Roster/Rumors/Speculation/Trade Talk - 2023-24: Hotel California

[The Real JT]

I can't wait til Sept 1 to find out what we actually did this offseason

Or what we didn’t do.

Shouldn’t be a surprise based on our inactivity at this past season’s TDL.

 

[The Real JT]

Just pay attention to trends...


Lou does NOT trade roster players unless he's forced to.


Toews, Leddy, and Ladd. Those are the only roster players Lou has traded, and in each case his hand was forced. Not to mention he's resigned every single notable UFA that hit the market since he took over.

I'm not even sure Lou would know how to rebuild even if it was the only choice.

Point is...Barzal ain't going anywhere.

I have to say I regret giving a like to that post but that’s really hard to argue with.

 

[Foppberg]

Y'all with Barzal are almost as crazy as Avs fans with MacKinnon . Barzal is the one high end offensive player the Islanders have, there's no way you trade him unless you get some fool who's willing to do a Tkachuk esque trade.

 

[MJF]

Y'all with Barzal are almost as crazy as Avs fans with MacKinnon . Barzal is the one high end offensive player the Islanders have, there's no way you trade him unless you get some fool who's willing to do a Tkachuk esque trade.

And there's always a sucker GM out there. That's why I trade Barzal. It could solve a host of other problems on our roster.

 

[IslandersFan17]

And there's always a sucker GM out there. That's why I trade Barzal. It could solve a host of other problems on our roster.

Our GM has been the sucker on the end of those deals since getting here. e.g. Toews trade

 

[The Real JT]

Y'all with Barzal are almost as crazy as Avs fans with MacKinnon . Barzal is the one high end offensive player the Islanders have, there's no way you trade him unless you get some fool who's willing to do a Tkachuk esque trade.

And there's always a sucker GM out there. That's why I trade Barzal. It could solve a host of other problems on our roster.

You’re both right.

 

[Chapin Landvogt]

I think a lot of people overlook the fact that Isles paid a lot of importance to character and personality when drafting (all most too much) and part of that leads to high character loyal players like Pelech, Pulock and Lee. Whilst they don't always end up being superstars, they were easy to resign in an era where we didn't have a real home and needed to retain talent. You see how terrible we are at signing quality UFA's (something you espoused as our plan for the offseason and I told you it wouldn't happen) so that was a pretty important factor.

I believe I espoused that we'd be adding a winger for Barzal and two LHDs - from the outside. I have not believed that the organization would be silly enough to think Salo or Aho are guys you have in the top six if you're going for the Cup. I also did not think the organization would risk going into the season with one of say Bellows or Wahlstrom being its initial answer for a spot on the wing with Barzal.

Naturally, what I espoused included additions per free agency or trades. I was long a good 70% certain that we'd be dealing our first rounder to answer one of these questions, lowering my belief in that possibility to 50/50 the day or two before the draft.

It's August 15th and YES, to date only 1/3rd of my espousement has come true.

On the other hand, we didn't really know what was truly happening last summer until roughly September 1st.

Is more coming before this team opens its camp?

In the end Snow has tons of weaknesses, and wasn't a successful GM, but surprised you are going down the 'all or nothing' 'black and white no gray' path here which seems to be a solely American trait. The core was obtained primarily by Snow, and it'd be obtuse to not give him some credit for that. It's still well with in your rights to have an opinion like that, but it's not logical, purely emotional.

Interesting.

I pride myself on attempting to analyze things with logic, reason, and understanding while remaining free of emotion as much as humanly possible.

Thus, my use of actual "results" being the critical portion of my statements on analyzing in how much I'd give Snow credit for our current success and value.

The greatest point of disagreement here is the take of those who feel that Snow's acquisition of players along the way who are part of our current success automatically gives him some portion of the credit (in some people's eyes, most of the credit) while the fact is that he SHOULD have acquired a whole lot more along the way through all the losing done in his tenure and that all those boys contributing now didn't get more than one second round appearance in 10 years with him in charge only to immediately hit the second round and then two conference finals once he was out.

