Roster Speculation 2015-16 Pt. III

[Zip15]

Based on Friedman's article, it sounds like Bylsma at least cognizant of the fact that Kane may need the puck on his stick as the primary puck-handling forward on his line--shades of Vanek in some ways. If that's the case, I wonder if he tries him with Girgensons initially. If you read Coller's article, Girgensons scored goals at a nice clip at ES, but was not a setup man (only 4 primary assists at ES). That'd be a heavy, fast line. And Kane can still get run with the top guys on the PP1.

 

[Zip15]

I wonder if a guy like Darcy Kuemper pops free this summer. Based on the Wild board, it sounds like they're at least open to the possibility of moving him, especially if they sign a long-term deal with Dubnyk (which sounds likely at this point based on the reports of the big insiders). Yeo lost faith in him last year, leading to that ridiculous amount of starts in a row for Dubnyk, but all of his numbers were excellent in 2013-14. While he still has another year at a reasonable salary ($1.25m AAV) and will only be RFA next summer, I have to imagine the Wild organization is aware that playing him only 15-20 games in a backup role behind Dubnyk will not appreciate his trade value. His value may not be higher than this summer, as teams may believe this past season was an anomaly.

A few other things to consider:

-Kuemper has several of the traits that GMTM values in goaltenders, including size (6'5'') and athleticism.

-Assuming you think age is Murray's top consideration when it comes to trade targets, Kuemper aligns with that preferred age group, having just turned 25 a few weeks ago.

-Murray and Fletcher clearly have a pretty good rapport. They've consummated two trades (Moulson and Stewart) in Tim's relatively short time at the helm of the Sabres.

-The Wild may want to start replenishing their cupboard. They didn't have a 1st in 2013, and didn't have a 2nd in 2014. They don't have a 3rd in 2015, no 2nd or 3rd in 2016, and no 2nd in 2017. Unless they put one of their 1st rounders in play at the next deadline, they have little draft pick ammunition to acquire help at the 2016 or 2017 trade deadlines. Also, we've seen what happens to depth when you have a dearth of top-90 picks over the course of several drafts (see Pittsburgh's roster).

It may make sense for Minnesota to grab a 2nd for Kuemper and then find a UFA backup for Dubnyk (or just ride out Backstrom for one more season if they don't buy him out).

 

[TalkingProuder]

Whatever line Eichel plays on will be the top line. I love Girgensons but even if he is the "1st line center" teams will still worry about Eichel far more. Other NHL teams will shift their best defensive assets and lines to stop him. So to say we will shelter him by putting him on the second line is pointless. Best thing to do is give him linemates that can produce.

 

[Beerz]

I wonder if a guy like Darcy Kuemper pops free this summer. Based on the Wild board, it sounds like they're at least open to the possibility of moving him, especially if they sign a long-term deal with Dubnyk (which sounds likely at this point based on the reports of the big insiders). Yeo lost faith in him last year, leading to that ridiculous amount of starts in a row for Dubnyk, but all of his numbers were excellent in 2013-14. While he still has another year at a reasonable salary ($1.25m AAV) and will only be RFA next summer, I have to imagine the Wild organization is aware that playing him only 15-20 games in a backup role behind Dubnyk will not appreciate his trade value. His value may not be higher than this summer, as teams may believe this past season was an anomaly.

A few other things to consider:

-Kuemper has several of the traits that GMTM values in goaltenders, including size (6'5'') and athleticism.

-Assuming you think age is Murray's top consideration when it comes to trade targets, Kuemper aligns with that preferred age group, having just turned 25 a few weeks ago.

-Murray and Fletcher clearly have a pretty good rapport. They've consummated two trades (Moulson and Stewart) in Tim's relatively short time at the helm of the Sabres.

-The Wild may want to start replenishing their cupboard. They didn't have a 1st in 2013, and didn't have a 2nd in 2014. They don't have a 3rd in 2015, no 2nd or 3rd in 2016, and no 2nd in 2017. Unless they put one of their 1st rounders in play at the next deadline, they have little draft pick ammunition to acquire help at the 2016 or 2017 trade deadlines. Also, we've seen what happens to depth when you have a dearth of top-90 picks over the course of several drafts (see Pittsburgh's roster).

It may make sense for Minnesota to grab a 2nd for Kuemper and then find a UFA backup for Dubnyk (or just ride out Backstrom for one more season if they don't buy him out).

