Roster/Rumors/Speculation/Trade Talk - 2023-24: Hotel California

[SI]

Dekeyser or Murray would be my picks.

de Haan or Murray would be my choices

 

[LeapOnOver]

And at the end of the day...What difference does it make? Kadri/no other notable player was added this offseason so this team is not better than the one from last season.

So your Cup hopes are not riding on a more talented roster, but that hopefully all the negative things from last year (13 game road trip, settling into the new arena, Covid issues, etc) were stopping this group from winning a championship.

...Oh and you also have to hope that a first-time coach is better than a Hall of Fame one.

The defense group is more talented, offense not so much. I find it hard to imagine that around here and in the hockey world we were consider a cup contender, but after missing the playoffs with suspect extenuating circumstances, we are not anymore. Listen, I wouldn't say I'm confident about the season, but I'm definitely confident that we'll see better from those players that are fully healed, adjusted, etc. Lambert's the wild card. Lou's fooled me before, and most certainly you as well. Getting Romanov and Dobson signed the way he did means we'll have space at the deadline. I'm willing to let this season play out.

I'm disappointed, but unlike you I don't waver from elation to crushing vitriol (mostly the latter). I have a varied emotional range and right now I'm mildly disappointed.

 

[Mike C]

The defense group is more talented, offense not so much. I find it hard to imagine that around here and in the hockey world we were consider a cup contender, but after missing the playoffs with suspect extenuating circumstances, we are not anymore. Listen, I wouldn't say I'm confident about the season, but I'm definitely confident that we'll see better from those players that are fully healed, adjusted, etc. Lambert's the wild card. Lou's fooled me before, and most certainly you as well. Getting Romanov and Dobson signed the way he did means we'll have space at the deadline. I'm willing to let this season play out.

I'm disappointed, but unlike you I don't waver from elation to crushing vitriol (mostly the latter). I have a varied emotional range and right now I'm mildly disappointed.

Try to stay as close to the middle as possible.

Lou has always been the coach. Same in almost all sports. The gm doesn't just hire a coach and tell him to get get at it. The gm hires a coach, who interviews, tells the gm he's gona coach in a method that the gm wants to hear...and see happen. That's the coach hired. And then after that the coach does what the gm tells him to each day...or is replaced.. its very possible that trotz didn't do exactly what he was told by Lou ...in regard to the young forward playing time. But this was always going to be Lou coaching. One time he got rid of the middle man and made himself coach a couple weeks before the playoffs just to ensure no lost messages.

Kinda like how baseball GMs and in some cases owners call the manager in the dugout and tell him to change pitchers or pinch hit

 

[periferal]

Okay, you're on probation. Don't let it happen again.

Since I could only live ON Long Island, by saying I don't live "in" it - Isn't that 100% correct?

But Kurz' tweet was from early July. If Lou wanted to sign Kadri, when would he have been shopping Bailey if not early July? And we can believe whatever we want, but we have no actual proof Lou was ever even in on Kadri.

As Chapin and I were discussing earlier...

Other than actual trades/signings announced by Lou or the team (essentially Lou), we cannot PROVE a damn thing otherwise. Doesn't mean that you cannot connect some pretty realistic/obvious dots to what was going on behind the scenes.

 

[Mike C]

Looking forward to the season fellas. The boys will come back with collective chips on their shoulders. Come spring time, the Isles will be a playa!

Going in with optimism too double m. Season can't start soon enough. Kid started high school today. Where does the time go my brother?

 

[mm11]

Going in with optimism too double m. Season can't start soon enough. Kid started high school today. Where does the time go my brother?

Yes my boy started 8/10. Yeesh I would of been bummed starting school in August as a kid on the mean streets of leafy massapequa.

 

[Mike C]

Yes my boy started 8/10. Yeesh I would of been bummed starting school in August as a kid on the mean streets of leafy massapequa.

Day after Labor Day always in the concrete jungle of Bensonhurst

 

[LeapOnOver]

Try to stay as close to the middle as possible.


