Speculation: Roster Building Thread XXXVI - It’s Miller Time…K-A

[mas0764]

As mika declines he's still gonna be a middle 6 guy.

I agree. Cup winners generally have great forward depth. I’m not building a competent team. I’m building a top 3 team.

 

[mas0764]

Only if we are really sure that Zibanejad will be cooked at age 34.

He won’t be cooked but I have serious doubts that he’s a legit 1C at that age.

 

[NYR Viper]

If Lafreniere is moving to RW, I’d look at what Domi would cost from Columbus. It’s probably not much and he can play 3LW or 3C and add some scoring punch to the 3rd line. I’d be curious how he would fit here anyways so it may be a good opportunity for all involved. JD was high on Gauthier.

 

[RGY]

I would rather spend draft picks in rounds 4-6 on a guy like Jarnkrok than Kessel imo.

My hope is Vegas does still deal Smith and that we can get him for a 3rd due to the cap implications for potential buyers. Smith would my first deal. Then I would look to see what it would take to get Copp. That would be my second acquisition.

And if the deal is right I look for a Center. Pavelski and Giroux are less ideal because of impending UFA status. But I would be calling. Miller, Horvat, and Scheifele have term. That’s my 3rd acquisition.

Potentially out: Gauthier, Chytil, picks, prospect(s).

In: Smith, Copp, 2C.

Kreider-Zib-Smith
Panarin-Pavelski/Miller-Strome
Lafreniere -Copp-Kakko
Goodrow-Rooney-Hunt
Reaves

 

[Paul Padovano]

Who needs to try and win a cup when you can have a sick prospect pool?!?!?

/s


Of course it’s like anything else, truth is in the middle. You can do both and try to win and not sell the farm so you always have good prospects on the way. People get so hung up leaning too far one way or the other and they miss that the right course of action lies in the middle.

Also, the team doesn’t need to be 100% perfect for us to try and win. I feel like coming out of a rebuild we all get so hung up on acquiring prospects that having a good pool felt like the goal, but the actual goal is to win a Cup. And your team doesn’t need to be the 77 Canadiens for it to be “worth” or “the right time” to try and win. Saying the team has flaws and using that as the reasoning why it’s not worth trying to win when you have a shot right in front of your face is silly. OBVIOUSLY you don’t sell the farm in your attempt to try and win but part of the benefit of a rebuild is an overflowing prospect pool with trade able assets. Theres not going to be room for all of these prospects on the Rangers, that’s just a fact of life in the hard cap NHL.

I just think a lot of the arguments from people on here are rife with the type of logic that leads to perpetual rebuilds.

Yea, I remember the dynasty Red Wings of the 90's and 00's always seemed to have a great AHL team as well. If someone was injured, whoever took that player's position, stepped right in and played just as well or better. They were committed to drafting, developing, and playing a certain way in both leagues. This way guys knew what to expect. Of course they brought in some other key players, but never at the expense of screwing up the farm system. Pretty much the complete opposite of the NY Rangers philosophy, 95' - 17', 18'.

 

[bleedblue94]

The problem Arizona has is that they have already retained on two contracts and are holding the third spot for Kessel. He's got a $6MM cap hit but only $500K in salary this year. Most of his contract has been paid in bonuses. They are going to have to retain 50% of his cap hit to facilitate a trade.

I get that, but it could be more beneficial for them to say take a dadanov for a first and then trade him instead with the retention. He would be a more impactful player than kessel would be at this point. I honestly dont understand the kessel desire by other teams. He wont be a top 6 player on a good team, and he really doesnt fit the mold of a 3rd liner. He isnt the player he was in pitt

 

[bleedblue94]

One way or another they’re going to have to give up or waive a player once Eichel and Martinez come off the IR. 5o contracts- 51 players = -1 player.

Sure, they could trade one of the inconsequential of the 50 contracts with a marginal asset like a mid pick. It isnt a big deal. Teams are going to continue to play these kind of cap games as the years go by, it is becoming accepted practice around the league instead of it being looked down on.

 

[bleedblue94]

You need a guy who can eventually transition to 1C as Mika declines and you need a young middle 6 type. That’s doable.

If you were a team with a future 1c would you trade that future 1c for a package of kravtsov, nils, and a 1st? If you say yes than you are a liar...

 

[Paul Padovano]

If Lafreniere is moving to RW, I’d look at what Domi would cost from Columbus. It’s probably not much and he can play 3LW or 3C and add some scoring punch to the 3rd line. I’d be curious how he would fit here anyways so it may be a good opportunity for all involved. JD was high on Gauthier.

I thought he would be perfect for the bright lights of broadway, but than I hear others say he is a head case. I guess, if true, so what? Avery was a head case as well. An extremely entertaining head case.Thing is we got Kreider there.

 

[McRanger92]

Who needs to try and win a cup when you can have a sick prospect pool?!?!?