I'd be open to this... Give Minny their 2nd back.

 

[joshjull]

Whatever line Eichel plays on will be the top line. I love Girgensons but even if he is the "1st line center" teams will still worry about Eichel far more. Other NHL teams will shift their best defensive assets and lines to stop him. So to say we will shelter him by putting him on the second line is pointless. Best thing to do is give him linemates that can produce.

Eventually this will be the case but I'm doubtful it will be his first year. Obviously it will depend in how the lines shake out.

 

[joshjull]

I think there's some muddled thoughts in terms of "1st line, 2nd line, 3rd line"

Bylsma ****ing loved Staal. Staal played 19:30+ ice time a game (Crosby and Malkin both got 20+ minutes a game) from when Bylsma started as head coach.

Gotta think Girgensons is going to take that defensive heavy lifting duty over almost immediately unless we decide to get someone via UFA.

I think what we're going to see is a top heavy offensive line (Kane-Eichel-Ennis), a defensive heavy lifting line (Foligno-Girgesons-Gio/UFA/Trade), and a secondary scoring line with Moulson-Grigerenko/Larsson-UFA/Hodgson/Gionta/etc on it.

Kane would actually make more sense on the defensive line. He is a very good two way player with great speed. Kane/Girgs/xxx would be a very fast hell of a two way line taking the tough matchups. Then stick Eichel between Mouslon/Ennis

 

[Doug Prishpreed]

Kane would actually make more sense on the defensive line. He is a very good two way player with great speed. Kane/Girgs/xxx would be a very fast hell of a two way line taking the tough matchups. Then stick Eichel between Mouslon/Ennis

What about working Reinhart into the lineup using that Kane/Girgs pairing? After all, Bylsma specifically mentioned Reinhart when discussing examples of who might benefit by being paired with Girgs.

That would give you KANE/REINHART/GIRGS, where Zemgus could even start at center if necessary, while Sampson gets into the swing of things.

Then you'd keep Eichel between Ennis & Moulson, like you said, which leaves HODGSON/GRIGO or LARSSON/GIONTA for the easy minutes line. FOLGNO/LARS/DES for the 4th. Something like that?

 

[brian_griffin]

What about working Reinhart into the lineup using that Kane/Girgs pairing? After all, Bylsma specifically mentioned Reinhart when discussing examples of who might benefit by being paired with Girgs.

That would give you KANE/REINHART/GIRGS, where Zemgus could even start at center if necessary, while Sampson gets into the swing of things.

Then you'd keep Eichel between Ennis & Moulson, like you said, which leaves HODGSON/GRIGO or LARSSON/GIONTA for the easy minutes line. FOLGNO/LARS/DES for the 4th. Something like that?

I'm more "worried" about other teams taking potshots at Reinhart than I am Eichel. Your proposal has that added benefit of some beef / grit to hopefully protect Reinhart from cheapshots, etc.

Pair Reinhart with, e.g., Gionta (which has its own advantages) and I'd be concerned Samson would be steamrolled a little more often.

We'll see more in a few months... can't believe still weeks to the draft...

 

[Zman5778]

What about working Reinhart into the lineup using that Kane/Girgs pairing? After all, Bylsma specifically mentioned Reinhart when discussing examples of who might benefit by being paired with Girgs.

That would give you KANE/REINHART/GIRGS, where Zemgus could even start at center if necessary, while Sampson gets into the swing of things.

Then you'd keep Eichel between Ennis & Moulson, like you said, which leaves HODGSON/GRIGO or LARSSON/GIONTA for the easy minutes line. FOLGNO/LARS/DES for the 4th. Something like that?

I've championed a Kane/Reinhart/Girgensons line since we got Kane. I think it'd be perfect.

Moulson/Eichel/Ennis
Kane/Reinhart/Girgensons
Foligno/Larsson/Gionta


That's quite the top 9, IMO.

 

[Jame]

I've championed a Kane/Reinhart/Girgensons line since we got Kane. I think it'd be perfect.

Moulson/Eichel/Ennis
Kane/Reinhart/Girgensons
Foligno/Larsson/Gionta


That's quite the top 9, IMO.

Im with you... although, I would swap Eichel and Larsson... knowing full well, Eichel takes that spot at some point.

 

[TalkingProuder]

I'm more "worried" about other teams taking potshots at Reinhart than I am Eichel. Your proposal has that added benefit of some beef / grit to hopefully protect Reinhart from cheapshots, etc.

