Roster thread: Get To Work (2022-2023 Season)

[Chainshot]

Another interesting piece to this is the asking price for guys.

EF was on the Jeff Marek Show today said that since there were a lot of D that went for a 1st or more last year that the ask for guys like Schenn and Edmundson is likely to start at a 1st.

I can understand if Adams is wary of shopping right now if those are the prices.

Yep, and it only takes one GM being willing to fork up the Chiarot return to get a pile for one of those guys on an expiring deal. Buffalo isn't going to be looking at dealing away a 24th or later pick.

 

[Beerz]

I think the value of getting this core into the playoffs is very high, even if they don't get far. Need to start getting that experience to make it more real in their heads, and give them a real experience to set their future expectations against. Understanding what it really takes can help some players with taking the next step.

I don't think we get there without a few trades, but I do think a couple trades could get us there.

I would like to see 1 third line 2-way or heavy style defensive player, and TWO 4-6 capable genuine NHL dmen.

I would love the perfect trade for longterm dmen.... BUT to get to the post season this year I would be fine with moving a low draft pick and/or any of driftwood (Bryson, Fitz, Pilut, Hino, Olof, Aspland) to take on solid high cap dmen from Western Conference teams that will be UFA's. Don't buy big, buy its time to make some bottom roster adjustments to support the core.

Yes I realize its a "development year," but the opportunity is there and it seems to me the player assesments we needed to do are far enough along to identify the players that absolutely will not be part of the future. So there should be know impediment to improving the bottom group.

What's better for development than making the playoffs?

 

[BUCKSHOT]

What's better for development than making the playoffs?

Playoff hockey is probably good/great for youth development, but not at the expense of accelerating the rebuild

 

[The Blunder Years]

In the long term, this team does not need to use all 3 2nds in the draft. Maybe you use some to move up in the 1st to get a guy but I think they hold a bit more value than other years due to this deep draft class.

I think there are lots of ways we can add some complimentary pieces without giving up anything of major value

 

[The Blunder Years]

Also trading for impact players is not short sighted if you acquire players that have a future on the team. I don’t like the term accelerating the rebuild. Lots of rebuilding teams make a few strategic moves to acquire veterans or proven players to help fill some gaps the young players can’t.

 

[ValJamesDuex]

There have been a lot of teams linked to Chychrun over the past year, but it always comes back to the asking price being too high.

It comes back to the connections to the owner here, right ?

 

[Ace]

I want the top 4 D more than worrying about the 3rd line right now. There are many prospects developing right now that can be answers to the third line while this top 6 is still under contract. There is no answer on D.

 

[Zman5778]

In the long term, this team does not need to use all 3 2nds in the draft.

Maybe. But also: as we become better and better, we're going to need guys on ELCs to come in and contribute. 3 shots at that in the 2nd round isn't a bad thing at all.

Especially considering the state of our defensive prospects.

 

[Ace]

They can use all of those picks to replace the prospects they trade for help.

 

[WhereAreTheCookies]

It comes back to the connections to the owner here, right ?

I don't know that him knowing the family would make a ton of difference. Have to think if that mattered Buffalo would have drafted him over Nylander in 2016. He was the 4th ranked NA prospect at the time, and Nylander was 3rd plus Buffalo had a need for Dmen.

 

[ValJamesDuex]

Interesting note from Marek's latest podcast, he mentions that Sabres management called an audible in the 2017 draft and took Mittlestadt over Martin Necas who the scouts recommended. Interesting. See the 33:00 mark below.

 

[Diaspora]

So I am not allowed to say Tage is the best player? It seems to upset people here.

People should move on from their hate of Botts.

I'm all for moving on from hate.

 

[Fezzy126]

People should move on from their hate of Botts.

I thought I hated Murray for hiring Byslma. It was that duo that caused me to cancel my season tickets.

Then Botts came along and hired Krueger, and I learned what real hatred actually was.

The franchise is fun and exciting and super easy to root for, perhaps as much as the 05-06 group. And yet they still haven't recovered from the damage Botts and Krueger inflicted on the organization, I will never move on from my utter contempt for those two idiots.

 

[UnleashRasmus]

Interesting note from Marek's latest podcast, he mentions that Sabres management called an audible in the 2017 draft and took Mittlestadt over Martin Necas who the scouts recommended. Interesting. See the 33:00 mark below.

That was what, 3 GM's ago. Casey Mittelstadt, has found his role on this team, fits and works up and down the line up. He needs to continue to work on his play away from the puck. But, I definitely appreciate his overall game this year. I'm at a B- on the overall talent on the roster. Forwards are easily an A-, Defensemen are a B-, and goal tending is a C. If UPL continues to push for the crease, then this could change. The talent in the system with overall assets, i'd also give a B+.