The before and after results are downright damning of all he did here.

I don't write that with any emotion. I largely found myself supporting and rooting for Snow over all the years, liking many of the drafts and draftees over the course of time. I went to bat for a lot of his moves where plenty of folks in Islanderville weren't all that enthused.

But as a fan of the team, a certain amount of that support is automatically given.

Oh crap, am I letting the emotions sift in?

 

[WangMustGo]

Most of us are not saying Barzal is a part of the problem as much as Pat Lafontaine was not a problem. Some of us are saying Is we do not have a legitimate first line which is holding this team back from taking perhaps the next step. It may be all that is missing. Lou tried once again to fix that with Gaudreau like he tried with Panarin and came up empty. Blame Lou for that if you like. (I don’t)

Trading what was then a much better player than Barzal worked out because the team became better Instantly.

I will add Barzal has a contract situation coming soon.

It is suggested here that if you want to see a better team NOW like in 1-3 seasons, while the clock is ticking, then perhaps you entertain signing Kadri and trading Barzal for that elusive 30 goal scorer winger. Not sure what deals could be had, no one except perhaps Lou and only a few NHL GMs know.

Say for example Lou could sign Kadri and trade Barzal to say the Blues for Tarasenko and a top prospect, is Kadri with Tarasenko and say Wahlstrom or Beauvillier on the first line better than what we have now?

Now I am not saying that is the only potential deal out there. Tarasenko comes with his own problems. I have seen names like Connor and other names thrown out there. It is the concept that we are talking about So don’t climb all over the fact that a Taresenko deal is what I am suggesting is the only possibility, it is an example.

It seems the organization has been stuck going half way in with this first line situation for 3 seasons and would be better rebuilding which is next if they fail to win a cup the next 1-3 seasons which they have been built to do or going all in with a big change as suggested here. .

No it would not be better. Signing a 32 year old Kadri, and trading a 25 year old first line player for a 31 year old that is a year away from UFA does not solve the problem.

Build the 1st line around Barzal.

You want a first line winger than go trade our 1st+ for Kane or Miller.

Barzal-Kane/Miller is a far better combination than Kadri/Tarasenko.

People are quick to forget how good Barzal can be, and when the playoffs roll around Barzal steps up.

 

[Chapin Landvogt]

Our GM has been the sucker on the end of those deals since getting here. e.g. Toews trade

 

[Throttle]

Our GM has been the sucker on the end of those deals since getting here. e.g. Toews trade

Welcome to the never understanding context and never gonna be happy fan here.

No it would not be better. Signing a 32 year old Kadri, and trading a 25 year old first line player for a 31 year old that is a year away from UFA does not solve the problem.

Build the 1st line around Barzal.

You want a first line winger than go trade our 1st+ for Kane or Miller.

Barzal-Kane/Miller is a far better combination than Kadri/Tarasenko.

People are quick to forget how good Barzal can be, and when the playoffs roll around Barzal steps up.

How good can he be? He averages a 150 shots per season. He has 1PPG in over 125 games plus PP1 time. At some point, it’s a little less about those around you…

Did he step up vs PIT? If they relied on Barzal, they were out in the first round. However, Lou’s trade deadline acquisitions sure did.

 

[MJF]

Our GM has been the sucker on the end of those deals since getting here. e.g. Toews trade

All emotion. No thought

 

[danteipp]

I have yet to see anyone explain to me how the Isles could have possibly protected all four of Pelech, Pulock, Mayfield and Toews from expansion, with only three protection slots.

The Isles would have either had to probably give up a first to protect the fourth defenseman (either Toews or Mayfield), lose Mayfield for nothing to expansion, or pay Toews and then trade Mayfield prior to expansion and find a viable replacement for him.

And while in a vacuum Toews is better than Mayfield, Mayfield's salary allowed the Isles a lot of cap flexibility and he brings a physical element to the ice.

