Roster/Rumors/Speculation/Trade Talk - 2023-24: Hotel California

[YearlyLottery]

Maybe it's just a big fear of mine in light of Lou not having found a way to get rid of Bailey other than to pawn off a second (which I felt was failure), but Bailey wasn't a guy he acquired and well, he just couldn't play anymore.

Pageau is a Lou guy. And he can still play.

There are plenty of teams out there that could use him and several have too many youngsters in the organization to sign 'em all anyways.

If paying someone is what it takes to move him, you don't move him.

I'll be shocked - and terribly disappointed in the owners - if Lou's allowed to go that route again.

It would be utter failure, especially in light of the fact that this was actually a guy Lou paid to bring in and then dished out that long contract to. You wanna move Pageau and 2nd, then you better be getting a useful return in the process.

More "cap space and a roster spot" just doesn't cut it here.

***
I know many don't think about it, but things still reek around these parts for Lou having been allowed to separate from Trotz just to hire Lambert and then get to fire him as well with no consequence. We've seen too many instances in the world of pro sports where that meant the GM takes his hat too.

I do not agree with your bolded here. Pageau just looks like a shell of his former self after being injured in one of the playoff runs against Tampa and never looking the same. While I agree with a good amount of your post if Lou does not move on from Pageau this offseason it will be a major disappointment for me. The only thing worse than making a mistake is doubling down on your mistake.

Just to add there is so much that happened with Pageau I cannot blame Lou for. COVID screwed the cap (and also gave the Isles Pelech back and a playoff spot), Pageau's injury screwed his value to the team as well. That all being said he is the GM.

 

[Throttle]

Which is why I say it’s too late to rebuild now. The number of players Lou would have to attach a draft pick to in order to trade (5 by my count) makes a rebuild self-defeating.

Lou committed malpractice by not finding a way to keep Trotz in the organization, and then hiring Lambert without doing a thorough search for a coach first.

People who usually publicly state they want the job of their boss usually don’t last long. In the ‘everything sucks about Lou’ theme, this is the least of his alleged wrongs, it’s pretty standard practice across all industries.

He tried to see if Lou would bite, he didn’t. Poile - the winningest man that never won the big one - finally stepped aside for Trotz. Absent that happening, it’s doubtful he’s a GM in the NHL right now.

 

[Chapin Landvogt]

 

[Osakahaus]

Wait, which one of these years was an issue?View attachment 879522

His career SV% would have been behind only Hellebuyck this year as far as starters go - his playoff % behind only Swayman and Shesterkin. And that's all including his rough numbers this season. If Sorokin gets right the team gets right - and much to the dismay of many posters on this board we're built to be a perennial playoff team for the next 5 or so years.

He and Barzal are not the problems

the problems are going to be with core parts like Pelech, Nelson, Pulock, Pageau, and Dobson if he can keep taking that next step forward

View attachment 879572

define "big"

 

[periferal]

Maybe it's just a big fear of mine in light of Lou not having found a way to get rid of Bailey other than to pawn off a second (which I felt was failure), but Bailey wasn't a guy he acquired and well, he just couldn't play anymore.

Pageau is a Lou guy. And he can still play.

There are plenty of teams out there that could use him and several have too many youngsters in the organization to sign 'em all anyways.

If paying someone is what it takes to move him, you don't move him.

I'll be shocked - and terribly disappointed in the owners - if Lou's allowed to go that route again.

It would be utter failure, especially in light of the fact that this was actually a guy Lou paid to bring in and then dished out that long contract to. You wanna move Pageau and 2nd, then you better be getting a useful return in the process.

More "cap space and a roster spot" just doesn't cut it here.

***
I know many don't think about it, but things still reek around these parts for Lou having been allowed to separate from Trotz just to hire Lambert and then get to fire him as well with no consequence. We've seen too many instances in the world of pro sports where that meant the GM takes his hat too.

I usually agree with all of your posts. This one is really really really really really really really really agree with.

Big concern that Malkin/Ledecky are up Lou's butt, and either don't know who to swap him out for, scared to do it, or think he's doing a great job. If any of them are true things are pretty bad behind the curtain.

 

[Chapin Landvogt]

I usually agree with all of your posts. This one is really really really really really really really really agree with.

Big concern that Malkin/Ledecky are up Lou's butt, and either don't know who to swap him out for, scared to do it, or think he's doing a great job. If any of them are true things are pretty bad behind the curtain.

It is a big concern.

The fact that Lou had a presser not even a week after elimination and basically kicked it off by saying he ain't going anywhere had me worrying about exactly these things.

The timing of it really earned my ire. The fanbase hadn't even finished analyzing all the things that led to this quick 5-game dismissal.

