Roster Speculation 2015-16 Pt. III

[Zip15]

I think Anders Lindbäck should get a shot with a better team in front of him, he really did not do that bad even with the tire fire in front of him last season..

Plus the guy said he wants to play here,hell thats half the battle there..

The threshold requirement for a Lindback return would be re-hiring Irbe. If Irbe is gone, I'm not interested. Second, they'd need to move Chad Johnson or have a training camp competition the loser of which gets sent to Rochester (assuming Lieuwen is done, which for the sake of his long-term health and well-being I hope is the case).

I am against using that NYI 2nd for middle of the road goalies and suspects. I have no faith or interest in Lack. I'd rather go into the UFA market for a short term solution or attempt to acquire an RFA with a real ceiling than grab hand me downs.

Who is an RFA goaltender with a "real ceiling" that will cost only 51st overall or less? Gibson would cost a 1st. Maybe Lehner? He has a ceiling but a very low floor. Is Kuemper a hand-me-down, or just a guy who ended up losing his job to a Vezina candidate who his team now wants to re-sign to a long-term deal?

 

[Zip15]

Travis Yost seems to think we'd be interested in Erik Condra as a bottom-6 (likely 4th line) RW if Garrioch is correct that Ottawa will let him go to UFA. I would assume there may be some interest from Tim, who'd know him from their Bingo days. Seeing as how we only have one natural RW on the roster who is healthy--who the heck knows about McCormick's blood clot issues, which is obviously a severe issue (see Pascal Dupuis)--he shouldn't be discounted. He probably wouldn't be too expensive, either.

 

[couture23]

Don't mess with Bill's hot takes

 

[N.Y. Orangeman]

The threshold requirement for a Lindback return would be re-hiring Irbe. If Irbe is gone, I'm not interested. Second, they'd need to move Chad Johnson or have a training camp competition the loser of which gets sent to Rochester (assuming Lieuwen is done, which for the sake of his long-term health and well-being I hope is the case).



Who is an RFA goaltender with a "real ceiling" that will cost only 51st overall or less? Gibson would cost a 1st. Maybe Lehner? He has a ceiling but a very low floor. Is Kuemper a hand-me-down, or just a guy who ended up losing his job to a Vezina candidate who his team now wants to re-sign to a long-term deal?

Jones

 

[joshjull]

Not sure Murray would even be interested in Oshie if he is sticking to his 24yrs old and younger approach.

 

[Zip15]

Jones

I think Jones is pretty good, but I don't think he's discernibly better than Lack. Younger, yes. But I'm not sure he's better. And I don't think Jones has an extremely high ceiling.

 

[Jame]

I think Jones is pretty good, but I don't think he's discernibly better than Lack. Younger, yes. But I'm not sure he's better. And I don't think Jones has an extremely high ceiling.

goalies... it's good to have some... but it doesn't really matter which ones

 

[sabrebuild]

I fail to understand why we would trade assets for goalies when an equivalent goalie is available in fa. Sign neuvy, don't waste a pick.

 

[Jame]

I fail to understand why we would trade assets for goalies when an equivalent goalie is available in fa. Sign neuvy, don't waste a pick.

yea, i loath the idea of giving up anything of usable value for a guy like Eddie Lack... we have Chad Johnson... what's the difference? They are roughly the same age and size. Both were fringe AHLers before getting a chance behind a good team (Chad went 17-4, with a .925 / 2.10 in Boston)

 

[Zip15]

I fail to understand why we would trade assets for goalies when an equivalent goalie is available in fa. Sign neuvy, don't waste a pick.

I suppose the dispute lies in your premise. It's possible that Murray does not view Neuvirth as equal to some of the guys who may be available via trade. In fact, it sounds like he had no intention whatsoever of making any attempt at re-signing Neuvy based on his comments post-Neuvirth trade with the Isles. I think Neuvirth could be a low-end starter in this league, but given his relative lack of upside and his injury history, I'd look elsewhere.

If the prices are too high on trade candidates, I'd prefer Niemi on a three-year deal. At least you know he'll be more available than Neuvirth.