Pair Reinhart with, e.g., Gionta (which has its own advantages) and I'd be concerned Samson would be steamrolled a little more often.

We'll see more in a few months... can't believe still weeks to the draft...

I'm worried about both Eichel and Reinhart getting cheapshotted. Eichel got elbowed in the head by Malkin at the Worlds. Kane would benefit either one as we don't have anyone else in the top 6 to defend. Girgensons might push someone. We really need more toughness than we have. If we go the pick up a vet winger route I hope that the player can fight and defend our stars.

I also think Girgensons could fight, he has the body and demeanor. Maybe he needs to work with Rob Ray in the offseason.

 

[Zman5778]

Im with you... although, I would swap Eichel and Larsson... knowing full well, Eichel takes that spot at some point.

I'm 100% fine with that too. Shelter Eichel a little and give him protection in the form of Foligno.

I also figure with the KRG line.....Zemgus can play center while Reinhart gets comfy, then they can swap positions later in the year.

So to start the year:

Moulson/Larsson/Ennis
Kane/Girgensons/Reinhart
Foligno/Eichel/Gionta


Then to end the year:

Moulson/Eichel/Ennis
Kane/Reinhart/Girgensons
Foligno/Larsson/Gionta

 

[Sabresfansince1980]

Moulson-Eichel-Ennis...top line offense with players Eichel can feed, and feed off of.
Kane-Girgensons-Reinhart...Reinhart and Girgensons can flip at any time as needed.

Does anyone think McCormick will be able to play? If not who's the best option, Schaller, Hodgson, Grigorenko, or even Foligno? There are options, but not any good ones. That's why Rob's comment about Larsson starting at 4C might not be a bad choice.

Trading for a vet with one year under contract might be better than signing a UFA that will want a 2-4 year deal and have negative trade value after the first year. Ottawa might want to deal Legwand as a cap dump (maybe a 3rd or 4th rd pick), and one year for 3 mil might be worth it as a hassle-free answer to the 4C spot.

 

[Jame]

I'm 100% fine with that too. Shelter Eichel a little and give him protection in the form of Foligno.

I also figure with the KRG line.....Zemgus can play center while Reinhart gets comfy, then they can swap positions later in the year.

So to start the year:

Moulson/Larsson/Ennis
Kane/Girgensons/Reinhart
Foligno/Eichel/Gionta


Then to end the year:

Moulson/Eichel/Ennis
Kane/Reinhart/Girgensons
Foligno/Larsson/Gionta

whether any of these are "by the end of the year" or "next year" or "when we are contending"... doesn't really matter to me. "When the time is right, for each player" is how i look at it...

i wonder about one other transition.... bolded

Foligno needs to become a puck retrieval bull dog... and that top line could use one. While Moulson transitions down the lineup, keeps some chemistry with Larsson, and plays the veteran depth scoring role he will soon belong in.

 

[brian_griffin]

I'm worried about both Eichel and Reinhart getting cheapshotted. Eichel got elbowed in the head by Malkin at the Worlds. Kane would benefit either one as we don't have anyone else in the top 6 to defend. Girgensons might push someone. We really need more toughness than we have. If we go the pick up a vet winger route I hope that the player can fight and defend our stars.

I also think Girgensons could fight, he has the body and demeanor. Maybe he needs to work with Rob Ray in the offseason.

I've been saying the bolded (albeit softly, and periodically) for months. I'd like BUF to pick up a Hartnell-like player in size and style via trade - an upgrade from Foligno, if possible - to complement the rest of the forwards. I am not expecting anywhere near Hartnell-like production from that player, mind you, and I know those kinds of players are hard to get.

If ROR isn't pried out of Denver, I'd like to see Hodgson + used to get such an asset (depending on the value of that asset). Or even trade Foligno if a younger/upgraded replacement can be found.

Second, I'm comfortable Girgensons can play heavy when needed. However, I really don't want him doing so unless necessary. I don't want my best posession forward goaded into the box in addition to one of the young centers sitting out a couple shifts after his bell was rung.

My view: Add the right piece, don't mold what isn't the best fit.

 

[Jame]

I've been saying the bolded (albeit softly, and periodically) for months. I'd like BUF to pick up a Hartnell-like player in size and style via trade - an upgrade from Foligno, if possible - to complement the rest of the forwards. I am not expecting anywhere near Hartnell-like production from that player, mind you, and I know those kinds of players are hard to get.

