Roster/Rumors/Speculation/Trade Talk - 2023-24: Hotel California

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???

Miller would the team’s best forward AINEC for the next 5-7 years…
Nah no way. Barzal is better. Plus how do you know Miller will be able to keep putting up points like he has recently? I don't think he will. I am done giving big contracts to guys who already had their best seasons.

In addition to that, Miller already isn't a good defensive player, so if his offense declines over the next 2-3 years (he'll be 32-33 - just about when most players decline) we'd be stuck with yet ANOTHER bad contract.

Not interested in bringing in any more players on the back 9 of their careers. Not the way our team is currently constructed or the lack of picks and prospects . No thanks.
 
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Agree. it's time for a shift in focus. Get players whose best days are ahead of them and build from that. Don't sign players in their late 20s, early 30s to massive long term deals.
Yup. Bang on. As it is, this team already doesn't have enough young talent to push out vets as they will inevitably decline.

I mean, look at guys like Parise and Bailey. We are STILL waiting for Wahlly and Bellows to push them down the line-up. And it's not even a given that it will happen. Heck, I'm not even completely sold on Beauviller belonging in the top 6.

Adding yet another aging player just doesn't seem sustainable and could lead to big problems down the road.

Our system/pipeline just isn't strong enough.
 
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With Miller re-signing in Van they are 2M over cap, they also have to re-sign Horvat too.
What do you think of Garland for the isles? I'm not giving a 23 1st rounder.

I think he would be a good fit. Our lines look like this depending who we move.
Beau-Brazal-Parms
Lee-Nelson-Garland
Bellows/Parise-Pageau-Wally
Johnston/Martin-Casey-Clutter

Bailey
 
With Miller re-signing in Van they are 2M over cap, they also have to re-sign Horvat too.
What do you think of Garland for the isles? I'm not giving a 23 1st rounder.

I think he would be a good fit. Our lines look like this depending who we move.
Beau-Brazal-Parms
Lee-Nelson-Garland
Bellows/Parise-Pageau-Wally
Johnston/Martin-Casey-Clutter

Bailey

No matter how much some people seem to hate Bailey here, there is zero chance he is going to be an extra in that lineup.
 
No matter how much some people seem to hate Bailey here, there is zero chance he is going to be an extra in that lineup.

I get what you are saying. Just curious with that lineup. Who is Bailey replacing? Wally - NO, Parise/Bellows - Maybe that's about it.
 
Yup. Bang on. As it is, this team already doesn't have enough young talent to push out vets as they will inevitably decline.

I mean, look at guys like Parise and Bailey. We are STILL waiting for Wahlly and Bellows to push them down the line-up. And it's not even a given that it will happen. Heck, I'm not even completely sold on Beauviller belonging in the top 6.

Adding yet another aging player just doesn't seem sustainable and could lead to big problems down the road.

Our system/pipeline just isn't strong enough.
Must be time to rebuild and get more 1st rounders since all the players you mentioned were, well, first rounders…
 
No matter how much some people seem to hate Bailey here, there is zero chance he is going to be an extra in that lineup.
Yes but the point is players like him should eventually be bumped down to the bottom 6 or even out of the lineup entirely. Yet here we are where Parise is out playing Beauvillier, Bailey is a main-stay in our top 6, and Bellows/Wahlly can barely crack the lineup.
 
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I get what you are saying. Just curious with that lineup. Who is Bailey replacing? Wally - NO, Parise/Bellows - Maybe that's about it.
LOL. come on really? So many people here are brainwashed think Bailey is a bad player, he is not. He has flaws but so does every single forward on our roster. It is more like who of any of those would displace Bailey. who has been a part of our core for years. With the exception of Lee and Garland unless you want to make a case for Wally and Beau for their potential not for their achievements, I could make a strong argument that none of those other wingers (not talking about the centers) would displace Bailey.

You do realize Bailey

- HIs lack of shooting has been duly noted he is not a goal scorer but has averaged .6995 PPG over the last 6 seasons ( people use .56 ppg career but that does not reflect the full picture since he was rushed then played in the bottom 6 with the Marty reasoners of the world which doesn't help when your forte is setting up a goal scorer).
- Last season was the first in last 6 years he was not in our top 3 in points and fell below .6 points (barely at .5946 PPG) after a horrible start and covid but he had 11 goals and 24 points in his last 30 games (.8 PPG, 30 goal per 82 so a strong finish) he is far from done.
- He was given an "A" by this team. That needs to be earned. We have heard numerous coaches and players single Bailey out for his contributions to the team on and off the ice. Enough that it is not lip service.
- Other players such as the 4th line showed noticeable decline. Bailey's style which is frustrating since not physical may actually allow him a longer career.
- Other than Nelson and Cizikas, I would argue he is our best defensive forward.
- I would have to pull up the stat that I had asked Eric Hornick look up and he tweeted, but over his career our record is materially better when he is in the lineup then when he is out (that point was not to say he is the driving force for us winning but rather that we are not better off when he is out. )
- He is also a .70 PPG player in the playoffs including 3 GWG.
- He has played all over the lines, jerked around by our fan base, yet you have never heard a negative thing about his character or from his mouth. He is a class act.
- yes he is an accumulator but he is 4th all time on Isles in assists and 8th in points.