 

[jc17]

Travis Yost seems to think we'd be interested in Erik Condra as a bottom-6 (likely 4th line) RW if Garrioch is correct that Ottawa will let him go to UFA. I would assume there may be some interest from Tim, who'd know him from their Bingo days. Seeing as how we only have one natural RW on the roster who is healthy--who the heck knows about McCormick's blood clot issues, which is obviously a severe issue (see Pascal Dupuis)--he shouldn't be discounted. He probably wouldn't be too expensive, either.

I would definitely want Condra. I can't imagine he would break the bank and would fill a good 2nd or 3rd line role.

He has decent stats despite being given a lot of dzone starts in Ottawa.

 

[Bps21*]

Don't mess with Bill's hot takes

The 17 people that follow him should rethink their position.

 

[Sabretip]

Don't mess with Bill's hot takes

I have been on the O'Reilly bandwagon from the start because I think he's a great player - and great fit, in the mold of Peca - for what the Sabres need.

However, there is no way in this lifetime that I would consider dealing Reinhart to Colorado if that's what it takes to get O'Reilly. I hope Murray won't either.

Who is an RFA goaltender with a "real ceiling" that will cost only 51st overall or less?

Jones

Add Markstrom (6'-6", 25) and Campbell (6'-3", 23) to that list - both have the size and age Murray said he wants and both won't be the starter with their current organizations.

Not sure Murray would even be interested in Oshie if he is sticking to his 24yrs old and younger approach.

I doubt it - plus, there's something to be said for Oshie's disappearing acts in the playoffs compared to regular seasons as well as his history of sometimes marching to his own tune. My gut feeling is that Murray and Bylsma would pause before bringing in someone who they don't think would be a good influence on the younger players.

Travis Yost seems to think we'd be interested in Erik Condra as a bottom-6 (likely 4th line) RW if Garrioch is correct that Ottawa will let him go to UFA. I would assume there may be some interest from Tim, who'd know him from their Bingo days. Seeing as how we only have one natural RW on the roster who is healthy--who the heck knows about McCormick's blood clot issues, which is obviously a severe issue (see Pascal Dupuis)--he shouldn't be discounted. He probably wouldn't be too expensive, either.

I lobbied the idea for adding Condra a few weeks ago for those very reasons: he'll likely be cut loose from the Sens; Murray knows him well; he adds speed and plays the right side. I don't think he fits into the top 9 but as a 4th line energy guy who can pitch in on penalty-killing and offer depth, he makes some sense.

 

[mikemcburn]

I posted a couple months ago towards end of season what the lineup will look like based on the contracts we have heading into next season and prior to any FA/trades... 11 FWDs, 6 D, 1 G. This includes RFA's Grigo, Larsson, and Pysyk.

I came to a realization and commented that we dont really need to go after a big fish to insulate our roster such as ROR type trade. Simply by adding Kane and Eichel to the lineup, and if Reinhart is ready, we've become a significantly better team than the last 2 seasons. The kids have the skill and talent to play here and will be surrounded by wingers/veterans who have several seasons of NHL experience.

If Reinhart is NHL ready:

Kane-Eichel-Girgensons
Moulson-Larsson-Ennis
Foligno-Reinhart-Gionta
Deslauriers-Grigorenko-Hodgson
McCormick

If Reinhart isnt ready and gets sent to the AHL:

Kane-Eichel-Girgensons
Moulson-Larsson-Ennis
Foligno-Grigorenko-Gionta
Desluariers-XXX-Hodgson
McCormick

Then on defense, depending on if they send Zads down to AHL:

XXX-Bogo
Weber/Zads-Risto
Weber/Gorges-Pysyk
Weber/Gorges

XXX
Johnson

So ultimately, this leaves the following in my opinion:

1) Obviously have to figure out the goalie situation. Plenty of options between FA's and trades. I really liked Talbot from NYR this year. Im not a Lehner fan at all. Wouldnt mind Niemi although hes looking for probably his last NHL contract and wants to cash in at a higher clip since goalie contracts have gone up to $8M since he signed that last contract as a cup winning goalie. I support the goalies shouldnt eat up a large part of your cap viewpoint -- regardless of how much space we'll have.

2) We need a top paring LD. We've all talked about it. Im really curious what route Murray will go. I am in favor of Sekera returning via FA. Im in favor of going after a trade target by paying futures like has been talked about (Hjalmarsson, Staal, ?). Some okay but not great UFA options (Martin, Oduya).... could/would/do we want Ehrhoff to return in FA?

