Roster/Rumors/Speculation/Trade Talk - 2023-24: Hotel California

[Throttle]

i'm going into this season with a "clean slate" mentality. i'm hoping with lambert, and as someone mentioned yesterday, maclean, both having nhl experience on the ice and behind the bench, that Matt comes back with a fresh approach and a solid mentality to help the team succeed.

both lambert and maclean have championships as players (lambert in minors) and coaches. IF kadri comes onboard, his experience last year as a cup winner will be invaluable.


i'm going to give matt the benefit of the doubt starting off and hope that last season was the aberration and the whole team gets back to that winning attitude and play

obviously time will tell but let's go matt and let's go isles!!

Color me as someone who thinks Kadri may be able to help Barzal to a certain extent, however, too much of Barzal are his own faults. He has to want to adjust to the other players vs wanting to play his own game that hampers the other players.

 

[Glory Days]

Into the corner? Amazing skill.


If the Isles fall apart, then Barzal should be traded. That would be two seasons in a row that he didn’t elevate his game to help the team.

So it is impossible in your mind for Barzal to have a very good year and the team to have a bad year? So now he needs to carry all 4 lines and 3 defense pairs and 2 goalies. With those expectations no wonder you don’t like him.

 

[MJF]

So it is impossible in your mind for Barzal to have a very good year and the team to have a bad year? So now he needs to carry all 4 lines and 3 defense pairs and 2 goalies. With those expectations no wonder you don’t like him.

You ought to get Oscar consideration for that monologue.

There’s a good chance that if Barzal has a good year, the team will have a good year.

 

[Glory Days]

You ought to get Oscar consideration for that monologue.

There’s a good chance that if Barzal has a good year, the team will have a good year.

Completely untrue. Hockey is a team sport in case you forgot. Putting the team ‘s success all on one player is both unfair and unreasonable.

 

[Throttle]

So it is impossible in your mind for Barzal to have a very good year and the team to have a bad year? So now he needs to carry all 4 lines and 3 defense pairs and 2 goalies. With those expectations no wonder you don’t like him.

So, Barzal having a good year and the team having a bad year is a good thing? If the Isles have a bad year, then yes absent the goaltending crapping the bed, seems likely Barzal will have contributed to the team having a bad year. After all, he’s in a contract year, points get him paid, team success does not…

I don’t hate the player, rather, he’s flawed and he contributes to his own issues, and yes, I am expecting him to step up and earn his money/cap hit and not disappear in playoff series or half a season. Premier players don’t do that, 60point players making $5M do that. Yet, he’s not paid like that, but we know he’s sooo special that it’s everyone else’s fault for him not elevating his game or the team.

 

[Glory Days]

So, Barzal having a good year and the team having a bad year is a good thing? If the Isles have a bad year, then yes absent the goaltending crapping the bed, seems likely Barzal will have contributed to the team having a bad year. After all, he’s in a contract year, points get him paid, team success does not…

I don’t hate the player, rather, he’s flawed and he contributes to his own issues, and yes, I am expecting him to step up and earn his money/cap hit and not disappear in playoff series or half a season. Premier players don’t do that, 60point players making $5M do that.

I didn’t say that Barzal having a good year and the team having a bad year is a good thing. McDavid is the best player in the league. Would you agree? How far has he taken the Oilers? Matthews is probably right behind McDavid. His team can’t get past the first round. There is no guarantee that Barzal elevating his game will result in the Isles being successful. I agree he needs to elevate his game but that is not my point.

 

[doublechili]

Color me as someone who thinks Kadri may be able to help Barzal to a certain extent

Yeah, the consensus seems to be that if the Isles sign Kadri either Nelson or Pageau is moving to the wing so he can be a 2C or 3C. I wonder if the plan isn't for Kadri to play with Barzal on the 1st line? That would actually be my guess as to what happens.

 

[Throttle]

Yeah, the consensus seems to be that if the Isles sign Kadri either Nelson or Pageau is moving to the wing so he can be a 2C or 3C. I wonder if the plan isn't for Kadri to play with Barzal on the 1st line? That would actually be my guess as to what happens.

