Roster Thread (2023-2024 Season)

[Push Dr Tracksuit]

Yep. Just ask the Leafs.

Run and gun can get you into the playoffs......but won't win you much when you ge

Ya, it’s the run and gun system.

Not roster construction, cap management, keefe, terrible goaltending, Boston and Tampa, miserable bottom 6 pick ups, bad injuries.

 

[HogtownSabresfan]

Last night I counted 5x where a sabre was standing on the opposing blue line while possession was being contested in ours. Start there.

Everyone is on to our game plan. It's stale

Let's make the playoffs for the first time since Obama's first term and then we can worry about it.

No joke. We are worried about winning the cup and can't even get in. That's Terry Pegula thinking.

 

[Sabre the Win]

I think you may be missing the point. It does not matter what the team currently has in goal (which seems to be close to average league goaltending playing behind a bad defense that is still night and day better than last seasons defensive mess).

What we do know from league history is that goalies that are average behind competent defenses almost universally turn into below average ECHL goalies on teams that do not do their job defensively. That is a tried and true fact.

The defense cap structure isn't great, but the defensive lapses on the D are more than often caused by them being outnumbered down low due to the forwards missing reads.

I think if the forward core had more defensive discipline, the defensemen would look a whole lot better and there wouldn't be as much concern.

It really does tho, you can put a goalie like Vanecek behind the most elite defensemen of all time and he will still find ways to bleed goals.

I get what you are saying about the defense but even the best defensive defensemen can't make every save for the goalie.

 

[toddkaz]

Everyone is on to our game plan. It's stale



No joke. We are worried about winning the cup and can't even get in. That's Terry Pegula thinking.

The coach claims he can't teach them how to play a system because they either don't get it or wont listen.

How many coaches in the league keep their job after missing the playoffs 3 years in a rowand give up on trying to teach defense because they wont listen to him.

Granato - The players are too stupid to learn the defensive system so we will just not do it.

Tell me that is not what he is doing?

But I am told Granato is a good coach.

 

[Irie]

It really does tho, you can put a goalie like Vanecek behind the most elite defensemen of all time and he will still find ways to bleed goals.

I get what you are saying about the defense but even the best defensive defensemen can't make every save for the goalie.

True, the goaltenders have to be capable, but every goalie in the NHL has been above average skillwise in some league somewhere. We are generally talking about the best 75-80 athletes at their position in the world.

I've said it so many times before and I will say it again, "Goaltending at the NHL level is 95% mental". Goalies that are annoyed and frustrated with their D not doing their jobs tend to have their skills fall apart.

It's not unlike football QBs. Put an average NFL QB behind the best pass defending offensive line and you get an allpro. Trade that same QB to a below average blocking team and that same QB is out of the league in 2-3 years. Goaltending is very similar in a sense. Put an average goalie behind a Ken HItchcock defense/shell system, and most of them have career years. Move a goalie to a team that doesn't defend well in their own zone and gives up breakaways, and they are in the AHL in a season and a half.

 

[KeyserSoze81]

The coach claims he can't teach them how to play a system because they either don't get it or wont listen.

But I am told Granato is a good coach.

I don't think that anyone here is arguing that Granato is a good coach. He provided a steady voice to change the culture of the team after Krueger. He clearly helped a number of players achieve higher levels of play. He provided value over the last two years.

I think his fatal mistake is not hiring a more experienced staff. He is a first time NHL head coach, and his most experienced assistant coach is Marty Wilford, who spent 3 seasons as an assistant with Anaheim.

Marty Wilford: 3 years assistant coach in Anaheim, 7 years assistant in AHL​

Jason Christie: ~20 years of ECHL Head Coach experience​

Mike Bales: 5 years as goalie coach for Penguins and Hurricanes​

Matt Ellis: Rookie coach for Sabres​

For someone who is struggling to implement an NHL quality system, I don't see how they can come up with solutions internally. The team is not executing what the coaches are drawing up, and I am not confident that the roster, as constructed, will ever be sound defensively. There is a lot going wrong, and a lot of inexperience in the front office, behind the bench, and on the ice.

 

[toddkaz]

I don't think that anyone here is arguing that Granato is a good coach. He provided a steady voice to change the culture of the team after Krueger. He clearly helped a number of players achieve higher levels of play. He provided value over the last two years.