 

[alehman42]

I thought I hated Murray for hiring Byslma. It was that duo that caused me to cancel my season tickets.

Then Botts came along and hired Krueger, and I learned what real hatred actually was.

The franchise is fun and exciting and super easy to root for, perhaps as much as the 05-06 group. And yet they still haven't recovered from the damage Botts and Krueger inflicted on the organization, I will never move on from my utter contempt for those two idiots.

Baseball obviously has it's differences from hockey, but I worked for the Red Sox for a couple years so I tend to cut GMs a lot of slack. The job is way, waaay harder than it looks from a fan's perspective; there are a lot of smart, dedicated people working directly against your interests.

The O'Reilly trade...eh, there's some circumstantial evidence that trade was pushed by ownership, and if your owner says you need to move a guy before his bonus is paid, then other GMs have you over the barrel and you take the best deal you can find.

But...Marco Scandella. Marco f*cking Scandella. Not the most costly mistake, but the move that was most clearly, unequivocally a failure on his part. Botterill traded Scandella to Montreal for a 4th...and 46 days later Montreal flipped him for a 2nd *and* a conditional 4th.

Again, not a terribly costly mistake, but the most clear, unequivocal mistake I've ever seen a GM make, in any sport. This was not a case of a GM misjudging the potential of a prospect - which has happened forever, from Sam Bowie to the first 198 picks in the 2000 NFL draft, to our own Tage Thompson - but a case involving an established player who Botterill *absolutely* should have known the value of and *clearly* didn't.

Every GM makes bad judgement calls. Botterill literally did not know the value of an established player under his control.

Grrr...

 

[Weltschmerz]

Baseball obviously has it's differences from hockey, but I worked for the Red Sox for a couple years so I tend to cut GMs a lot of slack. The job is way, waaay harder than it looks from a fan's perspective; there are a lot of smart, dedicated people working directly against your interests.

The O'Reilly trade...eh, there's some circumstantial evidence that trade was pushed by ownership, and if your owner says you need to move a guy before his bonus is paid, then other GMs have you over the barrel and you take the best deal you can find.

But...Marco Scandella. Marco f*cking Scandella. Not the most costly mistake, but the move that was most clearly, unequivocally a failure on his part. Botterill traded Scandella to Montreal for a 4th...and 46 days later Montreal flipped him for a 2nd *and* a conditional 4th.

Again, not a terribly costly mistake, but the most clear, unequivocal mistake I've ever seen a GM make, in any sport. This was not a case of a GM misjudging the potential of a prospect - which has happened forever, from Sam Bowie to the first 198 picks in the 2000 NFL draft, to our own Tage Thompson - but a case involving an established player who Botterill *absolutely* should have known the value of and *clearly* didn't.

Every GM makes bad judgement calls. Botterill literally did not know the value of an established player under his control.

Grrr...

That looked super dumb, but honestly if we keep him, not sure we get that second or even more than the 4th.
He was bad with us and the habs had a good stretch and won some games and maybe someone thought he only looked bad with us because we were a bad team.

 

[truthbluth]

Interesting note from Marek's latest podcast, he mentions that Sabres management called an audible in the 2017 draft and took Mittlestadt over Martin Necas who the scouts recommended. Interesting. See the 33:00 mark below.

Between that and Jerry Forton’s story about Charlie McAvoy, I think the lesson is to let your scouts do their job. Seems to be what Kevyn does. Let’s hope it pays off.

 

[truthbluth]

Baseball obviously has it's differences from hockey, but I worked for the Red Sox for a couple years so I tend to cut GMs a lot of slack. The job is way, waaay harder than it looks from a fan's perspective; there are a lot of smart, dedicated people working directly against your interests.

The O'Reilly trade...eh, there's some circumstantial evidence that trade was pushed by ownership, and if your owner says you need to move a guy before his bonus is paid, then other GMs have you over the barrel and you take the best deal you can find.

But...Marco Scandella. Marco f*cking Scandella. Not the most costly mistake, but the move that was most clearly, unequivocally a failure on his part. Botterill traded Scandella to Montreal for a 4th...and 46 days later Montreal flipped him for a 2nd *and* a conditional 4th.

Again, not a terribly costly mistake, but the most clear, unequivocal mistake I've ever seen a GM make, in any sport. This was not a case of a GM misjudging the potential of a prospect - which has happened forever, from Sam Bowie to the first 198 picks in the 2000 NFL draft, to our own Tage Thompson - but a case involving an established player who Botterill *absolutely* should have known the value of and *clearly* didn't.

Every GM makes bad judgement calls. Botterill literally did not know the value of an established player under his control.

Grrr...