Upcoming expansion ultimately screwed the Isles, because otherwise Lou probably finds a way to keep Toews. Or maybe he still moves Toews but retains Leddy, which would have helped last season.

Of course in the Leddy deal, the Isles got the pick used for Raty, so we have that going for us. But I assume some will simply discount that and say the Isles got lucky.

 

[IslandersFan17]

All emotion. No thought

No thought? Do I need to spell out the ways he got taken on that deal and his Mia evaluation of the roster.

I have yet to see anyone explain to me how the Isles could have possibly protected all four of Pelech, Pulock, Mayfield and Toews from expansion, with only three protection slots.

The Isles would have either had to probably give up a first to protect the fourth defenseman (either Toews or Mayfield), lose Mayfield for nothing to expansion, or pay Toews and then trade Mayfield prior to expansion and find a viable replacement for him.

And while in a vacuum Toews is better than Mayfield, Mayfield's salary allowed the Isles a lot of cap flexibility and he brings a physical element to the ice.

Upcoming expansion ultimately screwed the Isles, because otherwise Lou probably finds a way to keep Toews. Or maybe he still moves Toews but retains Leddy, which would have helped last season.

Of course in the Leddy deal, the Isles got the pick used for Raty, so we have that going for us. But I assume some will simply discount that and say the Isles got lucky.

The expansion draft wasn’t until a year after the deal was made, I’ll cross that bridge when I come to it, not give up a homegrown, up and coming player who was absolutely worth more than two seconds

Solid contribution, could have just ignored the post all together, but the emoji was a far better route to take.

 

[PK Cronin]

No thought? Do I need to spell out the ways he got taken on that deal and his Mia evaluation of the roster.


The expansion draft wasn’t until a year after the deal was made, I’ll cross that bridge when I come to it, not give up a homegrown, up and coming player who was absolutely worth more than two seconds


Solid contribution, could have just ignored the post all together, but the emoji was a far better route to take.

It's been beaten to death, if you still don't understand why Toews had to be moved that's on you. Flat cap, arbitration, the looming expansion draft...but sure, you would've navigated it better.

 

[The Real JT]

I have yet to see anyone explain to me how the Isles could have possibly protected all four of Pelech, Pulock, Mayfield and Toews from expansion, with only three protection slots.

The Isles would have either had to probably give up a first to protect the fourth defenseman (either Toews or Mayfield), lose Mayfield for nothing to expansion, or pay Toews and then trade Mayfield prior to expansion and find a viable replacement for him.

And while in a vacuum Toews is better than Mayfield, Mayfield's salary allowed the Isles a lot of cap flexibility and he brings a physical element to the ice.

Upcoming expansion ultimately screwed the Isles, because otherwise Lou probably finds a way to keep Toews. Or maybe he still moves Toews but retains Leddy, which would have helped last season.

Of course in the Leddy deal, the Isles got the pick used for Raty, so we have that going for us. But I assume some will simply discount that and say the Isles got lucky.

All good points and I agree with you but…you have to admit it was quite fortunate that we were able to draft Raty. He was a well regarded falling star at a position of need. It’s also fair to give Lou credit because he could have pulled an Ishakov.

If there’s blame at all to go around you could give some to both Snow and Lou regarding the loss of a valuable Dman in the expansion draft. Perhaps Snow could’ve anticipated their dilemma a year earlier and considered a 2 for 1 trade. Not that any of us geniuses thought of that at the time.

 

[IslandersFan17]

It's been beaten to death, if you still don't understand why Toews had to be moved that's on you. Flat cap, arbitration, the looming expansion draft...but sure, you would've navigated it better.

I’m not a professional GM. The whole “you would have navigated it better” line is weak AF. This is what this man gets paid to do, he’s very clearly supposed to be better at his job than I.

Admitting Sakic was the better GM of the two when the move was made, isn’t some newfound or outlandish logic. It’s real, Lou got absolutely worked on that deal.