 

[Throttle]

I usually agree with all of your posts. This one is really really really really really really really really agree with.

Big concern that Malkin/Ledecky are up Lou's butt, and either don't know who to swap him out for, scared to do it, or think he's doing a great job. If any of them are true things are pretty bad behind the curtain.

Look around the league, what owners of playoff teams have fired their GMs in the past two seasons?

 

[periferal]

It is a big concern.

The fact that Lou had a presser not even a week after elimination and basically kicked it off by saying he ain't going anywhere had me worrying about exactly these things.

The timing of it really earned my ire. The fanbase hadn't even finished analyzing all the things that led to this quick 5-game dismissal.

Your pulse of the situation is right on. Shame we don't know what's going on behind the scenes, but doesn't feel like Malkin/Ledecky even had a post-season "state of the team" meeting with Lou. Shouldn't that be a mandatory meeting even if the owners are going to bring

Right now it feels like Malkin is handling finishing up the mall and his other business affairs and it's Lou that is running everything with the Isles. As a result it's scary to think how bad things would have to get for Malkin to step in and make a change.

 

[Top Corner]

I’ll say this as well - we are a team built from the net out… so if your franchise goalie has the worst year of his career and your PK is historically bad and you STILL make the playoffs there’s a silver lining there. These were strengths of ours through all of the other playoff years, and if you zoom out a little bit it’s quite possible last season was a blip. It would be difficult to see either of those getting worse or even staying the same, and I’m of the mind that the Sorokin issue will more or less fix itself in the offseason.

The PK is another issue entirely, but I think it’s fair to assume that Desrosier will be taking that over this camp and we won’t be running the same system out. I think having Mayfield back and healthy will be helpful there as well. Call me crazy but I’d love to see Barzal out there on the PK. I think he’s the type of guy who rises to a challenge and I think his speed will help keep other teams honest.

Bring in a PK specialist to play on the fourth line if you want - or if it’s a top 6 player make sure it’s someone like Lindholm who can potentially help out there. But any swings at big name scoring free agents don’t really feel like they address the issues we actually had last season.

Remember, a lot of teams s&*$ the bed for them to make it. Plain and simple , same team as this year , WE DO NOT MAKE PLAYOFFS NEXT YEAR

 

[Osakahaus]

It is a big concern.

The fact that Lou had a presser not even a week after elimination and basically kicked it off by saying he ain't going anywhere had me worrying about exactly these things.

The timing of it really earned my ire. The fanbase hadn't even finished analyzing all the things that led to this quick 5-game dismissal.

I dont think Lou is gonna rest on his laurels after the way this season went. They are getting changes. I believe it.

 

[Lek]

Remember, a lot of teams s&*$ the bed for them to make it. Plain and simple , same team as this year , WE DO NOT MAKE PLAYOFFS NEXT YEAR

did we not say that a good bunch last off season?...

 

[Isles72]

It might just be a year where they use the picks to plant some seeds for the future . Palms , Lee , Pageau's value will be at its highest at the trade deadlines of their walk year . Perhaps by then the AHL has prepared Dufour and Maggio enough to be become regulars and Tsyplakov becomes a diamond in the rough keeper to extend . Cap room obviously increases as the veterans depart increasing the odds of landing a bigger fish instead of a little fish in the summer of '24 . I think this is how they need to rebuild on the fly - take a few lumps while hoping Roy can milk the roster he's given into some type of miracle or two

 

[MJF]

I dont think Lou is gonna rest on his laurels after the way this season went. They are getting changes. I believe it.

I'm sure Lou believes this. I just have my doubts that he can accomplish any meaningful changes given the contracts we have on hand. At best I see a couple of rob Peter to pay Paul changes for 2025.

 

[Osakahaus]

did we not say that a good bunch last off season?...

Its just funny that it happened again in the metro. This entire division is a gong show to some degree.

 

[periferal]

I dont think Lou is gonna rest on his laurels after the way this season went. They are getting changes. I believe it.

The problem isn't wondering if the GM is motivated to make changes...The problem is the GM himself.

 

[impaaaaaact]

Quick try at an armchair gm build. Isles get a LOT faster. Both trades accepted by fans of the other teams - obviously require Lee and Pulock waiving. Cliff notes are:

OUT: Lee, Pulock, Vancouver 2024 2nd, Islanders 2025 3rd

IN: Nikolai Ehlers, Anthony Duclair, Dakota Joshua, Jan Rutta

 

[MJF]

People who usually publicly state they want the job of their boss usually don’t last long. In the ‘everything sucks about Lou’ theme, this is the least of his alleged wrongs, it’s pretty standard practice across all industries.