I think his fatal mistake is not hiring a more experienced staff. He is a first time NHL head coach, and his most experienced assistant coach is Marty Wilford, who spent 3 seasons as an assistant with Anaheim.

Marty Wilford: 3 years assistant coach in Anaheim, 7 years assistant in AHL​

Jason Christie: ~20 years of ECHL Head Coach experience​

Mike Bales: 5 years as goalie coach for Penguins and Hurricanes​

Matt Ellis: Rookie coach for Sabres​

For someone who is struggling to implement an NHL quality system, I don't see how they can come up with solutions internally. The team is not executing what the coaches are drawing up, and I am not confident that the roster, as constructed, will ever be sound defensively. There is a lot going wrong, and a lot of inexperience in the front office, behind the bench, and on the ice.

wasn't the culture under Kreuger also all about good vibes?

Many people here claim he is a good coach just go look at the coach thread.

Some even think he can win the cup here. Heck you are even making excuses for Granato not being able to run a defensive system

 

[OkimLom]

I don't think that anyone here is arguing that Granato is a good coach. He provided a steady voice to change the culture of the team after Krueger. He clearly helped a number of players achieve higher levels of play. He provided value over the last two years.

I think his fatal mistake is not hiring a more experienced staff. He is a first time NHL head coach, and his most experienced assistant coach is Marty Wilford, who spent 3 seasons as an assistant with Anaheim.

Marty Wilford: 3 years assistant coach in Anaheim, 7 years assistant in AHL​

Jason Christie: ~20 years of ECHL Head Coach experience​

Mike Bales: 5 years as goalie coach for Penguins and Hurricanes​

Matt Ellis: Rookie coach for Sabres​

For someone who is struggling to implement an NHL quality system, I don't see how they can come up with solutions internally. The team is not executing what the coaches are drawing up, and I am not confident that the roster, as constructed, will ever be sound defensively. There is a lot going wrong, and a lot of inexperience in the front office, behind the bench, and on the ice.

Granato was the right man for what the organization. Where culture needed to be corrected over standings/records, he did what had to do. But now the organization needs a veteran presence to help instill quality hockey structure and effort layered onto that culture.

IMO, you don't need to fire Granato. Keep him on the staff if he's that important to the guys, and bring in a guy that can bring that part of the game. Hell, you're already trying to recreate the wheel by not learning of experience and it's impact on coaching and management. May as well throw out tradition. Honestly, bring in Babcock for the structure and accountability. Let the two men focus on their strengths and get away from their weaknesses. Maybe either man can learn a thing or two from one another.

 

[TehDoak]

wasn't the culture under Kreuger also all about good vibes?

Many people here claim he is a good coach just go look at the coach thread.

Some even think he can win the cup here. Heck you are even making excuses for Granato not being able to run a defensive system

Krueger talked about accountability a ton. And sometimes he just talked and talked and talked and said nothing at all.

In the end, winning changes culture. You can make it about the culture, sure, make everyone best friends. But unless there is winning, the changes will never stick. Losing absolutely destroys any good culture.

 

[Mattilaus]

Granato was the right man for what the organization. Where culture needed to be corrected over standings/records, he did what had to do. But now the organization needs a veteran presence to help instill quality hockey structure and effort layered onto that culture.

IMO, you don't need to fire Granato. Keep him on the staff if he's that important to the guys, and bring in a guy that can bring that part of the game. Hell, you're already trying to recreate the wheel by not learning of experience and it's impact on coaching and management. May as well throw out tradition. Honestly, bring in Babcock for the structure and accountability. Let the two men focus on their strengths and get away from their weaknesses. Maybe either man can learn a thing or two from one another.

While this is a good idea in theory (i don't like babcock however), has there ever been a situation where a coach was relieved of his head coaching duties but stayed on with the organization in a reduced role? Not asking this as a gotcha or anything, I literally do not know. I feel like coaches move on after being let go from the head coaching gig.

 

[OkimLom]

While this is a good idea in theory (i don't like babcock however), has there ever been a situation where a coach was relieved of his head coaching duties but stayed on with the organization in a reduced role? Not asking this as a gotcha or anything, I literally do not know. I feel like coaches move on after being let go from the head coaching gig.

Most likely not, regarding about an existing coach having their role reduced for bench services. Just throwing out an outside the box thinking regarding the Coaching roles because why the heck not, hahaha.