You know, it was flipping Toronto a high 6th for a future low 6th that put me over the edge. Like, that’s a nickel for 4 pennies. There have been maybe 100 late round swaps since I started following hockey and the draft, and that was the dumbest one. Shockingly stupid. The fact that Toronto got a good player out of it, who is already in the league is the cherry on top. But he didn’t need to be a real player for that swap to be terrible.

 

[Irie]

The debate on Sabres twitter between making moves and being a year away misses the point.

The moves they need to make now are the ones they should have made in the offseason and didn’t. Top 4 D. Goalie. Defensive Center. Can’t get goalie now so it’s ride and likely die with what we have. But you can get the other things.

and here’s why you should. Because those aren’t the moves you were/are a year away from. Next off-season should be fixing the third line, moving on from the pieces that aren’t going to be long term core members, and figuring out the bottom pair D. The reason those are next offseason moves is that we took this season to see who would, and wouldn’t, be a part of it from what we already had here. And that wait can continue,

But,

Adams isn’t going to do all of those things. Adams does very little. We aren’t just one year away…because we are one year behind. Have to catch up so that we can be in position to do the year away things next year.

Just think how crappy the future would look if Adams had gone out last offseason and signed Campbell (goalie), Chiarot (top 4 D), and Copp (3rd line Center).

With Cozens upcoming contract, they would basically be at the cap and would have no wiggle room after Dahlin's extension. Then when Power, Cozens and Peterka were up the following year, there would be major cap casualties, and the team would still be lacking the depth they need for playoff success, and we'd be looking at waiting to get out of a bunch of bad contracts again so we could start the tank and the rebuild all over before even becoming a contender - once again.

 

[Rowley Birkin]

Guys - i have been guilty of this in the past - but can we please keep this thread for roster discussions?

It's hard enough to follow when you're not always logged in as it is - without having to filter through the regurgitated debates such as Botts vs Murray, ROR trade, etc.

 

[Rowley Birkin]

Re acquiring defensive depth - what's the deal with Luke Schenn? I see his name pop up a surprising amount & people wanting to trade decent assets for him. He seems like a patchwork fix to me though - especially given his age...

 

[GrierIsGod123]

Just think how crappy the future would look if Adams had gone out last offseason and signed Campbell (goalie), Chiarot (top 4 D), and Copp (3rd line Center).

With Cozens upcoming contract, they would basically be at the cap and would have no wiggle room after Dahlin's extension. Then when Power, Cozens and Peterka were up the following year, there would be major cap casualties, and the team would still be lacking the depth they need for playoff success, and we'd be looking at waiting to get out of a bunch of bad contracts again so we could start the tank and the rebuild all over before even becoming a contender - once again.

I'd agree that UFA would've been a poor route for the most part this off-season. I was more a proponent of trades and a couple better depth signings. They didn't have enough meat on the bone of this lineup, at least around the d-core.

It was easy to see that Fitzgerald was not an NHL d-man last season, so not sure why they thought coming in with him as the #7 was a smart idea. I'm sure his analytics were poor last year, and not much/if any better this year. He is what he is, and that should be an organizational #9/#10 guy that can come in for a game here or there and play 10 minutes. I know he's not playing this year, but I keep thinking back to a guy like Pysyk. Imagine throwing a guy like that in the lineup over Fitz and how much more solid the lineup would feel.

The third line could wait til the offseason, as that should be fairly reasonable to upgrade. I think the key is trying different combinations there. They CAN'T keep putting Mitts and Olofsson on the same line, it just doesn't work as a combo. Also, Asplund needs to be in this lineup. He's a good hockey player that is somehow being cast as an extra forward. With our defense shorthanded, there's no way a good defensive forward like him should sit. I'd like to see what Krebs can do for a stretch with Asplund and Olofsson. Jost seems like a better fit between Girgs and Okposo anyway, as he can play their game to a T. It's time to see this lineup without Mitts for a bit. We need to see if Krebs can develop his offensive game, but needs guys with a little more offensive game to do that. Girgs and Okposo are good grinders, but are hardly ever in scoring position to utilize Krebs' passing ability.

In the offseason, it might make sense to really upgrade that third line. Get another really good even strength winger that can replace Olofsson. We need to get positive contributions out of that line next year, time to get four lines that can all get it done.

 

[Jacob582]

I'll change the subject.

How about a playoff push rental?

Mittelstadt for ROR

(similar to the Jost for Sturm trade....on steroids)

 

[Rowley Birkin]

I'll change the subject.

How about a playoff push rental?

Mittelstadt for ROR

(similar to the Jost for Sturm trade....on steroids)

I highly doubt ROR would want to come back. I highly doubt Pegula would want him back. I highly doubt STL accepts that offer & I'm not sure that paying your de facto '3C' 7.5m/per (then presumably extending him) is the smartest thing to do from a long term cap/roster construction perspective.

 

[Dirty Dog]

ROR is certainly one of the few players in the league that would not be allowed to come back here