Kinda like how baseball GMs and in some cases owners call the manager in the dugout and tell him to change pitchers or pinch hit

Yeah, I mean I'm really not trying. Just thinking about how I feel. This team is virtually the same team that experts thought would vie for a Stanley Cup in 21-22. It's not like there weren't reasons that didn't happen, or can be attributed to it. LL says he believes in the group, players say they believe in the group, suddenly I'm an expert to say I don't believe in them?

My only doubt going into this season is whether Lambert will be an improvement on what Trotz brought to the table. This team was a monster in the playoffs, if they can get there, and Lambert can equal Trotz, could be another deep run. Getting there is what this team hasn't been able to prove as the two other deep runs were in seasons that weren't full.

 

[SI]

The defense group is more talented, offense not so much. I find it hard to imagine that around here and in the hockey world we were consider a cup contender, but after missing the playoffs with suspect extenuating circumstances, we are not anymore. Listen, I wouldn't say I'm confident about the season, but I'm definitely confident that we'll see better from those players that are fully healed, adjusted, etc. Lambert's the wild card. Lou's fooled me before, and most certainly you as well. Getting Romanov and Dobson signed the way he did means we'll have space at the deadline. I'm willing to let this season play out.

I'm disappointed, but unlike you I don't waver from elation to crushing vitriol (mostly the latter). I have a varied emotional range and right now I'm mildly disappointed.

I am disappointed in the offseason, but I do put the Isles in the middle of the pack in the Metro. Carolina is tops, but I rate the Isles right there with the Rangers... Caps and Pens have major health and age issues. Devils and Columbus might be surprises and the Flyers might be the worst team in the metro.

This Isles lineup has the talent to score over 250 goals and the D corp and goalie tandem should keep the goals against between 190-210. And at that goal diff. this should be a 100 pt team. Do they have enough to be better than the Canes, Lightning, & Panthers?

 

[Mike C]

Yeah, I mean I'm really not trying. Just thinking about how I feel. This team is virtually the same team that experts thought would vie for a Stanley Cup in 21-22. It's not like there weren't reasons that didn't happen, or can be attributed to it. LL says he believes in the group, players say they believe in the group, suddenly I'm an expert to say I don't believe in them?

My only doubt going into this season is whether Lambert will be an improvement on what Trotz brought to the table. This team was a monster in the playoffs, if they can get there, and Lambert can equal Trotz, could be another deep run. Getting there is what this team hasn't been able to prove as the two other deep runs were in seasons that weren't full.

I try and stay even keel. No matter what Lou does, 50 percent will agree, 50 percent will not. I like the fact that Lambert and MacLean both are ex players with championships as players and coaches. I also would have liked Barry to stay.

My suspicion is Lou probably told/asked Barry to be a little more flexible and try and let Barzal, Beau and Wally use their skill sets a little more and Barry didn't tell Lou what he felt was necessary. Hence the "new voice" but close enough to the old system. Just guesswork on my part.

Nonetheless, as big a fan as I am, I try my best to keep it in perspective. The NYI aren't really forthcoming with many ins and outs of the behind the scenes stuff. Much of what we speculate on, although fun, is really just fans being fans. It has its place but really amounts to venting, which again is fun to an extent.

When they lace 'em up I'll root like hell but when I wake up the next day, I'm over a tough loss. My 14 year old stays depressed for a bit.

Sorry for the overly lengthy reply!....always like chatting with you

 

[Throttle]

I am disappointed in the offseason, but I do put the Isles in the middle of the pack in the Metro. Carolina is tops, but I rate the Isles right there with the Rangers... Caps and Pens have major health and age issues. Devils and Columbus might be surprises and the Flyers might be the worst team in the metro.

This Isles lineup has the talent to score over 250 goals and the D corp and goalie tandem should keep the goals against between 190-210. And at that goal diff. this should be a 100 pt team. Do they have enough to be better than the Canes, Lightning, & Panthers?

