Roster Thread (2023-2024 Season)

[Old Navy Goat]

I just feel like NHL teams and people involved in the draft disagree with you on the size part. You make all good points that I agree with but are ignoring my main point - you often need to be strong to live down low, and for most guys it’s hard to be strong enough without the frame to support it.

There are different ways around it, but it takes unicorn traits to do that.

Most NHL players are about equally skilled, some maybe faster, bit better hands etc but all in all they're about the same tier. Knowing that a bigger man with the same skill level should be expected to outperform the smaller player. The problem with that is it neglects to take into account the fight within the dog or their hockey IQ.

Look at Krebs and Cozens. Krebs by far has the better awareness in seeing the ice, however he lacks the discipline not to do stupid shit on a regular basis. Cozens potentially could be a superstar but is held back by his vision, he just doesn't see the ice in the way that a Mitts did so is your classic north-south C

 

[Tatanka]

Most NHL players are about equally skilled, some maybe faster, bit better hands etc but all in all they're about the same tier. Knowing that a bigger man with the same skill level should be expected to outperform the smaller player. The problem with that is it neglects to take into account the fight within the dog or their hockey IQ.

Look at Krebs and Cozens. Krebs by far has the better awareness in seeing the ice, however he lacks the discipline not to do stupid shit on a regular basis. Cozens potentially could be a superstar but is held back by his vision, he just doesn't see the ice in the way that a Mitts did so is your classic north-south C

I question whether Krebs knows which end to shoot at unless told before the period starts.

 

[Der Jaeger]

I just feel like NHL teams and people involved in the draft disagree with you on the size part. You make all good points that I agree with but are ignoring my main point - you often need to be strong to live down low, and for most guys it’s hard to be strong enough without the frame to support it.

There are different ways around it, but it takes unicorn traits to do that.

It helps to be strong to be a center. But Pettersson is a string bean. Aho isn’t big. And there are more like them, where they might have the height but not necessarily the frame and the strength.

I think teams look at big strong kids who are good skaters and put them at center thinking they’ll be a help defensively. And they aren’t wrong. Florida does it with Sam Bennett. Granato is doing it with Cozens. It’s a good way to play.

But also take a look at the downside. Cozens has been wildly inconsistent this season and a lot of that is due to what he’s being asked to do at center. I think he’s a better winger.

I do think teams see smaller players and move them to wing. I don’t necessarily think that should be a guiding principle. I’d rather have a smaller kid like Krebs at center. Who has the head for the position, than Cozens.

 

[Doug Prishpreed]

It helps to be strong to be a center. But Pettersson is a string bean. Aho isn’t big. And there are more like them, where they might have the height but not necessarily the frame and the strength.

I think teams look at big strong kids who are good skaters and put them at center thinking they’ll be a help defensively. And they aren’t wrong. Florida does it with Sam Bennett. Granato is doing it with Cozens. It’s a good way to play.

But also take a look at the downside. Cozens has been wildly inconsistent this season and a lot of that is due to what he’s being asked to do at center. I think he’s a better winger.

I do think teams see smaller players and move them to wing. I don’t necessarily think that should be a guiding principle. I’d rather have a smaller kid like Krebs at center. Who has the head for the position, than Cozens.

You’re talking about the optimal way to identify a center while I’m talking about the GMs and how they think. Kind of a different thing. GMs are very conservative and often behind the curve as a result.

Anyway, does Ostlund or Savoie have the speed and puck skill combo that Pettersson and Aho have? I haven’t watched enough of Ostlund to know but Savioe doesn’t seem to to me.

 

[Der Jaeger]

You’re talking about the optimal way to identify a center while I’m talking about the GMs and how they think. Kind of a different thing. GMs are very conservative and often behind the curve as a result.

Anyway, does Ostlund or Savoie have the speed and puck skill combo that Pettersson and Aho have? I haven’t watched enough of Ostlund to know but Savioe doesn’t seem to to me.

True.

Savoie has better speed than both Pettersson and Aho and while not as good on the puck as they are currently, he’s better than Aho was at his same age.

