Speculation: Roster Building Thread - Part XXXIV

[leetch99]

Resume...

Just like the VCR...technology is amazing !

 

[RangerBoy]

That’s what worries me too. Copp is a good player and would be a solid top-9 addition for this year. I don’t think that carries into next season with an expanded role and larger contract.

It didn't worry about it. The more I thought about it yesterday after writing that, maybe Copp is the guy. Then the Rangers made the trade later in the day.

 

[Ola]

It didn't worry about it. The more I thought about it yesterday after writing that, maybe Copp is the guy. Then the Rangers made the trade later in the day.

I don’t think Copp is Panarin’s center — but we need a center on the 2nd line that can perform and we need a center on the 3rd line that can perform.

Chytil haven’t been good enough. Can Chytil improve?

On one side, Fil is still young, when Kevin Hayes was the same age as Chytil is now, he was playing for BU. After that, Hayes needed 2+ years stumbling around the NHL before becoming a meaningful contributor in the NHL.

On the other side, — exactly — what we are seeing with Chytil is why you don’t rush kids. It’s six years since Chytil was a point per game player. U18 in Czech Rep. 15-16 y/o. He hasn’t played at a level he is dominant at since. Pro hockey in the Czech Rep at 16-17. The AHL when he was 17-18. The NHL since. What do a kid miss out on if he never plays at a level he is really good at? It’s having the puck on your stick a lot in high pressure situations. It’s to get to work on shifting tempo with the puck. Running things. Forced to find solutions to locking up Ds.

Chytil comes in and looks great at 17, he adopts to the NHL the following 2-3 years — but then what? When will he take the next step? Can he now make up for what he missed out on when he was 16-21?

I don’t know. There might be some kind of middle road. He isn’t that unlike Kreider actually. But it’s much easier for a winger who has a much more N-S job description. A center must be unpredictable, able to control the pace, be comfortable with the puck.

Ultimately, the alternative that I see is that Copp centers the 3rd line. This solves an issue we also have that also must be solved. Who centers the 2nd line next season? Perhaps that can be Chytil. I think playing with Panarin is one of those things that could enable him to recover some of the quality offensive time he has missed out on. Maybe Drury can trade for someone to be the next Ryan Strome.

 

[RangerBoy]

If the Rangers were to trade for Copp, it would be as a Strome replacement. And he would be playing center. Those are the easy answers to your questions.

Whether that move would be a wise one has much more difficult questions.

Yep.

$5M per at 5 or 6 years for Copp. I read Evolving Hockey's model had Copp at $5M AAV in a long term contract.

Strome is asking for $6M?$6.5M? Brooks said the Rangers want the number to start with a 5. Let him walk.

 

[duhmetreE]

Yep.

$5M per at 5 or 6 years for Copp. I read Evolving Hockey's model had Copp at $5M AAV in a long term contract.

Strome is asking for $6M?$6.5M? Brooks said the Rangers want the number to start with a 5. Let him walk.

It's not even that Strome is asking for $6.5M ( which he will probably get from a team like Seattle ) it's the type of player he is. Copp strengthens our weakness.

Chytil is the replacement for Strome and what he provided at 5v5. If he could develop his 2way game, even better.

 

[NYR Viper]

I’m hopeful Drury can find a way to retain the services of both Vatrano and Motte. The bottom-6 needs to be a priority and getting the right guys will be important.

 

[Mac n Gs]

It didn't worry about it. The more I thought about it yesterday after writing that, maybe Copp is the guy. Then the Rangers made the trade later in the day.

Yep.

$5M per at 5 or 6 years for Copp. I read Evolving Hockey's model had Copp at $5M AAV in a long term contract.

Strome is asking for $6M?$6.5M? Brooks said the Rangers want the number to start with a 5. Let him walk.

I was worried he’d be closer to 6x$6M because he’s an Overhardt client, but something closer to 5x$5M would be a solid deal given that he can be plugged in all over the top-9. I have faith in Chytil taking a step forward next year, and I’d prefer to roll with him and Copp going forward.

Rangers need to be smart about their other contracts, but they can make it work finding good depth like Hunt/Motte.

