with me forever about Olofsson’s production but he should have been gone too. Get players in the lineup that would actually benefit the young guys to play with…not take half a season to figure out who they can even play with.

They say it’s about development…and then don’t put the pieces in place to help them develop.

Won’t change until ownership does

 

[Zman5778]

Did they? It seems like we all knew last summer that Quinn and Peterk were going to be in the lineup and Hino was going to be the extra (barring injury).

Bjork absolutely, positively got beat out. No question.

Hino......a case can be made that he "tied" with the kids.......but the tie was clearly going to the kids. So in Hino's case, I think it's a touch better to say that he didn't beat the kids out of a spot.