/s


Of course it’s like anything else, truth is in the middle. You can do both and try to win and not sell the farm so you always have good prospects on the way. People get so hung up leaning too far one way or the other and they miss that the right course of action lies in the middle.

Also, the team doesn’t need to be 100% perfect for us to try and win. I feel like coming out of a rebuild we all get so hung up on acquiring prospects that having a good pool felt like the goal, but the actual goal is to win a Cup. And your team doesn’t need to be the 77 Canadiens for it to be “worth” or “the right time” to try and win. Saying the team has flaws and using that as the reasoning why it’s not worth trying to win when you have a shot right in front of your face is silly. OBVIOUSLY you don’t sell the farm in your attempt to try and win but part of the benefit of a rebuild is an overflowing prospect pool with trade able assets. Theres not going to be room for all of these prospects on the Rangers, that’s just a fact of life in the hard cap NHL.

I just think a lot of the arguments from people on here are rife with the type of logic that leads to perpetual rebuilds.

Bingo, There’s no checklist to win a Stanley Cup. You work to acquire a core of elite talent and then you build around them to the best of your ability while they are in their prime. The Rangers are blessed with top u23 NHL talent, a top 10 prospect pool and all their draft picks. They need to start using some of it to win now. Thats how they can create a culture of winning that extends windows.

 

[Bruner4329]

No one has ever argued for perpetual rebuilding. We need two more young centers to grow with our stud young wingers in Kakko, Lafreniere, Chytil, Kravtsov/Othmann.

Then it’s rebuild over. Until then, it’s not rebuild over.

Go do that instead of frittering away assets on JT Miller and 90% of board arguments cease. Then go rent whoever you want.

You lost me with stud wingers and Chytil in the same sentence.

 

[LORDE]

If you were a team with a future 1c would you trade that future 1c for a package of kravtsov, nils, and a 1st? If you say yes than you are a liar...

Nope. Which is why I would give more. A lot more.
Anyone thinking we win a cup w Z and Strome are insane

 

[bobbop]

I get that, but it could be more beneficial for them to say take a dadanov for a first and then trade him instead with the retention. He would be a more impactful player than kessel would be at this point. I honestly dont understand the kessel desire by other teams. He wont be a top 6 player on a good team, and he really doesnt fit the mold of a 3rd liner. He isnt the player he was in pitt

Kessel has a reputation. He still is an excellent passer. That’s about it.

I’m not high on Dadanov at all.

 

[Synergy27]

Say it with me: We never had the opportunity to draft Jack Hughes.

Say it with me: I need to lighten up.

 

[bleedblue94]

Nope. Which is why I would give more. A lot more.
Anyone thinking we win a cup w Z and Strome are insane

Curious what is the more you are okay trading?

 

[wolfgaze]

I don't follow Rangers beatwriters anymore so I'm out of the loop - are all of our players expected to be healthy when play resumes on Tuesday?

 

[bl02]

I don't follow Rangers beatwriters anymore so I'm out of the loop - are all of our players expected to be healthy when play resumes on Tuesday?

Blais (knee) Kakko (shoulder???) are the only two that won't be around tuesday eve vs Boston..
GG said Chytil looked good today in practice so i'm assuming he should be good to go.
Nemeth also back.

 

[Paul Padovano]

Blais (knee) Kakko (shoulder???) are the only two that won't be around tuesday eve vs Boston..
GG said Chytil looked good today in practice so i'm assuming he should be good to go.
Nemeth also back.

and Fox. I hope he's close

 

[LORDE]

Curious what is the more you are okay trading?

For what? Or who? Young center? Yet unproven? More than Chytil and Robertson.

Glaring hole = demand

we have supply in many ways, although we have wasted or exhausted a lot.

there’s only so many mistakes you can make in a cap world on your way to a cup and we have made A LOT of mistakes.

NOW we have to dig ourselves out or start over

 

[Paul Padovano]

For what? Or who? Young center? Yet unproven? More than Chytil and Robertson.

Glaring hole = demand

we have supply in many ways, although we have wasted or exhausted a lot.

there’s only so many mistakes you can make in a cap world on your way to a cup and we have made A LOT of mistakes.

NOW we have to dig ourselves out or start over

Which guys would u have not signed? By "start over," who do u think should go?

 

[Paul Padovano]

Nope. Which is why I would give more. A lot more.
Anyone thinking we win a cup w Z and Strome are insane

I see. I guess Panarin goes too

 

[MrPodz]

I see trade proposals but I am so confused on what people believe we lack? I agree its not 1 forward, especially with kakko out for an extended time, but I mean, where do we go from here? Making the playoffs is hard enough and I always saw it as a skills grind followed by a physical skill grind. That means you can islanders your way to an ecf or win it all like tampa did with a punishing third line. We need a mix. Right now, our powerplay is spicy and I dont think we need players of that mold. We need 5v5 creators. That is why I am banging the drum on lekhonen. He drives play at an absurb rate, but just cant finish that well.
Our 3rd is our weak point. Fully healthy, we have a line of chytil goodrow gauthier. That is a line with 0 finishing, gauthier whose one move is drive to the net and hopefully get a pp called on it, goodrow who is the defensive conscience on that line and therefore not needing to be the creator and chytil. Chytil is an odd case because his teammates haven't been able to finish his plays but neither has he. He's also never shot this poor. Every year, we think this is the year he explodes. Im not so sure. Granted, hes actually only 22, but hes underperformed at the wrong time. Im sure he will probably get traded and boom, he becomes a consistent 40-50 point guy.