They need to get in on the Pittsburgh model of drafting/developing those PPG USHL players in their draft year that consistently turn into quality bottom-6 players that fit their systems. They hit huge on Guentzel becoming a star. Rust is a great complementary piece. I’m hoping Berard fits that same mold for the Rangers. John Lilley found some great pieces for Toronto in Abruzzeze, Knies, and Robertson.

 

[n8]

Some radical line combos to try. The boys looked so out of it tonight.

Panarin-Zib-Chytil
Kreider-Strome-Goodrow
Laf-Copp-Vatrano
Motte-Broz-Hunt

 

[UAGoalieGuy]

Vegas currently on the outside looking in regarding the playoffs. Stars jumped a head of them and the Stars have 4 games in hand. Heck the Jets are just 2pts behind Vegas with 2 games in hand. Even theoretically the Canucks could get into a tie in points with Vegas if they win their games in hand.

Vegas is still 4th in the Pacific but the Oilers are up by 3 points and have 2 games in hand.

 

[Rangers in 7]

Some radical line combos to try. The boys looked so out of it tonight.

Panarin-Zib-Chytil
Kreider-Strome-Goodrow
Laf-Copp-Vatrano
Motte-Broz-Hunt

There is no way gallant flips panarin and kreider

 

[GAGLine]

Looking at the Vegas situation with Dadonov, it seems like the deal will get voided, which means Vegas will have to do something else to clear cap space.

Any player they trade at this point can't play for their new team. I originally thought it was just in the playoffs that he couldn't play, but according to Mouser, who is very knowledgeable about these things, the player can't play even in the regular season.

So which team is going to take on Dadonov's contract and then not play him the rest of the year? I can't see any team doing that. He has another year left on a 5 mil cap hit, with 6.5 mil in actual money. Reilly Smith is a pending UFA, and he also has a 5 mil cap hit. Moving him out would clear the same amount of cap space as moving Dadonov. He also doesn't have any trade protection according to CapFriendly.

It would be a really shitty move on Vegas' part to trade him, since he will then be ineligible to play the rest of the year, but I don't know what other choice they have. Martinez is going to come off LTIR eventually and they have to make room for him.

So, it seems like Vegas will have to pay some team to take Smith. The Rangers could take on that contract in exchange for Vegas' 2nd this year, or 1st next year.

It may not end up playing out that way. The league might just penalize the shit out of Vegas and allow them to activate Martinez without first clearing cap space. That wouldn't be an ideal solution as it puts the integrity of the league into question, but it also doesn't screw over a player who has done absolutely nothing wrong. It's also possible that the league makes an exception and allows the traded player to still play for his new team. That would also put the integrity of the league into question, though I think to a lesser degree.

Another option, and the one that is likely most by the rules, would be to have Vegas forfeit every game once Martinez is activated, since they won't be cap compliant. It's a fitting scenario for Vegas, but gifting other teams free wins doesn't seem very fair. Vegas has 16 games left. I don't know when Martinez will have to come off LTIR, and they will likely stretch it as long as possible, but even if it's only 8 games that they forfeit, that's 8 free wins for teams that may be in a playoff race. They play Vancouver 3 times in their last 12 games. If all of those are forfeit, that greatly helps Vancouver's chances of making the playoffs.

It's a huge mess and I don't envy the NHL in figuring it out. Then again, they should have a system in place to ensure that no trade lists are registered with the league, and not just managed by the teams.

 

[Rangers in 7]

Looking at the Vegas situation with Dadonov, it seems like the deal will get voided, which means Vegas will have to do something else to clear cap space.

Any player they trade at this point can't play for their new team. I originally thought it was just in the playoffs that he couldn't play, but according to Mouser, who is very knowledgeable about these things, the player can't play even in the regular season.

So which team is going to take on Dadonov's contract and then not play him the rest of the year? I can't see any team doing that. He has another year left on a 5 mil cap hit, with 6.5 mil in actual money. Reilly Smith is a pending UFA, and he also has a 5 mil cap hit. Moving him out would clear the same amount of cap space as moving Dadonov. He also doesn't have any trade protection according to CapFriendly.