He tried to see if Lou would bite, he didn’t. Poile - the winningest man that never won the big one - finally stepped aside for Trotz. Absent that happening, it’s doubtful he’s a GM in the NHL right now.

Where did Trotz state he wanted to be the Islanders GM? Reading between the lines again?

Your world view of hockey managers seems to be that many of them work in CYA mode first, betterment of the team 2nd.

Oddly enough the guy who doesn't have to work in CYA mode, Lou Lamoriello, has his team on a 3 year downward trajectory, chasing STHs away, and and carte blanche from the owner to keep it up.

 

[Throttle]

Where did Trotz state he wanted to be the Islanders GM? Reading between the lines again?

Your world view of hockey managers seems to be that many of them work in CYA mode first, betterment of the team 2nd.

Oddly enough the guy who doesn't have to work in CYA mode, Lou Lamoriello, has his team on a 3 year downward trajectory, chasing STHs away, and and carte blanche from the owner to keep it up.

Yet, here’s someone routinely complaining about the direction of the franchise…that wait for it…renewed his season tickets.

Trotz stated he was interested in moving upstairs into management while having term on his coaching contract. By doing that, he tossed a feeler out there that the media took and ran with it. Eventually, it worked in his favor, at another team that he has a history with and was comfortable hiring a coach with zero management experience as their GM.

 

[SayItAintSoJohnny]

Quick try at an armchair gm build. Isles get a LOT faster. Both trades accepted by fans of the other teams - obviously require Lee and Pulock waiving. Cliff notes are:

OUT: Lee, Pulock, Vancouver 2024 2nd, Islanders 2025 3rd

IN: Nikolai Ehlers, Anthony Duclair, Dakota Joshua, Jan RuttaView attachment 879708View attachment 879709

Ya, you could make many good plans if Lou was to trade some of his regulars, but what are the odds really that he even approaches Lee, much less San Jose of all places NOT being on his NTC list? Plus you didn't eat any of that 7 million per, and I don't know that a 2nd round pick gets the Sharks to eat all of that, even if the cash is much less.

I do think if Ryan waives his it will only be to return closer to home though (Winnipeg)

 

[MJF]

Yet, here’s someone routinely complaining about the direction of the franchise…that wait for it…renewed his season tickets.

Why shouldn’t I renew my season tickets? Aren’t you one of the folks who talks about how Islanders fans aren’t loyal at all and look for reasons not to spend money on the team? The kind of fan you like to snark at.

Trotz stated he was interested in moving upstairs into management while having term on his coaching contract. By doing that, he tossed a feeler out there that the media took and ran with it.

This is a bit of a stretch considering he never made a statement like that while he was employed by the Isles.

 

[Throttle]

Toronto hires Lambert as associate coach.

 

[impaaaaaact]

Ya, you could make many good plans if Lou was to trade some of his regulars, but what are the odds really that he even approaches Lee, much less San Jose of all places NOT being on his NTC list? Plus you didn't eat any of that 7 million per, and I don't know that a 2nd round pick gets the Sharks to eat all of that, even if the cash is much less.

I do think if Ryan waives his it will only be to return closer to home though (Winnipeg)

The SJ trade was actually proposed by a sharks fan and seconded by another. But I agree, SJ is probably a tough sell for Lee

 

[periferal]

Ya, you could make many good plans if Lou was to trade some of his regulars, but what are the odds really that he even approaches Lee, much less San Jose of all places NOT being on his NTC list? Plus you didn't eat any of that 7 million per, and I don't know that a 2nd round pick gets the Sharks to eat all of that, even if the cash is much less.

I do think if Ryan waives his it will only be to return closer to home though (Winnipeg)

Exactly. Lou is all about vets and loyalty, but he's going to ask the team captain to waive the modified NTC that Lou gave him (to go to a rebuilding team)?

 

[Throttle]

Why shouldn’t I renew my season tickets? Aren’t you one of the folks who talks about how Islanders fans aren’t loyal at all and look for reasons not to spend money on the team? The kind of fan you like to snark at.

This is a bit of a stretch considering he never made a statement like that while he was employed by the Isles.

It’s entertainment, discretionary income and time for individuals that elect to spend their money how they do so. Isles fans have shown over there years a lot of reasons to not attend games. By going to Belmont, the Isles have increased their corporate support, which makes them less reliant on the fly by night fans.

And Trotz made that statement while coach of the Isles.

 

[Lek]

Toronto hires Lambert as associate coach.

Good for him.....despite me not wanting him as our head coach i would bet he is still a solid assistant coach....and always seemed like a nice enough person.