 

[PK Cronin]

I’m not a professional GM. The whole “you would have navigated it better” line is weak AF. This is what this man gets paid to do, he’s very clearly supposed to be better at his job than I.

You said, "I’ll cross that bridge when I come to it, not give up a homegrown, up and coming player who was absolutely worth more than two seconds" which implies you think you'd have done a better job.

Admitting Sakic was the better GM of the two when the move was made, isn’t some newfound or outlandish logic. It’s real, Lou got absolutely worked on that deal.

He was the better GM? How? You're just doing the ultimate head in sand move and ignoring anything but the result. There's a limit to what a GM can do in that situation but you don't care because "results!" which is the most myopic way of looking at individual deals, especially ones that have so many unpredictable events surrounding it.

Sakic made a good deal, he was able to make a good deal because of the situation his team was in financially. He didn't outwit Lamoriello or something, he benefitted from a global catastrophe by chance.

Oh, and the next season the team did better without Toews than they did with him, just saying.

 

[SI]

Y'all with Barzal are almost as crazy as Avs fans with MacKinnon . Barzal is the one high end offensive player the Islanders have, there's no way you trade him unless you get some fool who's willing to do a Tkachuk esque trade.

I would like to correct you a bit - there are TWO posters here who would shoot Barzal to the moon - and the majority are still believers.

 

[The Real JT]

I would like to correct you a bit - there are TWO posters here who would shoot Barzal to the moon - and the majority are still believers.

Not the best analogy but way back when, the Mets traded Nolan Ryan for Jim Fregosi.

Sure we’ve expected more from Barzal but trading him is crazy unless there’s an even crazier overpayment coming back.

 

[Foppberg]

I would like to correct you a bit - there are TWO posters here who would shoot Barzal to the moon - and the majority are still believers.

I only come here periodically so I must've popped in at the wrong time

I know the Islanders only have so much cash to play with, especially if they end up signing Kadri. But one guy that I think could be a sneaky (and cheap) pickup is Sonny Milano. Talented Long Island native who had a bit of a breakout season, he'd be an interesting experiment next to Barzal.

 

[PWJunior]

I only come here periodically so I must've popped in at the wrong time

I know the Islanders only have so much cash to play with, especially if they end up signing Kadri. But one guy that I think could be a sneaky (and cheap) pickup is Sonny Milano. Talented Long Island native who had a bit of a breakout season, he'd be an interesting experiment next to Barzal.

Milano is a stereotypical LI punk. I remember when he got drafted, he pulled away from someone who almost touched his hair or something. He was like, "don't mess with the f***ing fro". I immediately didn't like him.

 

[ScaredStreit]

And there's always a sucker GM out there. That's why I trade Barzal. It could solve a host of other problems on our roster.

This isn’t nhl 22, it doesn’t work that way. We should absolutely not trade barzal.

 

[saintunspecified]

I kind of wish something would happen if only so folks would then have something meaningful to talk about. Watch a pro baseball game - it's bound to be more exciting (everything is relative) than anything NYI related anyone could talk about until something happens. And it may even lower your blood pressure.

 

[PWJunior]

I kind of wish something would happen if only so folks would then have something meaningful to talk about. Watch a pro baseball game - it's bound to be more exciting (everything is relative) than anything NYI related anyone could talk about until something happens. And it may even lower your blood pressure.

Been playing Mobile Legends Bang Bang to pass the time. It reminds me of my younger days when we used to play Quake 2 with the grappling hook mod in our office after hours. 5v5 battle, it's quite satisfying to wreck people. Of course, my BP goes sky high when I'm getting wrecked or you get a random crap team.

Since there is no Isles news and there won't be before the eve of training camp, it does the trick.

 

[The Real JT]

Milano is a stereotypical LI punk. I remember when he got drafted, he pulled away from someone who almost touched his hair or something. He was like, "don't mess with the f***ing fro". I immediately didn't like him.

They were messing with the downstairs fro so I’ll cut him some slack.