If ROR isn't pried out of Denver, I'd like to see Hodgson + used to get such an asset (depending on the value of that asset). Or even trade Foligno if a younger/upgraded replacement can be found.

Second, I'm comfortable Girgensons can play heavy when needed. However, I really don't want him doing so unless necessary. I don't want my best posession forward goaded into the box in addition to one of the young centers sitting out a couple shifts after his bell was rung.

My view: Add the right piece, don't mold what isn't the best fit.

I think we need to develop Foligno in to that player... an upgrade in talent, with that type of power forward mentality... is rare, and hard to find.

If we could pry Tom Wilson out of Washington... that would be crazy awesome.'

Antoine Roussel is underrated.

 

[Matt Ress]

We've got some pretty big d men. Risto can be nasty when he needs to be. Zad should be the guy working with Ray in the off season.

 

[Dubi Doo]

I've been saying the bolded (albeit softly, and periodically) for months. I'd like BUF to pick up a Hartnell-like player in size and style via trade - an upgrade from Foligno, if possible - to complement the rest of the forwards. I am not expecting anywhere near Hartnell-like production from that player, mind you, and I know those kinds of players are hard to get.

If ROR isn't pried out of Denver, I'd like to see Hodgson + used to get such an asset (depending on the value of that asset). Or even trade Foligno if a younger/upgraded replacement can be found.

Second, I'm comfortable Girgensons can play heavy when needed. However, I really don't want him doing so unless necessary. I don't want my best posession forward goaded into the box in addition to one of the young centers sitting out a couple shifts after his bell was rung.

My view: Add the right piece, don't mold what isn't the best fit.

I've wanted Simmonds for this exact reason for a long time. The cost is likely too high, though.

 

[brian_griffin]

I think we need to develop Foligno in to that player... an upgrade in talent, with that type of power forward mentality... is rare, and hard to find.

If we could pry Tom Wilson out of Washington... that would be crazy awesome.'

Antoine Roussel is underrated.

I agree 100%. Those players are rare, but BUF needs one. Kane can't do it all, and BUF needs a less-talented complement. Maybe Foligno grows into that. Sabres should certainly try. (Stafford had flashes of it - can BUF find a 6+ year younger version of Stafford, with upside / potential.)

Tom Wilson would indeed be crazy awesome. I need to learn more about Roussel.

Problem is, no one wants to give that kind of player up...

edit: No way Philly gives up Simmonds. Another 100% ideal choice.

 

[Pads of Irbe]

I also think Girgensons could fight, he has the body and demeanor. Maybe he needs to work with Rob Ray in the offseason.

Yes, he can, kinda.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QIijd-BGoqw

 

[Sabretip]

McCormick can't even stay healthy.

Have there been any reports on his current health or injury?

He was injury prone in his first run with Buffalo and that didn't stop Murray from signing him for a second run. Like it or not, I think the reality is that McCormick will be one of the top 13 forwards next season unless he's on IR.

Thought: Grigerenko for Shaw and Raanta

That certainly has potential although it might depend on Shaw's asking price if the Hawks decide to deal him or not.

I'd really like to keep Larsson and Grigorenko, making room by dumping Hodgson somehow. If we move Grigorenko in a ROR trade though then that's another matter.

100% with you on all 3 fronts, Pax

Hey guys...when Larsson was playing short minutes on the 4th line he didn't create offense.

On the 4th line. Why are we wasting Larsson on the 4th line?

Larsson doesn't really need developmental minutes. That line would be heavy and hard with a bit of goal scoring ability.

Larsson was neither happy nor a productive contributor when he only got 8-10 minutes a game on the 4th line. He shouldn't spend another minute outside the top 9 IMO unless it's pinch-hitting for an unexpected injury during game action.

I wonder if a guy like Darcy Kuemper pops free this summer. Based on the Wild board, it sounds like they're at least open to the possibility of moving him, especially if they sign a long-term deal with Dubnyk (which sounds likely at this point based on the reports of the big insiders). Yeo lost faith in him last year, leading to that ridiculous amount of starts in a row for Dubnyk, but all of his numbers were excellent in 2013-14. While he still has another year at a reasonable salary ($1.25m AAV) and will only be RFA next summer, I have to imagine the Wild organization is aware that playing him only 15-20 games in a backup role behind Dubnyk will not appreciate his trade value. His value may not be higher than this summer, as teams may believe this past season was an anomaly.