Based on a recent Kevin Weekes podcast I listened to, I think Kadri to the Isles is a done deal. He spoke about relationships being key in attracting players. Lou had the ‘ problem child’ Kadri in Toronto and stood by him. When Lou left, Dubas shipped him out to cut ties with a Lou player and also as one of many foreshadowing scapegoats of Toronto’s playoff futility.

Notably, Weekes was gushing about Kadri’s game on the ice and how he’s a rare combo of talent, teammate, skill, etc. He seems like the 100% jam guy Lou wants for this team and the playoffs.

I didn’t say that Barzal having a good year and the team having a bad year is a good thing. McDavid is the best player in the league. Would you agree? How far has he taken the Oilers? Matthews is probably right behind McDavid. His team can’t get past the first round. There is no guarantee that Barzal elevating his game will result in the Isles being successful. I agree he needs to elevate his game but that is not my point.

Sure, but EDM has no defense and no goaltending. McDavid is another stratosphere and until EDM shores up it’s defense and goaltending, they are not getting far unless it’s open rec hockey like this past playoff’s.

Except…Barzal plays on a team that has had top 1-5 goaltending, probably top 10 D (except last year), and has a solid 4 line TEAM offensive corps.

 

[MJF]

Completely untrue. Hockey is a team sport in case you forgot. Putting the team ‘s success all on one player is both unfair and unreasonable.

That’s exactly what I’m saying. If Barzal is playing well, chances are the entire team is playing well. The Islanders game plan always relied on the contributions from all 4 lines.

 

[Glory Days]

Based on a recent Kevin Weekes podcast I listened to, I think Kadri to the Isles is a done deal. He spoke about relationships being key in attracting players. Lou had the ‘ problem child’ Kadri in Toronto and stood by him. When Lou left, Dubas shipped him out to cut ties with a Lou player and also as one of many foreshadowing scapegoats of Toronto’s playoff futility.

Notably, Weekes was gushing about Kadri’s game on the ice and how he’s a rare combo of talent, teammate, skill, etc. He seems like the 100% jam guy Lou wants for this team and the playoffs.


Sure, but EDM has no defense and no goaltending. McDavid is another stratosphere and until EDM shores up it’s defense and goaltending, they are not getting far unless it’s open rec hockey like this past playoff’s.

Except…Barzal plays on a team that has had top 1-5 goaltending, probably top 10 goaltending (except last year), and has a solid 4 line TEAM offensive corps.

IMO you over rate the Isles forwards. I agree on the goaltending and defense but that isn’t enough. The team needs more talent upfront. I can easily see Barzal getting 80 points especially if the new coaching staff opens things up a bit. I don’t agree that will correlate to post season success.

 

[Glory Days]

That’s exactly what I’m saying. If Barzal is playing well, chances are the entire team is playing well. The Islanders game plan always relied on the contributions from all 4 lines.

I just don’t see enough forward talent throughout all 4 lines. If the new coaching staff opens up the offense a bit I can see Barzal getting 80 points. I don’t think that will automatically mean the team is much better.

 

[Throttle]

IMO you over rate the Isles forwards. I agree on the goaltending and defense but that isn’t enough. The team needs more talent upfront. I can easily see Barzal getting 80 points especially if the new coaching staff opens things up a bit. I don’t agree that will correlate to post season success.

Lou had made a pre-deadline trade that has impacted the team’s success in the playoffs. I would expect the same to happen this season too. And fans will crap the bed when he tosses the 1st rounder for a Kane player…

As a collective group the forwards are fine, yes there needs to be more talent, but gonna be hard to get an elite player (UFA says no…), so it’s going to have to be an impactful trade at the deadline. The current group needs to stay in the top 8 and they can do that with internal improvements or meeting expectations.