While teams improved, there was not this huge swing. Canes have goalie injury issues that they didn’t solve for, Panthers made moves but D and G remain questionable and hence once you turn off the O, they are done. TB is getting older and hasn’t introduced that next gen of youth to keep things humming. PHI is awful. CLB got better, sort of, but again D and G are weak. One of the Pens/Caps is probably going to fall back. Rangers should slide back too, maybe they get a bit high on themselves and struggle. Isles just need to play their game consistently and they should be in the thick of it. Once in, I would not doubt this team no matter the matchup.

This fan would be more than happy with LAK style run short window of competing and winning or even ANA, while they only won one, they did compete for several years at a high level, even if they failed along the way. This team is not going on a CHI or DET year over year path. That’s fine.

I’m not sold the entire league turned over in one season and the atrocious defense and goaltending last playoff’s is the norm. The condensed schedule, Covid, reworked schedule, first full nhl season in 3 years, etc. all had a league-wide impact. Let’s see how permanent it is.

 

[SI]

While teams improved, there was not this huge swing. Canes have goalie injury issues that they didn’t solve for, Panthers made moves but D and G remain questionable and hence once you turn off the O, they are done. TB is getting older and hasn’t introduced that next gen of youth to keep things humming. PHI is awful. CLB got better, sort of, but again D and G are weak. One of the Pens/Caps is probably going to fall back. Rangers should slide back too, maybe they get a bit high on themselves and struggle. Isles just need to play their game consistently and they should be in the thick of it. Once in, I would not doubt this team no matter the matchup.

This fan would be more than happy with LAK style run short window of competing and winning or even ANA, while they only won one, they did compete for several years at a high level, even if they failed along the way. This team is not going on a CHI or DET year over year path. That’s fine.

I’m not sold the entire league turned over in one season and the atrocious defense and goaltending last playoff’s is the norm. The condensed schedule, Covid, reworked schedule, first full nhl season in 3 years, etc. all had a league-wide impact. Let’s see how permanent it is.

I think Pens and Caps have goaltending issues and they are older than the Isles!
Rags rely too much on Shesterkin and outside of their top 3 F and Fox they are very ordinary.
Devils have a young team, but they are small upfront.
Bluejackets can be a surprise, but in the end not good enough in net.

My prediction - Metro
Canes
Rangers
Isles
Pens
Jackets
Caps
Devils
Flyers

 

[dlawong]

Thank goodness that Lou got Dobson and Romanov both resigned. Now top 4 D is settled. Be interesting to see who else Lou can land next.

 

[BelovedIsles]

This is a bubble WC team. They'll be in the hunt for most of the season, *probably sneak in, but I don't see any kind of Cinderella runs (goalscoring). The East is better, rebuilding teams are better (internally, and via external). Lambert is an unknown. This team will struggle to consistently get that extra goal to gain a point or two. The window to capitalize on two ECFs is very small; one more offseason (I hope).

 

[dlawong]

I think Pens and Caps have goaltending issues and they are older than the Isles!
Rags rely too much on Shesterkin and outside of their top 3 F and Fox they are very ordinary.
Devils have a young team, but they are small upfront.
Bluejackets can be a surprise, but in the end not good enough in net.

My prediction - Metro
Canes
Rangers
Isles
Pens
Jackets
Caps
Devils
Flyers

Jackets should be higher, maybe past Isles. Devils also improved, will be a close race between them and Isles. Flyers will be tanking for Bedard.

 

[JKP]

So, our top 5 are making less than $20M combined. Pretty nice! I’d put those 5 up against any 5 in the league.

That plus the best goaltending tandem in the league and I think we’ll be alright.

Less worried about the Fs than many. If they get second half Palms and Zach, and everyone else plays to their norm, I think we’ll be fine.

Of course, this could just be 4 days of vacation drinking talking…

 

[Chapin Landvogt]

Extending Mayfield could be "The 4th Transaction".

Coming soon to a theater near Lou.

 

[NC 1972]

The Isles are not going to waive Ross Johnston or bury him - not happening and they are not going to give Bellows 1.2 just for him to also lose his spot to Milano or Steel. This is the team.