To reiterate, I dont really care about how this team goes about. You can say hold on to your 1st rounder and we generally have done a good job with mid to late first rounders so I would be inclined to agree, but the draft is always a crapshoot and when youre picking low, you really have to take a swing.

Ultimately, my opinion is if you make a deal, win the trade or get equal value. Sakic, yzerman built through the first round(sakic) , later rounds (yzerman) and through trades. Drury is a rookie with agm experience, but he hasn't made many trades, save for the buch one. For all hating that deal, yes it blew our depth, but a trade with picks and young players can only be judged 3 or 4 years from now, not yet.

The only good news I have seen so far is drury is active. He should be. The fact that no trigger has been pulled is a good thing. You dont overpay unless it is a nobrainer and if its a no brainer, you are not really overpaying. He has his pieces in kravstov, a first, lundkvist/jones and chytil. Secondary pieces would be more adds, but that is your package.

I got roasted, maybe rightfully so, for trading a bevy of picks in a proposed stars deal. I dont know, i just feel like klingberg and pavelski is who drury would target as a way to add more experience.

I will say this though. If the team wins a round, they get a reputation. They start getting that, you get super old stars signing minimums to cup chase and they provide more of a scoring boost then greg mckegg. We are winning now, why not make a significant trade and try it. When will we have 30 mil of cap space available? Dont blow up the farm, but dont let your prospects over marinate and lose value. That will happen with lundkvist . It has happened with kravstov.

 

[jay from jersey]

I would rather spend draft picks in rounds 4-6 on a guy like Jarnkrok than Kessel imo.

My hope is Vegas does still deal Smith and that we can get him for a 3rd due to the cap implications for potential buyers. Smith would my first deal. Then I would look to see what it would take to get Copp. That would be my second acquisition.

And if the deal is right I look for a Center. Pavelski and Giroux are less ideal because of impending UFA status. But I would be calling. Miller, Horvat, and Scheifele have term. That’s my 3rd acquisition.

Potentially out: Gauthier, Chytil, picks, prospect(s).

In: Smith, Copp, 2C.

Kreider-Zib-Smith
Panarin-Pavelski/Miller-Strome
Lafreniere -Copp-Kakko
Goodrow-Rooney-Hunt
Reaves

not bad in terms of thinking, but the rangers didn’t give goodrow that deal to give him 4th line minutes. Especially in the playoffs where he’s a proven savage.
Adding Copp makes a ton of sense. He’d be my target if Drury can’t swing the long term option at center until the offseason...
Kreider-Zibby-LaF/Lehkonen or Giroux
Panarin-Strome-Kakko
LaF/Lehkonen or Giroux- Copp-Goodrow
Hunt-Rooney-Reaves
Barron or Gauthier as The extra

if LaF stays playing well, leave him with Kreids Zibby, if not drop him and move someone else up.
Copp being able to play center/wing is a huge plus, similar to Miller just not at the cost.

Giroux is a def possibility. If he doesn’t want to be traded far away, it’s def going to affect his price, and NYR is an ideal spot for a playoff run with him...
I’m also big on Jarnkrok, he has similar abilities as Copp to move anywhere in the bottom 6 just a bit less talented production wise.
If we can’t add Jarnkrok at the TDL, I’d like to sign him to replace Rooney who imo is def gone after this year..
I know many would like to add a 3D to play with Schneider, but getting 1-2 guys at FWd/center is a far more pressing need. I’m fine platooning Jones/Hajek with Schneider tbh.
copp+ 1 of Lehkonen / Jarnkrok/Giroux /Brown etc
Is the way I’d go in looking to add. The prices to add Copp + one of those players shouldn’t be outrageous.
We also have to see how severe this kakko injury is. If he may require surgery, or be out for a while, I can see them taking a hard run at a Pavelski type

 

[Clark Kellogg]

Say it with me: We never had the opportunity to draft Jack Hughes.

Maybe not that Jack Hughes, a Jack Hughes is available in the upcoming draft.
Plays for Northeastern University and is highly touted.

 

[Ola]

If Lafreniere is moving to RW, I’d look at what Domi would cost from Columbus. It’s probably not much and he can play 3LW or 3C and add some scoring punch to the 3rd line. I’d be curious how he would fit here anyways so it may be a good opportunity for all involved. JD was high on Gauthier.

I like Domi for our team. We got so many bigger forwards who are good with the puck, but not many who can slalom through traffic and get away from pressure when the opposing team puts up an intact defense.