He is not our worst forward, I hope guys like Wally /Bellows and Beau (still) make the big leap and Palmieri returns to prior form but until they do Bailey's job is not in jeopardy.

Side note and this is true. I was at Bandon Dunes this week about 2.5 hours south of Eugene Oregon. Some of the golfers here would be familiar with it, it is phenomenal golf. My caddy (you have to walk and use a caddy, I am not a country club guy )was asking me which NY teams I root for. When I said the Islander he immediately responded that he did not grow up a hockey fan and had to be told they were NHL players but had met Josh Bailey and John Tavares when Tavares was going into free agency. Said Bailey was one of the nicest people he had ever met, so now he follows the Islanders.

.

Yes but the point is players like him should eventually be bumped down to the bottom 6 or even out of the lineup entirely. Yet here we are where Parise is out playing Beauvillier, Bailey is a main-stay in our top 6, and Bellows/Wahlly can barely crack the lineup.
Bottom 6 yes (Bailey spent a lot of time last year with JGP and Palmieri which would be 3rd line) but there are guys like Palmieri and Parise and Martin/Johnston that may very well get bumped even before Bailey. Lee/Nelson/Bailey are not that different in age, so the stories of his demise are premature. Bailey still has a few years left before he hits that cliff (Lee's style may mean he hits that well before Bailey does, his contract is the only one we have which scares me long term).
 
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Barzal currently isn't worth the 7 mil. he's making. If he doesn't elevate his point totals, he isn't earning a raise, as far as I'm concerned.

He makes 10M in his final season which means that how much he gets for a QO. I am guessing if he isn't getting a long term deal before that he accepts the QO
 
He makes 10M in his final season which means that how much he gets for a QO. I am guessing if he isn't getting a long term deal before that he accepts the QO
They changed the rule - QO would be 7.

With the contracts that have gone down - Barzal is absolutely worth 7- now I still think he signs somewhere between 8 and 9.
 
They changed the rule - QO would be 7.

With the contracts that have gone down - Barzal is absolutely worth 7- now I still think he signs somewhere between 8 and 9.
I think that number sounds about right for what he will sign for but at the same time I would like to see some improvement in his overall game so that 8M to 9M is a bargain or at least a fair deal. Based on his performance It think it is an overpay (at least a slight overpay) but that doesn't mean that we won't offer it, as I think any UFA(s) we used that cap money on should he leave would likely need to be even more an overpay (hope that makes sense, I am half asleep as I write this lol).
 
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With Miller re-signing in Van they are 2M over cap, they also have to re-sign Horvat too.
What do you think of Garland for the isles? I'm not giving a 23 1st rounder.

I think he would be a good fit. Our lines look like this depending who we move.
Beau-Brazal-Parms
Lee-Nelson-Garland
Bellows/Parise-Pageau-Wally
Johnston/Martin-Casey-Clutter

Bailey

Agreed, souldn't be moving that 23 1st rounder.

So, how do the NYI acquire Miller?

If that, or any other such move of this nature, would be made, the team sending us the established player would simply have to be taking back a body or two up front.

We're in no position to simply move futures.
 
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Barzal currently isn't worth the 7 mil. he's making. If he doesn't elevate his point totals, he isn't earning a raise, as far as I'm concerned.

Alas, everyone in this league knows who Barzal is and what he's physically capable of... which is far more than what he produces.

We're all hoping that a new coach will at least see Barzal add 10-20 some points, but doing so will also simply require him shooting more. He creates so much space, but rarely uses the space he creates to launch pucks from his stick. Every little phase he's had where he decided to shoot more, it opened everything up for everybody.

Hopefully Lambert is successful in that department.

But Barzal's physical abilties (the skating is top 5 in the league) should have him being one of the 10-15 best paid players in the NHL with his next contract.
 
Phasing out:
Bailey has 2 years on his current contract, as does Clutterbuck. Parise has one year. For those eager to see the Holmstroms, Ratys, and Dufours of the world worked into the fold, the pathway to those spots has been laid out. And Bellows and Wahlstrom have to define themselves for this organization this season or they may need to find themselves elsewhere in the league.
 
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They changed the rule - QO would be 7.

With the contracts that have gone down - Barzal is absolutely worth 7- now I still think he signs somewhere between 8 and 9.
Barzals QO is aprox 8.4 m due to the new rule , not 7.0
 
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