 

[Mike C]

Color me as someone who thinks Kadri may be able to help Barzal to a certain extent, however, too much of Barzal are his own faults. He has to want to adjust to the other players vs wanting to play his own game that hampers the other players.

certainly understand what you're saying.

thinking back to when i was a young pup, i was a bit headstrung and tunnel visioned (no such word i think!) my hope is maybe a little maturity, the "new voices in the room" and a new season makes a difference. just saying i'm willing to forget the past and look ahead. after all, we DID make 2 semi final runs before last season's debacle and i would say the team needs a committed barzal to succeed

the rest is up to him!

the thing about kadri is that he has no history with barzal and i don't think he'd be hesitant to point something out that might hurt his feelings so to speak.

 

[seafoam]

Why? He's not a magician. He's not a prolific scorer. He's difficult to play with because he complicates his game so much. He's simply a great skater.

Some of the best skaters in the game got traded. LaFontaine and Denis Savard, off the top of my head. Leerogy's trade proposal makes us a better team. That's what I'm looking for.

I'm not sure what the proposal was, and we may see Lambert try Barzal on the wing (if Kadri signs) to try force him to shoot more and simplify his game.

I'm not sure if I agree with that, but after going back and looking at some of his highlights he does like to drive up the right wing with the puck...Kevin Kurz also mentioned Giroux as someone who recently transitioned from center to wing and flourished alongside Couturier. Lambert might be able to replicate that with Kadri or Nelson.

 

[seafoam]

Also I’m not against trading Barzal if it makes sense, I just wouldn’t be actively shopping him if I was the GM of the New York Islanders (which I’m not but should be).

I don’t think he returns someone like Connor from WPG because of his contract status.

 

[Glorydays22]

Again, if the Isles are out of it, then Barzal is part of the problem. He’s supposed to be most talented and best player according to the fanboys. If he can’t elevate his game and the team, then that’s an issue.

If we are out of it as you say. Then it's a full rebuild....trading, Lee, Pageau, Bailey (if he's not already dealt), Nelson, Mayfield and Vary.

You build around your young Defense, Sorokin and Brazal. You need someone for fans to come see. To me, our new coach is a HUGE unknown. Will he be able to open up the offense or will he be a mini version of Trotz

 

[JKP]

To the people that want to trade Barzy, what do you think you get for him that makes the team better right now?

 

[Chapin Landvogt]

Implications... or perceptions? To me it's just stating a fact and everything happening after that is a reaction. When i say it, it's only to refute that Snow was 100% incompetent like some posters want to contend. It's nothing beyond that.

No doubt that Snow drafted and brought in a boatload of good players.

It actually should have been a heck of a whole lot more in light of all the top 5 picks he had, but we ALL know that.

He killed it his first two drafts and then Tavares was a gimme, but he also drafted a number of players in later rounds who continue to eat important minutes for us. Turning Reinhart into Barzal and the boost needed to grab Beauvillier was his greatest coup.

What I won't do is give him credit for our current success or value because he had years and years and years of opportunity to do exactly what Lou immediately did upon taking on the job, and most of the time he had the face of the franchise to work with. Lou didn't get that opportunity, which ultimately served as the straw that broke the Snow camel's back in the eyes of ownership.

In fact, having Tavares walk without replacement and then getting to the second round of the playoffs nonetheless immediately after Snow's dismissal was about as big a slap to the face of Snow's legacy as can be made. I mean, sheesh.

At the end of the day, Snow's decade as GM culminated in us seeing the second round of the playoffs just once. That feat was blown out of the water in three consecutive seasons after Snow's dismissal, despite much of the same personnel being at the core of that on-ice success.

That sure doesn't speak for Snow's body of work.

 

[YearlyLottery]

No doubt that Snow drafted and brought in a boatload of good players.

It actually should have been a heck of a whole lot more in light of all the top 5 picks he had, but we ALL know that.

He killed it his first two drafts and then Tavares was a gimme, but he also drafted a number of players in later rounds who continue to eat important minutes for us.