3) Hodgson. I dont think its absolutely necessary to move him. But if there was one trade I want Murray to make, its to turn Hodgson into something. Or maybe he could turn it around next year by connecting with Bylsma.

4) In the event that Reinhart is in AHL, we'll need a good veteran 4th line C given McCormick uncertain status. If Reinhart is ready, I'd roll with Grigo and give him a shot with Des and Hodgson in favorable O-zone matchups on the 4th line.

Ultimately, I dont think we need to go crazy with changes. Let the kids play and see how they do. I cant imagine the lineups listed being equal to or worse than the teams we've had the last 2 years.

Please, enough of the Des&Hodgson guck. Nolan tried it when he first came on as coach, and again pushed it for long stretches this year. It doesn't work. There is ZERO good that comes of a line with this wing pair.

And that's not a knock on Des for what he brings - it's just an acknowledgement that what Des and Hodgson bring do not make for a useful chemical mix. So, if you're not going to put Hodgson back into center (the only spot he's actually demonstrated capacity to produce at the top 6 over multiple seasons) then at least put him into a wing pair with a guy who actually has some offensive ability.

Otherwise, press box him from the onset to the season and be done with it. There's just no point in continuing to put any player into a position he cannot succeed - and then complaining about the fact he doesn't magically succeed.

Personally though, if Hodgson is even a Sabre come September, I'd plug him into the top 6 by definition. He's as wasted in the bottom 6 as a guy like Moulson (who has never shown a defensively sound bone in his own body). So, plug him into a role where he's proven capable and let him either make a case to keep the spot or build his trade value.

Playing Hodgson as a 4th line grinder with Des isn't going to do the Sabres any good whatsoever.

 

[Sabretip]

The threshold requirement for a Lindback return would be re-hiring Irbe. If Irbe is gone, I'm not interested. Second, they'd need to move Chad Johnson or have a training camp competition the loser of which gets sent to Rochester (assuming Lieuwen is done, which for the sake of his long-term health and well-being I hope is the case).

I totally agree with this - I think the rehab of Lindback into a decent NHL goalie began with Irbe. Without that coaching around, I could see Lindback falling back into the abyss he was in at Dallas and Tampa.

 

[flashsabre]

Just read a rumor, which is just that, a rumor, that Sabres are discussing a Hodgson for Mike Smith trade. I would make that trade. Smith is 33 and had a rough year for Arizona but is a solid keeper who had a nice tournament at the Worlds. I remember Van Boxmeer stating while he was over there that he "loves" Mike Smith. He could solidify the net for a couple of years while a young keeper is groomed. The only way to move Hodgson at this point is to take back another player a team doesn't want. This one makes sense for both teams.

 

[Sabretip]

Personally though, if Hodgson is even a Sabre come September, I'd plug him into the top 6 by definition. He's as wasted in the bottom 6 as a guy like Moulson (who has never shown a defensively sound bone in his own body). So, plug him into a role where he's proven capable and let him either make a case to keep the spot or build his trade value.

Playing Hodgson as a 4th line grinder with Des isn't going to do the Sabres any good whatsoever.

I would argue that playing Hodgson in the top 6 isn't going to do the Sabres any good either.

The Sabres were woefully thin at center when they traded for Hodgson so Regier felt it was a worthy addition. Since then, Grigorenko, Girgensons, Reinhart were drafted with Eichel set to join them, while Larsson was traded for. What was once a void for Hodgson to fill is now a logjam.

And, while Hodgson did post decent numbers last season, they still don't compensate for his lackadaisical defensive play or perimeter style of play, both of which don't meet Murray's M.O.

Bottom line is that there is no benefit to reserving a roster spot for Hodgson anywhere in the top 12 forward spots. Murray's better off just trying to get something for him, and failing that, at least get rid of the contract's cap hit.

 

[Woodhouse]

Just read a rumor, which is just that, a rumor, that Sabres are discussing a Hodgson for Mike Smith trade. I would make that trade. Smith is 33 and had a rough year for Arizona but is a solid keeper who had a nice tournament at the Worlds. I remember Van Boxmeer stating while he was over there that he "loves" Mike Smith. He could solidify the net for a couple of years while a young keeper is groomed. The only way to move Hodgson at this point is to take back another player a team doesn't want. This one makes sense for both teams.