I imagine there will be another D man that gets signed - even if Lou mentioned they are going internally. The team does not have the depth in the AHL to not add. They need depth and to protect themselves from injury. Chara was signed after September 1st and Gustafsson was brought in as a PTO.

Isles D prospects playing in the AHL-
Bolduc, Hutton, Wotherspoon

Wilde - do not know if he plays at Bridgeport or is loaned out again

AHL vets -
Ryan Mackinnon

New Signings -
Tim Cosgrove
Vincent Sevigny

I agree with the Bellows comment, glass half full I'm thinking a lot of what this team could be hinges on the youth of this team. Looking at games played and actual minutes for guys like Bellows and Wahlstrom I feel we will see significant steps in there physical development / man strength, and overall maturity expanded roles from a new coach and greater contributions. And Barzal in a contract year along with Dobson's continued progression the addition of Romanov, and Beau with a bounce back year it should be significantly better year then last. And yes we will in all likelihood be rooted in a defensive system but Lambert witnessed first hand the teams demise last year, so surly there will be some loosing of the reins offensively.

 

[JPIsles18]

Re: speculation about what Lou might and might not have been doing these past weeks, don't forget that Lou has said repeatedly that he likes "the group". And there was also this:



So maybe Lou was calling around, and maybe he made a low offer to Kadri, or maybe not. Maybe where we are right now was his plan all along. Criticize him for that if you like, but I don't understand the definitive "he missed out on JG and Kadri because he couldn't make cap space". We don't know that.

Both are really bad situations. You either have a GM who's contracts are so bad that they can't be moved without significant sweeteners. Or you have a GM who is actually in love with this incredibly anemic forward group. It's hard to know, but imagine that Lou simply refused to move Bailey, JGP, Varlamov for anything less than what he thought was market value.

This is Lou though. Extremely loyal and very little creativity. We got the good when he hired Trotz and basically rewired the culture. Now this is the bad: building teams like it was the 90s and an overall poor talent evaluator.

 

[doublechili]

Since I could only live ON Long Island, by saying I don't live "in" it - Isn't that 100% correct?

Too much nuance. Either that or you're covering your tracks.

 

[doublechili]

As Chapin and I were discussing earlier...

Other than actual trades/signings announced by Lou or the team (essentially Lou), we cannot PROVE a damn thing otherwise. Doesn't mean that you cannot connect some pretty realistic/obvious dots to what was going on behind the scenes.

We can, and do, try to connect dots. But there are so many dots that we're really just speculating in our own heads. Then we put it on a message board.

 

[Mr Misunderstood]

At this point, do we have any interest here in Phil the Thrill?

 

[seafoam]

At this point, do we have any interest here in Phil the Thrill?

I am going to say no.

With a 23 man roster, NYI has approximately 2.8M in cap space. My guess is they would prefer to start 'accruing' cap space from that number as opposed to a <1M so that they can have as much cap space as possible at the deadline.

Next deadline's rental class has the potential to be stacked (depending on things shake out). Here are just a few names...Tyler Bertuzzi, Bo Horvat, Patrick Kane (at 50% retained), J.T. Miller, David Pastrnak, Joe Pavelski, etc.

 

[periferal]

Both are really bad situations. You either have a GM who's contracts are so bad that they can't be moved without significant sweeteners. Or you have a GM who is actually in love with this incredibly anemic forward group. It's hard to know, but imagine that Lou simply refused to move Bailey, JGP, Varlamov for anything less than what he thought was market value.

This is Lou though. Extremely loyal and very little creativity. We got the good when he hired Trotz and basically rewired the culture. Now this is the bad: building teams like it was the 90s and an overall poor talent evaluator.

Superb post. Great takes and spot on.

Too much nuance. Either that or you're covering your tracks.

There's never enough nuance.


Never.

 

[beach]

One of the best top fours in the East now signed for the next three years at 22% of the current cap.

Sorokin also a steal for two years at 4M per.

Time to go back to eating teams up alive defensively and get this team into the playoffs so GMLL can go out and acquire a high-end scorer at the deadline.

Wait, but that means Lou knows what he is doing!