 

[Zman5778]

If it wasn't the 7.5M price tag for 7 more years it'd be worth considering. But....if the tank is already empty and it's just going to get smaller every year from here on out....yeah no thanks.

I'm not sure I'm even interested in Coots at 50%.

 

[TehDoak]

With a team full of problems the guy who will lead the team in goals and come close to his third consecutive 30 goal season is one of the lesser problems we have

The issue with the team isn't talent level.

It's inconsistent effort, defensive zone coverage, and just general softness.

Which player on our team embodies these "qualities"?

 

[Old Navy Goat]

The issue with the team isn't talent level.

It's inconsistent effort, defensive zone coverage, and just general softness.

Which player on our team embodies these "qualities"?

9/10 of the roster have inconsistent effort, lack proper d zone coverage and are soft. You're better off asking who doesn't show those qualities

 

[StrompTroller]

Don't worry guys we will bring back tyson jost and next years roster will be complete....

 

[Doug Prishpreed]

9/10 of the roster have inconsistent effort, lack proper d zone coverage and are soft. You're better off asking who doesn't show those qualities

The kids will probably get there eventually, in several more years. Some of them, at least. The problem is that the team is built to win in like 4 more years.

 

[toddkaz]

Baffling = Adams for 2 years has been trying to trade Olofsson and we are trying to make the playoffs and there he is on the roster.

So much dead weight on this roster.

coaching and management is incompetent.

(No I am not blaming Olofsson for missing the playoffs. I am blaming Adams and his inability to turn the page on players that need to go. Olofsson was probably tradable last offseason but Adams sat on his hands)

 

[debaser66]

How do you guys think the trade Mitts-Braym has worked out so far?
I personnaly cannot phantom how they are going to fix the center issue now so that they are competitive next year.
Especially with the top2 centers now are underperforming & missing a strong 2way element & that kind of style that actually wins you games.
Ufa will probably cost them more than resigning Mitts, are there even any options available?
Is the only route to go for a trade & who would you target?

 

[Sabresfansince1980]

How do you guys think the trade Mitts-Braym has worked out so far?
I personnaly cannot phantom how they are going to fix the center issue now so that they are competitive next year.
Especially with the top2 centers now are underperforming & missing a strong 2way element & that kind of style that actually wins you games.
Ufa will probably cost them more than resigning Mitts, are there even any options available?
Is the only route to go for a trade & who would you target?

Byram is a great talent, and he'll probably make the need for a steady RHD a lot less of an issue. I want to see more of his defensive game but if he can slot other guys down we're better than what we were before...on defense.

That said, KA just blew a giant hole into the FW group and I don't think most of the fan base realizes how solid Mittelstadt is/will be and how flawed Thompson and Cozens are in comparison. Krebs isn't even a thought to me. He's a guy that can top out as filler up the line-up during injuries. He can be a fine 4C after cutting down his stupid plays. There is no trade option that will work out unless it's Power going out, and even then KA won't go that big anyway. He's basically already hinted at his basic plan, so apparently he believes Krebs is a 3C. Nobody in UFA will make up for losing Mitts...a vet 4C at best.

The team can still improve enough to make the playoffs, but with that center group we can forget being a SC contender. Ostlund is going to have to fill the void but even if he hits potential, that's 3-4 years down the road.

 

[Beerz]

Good teams are coached by Drill Sargeants ...

The Sabres are coached by a University DEIB officer

 

[SabresFanNorthPortFL]

Honestly, it wouldn’t surprise me that Dahlin will be the next trade.

Behind the scenes, he’s frustrated and wants out. $11 mil out, #1 center in. Push the timeline out so Power n Byram mature.

I hate being a Sabres fan that I could even believe it could be a possibility….ugh

 

[joshjull]

He's still the most natural center in the entire organization though, Krebs and Mitts included. His calling card has always been that 360° centerman IQ. He was a top 3 center in the whole WJC, dominating his peers for long stretches.

I think most agree that effective size is the only concern about him becoming an NHL center. How many 5'11 180 centers are there? 180 does feel slight, but there's certainly precedent. And despite our pathologized worries about size, the league continues to get less physical and more skating-based. I know we're a young team, but our guys look more like soccer players shirtless in the locker room.