What I won't do is give him credit for our current success or value because he had years and years and years of opportunity to do exactly what Lou immediately did upon taking on the job, and all that time he had the face of the franchise to work with. Lou didn't get that opportunity, which became the straw that broke the Snow camel's back in the eyes of ownership.

In fact, having Tavares walk without replacement and then getting to the second round of the playoffs nonetheless immediately after Snow's dismissal was about as big a slap to the face of Snow's legacy as can be made. I mean, sheesh.

At the end of the day, Snow's decade as GM culminated in us seeing the second round of the playoffs just once. That feat was blown out of the water in three consecutive seasons after Snow's dismisal, despite much of the same personnel being at the core of that on-ice success.

That sure doesn't speak for Snow's body of work.

It still amazes me that people somehow look back at the Snow years and say "wow it would have worked if he had one more year!"

 

[dlawong]

To the people that want to trade Barzy, what do you think you get for him that makes the team better right now?

He should not be traded this summer or early next season. Two things must come first - contract negotiation, and his production next season. Do not trade him when his value is low. Injuries can happen and then he may become really valuable next season. Of course, on the other side, there is a risk that he may also get hurt and therefore can't be traded. But it is worthwhile to take that risk, as he is a key player on this team and he is young. I will object to trading him for an older player, but not for a younger speedy top prospect who can score consistently. Definitely not trading him for someone who is an average skater because that will hurt the team speed.

All depend on what the owner's objectives are:
- make playoffs next 3 years to increase the value of the team in case they may want to sell the team to recover investment
- to make this team competitive for a long time which can only be done by continuing to improve the pipeline and keeping the most valuable young core players

As no one really knows what is the owner group's objective, it is difficult to predict what Lou is going to do, as he has to answer to them or he will be fired after next season.

 

[Glory Days]

Lou had made a pre-deadline trade that has impacted the team’s success in the playoffs. I would expect the same to happen this season too. And fans will crap the bed when he tosses the 1st rounder for a Kane player…

As a collective group the forwards are fine, yes there needs to be more talent, but gonna be hard to get an elite player (UFA says no…), so it’s going to have to be an impactful trade at the deadline. The current group needs to stay in the top 8 and they can do that with internal improvements or meeting expectations.

Agreed, all I’m saying is those internal improvements need to be primarily within the forward group and by more than just Barzal. Other than Nelson I don’t recall another forward that met expectations.

 

[MJF]

Agreed, all I’m saying is those internal improvements need to be primarily within the forward group and by more than just Barzal. Other than Nelson I don’t recall another forward that met expectations.

Anders Lee.

 

[gordie43]

It still amazes me that people somehow look back at the Snow years and say "wow it would have worked if he had one more year!"

Also makes you wonder what could have become of this group had change been made earlier and guys like Nelson could have blossomed sooner

 

[IslandersFan17]

You really think this is mostly Snow's roster? Tweaks like Pageau, Palmieri, Varlamov, actually bringing Sorokin over, hiring real NHL coaches, drafting Dobson, etc.

I get the hate on Lou for this offseason. I really do. Until they sign Kadri but just my opinion. That being said do you truly think Snow gets this team the distance they went? You cannot possibly think so.

He admitted he allowed the scouts to handle the Dobson draft. Palms has not been that great at all. JGP def a good addition, but we are now saying one or two additions to a roster in four years deserves credit?

 

[YearlyLottery]

He admitted he allowed the scouts to handle the Dobson draft. Palms has not been that great at all. JGP def a good addition, but we are now saying one or two additions to a roster in four years deserves credit?

So if we don't give him credit for the good things in the draft it isn't fair to discredit him for any bad picks.

Palmieri, Pageau, Lehner, Varlamov, Filpula, Dobson, Martin, Wahlstrom, were not here when Snow was here. Pelech and Nelson were on much different trajectories. Sorokin was not close to coming over.

He didn't make 1-2 additions in four years to the roster. I am not crazy about the offseason thus far if he doesn't get Kadri but man some of you act like Snow was a better GM than Lou is.