A few other things to consider:

-Kuemper has several of the traits that GMTM values in goaltenders, including size (6'5'') and athleticism.

-Assuming you think age is Murray's top consideration when it comes to trade targets, Kuemper aligns with that preferred age group, having just turned 25 a few weeks ago.

-Murray and Fletcher clearly have a pretty good rapport. They've consummated two trades (Moulson and Stewart) in Tim's relatively short time at the helm of the Sabres.

-The Wild may want to start replenishing their cupboard. They didn't have a 1st in 2013, and didn't have a 2nd in 2014. They don't have a 3rd in 2015, no 2nd or 3rd in 2016, and no 2nd in 2017. Unless they put one of their 1st rounders in play at the next deadline, they have little draft pick ammunition to acquire help at the 2016 or 2017 trade deadlines. Also, we've seen what happens to depth when you have a dearth of top-90 picks over the course of several drafts (see Pittsburgh's roster).

It may make sense for Minnesota to grab a 2nd for Kuemper and then find a UFA backup for Dubnyk (or just ride out Backstrom for one more season if they don't buy him out).

I think you've got a great case for Kuemper being one of those "under-the-radar" types that Murray may have thought of looking at. He could even package up Johnson as the backup insurance the Wild would need once they re-sign Dubnyk and purge Backstrom/Harding from the roster.

I've championed a Kane/Reinhart/Girgensons line since we got Kane. I think it'd be perfect.

Moulson/Eichel/Ennis
Kane/Reinhart/Girgensons
Foligno/Larsson/Gionta
.

If Murray doesn't add a top 9 forward via trade - which I think he will - I'm OK with those lines or any combination thereof as long as those are the 9 forwards. I don't see Grigorenko or Hodgson as being a better fit in lieu of those 9.

If ROR isn't pried out of Denver, I'd like to see Hodgson + used to get such an asset (depending on the value of that asset). Or even trade Foligno if a younger/upgraded replacement can be found..

It will be a harder sell to accomplish after the playoffs he just had for the Ducks but if Murray's first presumed target (O'Reilly) can't be acquired, then I could see him trying to either trade for or offer sheet Silfverberg. He was one of Murray's draft picks that Ottawa reluctantly forfeited to get Ryan, and he has the size (6'-1", 200) and speed of Girgensons with similar two-way play that really came into his own when teamed with Kesler's line. He may be a lot less costly to get signed as an RFA than O'Reilly although the odds of Anaheim making him available seem slimmer.

If O'Reilly, Silfverberg and Toffoli are unattainable, then I'd piggyback onto Zip's theory on Kuemper and see if maybe a bigger package to Minnesota could lure getting Coyle back as well. All 4 are good 2-way RWs that would slide into the lineup well and give Buffalo a decent 1-2 punch on RW with Ennis.

 

[joshjull]

What about working Reinhart into the lineup using that Kane/Girgs pairing? After all, Bylsma specifically mentioned Reinhart when discussing examples of who might benefit by being paired with Girgs.

That would give you KANE/REINHART/GIRGS, where Zemgus could even start at center if necessary, while Sampson gets into the swing of things.

Then you'd keep Eichel between Ennis & Moulson, like you said, which leaves HODGSON/GRIGO or LARSSON/GIONTA for the easy minutes line. FOLGNO/LARS/DES for the 4th. Something like that?

I like that idea of a Kane/Girgs/Reinhart line with Reinhart sliding to center when ready.

 

[Jacob582]

I'm not worried about toughness on this team. Kane, Foligno and Des on three different lines who can throw them, plus add the half season that McCormick is healthy.

 

[Sabretip]

I like that idea of a Kane/Girgs/Reinhart line with Reinhart sliding to center when ready.

The only qualm I'd have with that is that Reinhart is more of a playmaker than a finisher and I think he'd be best maximized with two finishers on his wings. I love Girgensons but he isn't the best finisher of scoring chances.

Now if he were the wing on Eichel's line, with either Kane or Moulson on the other side, I suspect Eichel and the LW will handle more of the goal scoring and Girgensons can be more of the puck retrieval bulldog on the line with some added muscle.

 

[Sabretip]

I'm not worried about toughness on this team. Kane, Foligno and Des on three different lines who can throw them, plus add the half season that McCormick is healthy.

Not to mention the backend with Bogosian and Weber ready to throw them.