Re: fit with the Sabres, I don't see this org as being so rich in centers that a player like Ostlund gets moved off the position by any factors external to his own game.

I don’t get this response.

I was calling into question the idea that Bakes definitively called Ostlund a winger. All I’ve heard from him on the topic is he likely ends up be a winger, not that he is one. His rationale for that was about the NHL roster at the time, not Ostlund’s ability to play center. But as I said previously, that was before Mitts got traded.

I personally haven’t said anything about him being a wing or center. I don’t really have an opinion on it yet. I’ll wait to watch him play in North America first.

 

[elchud]

Is Pageau a good option until Ostlund is ready?

 

[Tatanka]

Is Pageau a good option until Ostlund is ready?

He has looked like there isn’t much left in the tank. He maybe injured, or the deployment isn’t right, but he has looked pedestrian at best for much of the year.

 

[elchud]

It's really disappointing that we haven't been able to draft/develop a Trent Frederic type. Every 5 years or so we should be drafting a guy in the 2nd or 3rd who is a potential 3C/4C

 

[kirby11]

9/10 of the roster have inconsistent effort, lack proper d zone coverage and are soft. You're better off asking who doesn't show those qualities

Yeah, in terms of guys who give their all consistently, are at least ok in the d-zone, and don't shy away from physical play, I think the list goes as such.

Forwards: Girgensons, Greenway, Benson (it's both bad and great that the 18 year old kid has created a highlight reel of teach tape in terms of forechecking, puck pursuit, and tenacity that other guys on the team should review)

Defensemen: Dahlin (for the most part; sometimes tries to get by on talent), Joker (in terms of generally providing decent d-zone coverage this year), Byram (jury's out on him to a certain extent but I mostly like what I've seen so far at both ends)

Way too many of their top guys just float in their own end and get outhustled/outworked too often

 

[elchud]

So it looks like they're OK with Krebs as the 3rd center. And adding Byram means they're not after a top 4 D.

It's simply unacceptable to not sign UPL to a 4 year deal, 4M per would be fine. That's gotta be top of the list for the offseason.

I'd resign Joker. RyJo and Bryson as 7/8 D.

Kulich or Savoie on the team. Not both.

That leaves 4C, 4RW.

I'm not sure what big hockey trades there are. All these proposals where we aren't moving out salary...I'm not seeing it.

 

[HOOats]

So it looks like they're OK with Krebs as the 3rd center. And adding Byram means they're not after a top 4 D.

It's simply unacceptable to not sign UPL to a 4 year deal, 4M per would be fine. That's gotta be top of the list for the offseason.

I'd resign Joker. RyJo and Bryson as 7/8 D.

Kulich or Savoie on the team. Not both.

That leaves 4C, 4RW.

I'm not sure what big hockey trades there are. All these proposals where we aren't moving out salary...I'm not seeing it.

Krebs as 3C is a potential disaster imo. He's not up for it. He plays an ineffectual, immature game. He's the opposite type of player we need as our bottom six centers. He's the type of player who can hang around on bad teams as he develops, but won't be useful to better teams until then (if it even happens).

If we want to be more competitive, we can't break in all this skilled youth while also having "grinder" youth.

 

[StrompTroller]

It's really disappointing that we haven't been able to draft/develop a Trent Frederic type. Every 5 years or so we should be drafting a guy in the 2nd or 3rd who is a potential 3C/4C

who needs that when you have Kisakov?!

 

[Reddawg]

I question whether Krebs knows which end to shoot at unless told before the period starts.

That helps explain why Dan is always letting us know which direction the guys wearing our jerseys are skating.

 

[Matt Ress]

Baffling = Adams for 2 years has been trying to trade Olofsson and we are trying to make the playoffs and there he is on the roster.

So much dead weight on this roster.

coaching and management is incompetent.

(No I am not blaming Olofsson for missing the playoffs. I am blaming Adams and his inability to turn the page on players that need to go. Olofsson was probably tradable last offseason but Adams sat on his hands)

The bar is so low that VO isn't even in the top 5 of controllable issues