Please stop referencing anonymous Twitter insiders. They're not a recognized rumor source.

 

[Sabretip]

Just read a rumor, which is just that, a rumor, that Sabres are discussing a Hodgson for Mike Smith trade.

Sounds like a theory floated on Hockeybuzz by someone who isn't paying attention to what the GM of a team has repeatedly said of his criteria for acquiring players. If Murray wants an over-30 goalie, he could just sign Niemi in free agency.

The only way to move Hodgson at this point is to take back another player a team doesn't want.

I find it hard to believe that Regier couldn't convince Maloney to send a draft pick - even if it's a 4th or 5th rounder - to add a young center to their roster. The Coyotes are rebuilding and woefully thin at the center position. Likewise, if Murray tested the waters and couldn't trade Hodgson for a player/contract he wanted, I'd think he'd prefer a low draft pick over absorbing another big contract or buying Hodgson out.

 

[Jacob582]

Just read a rumor, which is just that, a rumor, that Sabres are discussing a Hodgson for Mike Smith trade. I would make that trade. Smith is 33 and had a rough year for Arizona but is a solid keeper who had a nice tournament at the Worlds. I remember Van Boxmeer stating while he was over there that he "loves" Mike Smith. He could solidify the net for a couple of years while a young keeper is groomed. The only way to move Hodgson at this point is to take back another player a team doesn't want. This one makes sense for both teams.

Hodgson for Smith....I can live with that......what, Murray threw in a 3rd rounder too?.....I'm not sure I like that trade at all.

******

Can we send them Chadd Johnson too?

Mike Smith has four years left on his contract.

Are the Coyotes planning to tank another season? Seems like Tippet would have left if that's the case.

 

[mikemcburn]

I would argue that playing Hodgson in the top 6 isn't going to do the Sabres any good either.

The Sabres were woefully thin at center when they traded for Hodgson so Regier felt it was a worthy addition. Since then, Grigorenko, Girgensons, Reinhart were drafted with Eichel set to join them, while Larsson was traded for. What was once a void for Hodgson to fill is now a logjam.

And, while Hodgson did post decent numbers last season, they still don't compensate for his lackadaisical defensive play or perimeter style of play, both of which don't meet Murray's M.O.

Bottom line is that there is no benefit to reserving a roster spot for Hodgson anywhere in the top 12 forward spots. Murray's better off just trying to get something for him, and failing that, at least get rid of the contract's cap hit.

Fundamentally disagree.

First off, the consensus seems to be that there's a top 6 wing spot open anyway. So (and again, this presumes that Hodgson is even on the team come September), plugging him in there shouldn't be a hardship that costs anyone anything. Especially if the idea isn't just to drop ship two rookies (Eitchel/Reinhart) into the top 6 mix or give the same spots to unproven kids ala Larrson and Grigorenko.

Doesn't do any of Eitchel, Reinhart, Larrson or Grigorenko any harm to let them spend a few months earning up the roster. Some even argue that drop shipping rookies into top spots can potentially harm their natural development (see: Hodgson drafted 10th overall after being scouted for his solid two-way play, then drop shipped during his rookie year into a 1c spot without having had to actually transition his whole game to the NHL level - aka: earn the job).

Meanwhile, as the rookies are earning stripes, Hodgson can be there building trade value - something he just won't be able to do from a 3rd line shut down or 4th line grinder spot.

But aside from how to get the most value from Hodgson specifically...

The Sabres have sufficient depth that the 4th line doesn't need to be some sort of place just to toss whoever is left over after slotting names in and out of the top 9.

 

[Bps21*]

It does all of them harm having to play with a terrible player on their wing.

 

[Beerz]

Habs re-sign Petry. Looks like we're forced to keep Risto now.

 

[Husko]

The only way to move Hodgson at this point is to take back another player a team doesn't want.

I disagree with that. Especially to a team like Arizona. They're going to need players like Hodgson to get Matthews.

 

[Bps21*]

I disagree with that. Especially to a team like Arizona. They're going to need players like Hodgson to get Matthews.

And then what? Pay him a terrible contract for a few more years? His cheap buyout window will be closed and they'll get stuck.

I can't wait until he's bought out so that we can stop trying to force Cody Hodgson into the future plans. There's more defense of him from one poster than Hodgson has mustered against the opposition in his entire career.