It would be a really shitty move on Vegas' part to trade him, since he will then be ineligible to play the rest of the year, but I don't know what other choice they have. Martinez is going to come off LTIR eventually and they have to make room for him.

So, it seems like Vegas will have to pay some team to take Smith. The Rangers could take on that contract in exchange for Vegas' 2nd this year, or 1st next year.

It may not end up playing out that way. The league might just penalize the shit out of Vegas and allow them to activate Martinez without first clearing cap space. That wouldn't be an ideal solution as it puts the integrity of the league into question, but it also doesn't screw over a player who has done absolutely nothing wrong. It's also possible that the league makes an exception and allows the traded player to still play for his new team. That would also put the integrity of the league into question, though I think to a lesser degree.

Another option, and the one that is likely most by the rules, would be to have Vegas forfeit every game once Martinez is activated, since they won't be cap compliant. It's a fitting scenario for Vegas, but gifting other teams free wins doesn't seem very fair. Vegas has 16 games left. I don't know when Martinez will have to come off LTIR, and they will likely stretch it as long as possible, but even if it's only 8 games that they forfeit, that's 8 free wins for teams that may be in a playoff race. They play Vancouver 3 times in their last 12 games. If all of those are forfeit, that greatly helps Vancouver's chances of making the playoffs.

It's a huge mess and I don't envy the NHL in figuring it out. Then again, they should have a system in place to ensure that no trade lists are registered with the league, and not just managed by the teams.

This is just wild

The best course of action would be to let the player play

This is a special circumstance in my opinion

 

[HatTrick Swayze]

Looking at the Vegas situation with Dadonov, it seems like the deal will get voided, which means Vegas will have to do something else to clear cap space.

Any player they trade at this point can't play for their new team. I originally thought it was just in the playoffs that he couldn't play, but according to Mouser, who is very knowledgeable about these things, the player can't play even in the regular season.

So which team is going to take on Dadonov's contract and then not play him the rest of the year? I can't see any team doing that. He has another year left on a 5 mil cap hit, with 6.5 mil in actual money. Reilly Smith is a pending UFA, and he also has a 5 mil cap hit. Moving him out would clear the same amount of cap space as moving Dadonov. He also doesn't have any trade protection according to CapFriendly.

It would be a really shitty move on Vegas' part to trade him, since he will then be ineligible to play the rest of the year, but I don't know what other choice they have. Martinez is going to come off LTIR eventually and they have to make room for him.

So, it seems like Vegas will have to pay some team to take Smith. The Rangers could take on that contract in exchange for Vegas' 2nd this year, or 1st next year.

It may not end up playing out that way. The league might just penalize the shit out of Vegas and allow them to activate Martinez without first clearing cap space. That wouldn't be an ideal solution as it puts the integrity of the league into question, but it also doesn't screw over a player who has done absolutely nothing wrong. It's also possible that the league makes an exception and allows the traded player to still play for his new team. That would also put the integrity of the league into question, though I think to a lesser degree.

Another option, and the one that is likely most by the rules, would be to have Vegas forfeit every game once Martinez is activated, since they won't be cap compliant. It's a fitting scenario for Vegas, but gifting other teams free wins doesn't seem very fair. Vegas has 16 games left. I don't know when Martinez will have to come off LTIR, and they will likely stretch it as long as possible, but even if it's only 8 games that they forfeit, that's 8 free wins for teams that may be in a playoff race. They play Vancouver 3 times in their last 12 games. If all of those are forfeit, that greatly helps Vancouver's chances of making the playoffs.

It's a huge mess and I don't envy the NHL in figuring it out. Then again, they should have a system in place to ensure that no trade lists are registered with the league, and not just managed by the teams.

Thanks for writing all this. What a crazy situation. Don't envy the league having to make this decision right now.

 

[TheBloodyNine]

It may not end up playing out that way. The league might just penalize the shit out of Vegas and allow them to activate Martinez without first clearing cap space.

Sounds like a luxury tax, which is probably what needs to happen anyway.