 

[Ehran]

With the Sabres over the roster limit and Girgensons close to being back, plus the roster freeze ending tomorrow, I'm curious to see what transactions this team makes over the next 12 to 36 hours.

 

[StrompTroller]

With the Sabres over the roster limit and Girgensons close to being back, plus the roster freeze ending tomorrow, I'm curious to see what transactions this team makes over the next 12 to 36 hours.

stawp it! We are having the same coaching debate for the 17,000 time in the last 2 months!

 

[KeyserSoze81]

stawp it! We are having the same coaching debate for the 17,000 time in the last 2 months!

Listen, its either coaching in the roster thread, or lasagna in the Kulich thread. And I'm enjoying both conversations. Its tough to separate the roster issues from coaching, and Kulich's jawline pretty much invites masticating discussions.

With the Sabres over the roster limit and Girgensons close to being back, plus the roster freeze ending tomorrow, I'm curious to see what transactions this team makes over the next 12 to 36 hours.

A Tyson Jost waiving would make me quite happy.

 

[Sabresfansince1980]

With the Sabres over the roster limit and Girgensons close to being back, plus the roster freeze ending tomorrow, I'm curious to see what transactions this team makes over the next 12 to 36 hours.

I was going to reply about the options to waive or trade like Jost, Krebs, Robinson, Comrie... then I remembered how it doesn't matter because they're missing the playoffs anyway. #eeyore.

 

[Djp]

True, the goaltenders have to be capable, but every goalie in the NHL has been above average skillwise in some league somewhere. We are generally talking about the best 75-80 athletes at their position in the world.

I've said it so many times before and I will say it again, "Goaltending at the NHL level is 95% mental". Goalies that are annoyed and frustrated with their D not doing their jobs tend to have their skills fall apart.

It's not unlike football QBs. Put an average NFL QB behind the best pass defending offensive line and you get an allpro. Trade that same QB to a below average blocking team and that same QB is out of the league in 2-3 years. Goaltending is very similar in a sense. Put an average goalie behind a Ken HItchcock defense/shell system, and most of them have career years. Move a goalie to a team that doesn't defend well in their own zone and gives up breakaways, and they are in the AHL in a season and a half. Football is far more driven by system fit.

football is far more system driven or need of different types of role players. Seen too many players change teams and they were busts. Not so much in hockey.

With the Sabres over the roster limit and Girgensons close to being back, plus the roster freeze ending tomorrow, I'm curious to see what transactions this team makes over the next 12 to 36 hours.

Levi gets sent down. Robinson might have waiver exemption when he was sent down and called up earlier he has 10 games/30 days before clearing/ waivers needed.

 

[Push Dr Tracksuit]

football is far more system driven or need of different types of role players. Seen too many players change teams and they were busts. Not so much in hockey.

Levi gets sent down. Robinson might have waiver exemption when he was sent down and called up earlier he has 10 games/30 days before clearing/ waivers needed.

I would assume that if levi was going back to rochester he'd be in net for team Canada right now

 

[Chainshot]

I would assume that if levi was going back to rochester he'd be in net for team Canada right now

At the Spengler Cup?

 

[Push Dr Tracksuit]

At the Spengler Cup?

levi is much older than i thought he was

 

[Chainshot]

levi is much older than i thought he was

Turns 22 today.

 

[Ehran]

Turns 22 today.

Jeez, he's technically one of the elders on the roster now!

 

[MarkusKetterer]

Listen, its either coaching in the roster thread, or lasagna in the Kulich thread. And I'm enjoying both conversations. Its tough to separate the roster issues from coaching, and Kulich's jawline pretty much invites masticating discussions.


A Tyson Jost waiving would make me quite happy.

It ties in to the cheese sauce conversation in the Kulich thread that happened last year

 

[dortt]

I would assume that if levi was going back to rochester he'd be in net for team Canada right now

Levi's not going down

Comrie to waivers is far more likely. He is worth less than zero

If Comrie had a future here, he'd have been playing some of the games recently

 

[Gras]

Levi's not going down

Comrie to waivers is far more likely. He is worth less than zero

If Comrie had a future here, he'd have been playing some of the games recently

If he doesnt clear then Ticker becomes the #3 or #2 if Levi falters.

 

[toddkaz]

Kid is a stud. Give him another year or two.