 

[GAGLine]

This is just wild

The best course of action would be to let the player play

This is a special circumstance in my opinion

Thinking about it more, the best course of action might be to not allow Martinez to play once he comes off LTIR. It sucks for him, but the amount of games he'll miss would be less than what Dadonov or Smith would miss if they were traded. Vegas would not be cap compliant, but they wouldn't get any advantage from it since Martinez can't play, and the league would punish them in terms of fines and lost draft picks, rather than making them forfeit. Of course, if Vegas were to make the playoffs, what then? Under normal circumstances Martinez would be allowed to play since there is no cap in the playoffs. Though the way Vegas has been playing, it's doubtful they would make it.

 

[Rangers in 7]

Thinking about it more, the best course of action might be to not allow Martinez to play once he comes off LTIR. It sucks for him, but the amount of games he'll miss would be less than what Dadonov or Smith would miss if they were traded. Vegas would not be cap compliant, but they wouldn't get any advantage from it since Martinez can't play, and the league would punish them in terms of fines and lost draft picks, rather than making the forfeit. Of course, if Vegas were to make the playoffs, what then? Under normal circumstances Martinez would be allowed to play since there is no cap in the playoffs. Though the way Vegas has been playing, it's doubtful they would make it.

My only problem with that solution is that you are allowing Vegas to still cheat the system. I mean yeah it sucks for Martinez but in the end it still allows Vegas to be cap compliant when they obviously aren’t

 

[Matt Rentfree]

My only problem with that solution is that you are allowing Vegas to still cheat the system. I mean yeah it sucks for Martinez but in the end it still allows Vegas to be cap compliant when they obviously aren’t

They also are going to want to activate Mark Stone at some point I would think. What a complete mess.

 

[HatTrick Swayze]

Any decision that allows Vegas to maintain a cap noncompliant roster for any part of the regular season and still play games seems unfair to the rest of the league.

But I do get that forcing Dadonov to sit out is unfair to him and the PA will raise a stink.

 

[IDvsEGO]

Thinking about it more, the best course of action might be to not allow Martinez to play once he comes off LTIR. It sucks for him, but the amount of games he'll miss would be less than what Dadonov or Smith would miss if they were traded. Vegas would not be cap compliant, but they wouldn't get any advantage from it since Martinez can't play, and the league would punish them in terms of fines and lost draft picks, rather than making them forfeit. Of course, if Vegas were to make the playoffs, what then? Under normal circumstances Martinez would be allowed to play since there is no cap in the playoffs. Though the way Vegas has been playing, it's doubtful they would make it.

Vegas cant even let him off the ltir because they'll go over the cap. IIRC if a team is going to go over the cap (as in this scenario) transactions that caused it will be undone. The last non ltir transaction vegas made was eichel...

 

[Rangers in 7]

Vegas cant even let him off the ltir because they'll go over the cap. IIRC if a team is going to go over the cap (as in this scenario) transactions that caused it will be undone. The last non ltir transaction vegas made was eichel...

Woah woah woah….that’s a thing?

 

[Taluss]

Vegas cant even let him off the ltir because they'll go over the cap. IIRC if a team is going to go over the cap (as in this scenario) transactions that caused it will be undone. The last non ltir transaction vegas made was eichel...

Wait really? Wow. I thought it just meant the player couldn’t be activated off of LTIR.

 

[UnSandvich]

I wouldn't mind taking Dadonov's contract if he was okay with sitting some time out (assuming of course, Vegas ponies up something to make it worth our while)

 

[HatTrick Swayze]

I wouldn't mind taking Dadonov's contract if he was okay with sitting some time out (assuming of course, Vegas ponies up something to make it worth our while)

Don’t think that’s an option unless the NYR are better off with him than Strome/Copp/2C next season.

 

[Matt Rentfree]

I wouldn't mind taking Dadonov's contract if he was okay with sitting some time out (assuming of course, Vegas ponies up something to make it worth our while)

If he was a pending UFA sure, but he has another year on his contract. We can't afford his $5M cap hit next season.

 

[Off Sides]

Nemeth does not have an 8 team no trade list, trust me, I swear.